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Mass Effect 3: The Ending(s) [** Spoilers **]

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,207 ✭✭✭hightower1


    I think it will be an anxious wait for everybody and i see it being kept under wraps for a while if they are going to continue this story, if they are introducing a new story i see no reason for them to keep it secret for too long.


    Personally I'd like to see them head to a new galaxy with mass relays and a new story arc with some nods or even cameos from familliar faces / places. I cant see EA letting a massive franchise like this die, not with the savage merchendising the had for this installment. They carly see it as a cash cow. I certainly wouldnt like to see a prequel.

    I wouldnt be shocked to hear an announcment at E3 this year aknowlagnig they will continue he francise. Nothing morbut an announcement maybe. It'd have people keep their saves and kindle intrest in the intrerim DLC packs if they know teh universe would continue going.

    One thing that will hurt them about the endings being nearly identicle though is the replay value. I finished it last night and I have no intrest in replaying now as a soldier (was an adept) seein as any new decisions I may make will make no real differnce and Im happy with the current decisions I have made. Will trade it in tonight for the darkness. I dont buy into DLC as its just groundwork for rip offs and part outs of content. If the decions you make actually had big impacts on the game then Id definitly replay a few times to see all the possible timelines but seeing as they didnt do that I see no reason to replay.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    what i believe, then the final scene in the game was an attempted indoctrination
    Shryke wrote: »
    Unless the indoctrination theory is true.

    Yes but you see it is definitely not an indoctrination fever dream, that makes no sense, as I said already, if you do badly enough during the game your only choice at the end is to resist indoctrination, so that is definitely not what is going on.

    You're all starting to sound like the kind of people who are sure Jesus will be coming back very soon.
    Shryke wrote: »
    It's a waiting game now to see what the real intention of the endings are.

    There is no "real intention"! They are just bad endings.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,207 ✭✭✭hightower1


    Maximilian wrote: »
    I read a rumour that there will be DLC with the "true" ending but it will be free.

    Only a rumour of course but if true, it will make all of this a very memorable ending to a great trilogy.

    I dunno tbh, its means that if you dont have your xbox connected to the web you can only play a "fake" ending? Cant see that happening. If true its precednt for games to come incomplete in regards to the main story without DLC. If this kinda ****e starts with "true" free endings on DLC it would only be a matter of time before we have actuall game endings for paid DLC.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,199 ✭✭✭Shryke


    Zillah wrote: »
    There is no "real intention"! They are just bad endings.

    I'm refering to whether the indoctrination idea is true or not. Look, the idea is everywhere and there are plenty of nods to the idea throughout the games. You don't like the ending I get that, it's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I still love these games. I want pay off for the decisions I've made and I do find it difficult to comprehend how such brilliant games could be ended on such a whimper compared to 2 which was jaw dropping. It might be the case or it might not.
    If indoctrination is the reality of what happened then my hat really is off, it would be terrific. I really did feel disorientated and a bit confused by the end. It didn't feel right. The brilliance of putting the player through indoctrination, of making the player really experience it.
    The idea that the rest of the game would be added on with free dlc sounds really good. So the ending got leaked, but it wasn't the real ending, they kept that under wraps. They screw with players heads completely and get a whole load of controversy.
    Or if the ending is genuine and that's how they wanted to go then I'm fine with it in the end. If the ending goes no further then great. But even if there is no more to it the indoctrination theory stands. And maybe that's how the ending is meant to be, leaving it open to interpretation.
    What I'm looking at is either masterclass story telling or half assed laziness and I'm really not sure which. Things don't fully make sense from either side of the argument and that's what annoys me. That's why with a little time I hope to see more clarity put to the issue. I have patience here. I loved all 3 games. The ending has me thinking back and forth. Not a bad thing.
    If it comes down to it I rather the endings that we did get to a zoomed out parade and a bunch of high 5's. I expect more than that, and I certainly got something a little different.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,199 ✭✭✭Shryke


    A member of Bioware posted this over on their official forum in relation to the ending. It does raise an eyebrow. They're keeping quiet on purpose?
    (Sorry if posted already.)

    "We appreciate everyone’s feedback about Mass Effect 3 and want you to know that we are listening. Active discussions about the ending are more than welcome here, and the team will be reviewing it for feedback and responding when we can. Please note, we want to give people time to experience the game so while we can’t get into specifics right now, we will be able to address some of your questions once more people have had time to complete the game. In the meantime, we’d like to ask that you keep the non-spoiler areas of our forums and our social media channels spoiler free.

    We understand there is a lot of debate on the Mass Effect 3 ending and we will be more than happy to engage in healthy discussions once more people get to experience the game. We are listening to all of your feedback. "


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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Shryke wrote: »
    But even if there is no more to it the indoctrination theory stands.

    No it doesn't! I've said this three times, let me try and make it very clear:

    You spend the entire game trying to build up military resources, represented by Effective Military Score. The higher your EMS the better you have done. If you have very low EMS then "Destroy" is the only option you get, with higher EMS you unlock "Control" and then "Synthesis". According to the indoctrination theory, "Destroy" is the only option whereby you defeat the indoctrination. Therefore, if you do really badly during the game you are forced to choose the only option that defeats indoctrination. The better you do the more likely you are to succumb to the Reapers.

    It's retarded.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,743 ✭✭✭blatantrereg


    Zillah wrote: »
    No it doesn't! I've said this three times, let me try and make it very clear:

    You spend the entire game trying to build up military resources, represented by Effective Military Score. The higher your EMS the better you have done. If you have very low EMS then "Destroy" is the only option you get, with higher EMS you unlock "Control" and then "Synthesis". According to the indoctrination theory, "Destroy" is the only option whereby you defeat the indoctrination. Therefore, if you do really badly during the game you are forced to choose the only option that defeats indoctrination. The better you do the more likely you are to succumb to the Reapers.

    It's retarded.

    I think everyone gets your point. They just dont share your point of view.

    Also I brought up this question before you did.

    Not everyone sees this as refutation of the indoctrination idea. You are the one not seeing other people's PoV here.

    So stop getting angry and repeating yourself - well repeating me really, since I did bring up the point first and all. Stop thinking people must be stupid if they dont agree with you.
    Can the hallucination theory accommodate the conditional requirement for the synthesis ending? It seems to be dependant on a high effective war asset score.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Simply stating "I don't agree with your perfectly reasonable argument" isn't exactly a rational position. I've shown that the developers clearly didn't make the game intending the ending to be interpreted as indoctrination. People claiming otherwise are wrong/deluded.

    It can't be the real ending it just can't be!

    The parallels with religion are getting rather amusing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭Venom


    Shryke wrote: »
    A member of Bioware posted this over on their official forum in relation to the ending. It does raise an eyebrow. They're keeping quiet on purpose?
    (Sorry if posted already.)

    "We appreciate everyone’s feedback about Mass Effect 3 and want you to know that we are listening. Active discussions about the ending are more than welcome here, and the team will be reviewing it for feedback and responding when we can. Please note, we want to give people time to experience the game so while we can’t get into specifics right now, we will be able to address some of your questions once more people have had time to complete the game. In the meantime, we’d like to ask that you keep the non-spoiler areas of our forums and our social media channels spoiler free.

    We understand there is a lot of debate on the Mass Effect 3 ending and we will be more than happy to engage in healthy discussions once more people get to experience the game. We are listening to all of your feedback. "

    What a load of crap.

    EA are in panic mode due to one of there biggest franchises going down in flames with all future DLC and sequel plans going up in smoke and that's the only reason no comments have been forthcoming.

    If EA releases an ending DLC for free (best option for players) it will still be major bad press as it admits the game was released incomplete and screws over loyal customers who lack net access.

    If EA try to charge for a new ending they will be crucified in the media (even the paid review sites can't spin that into gold) not to mention the damage it would do to the EA brand overall.

    Either way I can see heads rolling for this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 978 ✭✭✭AceCard Jones


    Zillah wrote: »
    No it doesn't! I've said this three times, let me try and make it very clear:

    You spend the entire game trying to build up military resources, represented by Effective Military Score. The higher your EMS the better you have done. If you have very low EMS then "Destroy" is the only option you get, with higher EMS you unlock "Control" and then "Synthesis". According to the indoctrination theory, "Destroy" is the only option whereby you defeat the indoctrination. Therefore, if you do really badly during the game you are forced to choose the only option that defeats indoctrination. The better you do the more likely you are to succumb to the Reapers.

    It's retarded.

    I understand what you’re saying, and on the surface that does look to be a hole in the indoctrination theory, but I have my own theory on it.

    If you go through the game not getting the other races on your side, not helping to solve the conflicts, not gaining assets to military strength, then you could argue that your Shepard doesn’t really give a **** about anyone else. He/she didn’t take the time to build up trust with other races, people or factions and therefore doesn’t have any sort of emotional investment in them and so he/she wouldn’t be too bothered if any of them didn’t survive so long as the reapers are dead.

    If you take the indoctrination theory as true, then the reapers are trying to play to Shepard’s compassion by giving him/her seemingly better choices than the Destroy option (with regards to other races etc). If he/she has had no compassion throughout the game by not really caring about the others races etc then why would they try to convince him/her to have some now? So if you’re an ass or just too lazy to go and do all the missions, then I suppose you’re not as easy a target to indoctrinate lol.

    Anyway, I could be wrong, but I hope to God I’m not.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,314 ✭✭✭sink


    Zillah wrote: »
    No it doesn't! I've said this three times, let me try and make it very clear:

    You spend the entire game trying to build up military resources, represented by Effective Military Score. The higher your EMS the better you have done. If you have very low EMS then "Destroy" is the only option you get, with higher EMS you unlock "Control" and then "Synthesis". According to the indoctrination theory, "Destroy" is the only option whereby you defeat the indoctrination. Therefore, if you do really badly during the game you are forced to choose the only option that defeats indoctrination. The better you do the more likely you are to succumb to the Reapers.

    It's retarded.

    No, the developers have stated their intention to release DLC in the future. Now if the indoctrination theory is true, in order to have a post ME3 story the player character can't be indoctrinated. So in order to allow everyone to play the post ME3 DLC without going back and replaying the entire game in order to increase their EMS and get an ending where they defeat indoctrination, Bioware simply made it the default choice. Now I'm not saying this is necessarily the case, there is more that one way to skin a cat, but what I am saying is that no one really knows except the developers.

    Zillah this is a work of fiction, don't get to caught up in what fits the continuity from your perspective because fiction is not constrained by your interpretation of the story. Comparing it with religion is asinine.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,199 ✭✭✭Shryke


    Zillah wrote: »
    No it doesn't! I've said this three times, let me try and make it very clear:

    You spend the entire game trying to build up military resources, represented by Effective Military Score. The higher your EMS the better you have done. If you have very low EMS then "Destroy" is the only option you get, with higher EMS you unlock "Control" and then "Synthesis". According to the indoctrination theory, "Destroy" is the only option whereby you defeat the indoctrination. Therefore, if you do really badly during the game you are forced to choose the only option that defeats indoctrination. The better you do the more likely you are to succumb to the Reapers.

    It's retarded.

    You can only choose destroy but without high EMS you don't get the Shepard Survives clip. You fail, you don't survive without enough EMS. And you don't have enough hope inside yourself to imagine you could win/dominate the Reapers, therefore no other endings. Make a bit of sense?


  • Registered Users Posts: 170 ✭✭seyeM


    Zillah wrote: »
    No it doesn't! I've said this three times, let me try and make it very clear:

    You spend the entire game trying to build up military resources, represented by Effective Military Score. The higher your EMS the better you have done. If you have very low EMS then "Destroy" is the only option you get, with higher EMS you unlock "Control" and then "Synthesis". According to the indoctrination theory, "Destroy" is the only option whereby you defeat the indoctrination. Therefore, if you do really badly during the game you are forced to choose the only option that defeats indoctrination. The better you do the more likely you are to succumb to the Reapers.

    It's retarded.

    No you. With a low EMS the destroy ending wipes out the Earth too. With a Higher EMS the soldiers on earth survive. And in fact, the destroy ending is what benefits from the highest level of EMS, showing shepard taking a breath laying amongst rubble before the credits role. See below.
    0 to 1,749 EMS: Your only choice is to destroy the Reapers. Earth is destroyed.

    1,750 to 1,899 EMS: Shepard can choose to destroy the Reapers, or control them. If you destroy the Reapers, Earth is destroyed in the process as well. If you control the Reapers, Earth is devastated but not destroyed.

    1,900 to 2,349 EMS: Shepard can choose between destroying and controlling Reapers. Both choices save earth, and humanity survives, however Earth's buildings still get vaporized.

    2,350 to 2,649 EMS: Shepard can control Reapers, and save Earth

    2,650 to 2,799 EMS: Shepard can destroy Reapers, and save Earth. Shepard Dies.

    2,800 to 3,999 EMS: Shepard is able to create a link between Synthetics and Organics, and Earth and the Galaxy are saved

    4,000+ EMS: You can destroy the Reapers and Earth is saved. Shepard breathes (Survives).
    http://www.rarityguide.com/articles/articles/1739/1/Mass-Effect-3-Endings-Guide---HEAVY-SPOILERS/Page1.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,129 ✭✭✭_CreeD_


    I think everyone gets your point. They just dont share your point of view.


    Please don't use 'everyone'. While we have clashed from the start on the quality of the ending (I like it, he hates it) I wholeheartedly agreed on the indoctrination debacle - though some responses could be a wee bit more polite. It's a house of cards where so called 'facts' are really what-ifs based on other what-ifs (not in parallel as they are being presented for justification but standing and completely reliant on each other.....like I said a house of cards).

    Very simply indoctrination as described for this theory to work goes against EVERY description of it during the games. It makes NO sense in the context of the ME universe - this is not meant to be offensive to those of you that want it to be true, but wishful thinking does not fact make. And please before you argue this point replay the others (as I did right before 3) and take note of the victim descriptions, the reports and codex entries from various NPCs etc. These are all being ignored by proponents of this theory - they have come up with their own description of how it works custom built to suit the theory, the complete reverse of logical analysis.

    As I said earlier it's entirely possible Bioware will create a DLC with just this at the core, as an afterthought. They see the backlash, they see the fantasy that the disbelieving public are running to and will play to it....and make even more money in the process.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,743 ✭✭✭blatantrereg


    _CreeD_ wrote: »
    Please don't use 'everyone'. While we have clashed from the start on the quality of the ending (I like it, he hates it) I wholeheartedly agreed on the indoctrination debacle - though some responses could be a wee bit more polite. It's a house of cards where so called 'facts' are really what-ifs based on other what-ifs (not in parallel as they are being presented for justification but standing and completely reliant on each other.....like I said a house of cards).

    Very simply indoctrination as described for this theory to work goes against EVERY description of it during the games. It makes NO sense in the context of the ME universe - this is not meant to be offensive to those of you that want it to be true, but wishful thinking does not fact make. And please before you argue this point replay the others (as I did right before 3) and take note of the victim descriptions, the reports and codex entries from various NPCs etc. These are all being ignored by proponents of this theory - they have come up with their own description of how it works custom built to suit the theory, the complete reverse of logical analysis.

    As I said earlier it's entirely possible Bioware will create a DLC with just this at the core, as an afterthought. They see the backlash, they see the fantasy that the disbelieving public are running to and will play to it....and make even more money in the process.
    Reread it. I said everyone understands what he means - however not everyone has the same point of view.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    It is my personal belief that The Reapers are actually angels and that every fifty thousand years they come to slay all of the sinners. Intelligent races develop technology and because of their own hubris think they can play God and create life (AI). The little boy is obviously a representation of Jesus. If you choose to destroy the angels you "wake up" in Hell, as shown by the ruination surrounding Shepard, and in "control" you are destroyed completely because it is the ultimate arrogance. "Synthesis" is purgatory because you try to negotiate a middle ground rather than accept the authority and judgement of God.

    It is just a work of fiction and who knows what the real answer is and I don't care if this makes no sense it is just my opinion and no one can know for sure so don't say I am wrong personally I think this is the best most cleverest ending to a game I have ever seen and bioware are geniuses for tricking us into thinking that they're just terrible writers. There will be DLC where we get to play characters visiting all of the alien worlds spreading the gospel and it will end with Shepard redeeming himself and going to heaven.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    you are an unbelievable twat


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Look you don't have to take it so seriously its just a game stop gettin mad and I'm just sharing my opinion. No one knows what the ending means yet.


  • Legal Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 5,400 Mod ✭✭✭✭Maximilian


    Zillah wrote: »
    Look you don't have to take it so seriously its just a game stop gettin mad and I'm just sharing my opinion. No one knows what the ending means yet.

    I think you're the one taking it seriously. You haven't merely been stating your opinion, rather you have dogmatically been claiming to be right and everyone else wrong.

    But then who doesn't enjoy the taste of salty tears of rage.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    There's a difference between knowing when someone has the wrong answer and knowing the right answer yourself.

    Q: Who was the eleventh president of the United States?
    A: Enda Kenny.


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  • Legal Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 5,400 Mod ✭✭✭✭Maximilian


    Zillah wrote: »
    There's a difference between knowing when someone has the wrong answer and knowing the right answer yourself.

    Q: Who was the eleventh president of the United States?
    A: Enda Kenny.

    Lol. I'll just quote you.
    No one knows what the ending means yet.

    You no more know the mind of Bioware than anyone else. So you simply cannot say any theory advanced is wrong. It's amusing you can't or won't accept that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Therefore the Reapers are angels, duh.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,743 ✭✭✭blatantrereg


    Zillah wrote: »
    It is my personal belief that The Reapers are actually angels and that every fifty thousand years they come to slay all of the sinners. Intelligent races develop technology and because of their own hubris think they can play God and create life (AI). The little boy is obviously a representation of Jesus. If you choose to destroy the angels you "wake up" in Hell, as shown by the ruination surrounding Shepard, and in "control" you are destroyed completely because it is the ultimate arrogance. "Synthesis" is purgatory because you try to negotiate a middle ground rather than accept the authority and judgement of God.

    It is just a work of fiction and who knows what the real answer is and I don't care if this makes no sense it is just my opinion and no one can know for sure so don't say I am wrong personally I think this is the best most cleverest ending to a game I have ever seen and bioware are geniuses for tricking us into thinking that they're just terrible writers. There will be DLC where we get to play characters visiting all of the alien worlds spreading the gospel and it will end with Shepard redeeming himself and going to heaven.
    That's pretty derivative of Evangelion. Watch Evangelion.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,184 ✭✭✭marshbaboon


    I must be the only person that liked the ending. Made me feel that despite the massive struggle only shreds of the entire galaxy could be saved at an enormous cost. The boy seems to be a deliberate chosen form to draw sympathy from Shepard, we don't know who/what he is yet as it's obvious that the story hasn't ended yet.

    There's other themes that I picked up on during the ending such as the limitations of human knowledge and the perils of people trying to play god.

    I see a lot of people complaining about the ending, but none of them actually saying what they'd change the ending to? What did you possibly expect after the first two games?

    We knew the reapers were constructs of harvested races. We knew the citadel was in some way massively involved with the reapers.

    What ending did people expect? Shepard kills all the reapers with a giant I WIN LAZOR without damaging anything else and skips back down to earth for tea and crumpets with his buddies.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,586 ✭✭✭Healium


    tumblr_m0ymds3X5E1qbvroao1_1280.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJ6IHWSU3BX3X7X3Q&Expires=1332029379&Signature=PthLZqSQWbXKcXuZjTdq9cEr0Ww%3D


  • Legal Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 5,400 Mod ✭✭✭✭Maximilian


    I must be the only person that liked the ending. Made me feel that despite the massive struggle only shreds of the entire galaxy could be saved at an enormous cost. The boy seems to be a deliberate chosen form to draw sympathy from Shepard, we don't know who/what he is yet as it's obvious that the story hasn't ended yet.

    There's other themes that I picked up on during the ending such as the limitations of human knowledge and the perils of people trying to play god.

    I see a lot of people complaining about the ending, but none of them actually saying what they'd change the ending to? What did you possibly expect after the first two games?

    We knew the reapers were constructs of harvested races. We knew the citadel was in some way massively involved with the reapers.

    What ending did people expect? Shepard kills all the reapers with a giant I WIN LAZOR without damaging anything else and skips back down to earth for tea and crumpets with his buddies.

    Personally, I had hoped for a room with a door through which the Reapers would try to enter, only for Shepard to close it at the last minute, with the whole process repeating over and over for about 5 minutes. The Reapers would then rage quit the galaxy. Sadly, that didn't happen.


  • Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭namelessguy


    I must be the only person that liked the ending. Made me feel that despite the massive struggle only shreds of the entire galaxy could be saved at an enormous cost. The boy seems to be a deliberate chosen form to draw sympathy from Shepard, we don't know who/what he is yet as it's obvious that the story hasn't ended yet.

    There's other themes that I picked up on during the ending such as the limitations of human knowledge and the perils of people trying to play god.

    I see a lot of people complaining about the ending, but none of them actually saying what they'd change the ending to? What did you possibly expect after the first two games?

    We knew the reapers were constructs of harvested races. We knew the citadel was in some way massively involved with the reapers.

    What ending did people expect? Shepard kills all the reapers with a giant I WIN LAZOR without damaging anything else and skips back down to earth for tea and crumpets with his buddies.

    Just going to leave this here. Full epic discussion here.
    A. First, a few pet peeves. Tropes are very popular for making generalizations about parts of stories we dislike, but they have a tendency to be overused and misused.

    The Crucible isn't a MacGuffin. The best and most common example of an actual MacGuffin is the briefcase in Pulp Fiction; we don't know what is in the briefcase and we don't know how or why it functions, but it's important because it motivates the characters and drives the plot. Basically, a MacGuffin is important only because it's important. The Crucible in Mass Effect 3 is an actual plot device (a MacGuffin is a very specific subset of this); we are told what it is and what it's function is right from the beginning and it's use in the climax is in line with this.

    The Crucible isn't an example of deus ex machina. Again, we know all along that the Crucible's function is to stop the Reapers, it's introduced at the beginning of the story, it's importance is reinforced throughout, and it's function during the climax is in line with what is expected. An example of Mass Effect ending with deus ex machina would be: the Reapers win the battle of Earth and are seemingly unstoppable, suddenly, and with no previous justification, an even more advanced race emerges from deep space and destroys the Reapers, saving Earth. The difference is obvious; one is a clearly defined plot device, the other is a magical fix with no precedent in the story.

    Being the only time I'm going to talk about tropes, and for humorous purposes only, here are some I find more accurate for the ending: the lack of resolution after all the setting-shifting events, especially the lack of clarity in regards to the future of the setting and it's characters (including the protagonist and in some cases the antagonist force) may be considered no ending, the Reaper-God-Child and unexpected side effects of the Crucible may be considered diabolus ex machina, and the sudden shift of themes from hope and fighting the impossible fight to that of true art is angsty can be seen as an example of a sudden downer ending. I'm certain there are more we can shoehorn as applicable, but this is as far as I'm willing to go into tropes.

    I want to iterate that I dislike how much we over analyze tropes and assign them as labels to similar and overgeneralized devices and themes. Stories are usually divergent enough from other stories that generalizing aspects of them with tropes rarely do them justice and are ambigous enough that what tropes a story actually uses are debatable. I only addressed the aforementioned devices of deus ex machina and MacGuffin because they are venerable and distinct enough that their usage in reference to Mass Effect 3 is clearly wrong. TL;DR: tropes are convenient but our time is better spent looking at the specifics of a given story.


    B. The resolution of Mass Effect 3 falls short for many reasons. More than I'd care to get into, truth be told, so I'll try to punch on at least some of the major failings through the eyes of a screenwriter.


    1. The ending feels jarring and out of place and there is little closure, this is a sympton of the ending failing to live up to what we come expect from the story. As I've previously said, "Mass Effect is a conventional story with conventional expectations". A conventional story, almost all stories, follow a pretty standard plotline: Introduction - Ascending Action - Climax - Descending Action - Resolution. In film we break it up into 3 acts, roughly: the first act is the introduction, the second act is the rising action and longest act of the story, and the third act is the climax and resolution.

    Mass Effect 3 and the previous games follow this plotline both as individual stories and in the grand scheme of things as a trilogy (a trilogy is basically the three act structure writ large), that is until the final moments of 3. For reference, The battle for Earth is the climax of the series and the run across no man's land to the Citadel beam is the climax of the specific game; with this in mind, the Citadel sequence is the final part of the descending action and the resolution for both the game and series, the part where the antagonist is finally defeated, the themes and dramatic questions are answered, and the loose ends are tied. Or rather, it should be. After the defeat of the Illusive Man (the antagonist role is somewhat muddled and blurry towards the end of the story, more on that briefly), the protagonist has reached his goal, the defeat of the Reapers is at hand; conventionally, this is where the protagonist would succeed, the Crucible fire, and the Reapers destroyed. Instead, the story grows convoluted (once again, this is supposed to be the resolution) at the height of the scene by jarring us out of it with the bizarre, dreamlike sequence of Sheperd's ascent on the magic platform and the introduction of an ancient and seemingly god-like form who expounds the final choice between three options, all presented symbolically in appearance and action: one which mirrors a co-antagonist's desire which has been reinforced throughout as wrong and contradictory of the protagonist's; one which is downright bizarre and is almost completely outside the scope of the game's main themes save for being somewhat in line with the primary antagonistic forces' goal; and one which accurately mirrors the protagonist's goal from since the beginning. The results of these choices vary and are wide-reaching, creating a massive upheaval of the story world, while being unclear. All of the characters and the entire setting are left to an uncertain and sometimes confusing fate.

    Just looking at what I've typed, it's apparent this is not a resolution. New information is introduced throughout the entire sequence rather than tying loose ends. New information shouldn't be introduced in a resolution unless it directly resolves something or is quickly resolved itself; definitively, it's the opposite of what a resolution is. In layman's terms, this is what makes us feel like there are more questions than answers.

    The fate of the characters and the final destination they reach in the story are crucial to the resolution, especially on the scale of a trilogy. During the ascending action, right before the climax of the no man's land run, we are given a send off from all of the characters; this is both out of order for a conventional plotline (more fitting the descending action rather than ascending) and dimished by the implications of the ending. Ultimately, it is through the characters that we most directly identify with the story and find the meaning, the lack of resolution in this regard is especially unsatisfying.

    The resolution is where the audience is supposed to find the tale's "ever after", be it happy or sad. Mass Effect 3 completely lacks any sense of "ever after".


    2. Video games, like film, are a visual medium; the ending tells us what happens rather than shows us what happens. This is easy to overlook but very important. Visual mediums for story are all about what we see. Another cardinal sin of storytelling commited during the ending is the description of, and differences between, the options in the final choice are almost all conveyed through exposition. The cinematics themselves, what we actually see, are extremely similar and all the implications of the choice we make are conveyed through what the exposition had told us. This is very poor storytelling and worse still to be considered the resolution.


    3. Ambiguity, lack of clarity, plot holes. Relating to the previous points, the ending is excessively ambiguous and unclear. With only unclear exposition before the choice and without sufficient data presented afterwards, many situations are unaccounted for and either lack clarity at best or appear as plot holes at worst. The crash landing of the Normandy is a clear example of this ambiguity, both in it's plausibility and implications for the fate of the crew.


    4. Nothing is gained by breaking convention and attempting to make the ending enigmatic or profound. Assuming this was the writers' goal, this is another failing. Some believe, myself included, that the writers' tried to use the jarring impact of an unconventional, imperfect ending to hammer home a message or theme (presumably: pre-destination, the uncontrollable nature of fate, and the individual's limited ability to impact the world). This, however, comes at the cost of the story and the audience's pleasure, a cost that is far too high for the nature of storytelling.


    5. The resurgence and emphasis on The Illusive Man during the resolution as well as the lack of interaction with the Reapers and, more specifically, Harbinger, detracts from the Reapers as the antagonist. A lot of people expected a "boss fight" of sorts or a closing discussion with Harbinger at the end. This is a perfectly understandable and legitimate expectation. During the climax, we are almost defeated by Harbinger, the avatar for the Reapers as antagonist, however, during the resolution, it is the indoctrinated Illusive Man that takes takes center stage. Though he unwittingly is an assisting force for the Reapers, he is not directly representative of them, merely their influence. TIM's role is more fitting that of an obstacle to be overcome during the rising action.

    The prominance of The Illusive Man as the final foe to be overcome detracts from the overall threat and importance of the true antagonist, the Reapers.




    6. Shepherd is not a tragic hero. A common debate I see is between people who think there should be a happy ending and people who think such an ending would be out of place or impossible, sometimes refering to Shepherd as "tragic". The simple fact is, Shepherd has no tragic flaw nor does he make a tragic mistake; had such a tragic characteristic existed, it could be a foregone conclusion he would die. Overcoming the Reapers may be an impossible task, but the impossible is
    routinely overcome in the Mass Effect trilogy and other epics. As is, there is nothing in the story that would railroad Shepherd towards an inevitable demise, the difficulty of his task makes his death likely, but there's nothing that should remove the possibility of a happy ending. This may be why many people want a "happy" or "brighter" ending, there's no setup nor payoff to Shepherd's death and without those it may feel cheap; storytelling is all about setup and payoff.

    For an example of a good tragic hero, look no farther than Mordin Solus. His tragic mistake was the creation of the genophage. When a desperate need for krogan intervention arose and the genophage was the reason they refused, Mordin fulfilled his tragic role by sacrificing and redeeming himself. There's a big setup for the genophage throughout the series and Mordin's involvement is setup in the second game as a huge internal conflict for him. In three, this all pays off beautifully with either his redemption or brutal murder at Shepherd's hands before he can succeed. This is proper execution for a tragic character. From what I've seen, this is one of the most beloved and well-received storylines in the game; compare that to the ending's reception.


    These points were written as a stream of conscious, I'm sure there are plenty of things I've missed or didn't feel like going in depth about, but I think those are some of the most important ones.


    C. As I was writing this I read the Final Hours thread containing comments from Mac Walters and Casey Hudson as well as Walters' scribbled notes for the ending. Honestly I was taken aback.

    Judging the content Hudson cut based on his feel for "the moment", I'd say his feel for emotional beats and his judgement of what was expendable for story economy was atrocious. The first Mass Effect was inundated at times with exposition and had very poor economy, this ending, on the other hand, is something of an opposite with not nearly enough information.

    Walters' notes scrawled across loose leaf disappointed me. The ideas are clearly not fleshed out at all, strictly drawing board material, the execution we see in game is indicative of that. " Lots of speculation from everyone" is somewhat repulsive, as if providing an unclear, poorly planned ending that leaves your audience unsatisfied and grasping at straws for answers is somehow good storytelling. It gives me the inclination that the ending really was just for publicity.

    I hope it continues to backfire.

    Anyway, I'm off. Any interest or questions or if you want to pick my brain about storytelling, we'll call this a work in progress.


  • Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭namelessguy


    Healium wrote: »
    tumblr_m0ymds3X5E1qbvroao1_1280.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJ6IHWSU3BX3X7X3Q&Expires=1332029379&Signature=PthLZqSQWbXKcXuZjTdq9cEr0Ww%3D

    My new desktop background :D

    In honour of Shields.


  • Registered Users Posts: 78 ✭✭Robdoo


    There's so many things in the last sequence that could point to Shepard being indoctrinated that I don't think it's a coincidence. Also, it's the only way the ending makes sense.

    How awesome would a free DLC that clears the whole issue up be? Alternatively, how much money would a paid DLC that clears it up make EA?

    Whatever way you look at it, we're getting a true ending DLC.


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  • Legal Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 5,400 Mod ✭✭✭✭Maximilian


    If they charge for it, I think the internet will burn with anti-EA rage.


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