Munster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

09-04-2012 07:16PM

Knoyle, Peel, Blair, Cussiter, Youngs and Simpson are all better "scrum halfs" than Phillips.

Wales haven't used a scrum half as a scrum half since the emergence of Phillips though.

Hagz · 09-04-2012 07:16PM

Clegg wrote: »

Phillips will probably be the Lions scrum half next year. But there really aren't many quality options at scrumhalf in Britain or Ireland.

Anyway, I believe that a scrum half like Mike Phillips wouldn't significantly improve Ireland as we lack the monster backs to take the advantage that Phillips offers.

He sucks defenders in at ruck time and then that leaves a stretched defence for the massive welsh backs to run at. We don't have many massive backs to use this strategy. We need quick ball with accurate passing. Something that Mike Phillips doesn't really provide.

True.

totallegend · 09-04-2012 07:18PM

Clegg wrote: »

Phillips will probably be the Lions scrum half next year. But there really aren't many quality options at scrumhalf in Britain or Ireland.

Anyway, I believe that a scrum half like Mike Phillips wouldn't sognificantly improve Ireland as we lack the monster backs to take the advantage that Phillips offers.

In fairness to Philips, Wales won a grand slam in 2008 with the likes of Shane Williams, Mark Jones and Henson in the team, nowhere near the physicality of the 2012 model.

Philips is not technically great but he is a quick thinker, he decides instantly whether to break or pass and Murray's problem is not the speed of his pass, it's how long he dithers over it at the back of a ruck. It takes the momentum of the attack and allows the opponent's defensive line to reset

Brendan97 · 09-04-2012 07:20PM

Clegg wrote: »

The irony is that Mike Phillips is technically, a very poor scrum half.

He dithers over the ball, crabs with his passing and isn't very accurate with his throwing. That isn't the road that Munster and Ireland should be looking to go down with Murray.

Phillips works well for Wales because he can tie in forwards at ruck time with his physical presence. Then the ball gets whipped out to the massive Welsh backs who can wreak havoc on stretched defences. Ireland doesn't have the physicality of the Welsh backs. We should be looking for quick ball for Murray so he can give it to Sexton who can then unleash our backs.

He should be told to work on his passing and his speed at ruck time.

Its called assesing your options and tbh he usually makes the right calls, he works well with wales because he uses the forwards well, orchestrating them from SH, the backs kind of look after themselves though (but he does his job and gives them the ball fairly quickly when needed
He got MOTM against Ireland for a reason

skregs · 09-04-2012 07:26PM

Mike Phillips has hijacked this thread. Back on topic with picture of him with ROG in the 2009 Lions tour.

Clegg · 09-04-2012 07:27PM

Brendan97 wrote: »

Its called assesing your options and tbh he usually makes the right calls, he works well with wales because he uses the forwards well, orchestrating them from SH, the backs kind of look after themselves though (but he does his job and gives them the ball fairly quickly when needed
He got MOTM against Ireland for a reason

He difinitely takes too long at ruck time. He looks up, then puts his hands on the ball, looks up again, pauses, takes a step then releases the ball. It works well for Wales but it really wouldn't work for us. It would be great to have a defender as good as Phillips at scrummie though.

And Phillips really wasn't deserving of that MoTM award. There were 3 or 4 players more deserving of that prize but he got it because Tony Ward creams over him.

Brendan97 · 09-04-2012 07:30PM

Clegg wrote: »

He difinitely takes too long at ruck time. He looks up, then puts his hands on the ball, looks up again, pauses, takes a step then releases the ball. It works well for Wales but it really wouldn't work for us. It would be great to have a defender as good as Phillips at scrummie though.

And Phillips really wasn't deserving of that MoTM award. There were 3 or 4 players more deserving of that prize but he got it because Tony Ward creams over him.

He takes his time when nessescary(sorry if misspelled) and plays it quick when nessescary, he is a great decision-maker
I thought he played very well and did deserve it

thomond2006 · 09-04-2012 07:32PM

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_7662308,00.html

James Coughlan has fractured a bone in his hand, "likely" to miss the match against Glasgow. Another bloody backrow injury, no experienced player left now bar Wallace.

Clegg · 09-04-2012 07:35PM

North and Davies destroyed us in that game. Ian Evans had a blinder as did Ryan Jones.

On the Irish side, Rory Best and Stephen Ferris had very good games. They all had a greater impact on the game then Phillips, who was quiet for large parts of the game.

Brendan97 · 09-04-2012 07:40PM

Clegg wrote: »

North and Davies destroyed us in that game. Ian Evans had a blinder as did Ryan Jones.

On the Irish side, Rory Best and Stephen Ferris had very good games. They all had a greater impact on the game then Phillips, who was quiet for large parts of the game.

Phillips was easily MOTM imo, he stood out the most
but if thats your opinion

yosser hughes · 09-04-2012 07:53PM

Clegg wrote: »

The irony is that Mike Phillips is technically, a very poor scrum half.

He dithers over the ball, crabs with his passing and isn't very accurate with his throwing. That isn't the road that Munster and Ireland should be looking to go down with Murray.

Phillips works well for Wales because he can tie in forwards at ruck time with his physical presence. Then the ball gets whipped out to the massive Welsh backs who can wreak havoc on stretched defences. Ireland doesn't have the physicality of the Welsh backs. We should be looking for quick ball for Murray so he can give it to Sexton who can then unleash our backs.

He should be told to work on his passing and his speed at ruck time.

No he should just be dropped. He's not good enough right now and is totally undeserving of his position as first choice scrum half for Ireland. If Munster want him as theirs, then good luck to them.

Amazotheamazing · 09-04-2012 09:16PM

yosser hughes wrote: »

Clegg wrote: »

The irony is that Mike Phillips is technically, a very poor scrum half.

He dithers over the ball, crabs with his passing and isn't very accurate with his throwing. That isn't the road that Munster and Ireland should be looking to go down with Murray.

Phillips works well for Wales because he can tie in forwards at ruck time with his physical presence. Then the ball gets whipped out to the massive Welsh backs who can wreak havoc on stretched defences. Ireland doesn't have the physicality of the Welsh backs. We should be looking for quick ball for Murray so he can give it to Sexton who can then unleash our backs.

He should be told to work on his passing and his speed at ruck time.

No he should just be dropped. He's not good enough right now and is totally undeserving of his position as first choice scrum half for Ireland. If Munster want him as theirs, then good luck to them.

Are people forgetting Reddan v. England or something, he's just as poor only 8 years older.

Anatidaephobia · 09-04-2012 09:19PM

thomond2006 wrote: »

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_7662308,00.html

James Coughlan has fractured a bone in his hand, "likely" to miss the match against Glasgow. Another bloody backrow injury, no experienced player left now bar Wallace.

Our back row is definitely cursed. I presume Ryan will move to 6 for this one, which is still a ridiculously inexperienced backrow.

PhatPiggins · 09-04-2012 09:25PM

thomond2006 wrote: »

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_7662308,00.html

James Coughlan has fractured a bone in his hand, "likely" to miss the match against Glasgow. Another bloody backrow injury, no experienced player left now bar Wallace.

I heard Coughlan fractured it in the first half. Credit to him for playing so well while carrying an injury. Has to go on the summer tour imo.

thomond2006 · 09-04-2012 09:29PM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

I heard Coughlan fractured it in the first half. Credit to him for playing so well while carrying an injury. Has to go on the summer tour imo.

I suppose if Kidney is gonna pick D'Arcy and BOD (rightly for BOD), then the age card shouldn't be played against Coughlan.

He came into pro rugby pretty late anyway and looks to plenty of miles left on the clock.

CatFromHue · 09-04-2012 09:36PM

I'd be more worried about Earls to be honest.

thomond2006 · 09-04-2012 09:42PM

CatFromHue wrote: »

I'd be more worried about Earls to be honest.

Given his injury record I'd be very worried. He stayed on for too long.

durkadurka · 09-04-2012 09:43PM

He looked well shook last week too.

PhatPiggins · 09-04-2012 09:50PM

thomond2006 wrote: »

I suppose if Kidney is gonna pick D'Arcy and BOD (rightly for BOD), then the age card shouldn't be played against Coughlan.

He came into pro rugby pretty late anyway and looks to plenty of miles left on the clock.

Coughlan will make the next WC which should be the minimum target for an age decision. BOD is obviously exempt from any rules or criteria.

danthefan · 09-04-2012 09:52PM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Coughlan will make the next WC which should be the minimum target for an age decision. BOD is obviously exempt from any rules or criteria.

I'm assuming you left a word out there, but we should not be building a squad for the RWC 4 years in advance, it's absolutely ridiculous to even attempt that.

Kidney hardly had a notion of who his first choice half backs were in the middle of the competition (to disastrous effect), never mind asking him to make the right calls for a tournament in 2015.

I wouldn't have Coughlan on the tour btw. Honest toiler, never an international.

thomond2006 · 09-04-2012 10:02PM

danthefan wrote: »

I wouldn't have Coughlan on the tour btw. Honest toiler, never an international.

I suppose it depends how big the touring squad will be. I don't think he would/should make the 22 if everyone is fit but he wouldn't let anyone down if needed.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 09-04-2012 10:05PM

thomond2006 wrote: »

I suppose it depends how big the touring squad will be. I don't think he would/should make the 22 if everyone is fit but he wouldn't let anyone down if needed.

With just the three test matches how big do you think the touring squad is going to be?

Would you have Coughlan ahead of any of Heaslip, SOB, Ferris, POM and Henry? By my reckoning that would the the first five choices and probably all the backrowers that will actually travel.

Amazotheamazing · 09-04-2012 10:47PM

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Coughlan will make the next WC which should be the minimum target for an age decision. BOD is obviously exempt from any rules or criteria.

I will despair if Ireland need Coughlan at the next world cup.

Guys like Coughlan and Hurley are honest pro's but not top level HEC standard and not International standard.

Fishooks12 · 09-04-2012 11:16PM

Who slots in for Coughlan next week?

Butler?

CIARAN_BOYLE · 09-04-2012 11:25PM

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Who slots in for Coughlan next week?

Butler?

Will DOC2.0 be back? If so 6DOC2.0 7TOD 8POM, If not 6Ryan 7TOD 8POM or 6TOD 7Wallace 8POM.

Fishooks12 · 09-04-2012 11:29PM

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

Will DOC2.0 be back? If so 6DOC2.0 7TOD 8POM, If not 6Ryan 7TOD 8POM or 6TOD 7Wallace 8POM.

POM hasn't played 8 in a while and I don't think DOC2 will be back

I'd like to see management put some faith in Paddy

He's been mixed in the rabo when given the chance but I remember himself , POM and TOD started a game before Christmas against one of the Scottish teams and they worked very well together

Amazotheamazing · 09-04-2012 11:34PM

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Who slots in for Coughlan next week?

Butler?

Ryan to 6, POM to 8?

Personally I'd like to see Butler given a go, he was good on Friday. Certainly no worse than Ruddock or Dom Ryan who'd play for Leinster in similar circumstances. If we're losing then bring on DOC and switch Ryan to 6.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 09-04-2012 11:56PM

Anyone here how the Munster development team got on against Ensei STM.

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10352.php

ormond lad · 10-04-2012 12:03AM

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

Anyone here how the Munster development team got on against Ensei STM.

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10352.php

from someone on mf's who was at the game
"we won 34-24
Our loosehead was very good in the loose, as was Buckley, Rael looked good too. Holland and Hircock were the pick of the backs for me, Holland is an exceptional kicker going on today's evidence, converted his own try from the touchline line with a stiff wind blowing across the pitch.
Decent enough game in lousy conditions. The Russians were good value, decent team and they seemed to tire in the second half after being on top in the first. They failed with a few conversions that kept us in the game for the first half. Scrums were a bit iffy but our lineout was good"

ambid · 10-04-2012 02:32AM

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Who slots in for Coughlan next week?

Butler?

Butler was terrific in the B&I semi last weekend. It's a step down from the Rabo obviously, but he was probably the best player on the pitch.

Munster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread.

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