Alcoholism in your family?

JupiterKid · 13-03-2012 05:01AM

crapmanjoe wrote: »

I have a friend whose 29 who is the definition of a functioning alcoholic

When we were younger he was first to round up the troops for beers, then when we had enough he'd keep drinking with some one else. Then turned to drinking with any one in the local and now can just drink by himself.

Regularly throws away 4/5 bottles of wine Monday to Thursday at home and then go out Friday and Saturday. Few on Sunday then while watching soccer/ Gaa/ golf / water polo.. Any sports thats on tv and that he can gamble on.

Weird thing is I've never seen the man hung over or eating in general for that matter. Has a slightly strange green look and real red roses cheeks now

Has a good job and never seems to miss a days work. As I said a real functioning piss head.

If he is slightly jaundiced and ruddy cheeked at 29 years of age he is very likely to to die of liver disease before his 45th birthday if he does not stop.

I have a couple of mates that were massive drinkers in their 20s now in their 30s but with partners, kids and a mortgage drink a lot less.

MyKeyG · 13-03-2012 05:05AM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

You are making bold claims that you have no evidence for. If you want your claims to be taken seriously then you should present some evidence to back them or we may as well be arguing which flavour of ice cream is the best*.

*Vanilla.

I never said I wanted my claims to be taken seriously. When did I say that? Oh wait I didn't did I?

I managed to have a constructive conversation with another individual who was willing to debate opinion. The fact that you couldn't be arsed to go through the mountains of articles on Google dealing with the differences between addiction and dependency makes you a complete waste of time. Do you usually need everything spoon fed to you?

To be honest I couldn't care less whether you take my claim seriously or not. I said in my original post that it was my two cents so you can take it or leave it.

I was speaking from personal experience based on what I was told. You can accept it or not. Frankly my dear, I don't give a damn!:D

Shotgun_TEXAS · 13-03-2012 05:07AM

sure its great when your'e young!

Chuck Stone · 13-03-2012 05:16AM

MyKeyG wrote: »

I was speaking from personal experience based on what I was told.

Fair enough.

The onus is on people who make claims to provide evidence for them - especially people who would have you believe they are experts.

MyKeyG · 13-03-2012 05:20AM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Fair enough.

The onus is on people who make claims to provide evidence for them - especially people who would have you believe they are experts.

Never claimed to be an expert there chief! I stated what my psychiatrist told me.

I know because it's what I was told by a psychologist and senior psychiatrist.

Some would say the burden of proof is on the accuser and you didn't come up with a whole lot to prove I was wrong either to be fair. At least I offered the claim that there was plenty of information on Google, which there is.

But there's really no point protracting the debate, I doubt it will get us very far.

Chuck Stone · 13-03-2012 05:27AM

MyKeyG wrote: »

Never claimed to be an expert there chief!

I know. I was talking about people who do claim to be experts.

Some would say the burden of proof is on the accuser and you didn't come up with a whole lot to prove I was wrong either to be fair.

I wasn't accusing I was asking for evidence.

At least I offered the claim that there was plenty of information on Google, which there is.

I bet if I googled 'how to levitate' there'd be some whack-job saying 'buy these magic beans and make soup and'...

But there's really no point protracting the debate, I doubt it will get us very far.

Well it's not costing us much other than our time.

MyKeyG · 13-03-2012 05:30AM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I know. I was talking about people who do claim to be experts.

I wasn't accusing I was asking for evidence.

I bet if I googled 'how to levitate' there'd be some whack-job saying 'buy these magic beans and make soup and'...

Well it's not costing us much other than our time.

Ah feck it I think there's a bottle of whiskey in the kitchen press

Going back on topic though personally I feel the thread title really deals with the nature v nurture concept. Is alcoholism hereditary or is it acquired? Obviously following on from my own opinions on the sickness I would say nurture. Therefore if something is learned it can be unlearned.

Chuck Stone · 13-03-2012 05:46AM

MyKeyG wrote: »

Is alcoholism hereditary or is it acquired? Obviously following on from my own opinions on the sickness I would say nurture. Therefore if something is learned it can be unlearned.

I'm much more comfortable with the nurture hypothesis myself but that's because it's in keeping with my pinko, liberal, lack-of-hugs reasoning for the problems of the world. :pac:

MyKeyG · 13-03-2012 05:52AM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I'm much more comfortable with the nurture hypothesis myself but that's because it's in keeping with my pinko, liberal, lack-of-hugs reasoning for the problems of the world. :pac:

Damn didn't know I was debating with a hippy:D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2ZwJiK0fJ0

3rdDegree · 13-03-2012 05:54AM

MyKeyG wrote: »

Alcoholism is a biological addiction and shouldn't be confused with alcohol dependency which is a much more common problem.

I honestly didn't know there was a difference! So, now that you brought it up, what is the difference?

LH Pathe · 13-03-2012 06:20AM

Dependency is withdrawal symptoms from having gotten too used to it, is it.. and biological alcoholismicism is when you're craving just a.. little of that hard stuff up on the shelf to really warm your bottle. But don't have the vocabulary to ask yet

MyKeyG · 13-03-2012 06:33AM

LH Pathe wrote: »

Dependency is withdrawal symptoms from having gotten too used to it, is it.. and biological alcoholismicism is when you're craving just a.. little of that hard stuff up on the shelf to really warm your bottle. But don't have the vocabulary to ask yet

This is pretty much it in a nut shell. A good example is the one I found on an article regarding medication.

Addiction is a biological and psychological condition that compels a person to satisfy their need for a particular stimulus and to keep satisfying it, no matter what...A good example of dependence is a heavy coffee drinker's use of caffeine. If you are used to drinking several cups of coffee each day, you soon learn about physical dependence when you miss a day or two. This does not mean you are addicted to the caffeine; it only means your body is surprised not to see what it has come to expect.

This can often be the way with habitual drinkers. For me it wasn't a craving for alcohol but rather that I was dependent on it to solve my anxiety issues. I thought I needed it to function normally. If I wasn't having panic attacks I wasn't inclined to drink. People who suffer from alcoholism will abuse alcohol primarily because of it's euphoric effects, they do it because they want to get drunk.

A lot of people have disputed this but there is quite a lot of evidence available on the distinction. Whether you choose to believe what you read or not is another matter entirely.

44leto · 13-03-2012 09:14AM

Babybuff wrote: »

there is no evidence to suggest it is
http://alcoholism.about.com/cs/alerts/l/blnaa18.htm

I could certainly put up links that also suggests there are, even certain racial groups have different tendencies which definitely suggests a genetic link. I know from my own experience there are addictive personalities. But having the genes for a condition does not necessarily mean you will get that condition. Genetic profiling for diseases is more genetic astrology then science there are other factors. There are no clear genetic markers for things like alcoholism, depression, intelligence, even been an introvert and extrovert. But their are familial factors that may predict, but not necessarily.

You can draw an analogy with rolling a dice, the dice is weighed for some people to become alcoholics, it has a higher chance of it happening. We all know them people that can drink, sense able, and we all know people who can't (or shouldn't) the same applies to drugs, sex, exercise and even eating. We really have less free choice then our genes allow.

As I said above I am pretty sure given the right circumstances I could be a very enthusiastic alcoholic and yes the condition runs right through my family history.

OwaynOTT · 13-03-2012 09:30AM

I'd had a friend who said someone in my family wasn't an alcoholic but a drunk. What's the difference?

Kiera · 13-03-2012 10:25AM

Dudess wrote: »

Similar for my dad's side - his uncles. Not his father, although he died pretty young. My parents do drink but not that often. I think the fact that some children of alcoholics (e.g. my mum and her brother) ensure they don't abuse alcohol after what it turns their parents into, flies in the face of the genetic thing. It might be a learned behaviour, but I don't see how it could be literally in one's genes.

Yeah i never really thought about it tbh. It could very well be a learnt thing in some. Thinking about it now I also have an Aunt who was an alcoholic and her daughter became one too.

phil1nj · 13-03-2012 10:49AM

OwaynOTT wrote: »

I'd had a friend who said someone in my family wasn't an alcoholic but a drunk. What's the difference?

I think this is the start of an oft told joke: :" I'm not an alcoholic, I'm a drunk. Alcoholics go to meetings."

Anyone · 13-03-2012 10:55AM

My dad is an alcoholic as is 2 of his brothers. So does it run in the family? My guess would be yes, but its down to the perception of alcohol in that family.

Its a ****ty addiction by the way, destroys lives and not just those of the alcoholic. In my opinion its a far more destructive drug that most illegal drugs, as its freely available and socially acceptable to use.

gollywog · 13-03-2012 11:04AM

Im an alcoholic but ive been sober nearly three years, when i was drinking i never realised how much i was putting my family and friends through, i have alot of regrets. I gave up when i was 23 and at that early stage i was literally dying, amazing to think back i knew i could have lost my life but continued drinking before i saw the light!I ended up drinking from the second i woke up in the morning until the third time i went to bed each day, shocking volumes of alcohol. I know for a fact if i so much took a sip of alcohol now i wouldnt have the strength to stop again and id surely end up drinking myself to death... scary stuff altogether. But I have a great life now, im not AA as much as most in my situation, find alot of things wrong with it tbh. But im a very lucky guy and am so happy to be in this situation now, so if there is anybody reading this who thinks they are a hopeless case, dont despair, just give it a good hard try and hopefully you'll get through it, best decision i've ever made

minidazzler · 13-03-2012 11:06AM

My Maternal Grandfather is an alcoholic, he is forced to be off it now, but he's still one.

I've a very addictive personality, I can be literally addicted to people if they provide my brain with enough pleasure, so I probably drink far too often and far too much, but it's par for the course among my friends and I'm still quite young so I'm OK with it.

I'd be much more afraid of gambling, my mother is awful if she gets going on internet gambling because she doesn't see it as real money. I will never start gambling as a serious thing, maybe 15 euro buy ins for poker but never more simply because I know that if I really started I'd never stop...you can only drink so much, but you can gamble everything down to the fillings in your teeth.

mickrock · 13-03-2012 12:03PM

If you're addicted to heroin, cocaine, cannabis or any other drug you're not considered to be victim of an inherited disease, so why should alcohol be any different?

The unproven disease model of "alcoholism" hinders lots of alcohol addicts in stopping for good.

"I've got this disease which compels me to drink. I can't help it. There's nothing I can do about it."

mathepac · 13-03-2012 12:11PM

Hot Lips wrote: »

Sure there is,an addictive personality refers to a particular set of personality traits that make an individual predisposed to addictions.

Google it,I did.

Thankfully I can rely on authorities slightly more reliable than what good old Google, everyman's reference toolbox, scrapes out of the interweb..

Nothingbetter2d · 13-03-2012 12:12PM

Kimia wrote: »

With Paddy's day around the corner and the inevitable drinking that will ensue, I got to thinking about Ireland and drinking etc. I have several alcoholics in my family - one who just seems to be revving up - and at this stage I'm almost out of sympathy and am just sick of it. I live in Canada and it seems that noone I've met here has several alcoholics in their family like I do here.

Does alcoholism run in your family?

yes

on my mother's side of the family she has 2 brothers and 2 sisters that are all raging alcoholics

her uncle and one of her aunts (my mother's mother's sister and brother) were also alcoholics.

my oldest brother also drinks alot.

i enjoy a few beers too but health (IBS) and finances no longer affords me the option to go for beers as often as i used to.

number10a · 13-03-2012 12:15PM

None in my family.

Now, if we were in any other country, about 90% of us would be put away to "dry out". But, as we're in Ireland, we all just "like our drink".

My father nearly dropped dead when visiting family in America. At some party type event, no one had more than three *glasses* (not pints) of beer! He couldn't have any more then for fear of making a show of himself. Nearly drank Aer Lingus dry on the way home.

mathepac · 13-03-2012 12:16PM

MyKeyG wrote: »

Whoop de freakin do. Medical professionals differ in opinions, anything else you want to tell us that we already actually know?

Typical and predictable response when the authority of "I know it's true - that man told me so you're wrong [stamps foot]" Mammy!" expertise is challenged.

ash23 · 13-03-2012 12:32PM

My dad is/was one (doesn't drink now) and his brother is/was too (but he gave up a number of years ago)
My mums brother is an alcoholic - gave up for a number of years but is back drinking again.

The rest of the family all enjoy a drink but as far as I know, nobody has a drinking problem.

HalloweenJack · 13-03-2012 12:56PM

My brother, my father and my father's father are all alcoholics. There's also a considerable history of mental illness or disorders or my father's side of the family.

My brother's recovering and has been sober for nearly nine years. My father hasn't recovered, I don't know what's the longest he's gone without a drink, maybe a few weeks. My grandfather died at 78, he'd had about five or six strokes at that point.

Despite this, I still drink, frequently. I avoid drink when I'm angry or depressed as I see that being a big link with developing a problem. There've been periods when I drank a lot and had I not cut back, I'm certain I would have developed a problem. When I was depressed, I drank a lot (in quantity). However, now, I can't drink as much.

I'm no doctor but, from my own experiences and that of my family, to me, alcoholism is based on your reasons for drinking. If you're angry or depressed, maybe even bored, you should avoid alcohol. It's a mood enhancer and it's just going to make you more angry or depressed or bored.

Again, this is my interpretation and I don't have any scientific basis for it, I'm just going on what I've seen in the people I know who have suffered from it.

mathepac · 13-03-2012 01:21PM

HalloweenJack wrote: »

... It's a mood enhancer and it's just going to make you more angry or depressed or bored...

You're observation that alcohol alters mood gives insight into the reason people drink - there's an emotional reward for consuming the stuff in the short term. But the price to be paid later, sometimes even in the same drinking session, is the negative side of the equation.

Alcohol alters moods but ultimately it is one of a group of drugs that act as central nervous system depressants and it can, like other drugs in it's class, have long-term negative effects on the lives of a certain group of its consumers as well as their families and friends.

Alcohol is the the greatest solvent ever invented - it can remove you from your family, your friends, your home, your job and ultimately even your life.

ha ha hello · 13-03-2012 01:47PM

"Hi, I'm Randy... and I just really like beer"

skinsseries3 · 13-03-2012 01:57PM

My Dad is an alcoholic, and has been for the past 8 years or so. He has been in and out of treatment centers during that time only to come right out of them and start drinking again. Alcoholism is on both my parents sides.

I have lost any hope of recovery for him, and have pretty much successfully cut him out of my life, however my sister and his siblings continue to hope that he will see sense and soon hit the 'rock bottom' everyone says is necessary in order to begin recovery.

Its pretty incredible how much one persons's problem can affect and destroy an entire family unit. I can't imagine I will ever fully be able forgive him for all that he has caused, regardless of the fact that I know it is a disease and he can't help it.

I recently returned home from working abroad for a year and I can hardly believe the physical and mental change in him since I left. Alcohol has literally stripped him of his mind and body, he is hardly human anymore and in my eyes, although it is terrible to say it, would be better off dead than living the way he currently is.

I hope that anyone in a similar position know to be extra conscious of their relationship with alcohol, as I have become. I wouldn't wish the situation he is in on my worst enemy.

Kosseegan · 13-03-2012 02:14PM

Some people have an allergy to the food upon which the drink is based, eg wheat. This was demonstrated by Dr. Richard Mackarness in his book "Not all in the Mind" published in 1976. It is highly likely food allergies run in families and hence a predisposition to fall into alcoholism.
It has also been noted that the children of non drinkers and the children of alcoholics are more likely to have a problem with drink. No example is worse than good example.
Anyone who is addicted to anything will justify it to themselves so alcoholics are always going to make weak and delusional excuses to explain their behaviour.

Alcoholism in your family?

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