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Competition Authority clears joint venture between RTÉ and TG4 for NI Mulitplex

  • 24-02-2012 05:04PM
    #1
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭


    http://www.tca.ie/EN/News--Publications/News-Releases/Competition-Authority-clears-joint-venture-between-RT-and-TG4-.aspx
    The Competition Authority has cleared the creation of a joint venture between Raidió Teilifís Éireann (RTÉ) and Teilifís na Gaeilge (TG4). The proposed joint venture will create Multiplex Broadcasting Services N.I. Limited. The deal must now be cleared by the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation. It was notified to the Authority under the Competition Act 2002 on 7 December 2011.

    The Authority carried out an intensive investigation which involved research, obtaining the views of competitors and television advertising customers (including advertising agencies), extensive information from the parties themselves and consulting with the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland, the Commission for Communications Regulation and the UK Communications Regulator. None of these agencies opposed the deal.

    As a result of the investigation, the Authority found that the creation of Multiplex Broadcasting Services N.I. Limited will not substantially lessen competition in the market for the sale of television advertising in the State.

    During the investigation we focused on three possible problem areas where competition concerns might arise:

    · the possible impact on competition between Multiplex Broadcasting Services N.I. Limited and one or both of its parent companies, RTÉ and TG4

    · possible co-ordination between RTÉ and TG4 on the sale of television advertising airtime

    · possible price increases for television advertising airtime, particularly by RTÉ, if the joint venture goes ahead, or any anti-competitive consequences of an increase in RTÉ’s position in the market

    As with all media mergers, the deal can only go ahead if the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation does not direct the Authority to carry out a full (phase 2) investigation within 10 days. We will publish a public version of the decision on our website (www.tca.ie) by 23 April 2012, after the parties have had the opportunity to request that confidential information be removed.

    FAQ Answer: TnaG is separate to RTÉ.


Comments

  • #2
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    The Pope is Catholic too.

    The Competition Authority was never going to block this political sop.

    Did anyone ask us if we wanted to pay for this? It's not free.


  • #3
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    watty wrote: »
    The Competition Authority was never going to block this political sop.

    Did anyone ask us if we wanted to pay for this? It's not free.

    Why are they putting up a Multiplex exactly? other then they have political scope to broadcast into NI. Will they sell part of the Mux to other NI broadcasters? Are RTÉ 1, 2 and TG4 available on FreeView? I thought they would have just sat on one of the existing muxes in the north.


  • #4
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Also just a point about FreeView but IMO looking at the line up across the UK I think while there should be variations I would be more interested in having either S/4C or BBC Alba replace any of the +1 service or any of the so called lifestyle channel (home shopping channels). even if ITV could do a deal with UTV and STV to have their +1 channel replace ITV+1 where ITV would sell advertising for England. E.G.

    In England and Wales you get UTV+1 or STV+1, while in Scotland and NI you get ITV 1+1. (with local advertising sold by the local Channel 3 licence holder).

    NI line up
    UTV
    STV+1
    ITV1+2

    England Line up
    ITV 1
    STV +1
    UTV +2

    Wales Line up
    ITV 1
    UTV +1
    STV +2

    Scotland Line up
    STV
    UTV +1
    ITV 1+2


  • #5
    channnels
    Closed Accounts Posts: 36 ✭channnels


    Elmo wrote: »
    Also just a point about FreeView but IMO looking at the line up across the UK I think while there should be variations I would be more interested in having either S/4C or BBC Alba replace any of the +1 service or any of the so called lifestyle channel (home shopping channels). even if ITV could do a deal with UTV and STV to have their +1 channel replace ITV+1 where ITV would sell advertising for England. E.G.

    In England and Wales you get UTV+1 or STV+1, while in Scotland and NI you get ITV 1+1. (with local advertising sold by the local Channel 3 licence holder).

    NI line up
    UTV
    STV+1
    ITV1+2

    England Line up
    ITV 1
    STV +1
    UTV +2

    Wales Line up
    ITV 1
    UTV +1
    STV +2

    Scotland Line up
    STV
    UTV +1
    ITV 1+2

    Erm are we now down to discussing unlikely channel configurations?


  • #6
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Elmo wrote: »
    Why are they putting up a Multiplex exactly? other then they have political scope to broadcast into NI. Will they sell part of the Mux to other NI broadcasters? Are RTÉ 1, 2 and TG4 available on FreeView? I thought they would have just sat on one of the existing muxes in the north.

    No it's separate to Freeview. There is no Irish Channel on Freeview. There will be no UK channels on it.
    It's a separate Green White & Orange only Mini-Mux in NI. RTE & TG4 no UK or TV3.
    It will be the first DVB-T2 mux in UK not dedicated to HD only. Mostly SD. Not clear if RTE2 is HD or SD.

    Where have you been the last year?


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  • #7
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,392 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Elmo wrote: »
    Why are they putting up a Multiplex exactly? other then they have political scope to broadcast into NI. Will they sell part of the Mux to other NI broadcasters? Are RTÉ 1, 2 and TG4 available on FreeView? I thought they would have just sat on one of the existing muxes in the north.

    You've lots of catching up to do it seems.

    Part of the MoU signed between the two governments back in Feb 2010 following a year or more of discussion.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=75532781#post75532781
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=74941960#post74941960
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=69656821#post69656821
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056119408

    http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/cm200910/cmselect/cmniaf/237/237.pdf
    http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20101117105445/http://www.digitaltelevision.gov.uk/publications/pub_UK-ROI-MOU.html
    http://www.dtg.org.uk/dtg/press_release.php?id=27
    http://www.digitaltelevision.gov.uk/publications/pub_technote_tg4_NI.html
    http://www.culture.gov.uk/publications/8501.aspx
    http://www.e-tenders.gov.ie/search/show/search_view.aspx?ID=NOV287941


  • #8
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Jesus lads you can be such piss artists.
    channnels wrote: »
    Erm are we now down to discussing unlikely channel configurations?

    Erm Why not? It is the United Kingdom isn't it. Surely S/4C would be a better TV channel then bloody QVC.
    No it's separate to Freeview. There is no Irish Channel on Freeview. There will be no UK channels on it.
    It's a separate Green White & Orange only Mini-Mux in NI. RTE & TG4 no UK or TV3.
    It will be the first DVB-T2 mux in UK not dedicated to HD only. Mostly SD. Not clear if RTE2 is HD or SD.

    Where have you been the last year?

    I just assumed that RTÉ and TG4 would go on available space on MUXs in NI. FFS.


  • #9
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Too ****ing sensible for my own good. I assumed the MoU just allowed for RTÉ 1, 2 and TG4 to be available in NI, and would sit along side other FreeView Channels. (I won't deal with the BBC in the post as some people don't like unlikely channel configurations and well its been discussed to death, but then it looks like so has this).

    I just assumed that the 3 channels would go on to Freeview, wouldn't this be the most sensible thing to do? This will mean that many in the North won't receive these channels until they upgrade to DVB/T2, is this correct?

    This new mux (far from being a Green, White and Orange mux) isn't on FreeView EPGs?????

    It is as though they don't want people to know that the 3 channels are available on a Free basis in NI. So they have made it more difficult for them to get it, or at least complicated things.


  • #10
    icdg
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,707 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    Moved to Terrestrial.

    Elmo can you maybe start a new thread if you really do want to discuss very unlikely channel combinations...

    I'm not even sure why the Competition Authority were investigating it in the first place, given that the product being proposed is being proposed for outside the state.

    I can't see why the channels wouldn't on the Freeview EPG, despite not being part of the Freeview consortium. In NI I'd imagine the average viewer won't distinguish.


  • #11
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,392 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Elmo wrote: »
    I just assumed that RTÉ and TG4 would go on available space on MUXs in NI. FFS.

    Not enough capacity on the existing muxes for 3/4 new TV channels and a radio channel.

    The new mini-mux channels will be on the Freeview epg but will use the FreeviewHD standard DVB-T2/MPEG-4, so a FreeviewHD receiver will be required. LCN's not known yet.

    Saorview overspill into NI is estimated at 60% population coverage, the mini-mux is expected to increase coverage of RTÉ/TG4 to over 90% in NI.


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  • #12
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    icdg wrote: »
    Moved to Terrestrial.

    Elmo can you maybe start a new thread if you really do want to discuss very unlikely channel combinations...

    I'm not even sure why the Competition Authority were investigating it in the first place, given that the product being proposed is being proposed for outside the state.

    I can't see why the channels wouldn't on the Freeview EPG, despite not being part of the Freeview consortium. In NI I'd imagine the average viewer won't distinguish.

    I was just going to mention you ICDG, little gets posted in Broadcasting you'd wonder why its remains. It should be also posted in Broadcasting as much as in terrestrial.


  • #13
    STB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭STB


    icdg wrote: »

    I'm not even sure why the Competition Authority were investigating it in the first place, given that the product being proposed is being proposed for outside the state.


    The mini mux is to fulfill the terms of the MOU as part of the Good Friday agreement. That is that all people on the Island of Ireland have access to Irish PSB TV.

    And I agree it was unnecessary. More expense To keep McRedmond et al in Sandyford happy who weren't invited to the party as they are a commercial operator (and have a lot of similar content to UTV) but still don't want RTE making money in NI to cover TX costs, no doubt pointing the finger at having unfair advantage of being a more prospective advertising platform given their cross border reach terrestrially . After that its all bureaucracy. Nothing more nothing less.

    I am sure that the joint venture was required so that RTE wouldn't be lumbered with all the infrastructural costs that they have been lumbered with here for Saorview.

    The question still remains, how much did Tv3 contribute to the infrastructural costs for Saorview, a platform they will utilise for FTA terrestrial broadcasting in Ireland.


  • #14
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Nothing.
    Same as Analogue. They simply rent use.

    In N.I. Minimux RTE will have most of the cost and TG4 only a proportion.


  • #15
    MACHEAD
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 500 ✭✭MACHEAD


    I wonder has anyone considered the possibility of 'regional' advertising on the 'northern' service. Understandably the vast majority of RTÉ viewers up here will probably receive Saorview from cross border Tx's, and therefor will only see the 'national output'. But for the households who will only be able to get a relieable service via the minimux, surely there is scope here for an additional advertising revenue stream for RTÉ / TG4.


  • #16
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    STB wrote: »
    And I agree it was unnecessary. More expense To keep McRedmond et al in Sandyford happy who weren't invited to the party as they are a commercial operator (and have a lot of similar content to UTV) but still don't want RTE making money in NI to cover TX costs, no doubt pointing the finger at having unfair advantage of being a more prospective advertising platform given their cross border reach terrestrially . After that its all bureaucracy. Nothing more nothing less.

    If TV3 thought about it they could merge TV3 and 3e into one channel for NI audience if they really wanted. 3NI if you like. I am sure that the extra cost of That's 70s Show for an NI audience wouldn't be all that much.

    06:00 - 10:00 VB Repeat and Ireland AM
    10:00 - 11:00 FYI/Xpose Repeat
    11:00 - 13:00 Morning Show/Midday
    13:00 - 17:30 As 3E
    17:30 - 19:00 5:30 News/FYI/Xpose
    19:00 - 23:00 As 3E with some TV3 Irish programming
    23:00 - 00:00 VB
    00:00 - 02:00 As TV3
    02:00 - 06:00 Infomercials.

    They might even make some money out of it. They might even make some money out of it. (well prob just the cost, way into the UK market) Also I am sure TCA were also pleasing UTV Media who own Radio stations in this market.


  • #17
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,392 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    watty wrote: »
    In N.I. Minimux RTE will have most of the cost and TG4 only a proportion.

    The UK government is paying TG4 costs.


  • #18
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,461 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Box O' Frogs!


  • #19
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,584 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    MACHEAD wrote: »
    I wonder has anyone considered the possibility of 'regional' advertising on the 'northern' service. Understandably the vast majority of RTÉ viewers up here will probably receive Saorview from cross border Tx's, and therefor will only see the 'national output'. But for the households who will only be able to get a relieable service via the minimux, surely there is scope here for an additional advertising revenue stream for RTÉ / TG4.

    RTE are not even allowed to advertise on RTE News Now.

    There is plenty of scope for additional advertising for RTE if they were allowed RTE 3/RTE Plus, but they were stymied by the last Minister (part time) Carey on his last day in office.


  • #20
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    RTE are not even allowed to advertise on RTE News Now.

    Technically there is nothing stopping RTÉ advertising on RTÉ News Now on the web while replacing those ads on Broadcast RTÉ News Now with RTÉ Promos.


  • #21
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,584 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Elmo wrote: »
    Technically there is nothing stopping RTÉ advertising on RTÉ News Now on the web while replacing those ads on Broadcast RTÉ News Now with RTÉ Promos.

    Except the cost of doing so. They have been denied advertising on a channel for no good reason and cannot therefor provide a proper service. Even allowing a sponsor would allow some journalistic input and som schedule to be developed. It is a disgrace, and the decision to disallow RTE 3/RTE Plus has meant the RTE have decided to just ignore Saorview - probably until after its 'launch' on 24th October 2012.

    They could have had a good news channel, not just repeats and simulcasts with ticker-tapes destroying the picture. They could have used MHEG 5 to create the same daft effect for those that like it, leaving those, like myself, to just watch the picture in full frame.


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  • #22
    Mr. Rabbit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 778 ✭✭✭Mr. Rabbit


    I'm surprised TG4 wont be on the Freeview Lite transmitters in NI, post DSO, in the same way as BBC Alba is in Scotland.

    Though there might be an outcry if we lost BBC Radio.


  • #23
    blackius
    Closed Accounts Posts: 469 ✭✭blackius


    STB wrote: »

    I am sure that the joint venture was required so that RTE wouldn't be lumbered with all the infrastructural costs that they have been lumbered with here for Saorview.
    Surely it is we the licence payers and not RTE as we are it's owners , as such that were lumbered with that and I'm not sure lumbered is the right word given the infrastructure is in public ownership and it's a required updating.
    The question still remains, how much did Tv3 contribute to the infrastructural costs for Saorview, a platform they will utilise for FTA terrestrial broadcasting in Ireland.
    They should as a private operator be only paying a negotiated rental.
    The fact that this does not cover the cost of all the equipment up front is normal.
    If they are not paying up,there is a public process to turf them off the system.


  • #24
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,392 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    STB wrote: »
    The question still remains, how much did Tv3 contribute to the infrastructural costs for Saorview, a platform they will utilise for FTA terrestrial broadcasting in Ireland.

    RTÉNL charges TV3 (and other broadcasters) for transmission, distribution etc. based on a tarriff model. The tarriff model is calculated on operating costs and a charge based on capital costs.

    RTÉNL haven't published the updated tarriff model since early 2008. Elmo did post some RTÉNL mux costs last year which he said came from them.


  • #25
    STB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭STB


    blackius wrote: »
    Surely it is we the licence payers and not RTE as we are it's owners , as such that were lumbered with that and I'm not sure lumbered is the right word given the infrastructure is in public ownership and it's a required updating.
    They should as a private operator be only paying a negotiated rental.
    The fact that this does not cover the cost of all the equipment up front is normal.
    If they are not paying up,there is a public process to turf them off the system.

    RTENL is a wholly owned subsidary of RTE.

    RTE receive both licence fee monies and commercial income. In a normal year this budget would cover their outgoing etc. They have been loss making, breakeven and slightly profitable as an organisation over the last decade or so. In recent recssionary years they are loss making. Yet, they had to budget the €70m from within its own existing budget for the introduction of a new digital platform as required under EU law. They did not get any additional monies from the exchequer in which to set up the infrastructure. No wonder they are operating at a defecit. There seems to be a Field of Dreams buzz going on.

    If a commercial operator doesnt want to pay, then yes some of those monies that otherwise could be used by RTE for other programming puroposes will/could be lost and the taxpayer ends up defraying the costs of a commercial operation.

    TV3 had an existing transmission contract since 1997. Their contract says they have to have x amount of terrestrial coverage. I have seen the figures they pay for analogue transmission carriage.

    Saorview the digital service has been on air on the main sites since August 2008. RTE rolled out the rest of the network and fill ins between then and Summer last year. But it has been on continously since August 2008.

    What I am curious to know is how much TV3 have paid for the digital service being carried since August 2008 (a year in which TV3's advertising income was €62m) ? Are they contributing ?
    The Cush wrote: »
    RTÉNL charges TV3 (and other broadcasters) for transmission, distribution etc. based on a tarriff model. The tarriff model is calculated on operating costs and a charge based on capital costs.

    RTÉNL haven't published the updated tarriff model since early 2008. Elmo did post some RTÉNL mux costs last year which he said came from them.

    @ Cush, yeah I understand the capital element in the tariff. And I have read the Tx costs which you yourself have posted in the past. Are we sure that they are distinguishing between analogue and digital carriage ? I note that Tv3's TX (analogue only if that is the case) costs have dropped from €2.36m to €1.5m between 2006 and 2011.


  • #26
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,392 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    STB wrote: »
    What I am curious to know is how much TV3 have paid for the digital service being carried since August 2008 ?

    To get a definitive you'd have to ask RTÉNL or TV3 or your local TD to get an answer via a Dáil question

    Two Dáil questions were asked on this last May (see my post here). From the answers given it appears that neither TV3 nor TG4 paid anything to to the official public launch at the end of May at least. Since the launch we've had no information.
    Due to the nature of this pilot phase [Oct2010-May2011], it was considered appropriate that TG4, TV3 and other third party broadcasters would not be charged for DTT services during this period. However, broadcasters including TV3 and TG4 will be required to pay for DTT services on the RTÉ digital network thereafter.

    http://debates.oireachtas.ie/dail/2011/05/18/00099.asp#N2
    STB wrote: »
    Are we sure that they are distinguishing between analogue and digital carriage ? I note that Tv3's TX (analogue) costs have dropped from €2.36m to €1.5 between 2006 and 2011.

    We're not sure because they haven't published an up to date DTT Tarriff Model or Schedule or Charges for DTT.

    According to Elmo's post the cost per DTT SD channel would be in the region of €750,000 (from 51 sites), if that's correct that would be half of what they were paying from 12 analogue transmitters.


  • #27
    Elmo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    The Cush wrote: »
    To get a definitive you'd have to ask RTÉNL or TV3 or your local TD to get an answer via a Dáil question

    Two Dáil questions were asked on this last May (see my post here). From the answers given it appears that neither TV3 nor TG4 paid anything to to the official public launch at the end of May at least. Since the launch we've had no information.


    We're not sure because they haven't published an up to date DTT Tarriff Model or Schedule or Charges for DTT.

    According to Elmo's post the cost per DTT SD channel would be in the region of €750,000 (from 51 sites), if that's correct that would be half of what they were paying from 12 analogue transmitters.

    I assume that the Tarriffs are changing. I also assume that TV3 and TG4 are now paying. I must get my TDs to ask the questions again ;)


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