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24 men, women and children killed - get 3 months in prison (max)

  • 24-01-2012 01:17PM
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,659 ✭✭✭


    Sickening display of so-called US 'Justice'.

    Fair enough that this guy didn't do the murdering, and only gave a extremely poor order to 'shoot first', but that's enough for a manslaughter charge. The soldiers who fired their guns should be charged with 1st degree murder.

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0124/wuterichf.html
    A US soldier court-martialled over the deaths of 24 Iraqi civilians faces three months' imprisonment at most after admitting dereliction of duty, meaning manslaughter charges were dropped.

    A US soldier court-martialled over the deaths of 24 Iraqi civilians admitted dereliction of duty, but manslaughter charges were dropped yesterday.
    Staff Sergeant Frank Wuterich had faced nine counts of voluntary manslaughter and other charges over killings in the Iraqi town of Haditha in 2005. He now faces three months' imprisonment at most.
    He pleaded guilty to one count of negligent dereliction of duty, and will face a sentencing hearing today, said a spokesman for Camp Pendleton in California, where the 31-year-old went to a military trial earlier this month.
    The Marine, who accepted responsibility for giving orders which led to the deaths, could also be reduced in rank to private, and have his pay cut by two-thirds for three months.
    "Staff Sergeant Wuterich accepted responsibility... and agreed and admits that he gave a verbal order to shoot first, ask questions later, or don't hesitate to shoot, and words to that effect," said spokesman Joe Koppel.
    "That verbal instruction caused his Marines to (not) positively identify targets in the two homes. And now, at the sentencing phase, he'll be held accountable for those actions."
    Wuterich's attorney Neal Puckett said his client - who had been reported to be considering a plea deal last weekend - made the final decision.
    "This was his decision and his decision alone," he told the North County Times. "Staff Sergeant Wuterich believed this was the right and honorable thing to do."
    In all, 24 Iraqi civilians were killed - 19 in several houses along with the five men who pulled up in a car in the Iraqi town of Haditha on 19 November, 2005.
    The victims included 10 women or children killed at point-blank range. Six people were killed in one house, most shot in the head, including women and children huddled in a bedroom.
    The other seven Marines charged in the case have been exonerated through various legal rulings, fuelling anger in Iraq, where authorities had pushed for US troops to be subject to Iraqi justice before the US pullout in December.
    Yesterday's plea deal was announced at the start of what would have been the third full week of the court-martial at Camp Pendleton, where Wuterich has been an active serving Marine pending the long-delayed legal action against him.


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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭Temptamperu


    Sure the victims dont count, they're just rag heads :mad:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,753 ✭✭✭davet82


    its a sick world


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,327 ✭✭✭Sykk


    In before U.S are the greatest threat to mankind debate.. etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Attabear


    Sykk wrote: »
    In before U.S are the greatest threat to mankind debate.. etc.

    Tenner says this descends into debate about Israel and Palestinians.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Never wear the butchers' apron.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,029 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    The Iraqis have had a bad run of rotten luck for a long time now.

    Let's hope things get better for them and they can live without fear.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,029 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    Attabear wrote: »
    Tenner says this descends into debate about Israel and Palestinians.

    Tenners can't speak. :pac:


  • Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,397 Mod ✭✭✭✭MarkR


    Disgraceful carry on. Should have been dishonourably discharged and gotten 25 years. The soldiers firing the shots should also be on charges. Did they get anything?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,431 ✭✭✭M cebee


    nothing new this sort of hypocrisy


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Attabear


    Tenners can't speak. :pac:

    Mine can and they're very political unlike fivers who don't give a f**k.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,037 ✭✭✭Nothingbetter2d


    Tenners can't speak. :pac:

    they sing dont they?:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,039 ✭✭✭force eleven


    So much death and misery just for oil.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,752 ✭✭✭markesmith


    This is no different to the sickening violence perpetrated by the Zionist state against those poor Palestinians!!
    Attabear wrote: »
    Tenner says this descends into debate about Israel and Palestinians.

    Whoops


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Fear Uladh


    The victims included 10 women or children killed at point-blank range

    C*nt. :mad:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    America is becoming more like a nazi-type state everyday, If the victims were white would they get such a **** sentence ??


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,915 ✭✭✭MungBean


    The victims included 10 women or children killed at point-blank range. Six people were killed in one house, most shot in the head, including women and children huddled in a bedroom

    I dont understand how this isnt murder, whoever gave the order along with those who carried it out should be done for multiple counts of 1st degree murder.

    Boggles the mind it really does.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Fear Uladh


    MungBean wrote: »
    I dont understand how this isnt murder, whoever gave the order along with those who carried it out should be done for multiple counts of 1st degree murder.

    Boggles the mind it really does.

    They are fighting for freedom, one nation under God. *hums American national anthem*


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,016 ✭✭✭✭vibe666


    MungBean wrote: »
    I dont understand how this isnt murder, whoever gave the order along with those who carried it out should be done for multiple counts of 1st degree murder.

    Boggles the mind it really does.
    i don't care what sort of orders they were given, every soldier should question an order that would lead to an outcome like that unless they are some kind of sick fcuktards getting off on it imho.

    even a battle hardened soldier should have alarm bells ringing in their head about a shoot to kill order when they see women and children cowering in fear in a room. any rational human being wouldn't be able to do something like that to animals, never mind people. :mad:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 442 ✭✭Lambsbread


    In war I have to understand that civilian casualties will happen. These soldiers did not decide to invade Iraq and follow orders from the top. Therefore, sometimes soldiers will need protection if they do unfortunately kill an innocent civilian by accident.

    However, the circumstances here just seem so wrong. How can so many of the victims be killed at point-blank range? It is hard to understand the context from from the article, but it is still very difficult to understand.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Pretty appaling decision altogether. They all should spend the rest of there lives in a prison, as the nuremburg defense is no excuse for those who fired.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,395 ✭✭✭✭mikemac1


    vibe666 wrote: »
    shoot to kill order

    No such thing as shoot to wound


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 935 ✭✭✭giles lynchwood


    Siht happen's.Get over it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,050 ✭✭✭token101


    Is Rick Perry going to say they were just kids getting up to some hijinx again?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,499 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    If an American kills another citizen in America they face the prospect of death or never been released again, if your in the army fighting for old glory overseas you can kill 24 people and be out in less than 3 months.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,576 ✭✭✭Paddy Cow


    It's a ridiculous ruling but they are probably protecting themselves against further trials. God knows how many other incidents there are along these lines and they will do everything possible to cover them up :mad:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 78 ✭✭Treason


    Lambsbread wrote: »
    These soldiers did not decide to invade Iraq and follow orders from the top.

    They bloody well did decide to "follow orders from the top". Thats what you do when you join an army, follow orders.

    These people are complicit and enablers of the conquests of the ruling class. Paid agents of a rogue state.

    If any of them had a brain, or a conscience, they would not be in the army to begin with. Delinquents looking for some self worth, status, respect and acceptance by putting on the uniform of a murderous regime.

    Scum, every single one of them. From the pencil pushers in administration to the filthbags walking the streets of another peoples land.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,901 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Paddy Cow wrote: »
    It's a ridiculous ruling but they are probably protecting themselves against further trials. God knows how many other incidents there are along these lines and they will do everything possible to cover them up :mad:

    It wasn't a ruling, it seems to have been a plea deal. My guess is that it was accepted because the prosecution did not truly believe that it had sufficient evidence in the case to guarantee a conviction on the charges and went with a ' certain something' over a ' possible nothing'

    What would this thread be had there actually been a judgement of ' not guilty'?

    NTM


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭Attabear


    Treason wrote: »
    They bloody well did decide to "follow orders from the top". Thats what you do when you join an army, follow orders.

    These people are complicit and enablers of the conquests of the ruling class. Paid agents of a rogue state.

    If any of them had a brain, or a conscience, they would not be in the army to begin with. Delinquents looking for some self worth, status, respect and acceptance by putting on the uniform of a murderous regime.

    Scum, every single one of them. From the pencil pushers in administration to the filthbags walking the streets of another peoples land.

    I admire your passion but I disagree with your analysis.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,576 ✭✭✭Paddy Cow


    It wasn't a ruling, it seems to have been a plea deal. My guess is that it was accepted because the prosecution did not truly believe that it had sufficient evidence in the case to guarantee a conviction on the charges and went with a ' certain something' over a ' possible nothing'

    What would this thread be had there actually been a judgement of ' not guilty'?

    NTM
    Sorry, ridiculous plea deal. The whole thing is fcuked up. Soldiers are more often than not put on a super hero type pedestal and war is glamorised to depcit them as if they are bravely fighting against truely evil adversaries. Trying saying anything even slightly critical and wait for the "they gave their lives fighting so you could be a keyboard warrior" etc style outrage. Then you hear stories like this and it's unimaginable what/how it happened.

    It's a dispicable story but it's a catch 22 situation. On the one hand I can see that just because they are women and children, it doesn't mean that they don't have a bomb strapped to their chest so everyone is a potential treat but on the other, I can't get the image of frightened innocent civilians huddled in a bedroom and being shot in the head execution style. In a war where life is so disposible, it's very possible that insurgents were mixed with the civilians and didn't care if they caused innocent people to get killed but then again, the US do have a reputation of shoot first, ask questions later. You could go crazy trying to make sense out of it.


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,901 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Paddy Cow wrote: »
    Sorry, ridiculous plea deal. The whole thing is fcuked up. Soldiers are more often than not put on a super hero type pedestal and war is glamorised to depcit them as if they are bravely fighting against truely evil adversaries. Trying saying anything even slightly critical and wait for the "they gave their lives fighting so you could be a keyboard warrior" etc style outrage. Then you hear stories like this and it's unimaginable what/how it happened.

    If it's unimaginable, then how do you know as a certainy that the prosecution's case was winnable?

    The article states that the trial was in its third week. It is not unfeasible that the case was not going to the prosecution's satisfaction for whatever reason and they decided to cut their losses. This is not an episode of Law and Order where the 'right' outcome is scripted.

    NTM


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