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Girl allegedly raped on Brazilian Big Brother

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Comments

  • #92
    ottostreet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,987 ✭✭✭ottostreet


    jaja321 wrote: »
    Seriously?? A woman has allegedly been raped on live tv and you decide its appropriate to post her picture here?? FFS

    Pics or GTFO is a given. I happened to be reading the online article, so it was not difficult for me to attach a photo. Before you accuse me of insensitivity, this is AH, and while I sympathise with the girl, and agree that the attacker is a monster, I am not going to allow an opportunity for some tasteless humour to pass, based on the sensitivities of those who should know better.

    I apologise if you think I have crossed a line, but I don't think I have.


  • #93
    Samich
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,949 ✭✭✭Samich


    No one actually knows the full story either.


  • #94
    fedor.2.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,944 ✭✭✭fedor.2.


    ottostreet wrote: »
    Pics or GTFO is a given. I happened to be reading the online article, so it was not difficult for me to attach a photo. Before you accuse me of insensitivity, this is AH, and while I sympathise with the girl, and agree that the attacker is a monster, I am not going to allow an opportunity for some tasteless humour to pass, based on the sensitivities of those who should know better.

    I apologise if you think I have crossed a line, but I don't think I have.


    You dont need to apologise


  • #95
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-422513/Raped-drunk-does-mean-blame.html#ixzz1jlGMthKM


    I think it's disgusting that you posted that link as it contains pictures of the victims.


  • #96
    Da Shins Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,047 ✭✭✭Da Shins Kelly


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-422513/Raped-drunk-does-mean-blame.html

    Liza Kelsey, 26, is a fashion designer. She was raped three years ago by three men after going back to a flat with one of them after a party. Liza, who lives in West London, says:
    The proudest day of my life - the day I finished my course at Central St Martin's College of Art in London - turned into a nightmare when I was raped by three strangers after I got drunk celebrating the end of my degree.
    I still suffer horrific flashbacks to that night - forever haunted by the stupidity of putting myself in such a vulnerable position.
    I still consider myself a feminist and I believe that women deserve the utmost respect, even when they are drunk. But I should never have allowed myself to get in such a state and put myself in such danger. I was a potential victim from the moment I started drinking champagne and vodka.
    It was the evening of the party to mark the end of my four-year fashion degree. I'd had a typical middle class upbringing - my parents run their own business and I went to grammar school before university.
    It had been a great few years and, to celebrate, we were all hell-bent on getting drunk. I had a bottle of champagne before I went out, then countless vodka shots and glasses of beer.
    The next thing I remember is sitting in the back of a cab with a Spanish guy I'd met at the party. I didn't have a clue who he was or where I was going, and I didn't care as long as there was going to be more drink.
    Soon we were at his flat and heading for the bedroom, but - and I'm sorry to say this now -that wasn't a problem: I found him very attractive. But I didn't expect to find two other guys there.
    They turned out to be his flatmates, and as they poured me more drink I started to feel detached, as though everything was happening at arm's length. I don't remember them undressing me, but they must have done because there was no way I would ever have consented to having sex with three men.


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-422513/Raped-drunk-does-mean-blame.html#ixzz1jlGMthKM

    I see. You're a fan of the Daily Mail. It all makes sense now.


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  • #97
    Fluorescence
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 8,490 Mod ✭✭✭✭Fluorescence


    Feisar wrote: »
    This thread is seriously in the gutter.

    Because of the sensitive nature of the crime people jump to the victims defense. Whereas if a person leaves there car window open and their Nikon camera gets stolen people would be more inclined to say they were stupid/careless.
    A drunk person wanders out a dark road on their own and gets raped, then it's how dare anyone portion some responsibility of the crime to the victim. While the fault/blame must be totally assigned to the person who committed the crime people should not look out for themselves. The world suffers fools badly.

    Before someone says she wasn't wandering the roads drunk I know I've deviated from the circumstances of the situation under discussion.

    Surely these cameras are monitored 24/7. How was this allowed to happen???

    It is never the victim's fault for being raped. It's the rapist's fault for raping that person.


  • #98
    johnnycnandy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 335 ✭✭johnnycnandy


    This thread is pretty funny. (Not the subject matter obviously). But its basically broken down into people who can't understand that people don't get that they're joking VS people who don't get that the first group are joking. Keep it up AH.


  • #99
    stovelid
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,252 ✭✭✭✭stovelid


    fedor.2. wrote: »
    Im out

    of your ma?


  • #100
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-422513/Raped-drunk-does-mean-blame.html

    Liza Kelsey, 26, is a fashion designer. She was raped three years ago by three men after going back to a flat with one of them after a party. Liza, who lives in West London, says:
    The proudest day of my life - the day I finished my course at Central St Martin's College of Art in London - turned into a nightmare when I was raped by three strangers after I got drunk celebrating the end of my degree.
    I still suffer horrific flashbacks to that night - forever haunted by the stupidity of putting myself in such a vulnerable position.
    I still consider myself a feminist and I believe that women deserve the utmost respect, even when they are drunk. But I should never have allowed myself to get in such a state and put myself in such danger. I was a potential victim from the moment I started drinking champagne and vodka.
    It was the evening of the party to mark the end of my four-year fashion degree. I'd had a typical middle class upbringing - my parents run their own business and I went to grammar school before university.
    It had been a great few years and, to celebrate, we were all hell-bent on getting drunk. I had a bottle of champagne before I went out, then countless vodka shots and glasses of beer.
    The next thing I remember is sitting in the back of a cab with a Spanish guy I'd met at the party. I didn't have a clue who he was or where I was going, and I didn't care as long as there was going to be more drink.
    Soon we were at his flat and heading for the bedroom, but - and I'm sorry to say this now -that wasn't a problem: I found him very attractive. But I didn't expect to find two other guys there.
    They turned out to be his flatmates, and as they poured me more drink I started to feel detached, as though everything was happening at arm's length. I don't remember them undressing me, but they must have done because there was no way I would ever have consented to having sex with three men.


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-422513/Raped-drunk-does-mean-blame.html#ixzz1jlGMthKM
    Proving what? The woman is obviously messed up in such a bad way that she doesn't completely hold those men responsible for their behaviour, which they were.
    I think it's even slightly worse to rape a really drunk person because they are not in a position to defend themselves.


  • #101
    Belly_Dancer
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 88 ✭✭Belly_Dancer


    Millicent wrote: »
    No it's not. Rape is bloody rape. I don't care what the situation is--the victim is NEVER to blame. I am horrified you feel that way. Slut shaming is well and truly alive in Ireland today, it seems.

    maybe that's cos there are plenty of sluts out there?:eek:


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  • #102
    John Doe1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭John Doe1


    Are there actually "men" on this thread who believe because a women gets slightly tipsy, that excuses men from forcing themselves on a women and defiling her?

    All I can say is I hope I never meet you


  • #103
    Millicent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    This thread is actually depressing. I knew there were still some knuckle-draggers who apportion blame to the victim lurking in society, but it is shocking and really saddening to see how prevalent slut shaming is.


  • #104
    Da Shins Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,047 ✭✭✭Da Shins Kelly


    Feisar wrote: »
    This thread is seriously in the gutter.

    Because of the sensitive nature of the crime people jump to the victims defense. Whereas if a person leaves there car window open and their Nikon camera gets stolen people would be more inclined to say they were stupid/careless.
    A drunk person wanders out a dark road on their own and gets raped, then it's how dare anyone portion some responsibility of the crime to the victim. While the fault/blame must be totally assigned to the person who committed the crime people should not look out for themselves. The world suffers fools badly.

    Before someone says she wasn't wandering the roads drunk I know I've deviated from the circumstances of the situation under discussion.

    Surely these cameras are monitored 24/7. How was this allowed to happen???

    Having a camera stolen from you and being a victim of rape are not at all comparable.


  • #105
    Millicent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »
    maybe that's cos there are plenty of sluts out there?:eek:

    ETA: Not worth the ban.

    You should take a serious look at your values in life.


  • #106
    jaja321
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 793 ✭✭✭jaja321


    ottostreet wrote: »
    Pics or GTFO is a given. I happened to be reading the online article, so it was not difficult for me to attach a photo. Before you accuse me of insensitivity, this is AH, and while I sympathise with the girl, and agree that the attacker is a monster, I am not going to allow an opportunity for some tasteless humour to pass, based on the sensitivities of those who should know better.

    I apologise if you think I have crossed a line, but I don't think I have.

    I appreciate AH for what it is too.. and Pics of GTFO is a given on AH ... but when talking about alleged rape I don't find it appropriate - given some of the comments that it leads to.. and AH or not.. I don't think that's right in such circumstances. Anyway, I think we can just agree to disagree on this!


  • #107
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,418 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    Millicent wrote: »
    No it's not. Rape is bloody rape. I don't care what the situation is--the victim is NEVER to blame. I am horrified you feel that way. Slut shaming is well and truly alive in Ireland today, it seems.

    You are horrified I feel what way exactly? where did I say the victim is to blame?
    You have latched on to my comment to vent, I did not call anyone a slut.

    Rape is pretty difficult to prove, it's the reason many victims do not report it.
    I'm sorry you have the wrong impression of me.


  • #108
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,214 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »
    Millicent wrote: »
    No it's not. Rape is bloody rape. I don't care what the situation is--the victim is NEVER to blame. I am horrified you feel that way. Slut shaming is well and truly alive in Ireland today, it seems.

    maybe that's cos there are plenty of sluts out there?:eek:
    The bitterness is strong in this one, professor.


  • #109
    RobbingBandit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,392 ✭✭✭✭RobbingBandit


    Chastity Belts to be mandatory from next season onward, I would assume.


  • #110
    Fear Uladh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 810 ✭✭✭Fear Uladh


    Millicent wrote: »
    This thread is actually depressing. I knew there were still some knuckle-draggers who apportion blame to the victim lurking in society, but it is shocking and really saddening to see how prevalent slut shaming is.

    Not really, I would hope that being AH, it is mostly jokes.

    Otherwise you have some seriously retarded ****wits out there.


  • #111
    Sardonicat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,445 ✭✭✭✭Sardonicat


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »
    maybe that's cos there are plenty of sluts out there?:eek:
    Me oh my, but this troll is hungry...


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  • #112
    KeithM89_old
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,806 ✭✭✭✭KeithM89_old


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »
    maybe that's cos there are plenty of sluts out there?:eek:

    Youre done here too.

    Dont post here again.


  • #113
    cabbage kid
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 146 ✭✭cabbage kid


    Has to be a troll, I refuse to believe that Bellydancer is for real


  • #114
    Millicent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    hondasam wrote: »
    You are horrified I feel what way exactly? where did I say the victim is to blame?
    You have latched on to my comment to vent, I did not call anyone a slut.

    Rape is pretty difficult to prove, it's the reason many victims do not report it.
    I'm sorry you have the wrong impression of me.

    "Slut shaming" is the common terminology given to the practice of seeking to blame a victim in their own rape.

    You have said,
    I agree a girl has to accept some responsibility in these situations but if the male is awake and the female is asleep he is more to blame.

    If that's not blaming a victim in some way, I don't know what is. A woman (or man for that matter) who is raped bears NO responsibility for a rape.


  • #115
    languagenerd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭languagenerd


    Feisar wrote: »
    Because of the sensitive nature of the crime people jump to the victims defense. Whereas if a person leaves there car window open and their Nikon camera gets stolen people would be more inclined to say they were stupid/careless.
    A drunk person wanders out a dark road on their own and gets raped, then it's how dare anyone portion some responsibility of the crime to the victim. While the fault/blame must be totally assigned to the person who committed the crime people should not look out for themselves. The world suffers fools badly.

    You might say someone was stupid to leave the window open, but it's still not their fault that someone stole from them!! That's akin to saying "They left their window open, sure what else was the thief going to do?" and completely ignoring the fact that stealing is illegal whether the window is open or not.

    How can you possibly blame anyone for being raped?! Just because they're drunk or walking alone doesn't mean that their right not to be attacked doesn't exist anymore!! Yes, it may be "careless" of them, but that doesn't give anyone the right to rape them. The fact at the end of the day is that the rapist commits the crime, not the victim!


  • #116
    Belly_Dancer
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 88 ✭✭Belly_Dancer


    people (that includes men also btw) must take RESPONSIBILITY for their own safety.

    Liza finished her account with, "I don't think a woman ever deserves to be raped, but at the same time I do believe she has to take personal responsibility for herself".

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-422513/Raped-drunk-does-mean-blame.html#ixzz1jlIOcUEr


  • #117
    Fluorescence
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 8,490 Mod ✭✭✭✭Fluorescence


    cabbage kid wrote: »
    Has to be a troll, I refuse to believe that Bellydancer is for real

    You'd be surprised (and disgusted) at how common his views are. Especially prevalent among people aged 40+. Mothers and grandmothers tut and condemn girls who dress "provocatively" and act flirtatiously. If they normalise rape and victim blame, of course these views are going to be widely held.

    Society's attitudes need to change :mad:


  • #118
    Samich
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,949 ✭✭✭Samich


    John Doe1 wrote: »
    Are there actually "men" on this thread who believe because a women gets slightly tipsy, that excuses men from forcing themselves on a women and defiling her?

    All I can say is I hope I never meet you

    I think he'd be more interested in filling her tbh ;) :pac:


  • #119
    Millicent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    Belly_Dancer wrote: »
    people (that includes men also btw) must take RESPONSIBILITY for their own safety.

    Liza finished her account with, "I don't think a woman ever deserves to be raped, but at the same time I do believe she has to take personal responsibility for herself".

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-422513/Raped-drunk-does-mean-blame.html#ixzz1jlIOcUEr

    She was on a television show, for God's sake, drinking while on camera. How in your mind have you conflated that to her inviting an assault?

    ETA: You may be shocked to hear, but it's not actually uncommon for a victim of a crime, especially a sexual one, to seek any way to blame themselves.


  • #120
    Samich
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,949 ✭✭✭Samich


    Is it beyond the realms of possibility the girl went to bed, while later the guy followed in under the covers, they had a little whisper between them and agreed to have sex?

    He is a model so chances are she probably would do it sober, probably.

    Hardly the most far fetched outcome?


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  • #121
    Feisar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,929 ✭✭✭Feisar


    Da Shins Kelly wrote: »
    Having a camera stolen from you and being a victim of rape are not at all comparable.

    I didn't say they were. What I'm saying is that people need to look after there own welfare.
    I should be able to walk down the Shankill with the Tricolour but if I did and I got a hiding I'm sure people would say I was fairly dumb.

    People should be able to go out and enjoy themselves and wander about etc. but there are dangerous animals out there.
    It's not the victims fault but that's not going to cure the physical/mental damage done.

    First they came for the socialists...



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