Why is sexism such a difficult topic?

B0jangles · 16-02-2012 09:04PM

Feathers wrote: »

I was just saying that if the goal is to improve equality, it would be more affective to come at the issue from a less blame-laying standpoint.

Google "Tone Argument" to discover why this suggestion is a standard technique for derailing and silencing.

(Not saying that you are doing this intenetionally, but it is really unhelpful)

See http://derailingfordummies.com/ for the complete listing. It ridiculous how many of the standard derail tactics listed there have shown up repeatedly in this one thread.

Bigtoe107 · 16-02-2012 09:07PM

I don't know how to multi quote so im going to just give a general reply.

I genuinely blushed when i realised the babe thing

Lola your tone is quite condescending, I didn't intend to be charming, I was mearly expressing things from a males point of view. I agree women are under pressure but what im trying to say is this is a societal issue not a gender issue. Both men and women will benefit from a change in attitude. Also I understand that my opinion ins't concrete but nobody opinions are. Men choose to work in these sectors the same way women choose to work at home or have kids. It is expected that men work in these dangerous conditions

RDM_83 again · 16-02-2012 09:08PM

PrincessLola wrote: »

Like it or not, men have descriminated against women on a large institutionalised scale, misogyny still exists in internalised attitudes. Why should feminism have to tip-toe around you?

Misogyny definitely still exists, but the emphasis should be place on your use of have apart from a few examples mentioned in this thread I don't see any evidence of of what could be termed anti-female discrimination in an institutional or legal sense. This attitudes are changing however from my point of view the effects of class, geography, and Family have a much more corrosive effect on the caliber and diversity of those who manage to enter the 'higher' levels of society (Billy Barry kids at RTE etc)

as an aside in relation politics I remember a quote a told to me by a friend quoting his father (who was fairly senior in the last goverment) in relation to Harney "and people say Ireland has never had a female Taoiseach )

Bannasidhe · 16-02-2012 09:11PM

dark crystal wrote: »

Now it's overreactions like this that tend to give feminism a bad name, imo.

Police advising women to stay in after dark to protect themselves from a rampaging killer of women suddenly equals male opression over the female gender - it's just daft logic.

I, for one, would certainly not be outraged if it was suggested by the police that in order to protect myself from a woman-murdering maniac roaming the streets of town, it may be in my best interest to stay in after dark to avoid meeting a rather nasty end. In fact, I wouldn't need the police to work that out for myself.

The reason they didn't advise men to do the same was because the male of the species didn't interest Sutcliffe, seeing as he only enjoyed killing women.

I'm sure there wasn't a law prohibiting women from working after dark, it was most probably a warning to women to be extra cautious when having to go out after dark and avoid it altogether if at all possible (I'm sure they knew women had to work unsociable hours - they're not stupid people)

If this is really what made some women angry, instead of the fact that a guy was out killing women based on their gender, it implies that in this case, feminism really overtook logic. In this case, my life would certainly take priority over my idealogical principles for sure.

Would you like to accuse me of hysterical over-reaction now or would you like to wait a bit.

Let me just be clear that I understand your point:

Women murdered by man over a 5 year period = women told to stay home every night for 5 years or else...= querying the logic of this and stating it was not practical as women had to bloody well work = overreacting women giving feminism a bad name.

Well, sorry guys - it appears I am the one responsible for giving feminism a bad name.

Who knew I had such power...and a high butchness quotient too...

Right since I have all this power- I'm gonna get medieval on someone unless I get some complements about being butch soon

(Ye have a few minutes as I am washing the dog, doing laundry and baking a cake. )

Feathers · 16-02-2012 09:12PM

B0jangles wrote: »

Google "Tone Argument" to discover why this suggestion is a standard technique for derailing and silencing.

(Not saying that you are doing this intenetionally, but it is really unhelpful)

See http://derailingfordummies.com/ for the complete listing. It ridiculous how many of the standard derail tactics listed there have shown up repeatedly in this one thread.

This is the first result, so I'm going to go with it:

http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Tone_argument wrote:

A tone argument is an argument used in discussions, sometimes by Concern trolls and sometimes as a Derailment, in which it is suggested that feminists would be more successful if only they expressed themselves in a more pleasant tone.

I'm not saying the tone of feminism is wrong, I'm saying that if feminism is arguing for the same ideals as 'regular' equality, it would receive more support if it called itself 'equality' — more support would surely mean that it's more likely to achieve affective change. Under a wider umbrella, it could use as an aggressive tone as it likes when lobbying the government, etc.

& surely this is like a meta-thread anyway, if we're talking about why threads about sexism fail to discuss the issues in a balanced way?

B0jangles · 16-02-2012 09:16PM

Feathers wrote: »

This is the first result, so I'm going to go with it:

I'm not saying the tone of feminism is wrong, I'm saying that if feminism is arguing for the same ideals as 'regular' equality, it would receive more support if it called itself 'equality' — more support would surely mean that it's more likely to achieve affective change. Under a wider umbrella, it could use as an aggressive tone as it likes when lobbying the government, etc.

& surely this is like a meta-thread anyway, if we're talking about why threads about sexism fail to discuss the issues in a balanced way?

But by saying "feminism" should rename itself as generalized "equality" you ARE arguing that it should adopt a more pleasant (or appealing) tone. That is the definition of a tone argument.

B0jangles · 16-02-2012 09:18PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Would you like to accuse me of hysterical over-reaction now or would you like to wait a bit.

Let me just be clear that I understand your point:

Women murdered by man over a 5 year period = women told to stay home every night for 5 years or else...= querying the logic of this and stating it was not practical as women had to bloody well work = overreacting women giving feminism a bad name.

Well, sorry guys - it appears I am the one responsible for giving feminism a bad name.

Who knew I had such power...and a high butchness quotient too...

Right since I have all this power- I'm gonna get medieval on someone unless I get some complements about being butch soon

(Ye have a few minutes as I am washing the dog, doing laundry and baking a cake. )

Feck, I actually had a very admiring post drawn up but the internet ate it - short answer - kudos on your rugby-playing badassery! (even if you did play for Munster...)

PrincessLola · 16-02-2012 09:26PM

Bigtoe107 wrote: »

I don't know how to multi quote so im going to just give a general reply.

I genuinely blushed when i realised the babe thing

Lola your tone is quite condescending, I didn't intend to be charming, I was mearly expressing things from a males point of view. I agree women are under pressure but what im trying to say is this is a societal issue not a gender issue. Both men and women will benefit from a change in attitude. Also I understand that my opinion ins't concrete but nobody opinions are. Men choose to work in these sectors the same way women choose to work at home or have kids. It is expected that men work in these dangerous conditions

No it was sarcastic
You saying women's struggles are exagerated was condescending.
It is both a societal and gender issue, the two aren't inherently seperate.

RDM, you are pretty dissmissive saying you have hardly seen "any evidence of of what could be termed anti-female discrimination in an institutional or legal sense." You should read the rape thread in the Ladies Lounge

Feathers · 16-02-2012 09:30PM

B0jangles wrote: »

But by saying "feminism" should rename itself as generalized "equality" you ARE arguing that it should adopt a more pleasant (or appealing) tone. That is the definition of a tone argument.

OK, I see where you're coming from. (The link that I followed seemed to say that the 'tone 'argument' was how forcefully you were putting across what you were saying.) I'm not suggesting to change what you're arguing for, just that from the majority of the posts it seems to be equality — both of rights & of gender expectations.

You mentioned that feminism was institutionalised — do you think that to still be the case, or do you mean historically? I'd see feminism to be a somewhat divisive term, as it seems to often put the blame of past sexism at the feet of every man today.

Using the more apt term equality, would avoid exactly what you & this thread are talking about — derailment — & force people to focus more on the issues themselves.

Or do you think there's a difference of agenda between feminism & equality?

Medu · 16-02-2012 09:34PM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

I'm not having a go at all sport, but it plays a massive part in sexism.

Who are the main role models for young guys today: soccer stars in England.
Do they treat women like sh*te - yes.

The media influences young men - and the pattern is played out everywhere.

Now a question I have: sports stars are in general the role models for young men, who are the female role models for women in society? What arena is there for them to showcase their talents and for women to look up to them?

In sport they are not anywhere near as revered as men, where are women celebrated for being great women? Who do young women have to look up to?

This is one thing that really bugs me about Feminists- they don't look at the whole picture.

Look at some of the main female role models- English footballers WAGS!! Millions of women/girls admiring women that are largely talentless and often their claim to fame is that their famous partner got caught cheating on them! I know dozen's of intelligent women, if we judge intelligences by work achievements..., that spend hours each week reading trashy mags about these "role-model's". Men of course will spend this wasted time watching football but at least they are 'admiring' people that are successful at their profession.

It just seems to be that some women want to be dissolved of ALL responsibility as to how men perceive and treat them.

Feeona · 16-02-2012 09:42PM

Medu wrote: »

It just seems to be that some women want to be dissolved of ALL responsibility as to how men perceive and treat them.

Well in the case of rape (traditionally a method for a male rapist to exert his power over a female and/or helpless victim) that should be a given. I know it's a strong angle to be coming from because you were discussing footballers and WAGs. It's just an example of where women might feel like they're getting the short end of the stick with regard to personal safety.

16-02-2012 09:44PM

Medu wrote: »

midlandsmissus wrote: »

I'm not having a go at all sport, but it plays a massive part in sexism.

Who are the main role models for young guys today: soccer stars in England.
Do they treat women like sh*te - yes.

The media influences young men - and the pattern is played out everywhere.

Now a question I have: sports stars

This is one thing that really bugs me about Feminists- they don't look at the whole picture.

Look at some of the main female role models- English footballers WAGS!! Millions of women/girls admiring women that are largely talentless and often their claim to fame is that their famous partner got caught cheating on them! I know dozen's of intelligent women, if we judge intelligences by work achievements..., that spend hours each week reading trashy mags about these "role-model's". Men of course will spend this wasted time watching football but at least they are 'admiring' people that are successful at their profession.

It just seems to be that some women want to be dissolved of ALL responsibility as to how men perceive and treat them.

Not all femminists. I abhor all the wag mentality and yes its is supported by female focussed media but not the ones that at least attempt to cover topics more varied than who shagged who .

Some woman but not all acknowledge that the weekly trash magazines do nothing posistive for woman. I hate the fact wags are set as examples to younger girls as something to aspire too!
What happened to aspiring to be smart rather than pretty? Its depressing .
I think these beauty pressures are on both sides though .men feel the pressure too.

Bannasidhe · 16-02-2012 09:44PM

Medu wrote: »

This is one thing that really bugs me about Feminists- they don't look at the whole picture.

Look at some of the main female role models- English footballers WAGS!! Millions of women/girls admiring women that are largely talentless and often their claim to fame is that their famous partner got caught cheating on them! I know dozen's of intelligent women, if we judge intelligences by work achievements..., that spend hours each week reading trashy mags about these "role-model's". Men of course will spend this wasted time watching football but at least they are 'admiring' people that are successful at their profession.

It just seems to be that some women want to be dissolved of ALL responsibility as to how men perceive and treat them.

Conversely some women had to have the term WAG explained to them by their 77 year old mothers on account of the fact that some women don't read glossy magazines so thought a wag was a very witty person living in the 18th century.

It appears as if some men posting on here think all women are from an identy-kit clone mass production unit somewhere and as we all share the same brain cell we all aspire to no greater destiny them to shag some overpaid ball-kicker and therefore we admire those women who do achieve this holy grail of feminosity.

midlandsmissus · 16-02-2012 09:46PM

Medu wrote: »

This is one thing that really bugs me about Feminists- they don't look at the whole picture.

Look at some of the main female role models- English footballers WAGS!! Millions of women/girls admiring women that are largely talentless and often their claim to fame is that their famous partner got caught cheating on them! I know dozen's of intelligent women, if we judge intelligences by work achievements..., that spend hours each week reading trashy mags about these "role-model's". Men of course will spend this wasted time watching football but at least they are 'admiring' people that are successful at their profession.

It just seems to be that some women want to be dissolved of ALL responsibility as to how men perceive and treat them.

Yes they are terrible female role models, I agree. But I would disagree that millions or women admire them. Most people think they are vacuous. Do you think soccer players are good/ bad role models? The whole system is an awful representation of gender role models to men and women!

Micky Dolenz · 16-02-2012 09:49PM

Roy Yummy Grenade wrote: »

Not all femminists. I abhor all the wag mentality and yes its is supported by female focussed media but not the ones that at least attempt to cover topics more varied than who shagged who .

Some woman but not all acknowledge that the weekly trash magazines do nothing posistive for woman. I hate the fact wags are set as examples to younger girls as something to aspire too!
What happened to aspiring to be smart rather than pretty? Its depressing .
I think these beauty pressures are on both sides though .men feel the pressure too.

I suspect most women or people who read glossy mags use it as a bit of light entertainment and forget about it as soon as they are put down.. I grew up in a heavily female dominated family where there were more mags then most. My favourite were the real life stories one's. The glossy ones had nice pictures in them though.

16-02-2012 09:49PM

Millions do unfortunatley collen rooney has made a whole career and millions from being a wag . Depressing role model cheated on repeatedly and stays for ? Hmmm money ?

B0jangles · 16-02-2012 09:50PM

Feathers wrote: »

OK, I see where you're coming from. (The link that I followed seemed to say that the 'tone 'argument' was how forcefully you were putting across what you were saying.) I'm not suggesting to change what you're arguing for, just that from the majority of the posts it seems to be equality — both of rights & of gender expectations.

You mentioned that feminism was institutionalised — do you think that to still be the case, or do you mean historically? I'd see feminism to be a somewhat divisive term, as it seems to often put the blame of past sexism at the feet of every man today.

Using the more apt term equality, would avoid exactly what you & this thread are talking about — derailment — & force people to focus more on the issues themselves.

Or do you think there's a difference of agenda between feminism & equality?

To me, Equality is an umbrella term which covers feminism along with other issues like racism and gay rights.

It is perceived as a divisive term because it forces some men to recognise that they may well have unintentionally participated in sexist behaviours; this generally results in anger, denial and the accusation that the problem is that feminists are needlessly harsh and humourless.

We live in a societal structure that has changed a great deal in the last century; things are greatly improved but there is still a way to go.

SillyMcCarthy · 16-02-2012 09:52PM

I've the final solution to get rid of sexism.
Lets bring in to law a rule that all women up to the age of 60
must wear something along these lines & if women are serious
about ending sexism we'll be seeing them in this attire in the near future.
Bring it on girls!!!
http://www.islamicboutique.com/dresscode.asp

midlandsmissus · 16-02-2012 09:53PM

Roy Yummy Grenade wrote: »

Millions do unfortunatley collen rooney has made a whole career and millions from being a wag . Depressing role model cheated on repeatedly and stays for ? Hmmm money ?

But who looks up to her? Do you or I? Or do we think she's a sad sod who took a man back that was with two prostitutes while she was pregnant. If I think of her at all I think what low self esteem she must have and what a bad example she is setting women. I certainly don't know anyone who looks up to her. Of course it is the wags aswell as the footballers who keep the whole awful thing going, but why doesn't a footballer every marry a scientist?

dark crystal · 16-02-2012 09:57PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Let me just be clear that I understand your point:

Women murdered by man over a 5 year period = women told to stay home every night for 5 years or else...= querying the logic of this and stating it was not practical as women had to bloody well work = overreacting women giving feminism a bad name.

Well, sorry guys - it appears I am the one responsible for giving feminism a bad name.

Who knew I had such power...and a high butchness quotient too...

Firstly, women were never told to stay home every night for five years. There was no edict, no law, no one forced women to do anything. Police were merely advising women that, in the interests of their own safety, it might be an idea to avoid going out after dark if at all possible.
This advice somehow caused women to get offended because they saw it as some sort of oppressive act of chauvinism. As a woman myself, I see no foundation in that accusation at all and yes, I think it's a total overreaction.

Was there any evidence that any women who worked unsociable hours actually gave up working based on this police advice at all? I'm sure very few, if any, did - policewomen included.

Also, I never said you gave feminism a bad name at all, but how any woman could see that perfectly logical safety advice as a protestable issue is beyond me altogether.

16-02-2012 09:57PM

Who knows maybe because they feel socially pressured to marry a moodel ? Not i loathe wags they are the pits .
But obviously loads of woman do hence the fragrent colleens clothing line

perfume books etc etc

RDM_83 again · 16-02-2012 09:59PM

Ok this may seem like a trolling attempt (but as in my previous post I think the WAG idea is messed up, though more a social than sexism issue) ,

But could a WAG not be considered the definition of the empowered post feminist woman in that simply using her sexuality she achieves an extremely comfortable lifestyle and position in society without having to make the considerable sacrifices necessary to achieve this lifestyle by other means (look at the training, diet and match schedule of a prof footballer and you can see what I mean).

midlandsmissus · 16-02-2012 10:00PM

Roy Yummy Grenade wrote: »

Who knows maybe because they feel socially pressured to marry a moodel ? Not i loathe wags they are the pits .
But obviously loads of woman do hence the fragrent colleens clothing line perfume books etc etc

I think they all came out before the prostitute scandal though. She hasn't done much since, I don't think.

Millicent · 16-02-2012 10:05PM

Feathers wrote: »

OK, I see where you're coming from. (The link that I followed seemed to say that the 'tone 'argument' was how forcefully you were putting across what you were saying.) I'm not suggesting to change what you're arguing for, just that from the majority of the posts it seems to be equality — both of rights & of gender expectations.

You mentioned that feminism was institutionalised — do you think that to still be the case, or do you mean historically? I'd see feminism to be a somewhat divisive term, as it seems to often put the blame of past sexism at the feet of every man today.

Using the more apt term equality, would avoid exactly what you & this thread are talking about — derailment — & force people to focus more on the issues themselves.

Or do you think there's a difference of agenda between feminism & equality?

I don't think there's any difference of agenda between feminism & equality, mostly because one is a subset of the other.

I also see how it can feel that feminism puts the blame of historical sexism solely at the feet of men. To study something, often you have to use a generalised view of a situation and it is not always that these generalisations are qualified. However, any feminist who thinks that all men were complicit in these situations is not a feminist worth her salt, IMO. They weren't all complicit, just as not all Germans were Nazis (apologies for the Godwin) or not all South Africans supported apartheid. I also don't think all men are complicit in gender stereotyping that happens today, nor are all women innocent of doing the same on the other side.

It's (an no offence intended at all) still a bit of a lazy standpoint to assume that feminism is divisive without knowing more about the movement or the theology of it. People shouldn't rely on what they think they know about a subject and should seek to read up on something before forming a strong opinion of it. In the same way that I wouldn't judge a film, for example, that my friend said was crap without going to see it, a whole theology shouldn't be judged on what people *think* they know about it. Some of the best films I've ever seen were ones people told me were terrible. :pac:

Medu wrote: »

This is one thing that really bugs me about Feminists- they don't look at the whole picture.

Look at some of the main female role models- English footballers WAGS!! Millions of women/girls admiring women that are largely talentless and often their claim to fame is that their famous partner got caught cheating on them! I know dozen's of intelligent women, if we judge intelligences by work achievements..., that spend hours each week reading trashy mags about these "role-model's". Men of course will spend this wasted time watching football but at least they are 'admiring' people that are successful at their profession.

It just seems to be that some women want to be dissolved of ALL responsibility as to how men perceive and treat them.

What are the other choices for role models though? Seems to me when I was younger, there were a lot more female-centric children's series and books. "The Worst Witch" for example was a favourite of mine.

I take your point and I do appreciate it. I just think that there should be encouragement towards better role models than WAGs, Hannah bloody Montana, Disney princesses who tend to be saved by a charming prince, or that "Twilight" tripe for young girls. Boys have "Ben 10", "Harry Potter" (Hermione is a side character and love interest, even in a book with a female author), "Batman", etc.

I was reminded of this lately when I asked a little one (she's 10) I know what she wanted to be when she grew up. Now this child is vivacious, intelligent, sharp and really lovely but sadly has no good role model at home. Her reply was "Justin Bieber's wife." Even when pressed on what she might do as a job when Justin was away on tour, for example, she couldn't engage with it. All the emphasis in her life and everything she has learned thus far centres on looks, celebrity and pop culture. She doesn't consider herself in terms of intelligence, wit, skill or talents. She's not the only little girl I know like this either.

At least her male cousins have some sort of aspiration towards football or some sort of fancy career for themselves. She has been taught to be completely placid about having ambition for herself and to value her looks over her innate intelligence.

To me, feminism is the ideology that helps me to tell her, "you can have more for yourself. You can be whatever you want to be."

Just because women are complicit in creating gender roles for themselves and other women, doesn't mean that feminism is not useful nor does it mean that the ideology should ignore the complicity of women in gender stereotypes.

midlandsmissus · 16-02-2012 10:06PM

RDM_83 again wrote: »

Ok this may seem like a trolling attempt (but as in my previous post I think the WAG idea is messed up, though more a social than sexism issue) ,

But could a WAG not be considered the definition of the empowered post feminist woman in that simply using her sexuality she achieves an extremely comfortable lifestyle and position in society without having to make the considerable sacrifices necessary to achieve this lifestyle by other means (look at the training, diet and match schedule of a prof footballer and you can see what I mean).

That's a good question. They have technically gained a comfortable life. Materially. But being married to some-one that continually cheats on you and selling your respect and self esteem down the river is the trade off. Basically presenting yourself to the world that you are willing to be treated this badly to maintain a highly material life. It's sad really. That is why no-one respects them.

16-02-2012 10:07PM

RDM_83 again wrote: »

Ok this may seem like a trolling attempt (but as in my previous post I think the WAG idea is messed up, though more a social than sexism issue) ,

But could a WAG not be considered the definition of the empowered post feminist woman in that simply using her sexuality she achieves an extremely comfortable lifestyle and position in society without having to make the considerable sacrifices necessary to achieve this lifestyle by other means (look at the training, diet and match schedule of a prof footballer and you can see what I mean).

No its as old as the hills getting a man with your looks to gain power money . They are just more orange and have extentsions nowadays sigh i blame bratt dolls

Feathers · 16-02-2012 10:11PM

B0jangles wrote: »

To me, Equality is an umbrella term which covers feminism along with other issues like racism and gay rights.

It is perceived as a divisive term because it forces some men to recognise that they may well have unintentionally participated in sexist behaviours; this generally results in anger, denial and the accusation that the problem is that feminists are needlessly harsh and humourless.

We live in a societal structure that has changed a great deal in the last century; things are greatly improved but there is still a way to go.

But surely they're the same rights when you break them down? & it's about equality in the application of those rights, rather than this stand-alone concept. As in, when we mentioned parental leave or political participation — the right is for time from work or to stand for office, rather than "women's rights".

I would say it's perceived as divisive as there is always a large focus given to the historical context, more so than in other issues, in addition to the particular issue discussed. So as a man, it's not just about whether I am myself sexist or not in relation to women, or even if other men are, but it's also about if men previously were, which has lead to an environment which discourages women from politics, for example.

I would think there would be more focus on the issue at hand & less chance for derailment if issues were discussed more neutrally — childcare policies in the workplace, who does it currently benefit, how can it be improved, etc.

Unless there are issues specific to women that would get lost by a wider focus on equality.

jaffacakesyum · 16-02-2012 10:11PM

It really makes me sad to see posters claim sexism doesn't exist any more and women are equal, if not at an advantage in society, to men.

I don't see how it's so hard to 'get' and why some men continuously deny that sexism IS real and DOES affect us.

YES there is sexism that affects women in Ireland negatively. I can't speak for all women but I would hazard a guess that most women have experienced it in some way (at least my friends and family have)
e.g. unequal pay

YES there is sexism that affects men in Ireland negatively
e.g. father's rights, gender quota in the Dáil

I'm not even going to go into the way society views women/men. Let's just say that off the top of my head from the start of this year I have had comments been made on the fact that ''it's not right for women to be partaking in such sports'' (a man talking about football to me), that I should ''get back in the kitchen'' (drunken eejits) and that "women are more emotional than men and therefore less rational thinkers" (very serious deep conversation one night!!)

On the other hand, I'm sure many men have come across idiot women who are sexist towards them too.

Millicent · 16-02-2012 10:16PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

I suspect most women or people who read glossy mags use it as a bit of light entertainment and forget about it as soon as they are put down.. I grew up in a heavily female dominated family where there were more mags then most. My favourite were the real life stories one's. The glossy ones had nice pictures in them though.

I dunno though. Those sorts of magazines are everywhere. I stopped buying women's magazines for a long time because of all the advertising I had to wade to to get to the stories. Pages and pages and pages of perfect looking people, with flawless makeup and expensive clothes. I know this happens in men's mags too, but I think the advertising for beauty products and clothes in women's far outweighs that of men's.

I have also rarely seen the fixation in men's magazines with the weight of celebrities--too skinny, too fat, too skinny again, wow! look at the weight this z-list celebrity lost on some diet that doctors warn puts you under the starvation threshold. I have shopped an article about the dangers of fad diets to a number of women's magazines (as a journalist). None were interested. It either didn't fit the focus of the magazine or they never responded. Funny how such an article wouldn't fit the theme of a magazine that focused so intently on weight and dieting.

Those magazines feed into a lot of the insecurities women create for themselves and they are big business. They're feeding into the very damaging gender roles that I rail against as a feminist. The sad thing is, rather than these gender expectations being eliminated, it's now starting to spill over into the media focused at men too. That's definitely not progress even though it's bringing male beauty expectations in line with women's. I find the trend horrifying.

That said, the weekly women's ones you're talking about are hilarious. The headlines would give Jerry Springer a run for his money: My foot exploded when I caught my mother with my Turkish boyfriend who stole my daughter's crib. They are ROFL-worthy.

Millicent · 16-02-2012 10:18PM

SillyMcCarthy wrote: »

I've the final solution to get rid of sexism.
Lets bring in to law a rule that all women up to the age of 60
must wear something along these lines & if women are serious
about ending sexism we'll be seeing them in this attire in the near future.
Bring it on girls!!!
http://www.islamicboutique.com/dresscode.asp

This suggestion is so full of fail I don't know where to start with it.

Why is sexism such a difficult topic?

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