Sorry Mods - But I had to post this here - its so UNREAL! Noonan and unemployment!

amacachi · 19-01-2012 03:17PM

aidan24326 wrote: »

The article clearly states that over half of those who left are Irish.

And even if some of those people do come back in a year or two in most cases it'll be either because they can't find a job wherever they went, their visa has run out or whatever. I guarantee you anyone that does land a job in Sydney or Auckland or wherever they end up will be in no rush to come back here anytime soon unless they've no choice. Lifestyle choice my arse.

Over half, meaning less than 60%, probably closer to 50%. There's more non-Irish leaving now than there was 5 years ago so back then the percentage of Irish leaving would've been much higher than the current percentage.

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Do you have links to figures?

Would love to see them.

They've been posted here many times, I'm not going to search for them for you.

Biggins wrote: »

Thanks, good reply.
Even so, of the many that have left, with those with WHVs and those without, would it not be fair to say, its all 'work' related and not just leaving due to 'lifestyle choice?

No, because there's been damn all increase. Without a survey we'll never know but I doubt that our culture has changed so much in 5 years that nobody would want to leave compared to those who were in their late teens/early 20s. There's always an underlying demand for people leaving whether things are brilliant or awful, there hasn't been that big an increase in Irish people leaving to now make up half of the total being down to the increase unemployment.

bladerunner48 · 19-01-2012 03:17PM

just read that noonan has got the personal insolvency legislation kicked down the road for another month,he claims he has no problem with alan shatters version of it but noonan is scared ****less to include mortgages in the deal in case he upsets his friends the banks.

he, fine gael and the government dont give a **** about the ordinary people in this country who r hurting out of no fault of their own and this legislation could help them out.protect the bankers or **** depends on which way you look at it at all costs anyhow mr noonan.its not important that they r the people who got us into this mess.

Standard Toaster · 19-01-2012 03:17PM

I like angry Biggins.

I'd be getting the feck outta here too if I was related to that bellend Noonan.

De Hipster · 19-01-2012 03:17PM

I couldn't believe my eyes when I read the article...FG/Lab combo make me want to throw violent rages even more than the last lot.

What next from the government who didn't bring us; bailout renegotiations, dutch-stlye health reform, implementation of their own programme for gov (rather than continuation of the last lot of crims...).

Am tempted to emigrate - ye know to 'pfft, see another country & stuff'. Idiot!

2 stroke · 19-01-2012 03:19PM

Viva la Guillotine!

DrumSteve · 19-01-2012 03:19PM

44leto wrote: »

He did dirty his bib in that leadership challenge gig.
I still think Noonan is more capable I THINK he is an economist. I remember him giving his analysis on the situation when he was in opposition, he knows his stuff.

Pity he is not applying it now... Just do not trust this guy to run the economy.

Also if he owns German bonds, that's a pretty major conflict of interest right there.

Chucky the tree · 19-01-2012 03:20PM

He's not that wrong. Plenty of people hear could work ****e minimum wages jobs but instead they'd rather do in in Austrialia or wherever else.

Guy:Incognito · 19-01-2012 03:21PM

I know 8 or 9 people that went to Australia and Canada. All left jobs to go.

ejmaztec · 19-01-2012 03:22PM

mikemac1 wrote: »

Nobody here ever took a year off to go travelling and backpacking?

Isn't that what he is referring to?

Nowadays you get contracts for TEFL in Korea, decent money and then do some travelling when you leave.
Same in South America

Some people get career breaks to do it
Or in my first graduate job there was almost a person leaving every few weeks to head off to Australia for a year.
They would have been confident of a job on their return

I'd do it myself with my savings if I could get a career break

JFK's ancestors probably took a year out back-packing.

Biggins · 19-01-2012 03:22PM

amacachi wrote: »

...There's always an underlying demand for people leaving whether things are brilliant or awful, there hasn't been that big an increase in Irish people leaving to now make up half of the total being down to the increase unemployment.

True that there has always been a percentage that has left due to 'other reasons' but honestly, in a recent trip last year to Galway and talking to 'about to graduate' students, 9 out of ten that said they were leaving, stated it was DIRECTLY because of lack of work.

Just read some of the statements on the journal.ie site. They give the same clear message.
They by far, have left due to lack of work.

Aidric · 19-01-2012 03:25PM

It seems extremely naive of the usually intelligent Noonan to make such remarks.

As I recall, Mary Coughlan made similar remarks in a BBC interview while the last government was in power and she was roundly slammed for it.

Some people, including myself, do make a choice to live abroad and experience a different culture but to discount unemployment as a current driver of emigration is very foolish in the extreme.

amacachi · 19-01-2012 03:26PM

Biggins wrote: »

True that there has always been a percentage that has left due to 'other reasons' but honestly, in a recent trip last year to Galway and talking to 'about to graduate' students, 9 out of ten that said they were leaving, stated it was DIRECTLY because of lack of work.

Just read some of the statements on the journal.ie site. They give the same clear message.
They by far, have left due to lack of work.

Some people shout louder than others, doesn't mean there's more of them. So far the figures haven't supported any mass exodus that if one pays attention to the media we should be expecting.

2 stroke · 19-01-2012 03:27PM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

I know 8 or 9 people that went to Australia and Canada. All left jobs to go.

I know a few too. 2 left supermacs, 1 left abrakebabara & 3 others left jobs where they had been put on a 3 day week. 2 of these employers have since closed.

kraggy · 19-01-2012 03:27PM

amacachi wrote: »

A J1 or year on a WHV is a bit more than a holiday.

Most people going on WHV's right now are not coming back. They're going on the 1 year WHV initially as a first step.

In most cases, you can't just arrive in OZ/NZ/Canada and say "Howye, I'm here to stay". You have to go on a one year visa first of all and then hope to get sponsored.

maxfresh · 19-01-2012 03:27PM

Noonans a ar$ehole

Guy:Incognito · 19-01-2012 03:28PM

2 stroke wrote: »

I know a few too. 2 left supermacs, 1 left abrakebabara & 3 others left jobs where they had been put on a 3 day week. 2 of these employers have since closed.

So at least half the poeple you know left not because they couldnt get work,but because they didnt like they work they were doing?

Howjoe1 · 19-01-2012 03:28PM

Biggins,

This deserves a thread of its own. Likewise Pat Rabbitte's obnoxious comment about the TV licence shows contempt and how out of touch they are with the feelings of the electorate who are drowning under bills.

"This is not a new household charge............ If you are evading it, then I am afraid you had better go to the post office or the credit union."

Is he suggesting people can go to the Credit Union to borrow the amount to pay this???

A little more savvy wouldn't go a miss.

How have we allowed such a level of non compliance?

ps I always pay my TV licence. Would hate to see Joe Duffy having to take another pay cut:rolleyes:

amacachi · 19-01-2012 03:30PM

2 stroke wrote: »

I know a few too. 2 left supermacs, 1 left abrakebabara & 3 others left jobs where they had been put on a 3 day week. 2 of these employers have since closed.

What're they at now? Of the people off the top of my head who left, 3 are on WHVs down under. 2 of them were the type who would've gone anyway, the other went out of boredom despite working fulltime here. 1 is working in a crap job over there and the other two are still looking for work.
Best mate went to Canada and enjoys it over there despite only having seasonal work. Financially he would've been better here with the work he was getting.
One lad went to London because his dad could sort work for him with no qualifications.

We can all tell stories. :pac:

aidan24326 · 19-01-2012 03:32PM

mikemac1 wrote: »

Nobody here ever took a year off to go travelling and backpacking?

Isn't that what he is referring to?

Nowadays you get contracts for TEFL in Korea, decent money and then do some travelling when you leave.
Same in South America

Some people get career breaks to do it
Or in my first graduate job there was almost a person leaving every few weeks to head off to Australia for a year.
They would have been confident of a job on their return

I'd do it myself with my savings if I could get a career break

Yeah and look how that turned out. Anyone who can stay gone probably will if their work visa situation allows it.

This goverment still don't get it that unemployment is by far our biggest problem in all this mess, and that it's a problem that should consume every minute of their waking day. They've done nothing at all to stimulate job growth or to give any inclination that they even have a clue how to go about that. Getting people off the dole and back working is crucial to any possibilty of a recovery yet this crowd (and the last lot) give the impression that they'd prefer we all just buggered off somewhere else

hooradiation · 19-01-2012 03:32PM

amacachi wrote: »

Some people shout louder than others, doesn't mean there's more of them. So far the figures haven't supported any mass exodus that if one pays attention to the media we should be expecting.

Yes, but that sentiment feels truer and therefore is the one that people will run with, reality be damned.

krudler · 19-01-2012 03:32PM

Here's the pulse of the nation

> .

.<.....................................and here's the finger of TD's.

nowhere near the pulse, jammed up their own arse.

amacachi · 19-01-2012 03:32PM

kraggy wrote: »

Most people going on WHV's right now are not coming back. They're going on the 1 year WHV initially as a first step.

In most cases, you can't just arrive in OZ/NZ/Canada and say "Howye, I'm here to stay". You have to go on a one year visa first of all and then hope to get sponsored.

Hope to get sponsored, that's the key. With the Aussies tightening everything up I don't expect to see much of an increase in it.

amacachi · 19-01-2012 03:33PM

hooradiation wrote: »

Yes, but that sentiment feels truer and therefore is the one that people will run with, reality be damned.

Good ol' truthiness.

Morlar · 19-01-2012 03:33PM

It's funny how the 'lifestyle choice' increases exponentially at a time of high unemployment. Presided over by his govt.

In fairness, for some people from a more privileged background it may well be purely a lifestyle choice and nothing to do with the state of the economy or unemployment.

I'd have thought that they'd be the exception & not the rule.

For an Irish politician to come out with that shows a lack of regard for the Irish people or their families who are either living with or facing this prospect out of necessity.

I really would have thought he was a more intelligent politician than that. Tool.

Logical Fallacy · 19-01-2012 03:35PM

amacachi wrote: »

They've been posted here many times, I'm not going to search for them for you.

Fair enough. I'm really just wondering if you had seen them is all.

You said the vast majority of people emigrating are not Irish, when the split seems to be about 50/50.

I am just wondering why you consider half of something to be a "vast majority".

Biggins · 19-01-2012 03:35PM

amacachi wrote: »

Some people shout louder than others, doesn't mean there's more of them. So far the figures haven't supported any mass exodus that if one pays attention to the media we should be expecting.

Almost 70,000 have sought a new life abroad in past year

Independent.ie

THE exodus of Irish workers intensified in the last year with almost 70,000 people moving to the ‘big six’ traditional emigrant destinations.

An investigation by the Irish Independent has found a 50pc surge in the number of emigrants heading for Australia, New Zealand, Canada, Britain, the US and Germany — up from 46,000 when we carried out a similar survey a year ago.

The numbers emigrating to Britain alone soared by 56pc as over 16,000 people travelled across the Irish Sea to find work in the UK 2010/11 tax year.

That’s nearly twice as many as were making this journey 10 years ago.

Figures obtained from the UK Department of Work and Pensions show the flow continued throughout 2011 with over 300 Irish people a week applying for national insurance numbers to allow them work there, the vast majority of whom were aged 18 to 34.

That department noted this surge was because “the Irish economy has recently experienced one of the sharpest recessions in the eurozone”.

Article continues: http://www.sovereignindependent.com/?p=32195

The bolded bit just applying to England alone.

Where To · 19-01-2012 03:38PM

He does have a point though. A lot of the people who have emigrated from my local area did so not because they were unemployed but because they could no longer earn €1000 for a three day week labouring and they thought the grass was greener elsewhere.

Ireland's biggest problem is not unemployment, Ireland's problem is people don't want to work.

hooradiation · 19-01-2012 03:40PM

where do i go from here wrote: »

Ireland's biggest problem is not unemployment, Ireland's problem is people don't want to work.

That's an interesting point, let me just open this can before I address it.. SHIT, HOW DID THESE WORMS GET EVERYWHERE?

Biggins · 19-01-2012 03:40PM

where do i go from here wrote: »

He does have a point though. A lot of the people who have emigrated from my local area did so not because they were unemployed but because they could no longer earn €1000 for a three day week labouring and they thought the grass was greener elsewhere.

Ireland's biggest problem is not unemployment, Ireland's problem is people don't want to work.

I see - so all those applying for work numbers in other countries, are doing so that they can continue their back-packing holidays!

Thanks for clearing that up.

Logical Fallacy · 19-01-2012 03:40PM

where do i go from here wrote: »

Ireland's biggest problem is not unemployment, Ireland's problem is people don't want to work.

Glad that's cleared up.

Sorry Mods - But I had to post this here - its so UNREAL! Noonan and unemployment!

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