Why must we claim non-Irish people for Ireland?

starbelgrade · 16-01-2012 02:02AM

El Weirdo wrote: »

Exactly.

Fernando Torres' sports bag. Nice.

Sleepy · 16-01-2012 02:03AM

OP, it's something that's irritated me for a long time too.

Try telling anyone in Northern Ireland that's on welfare that they're Irish when their Irish counterparts get twice their dole.

Chuck Stone · 16-01-2012 02:03AM

Funny enough but most successful Protestant people from NI are quite comfortable with being identified as being Irish.

It's a credit to them that they are able to shake off the bollocks that they've been indoctrinated with by their families and communities.

grenache · 16-01-2012 02:03AM

Trader1991 wrote: »

Rory McIlroy and Darren Clarke did learn their trade in the republic as well as the north. The golfing union of Ireland includes all four provinces, and most of the golf(tournaments) they played when they were younger was in the republic. I watched rory mcilroy win the west of Ireland championship a couple of times. He also played for the Irish team.

While i accept your point that both Clarke and McIlroy played in the South many times, most of their day to day training would have taken place in the North. Along with any sports funding they received. For me, they represent Northern Ireland.

AlmightyCushion · 16-01-2012 02:04AM

starbelgrade wrote: »

You can be British and be Irish in that you can claim dual nationality & hold a passport from Ireland & the UK (once you meet the required criteria).

Yeah, you're right. My brain was being stupid for a minute there.

Sindri · 16-01-2012 02:04AM

I'd have to agree with some of your sentiments Grenache. It is annoying, embarrasing and cringe worthy watching Tubridy asking people about their Irish heritage or about their minuscule links to Ireland.

EDIT

400th post!

bwatson · 16-01-2012 02:05AM

dlofnep wrote: »

"But at the end of the day, I’m Irish. I mean, I’ve got a British passport, but if you’re from Ireland, north or south, you’re Irish. And ‘British’ is. . . such a nondescript thing, isn't it?"

-Eddie Irvine

Apart from enlightening everyone to the fact that Eddie Irvine decided to identify as Irish, what is your point? That every person to have been born in Northern Ireland shares the same mindset as Eddie Irvine? Or that his opinions on what constitutes being British blows everyone else's out of the water because he can drive cars better than most?

El Weirdo · 16-01-2012 02:06AM

Bollocks to this. I'm pissed.

Tiocfaidh ár lá and all that jazz.

/trolling

El Weirdo · 16-01-2012 02:08AM

bwatson wrote: »

Or that his opinions on what constitutes being British blows everyone else's out of the water because he can drive cars better than most?

Erm.. He is called "Irve the Swerve"... Of course his opinion means more than anyone else. :rolleyes:

grenache · 16-01-2012 02:09AM

fullstop wrote: »

Sigh, I wish you would at least have got your facts straight before coming on spouting ****e. If you did you'd know that golf is an all-Ireland sport and the Clarke and especially McIlroy benefitted hugely from GUI (Golfing Union of IRELAND) funding and coaching programmed and were sent all around the world representing, you've guessed it, IRELAND at the union's expense. So STFU

If i had got my facts straight then you wouldn't have been able to tell me to STFU, and i know that would have disappointed you greatly.
They're both from the North, both representing Northern Ireland. Have you noticed the "NI" after their names....

gsxr1 · 16-01-2012 02:10AM

Op has no clue.

N.Ireland is part of the island of Ireland. Border or no border.

The word Irish is not yours because you live in the Rep of Ireland you know.

Look
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=ireland&hl=en&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=39.916234,79.013672&vpsrc=0&hnear=Ireland&t=h&z=7

Seomra Mushie · 16-01-2012 02:11AM

OP, I'm fairly sure other countries get up to this too. I've heard both Jonathan Rhys-Meyers and Colin Farrell described as British in the British press. I've seen Canadian celebs referred to as American. I can see this happening everywhere.

mikemac1 · 16-01-2012 02:12AM

Andy Murray is British

Oh he lost? He's Scottish so

charlemont · 16-01-2012 02:13AM

grenache wrote: »

If i had got my facts straight then you wouldn't have been able to tell me to STFU, and i know that would have disappointed you greatly.
They're both from the North, both representing Northern Ireland. Have you noticed the "NI" after their names....

I think the I stands for Ireland..:eek:

grenache · 16-01-2012 02:14AM

gsxr1 wrote: »

Op has no clue.

N.Ireland is part of the island of Ireland. Border or no border.

The word Irish is not yours because you live in the Rep of Ireland you know.

Look
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=ireland&hl=en&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=39.916234,79.013672&vpsrc=0&hnear=Ireland&t=h&z=7

really? Thanks for the insight, i had not noticed. :rolleyes:

That is not the point at issue here. How do you know that any of the more famous personalities from the north are happy at being described as Irish? They are not ours to claim.

mikeyboy · 16-01-2012 02:15AM

Sindri wrote: »

Wasn't his father Irish?

Yep, Leo Milligan from No 5 Holborn St. in Sligo and Spike's full name was, Terence Alan Patrick Sean Milligan. How Irish was that. I remember from one of his memoirs him saying that he was regularly beaten up at school because he used to claim descent from the High Kings of Ireland.

Mr Benevolent · 16-01-2012 02:18AM

Born in France, you're French. Born in Germany, you're German. ROI and NI are the same, separate countries sharing a border. Why is this so hard for people to understand?

Trader1991 · 16-01-2012 02:19AM

grenache wrote: »

really? Thanks for the insight, i had not noticed. :rolleyes:

That is not the point at issue here. How do you know that any of the more famous personalities from the north are happy at being described as Irish? They are not ours to claim.

but theres nothing to be unhappy about.. they are Irish. Weather your northern Irish or southern Irish your still Irish.

dlofnep · 16-01-2012 02:21AM

bwatson wrote: »

Apart from enlightening everyone to the fact that Eddie Irvine decided to identify as Irish, what is your point? That every person to have been born in Northern Ireland shares the same mindset as Eddie Irvine? Or that his opinions on what constitutes being British blows everyone else's out of the water because he can drive cars better than most?

The original post stated that we 'claimed' Eddie Irvine. I'm merely pointing out that many sports-people in the north identify as being Irish freely. Nobody has claimed anyone.

Sindri · 16-01-2012 02:21AM

Britishness is an odd concept that encompasses Sikhs, Pakistanis and Africans. It could be used to refer to all citizens of the Empire back in the day.

We're are all fairly similar culturally and genetically to all the peoples of the Western Isles, while these people may be British they can also be Irish. They self identify as British, we don't but we're not all that dissimilar. Sure we all watch the BBC.

mikemac1 · 16-01-2012 02:22AM

Why does England claim our top cricketers? :mad:

nice_very · 16-01-2012 02:27AM

whoever it was that mentioned ian paisley, I am 35 and I remember him saying that he is Irish, as born on the Island...

IMO born on the Island = Irish, if afterwards want to become a traitor thats their own business, go live in the other country.

gsxr1 · 16-01-2012 02:28AM

grenache wrote: »

really? Thanks for the insight, i had not noticed. :rolleyes:

That is not the point at issue here. How do you know that any of the more famous personalities from the north are happy at being described as Irish? They are not ours to claim.

Why would they have an issue? If they where born in ULSTER.

Look at the link, you may notice that area is in Ireland . Eddie Irvine as far as I remember drove his car under a British flag but still considered himself Irish(not Scottish, English) . When he won a podium the British National anthem was played(apart from one time)

If they did not like the Irish claims then im sure they would reject them.

Having a country claim you as their own would be very flattering to most I would think.

fullstop · 16-01-2012 02:34AM

grenache wrote: »

fullstop wrote: »

Sigh, I wish you would at least have got your facts straight before coming on spouting ****e. If you did you'd know that golf is an all-Ireland sport and the Clarke and especially McIlroy benefitted hugely from GUI (Golfing Union of IRELAND) funding and coaching programmed and were sent all around the world representing, you've guessed it, IRELAND at the union's expense. So STFU

If i had got my facts straight then you wouldn't have been able to tell me to STFU, and i know that would have disappointed you greatly.
They're both from the North, both representing Northern Ireland. Have you noticed the "NI" after their names....

Don't suppose you happened to catch McIlroy and McDowell representing Ireland under the tricolour at the World Cup in November, no?

Little link and all to help you

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/golf/15902385.stm

K-9 · 16-01-2012 02:46AM

Irish and British, all the same to me.

They all look and speak the same.

K-9 · 16-01-2012 02:50AM

Oh yeah, Spike Millligan is a legend.

Gay Byrne: "How long were you in North Africa?"

Milligan: (with an incredulous look) 6'5".

Fecking WWII traitor.

starbelgrade · 16-01-2012 03:00AM

Sindri wrote: »

Wasn't his father Irish?

I think so.

Tayla · 16-01-2012 03:01AM

bwatson wrote: »

Apart from enlightening everyone to the fact that Eddie Irvine decided to identify as Irish, what is your point? That every person to have been born in Northern Ireland shares the same mindset as Eddie Irvine? Or that his opinions on what constitutes being British blows everyone else's out of the water because he can drive cars better than most?

I think his point was obvious when you read it in relation to what this thread is actually about, the OP thinks that we are claiming people that we shouldn't claim.

If someone identifies themselves as Irish then they should be considered Irish.

If a highly successful Catholic person from Northern Ireland with an Irish name and Irish family decided to say that he was British and not Irish then fair enough, I wouldn't want us to claim them as our own.

starbelgrade · 16-01-2012 03:04AM

Italia 90 would never have been as good as it was if we hadn't had claimed some British as ours, so I'm all for it.

Cavehill Red · 16-01-2012 03:10AM

grenache wrote: »

Why do we do it? RTE in particular are notorious for it. The seem to love pinching people from the North. The likes of Rory McIlroy, Darren Clarke or Eddie Irvine did not learn their trade in our country. They were not taught the basic skills of their sport here, nor did they receive any funding from the Irish government or Sports Council.

All of the above are Irish.

grenache wrote: »

Now, i know some of you will try and play the "but they are from the island of Ireland" card. But to me that matters not a jot. So is Ian Paisley.

The same Ian Paisley who has said on a number of occasions that he is proud to be an Ulsterman and an Irishman. It matters not a jot to me what matters to you. I'm born in Ireland, have an Irish passport and like 1.5 million others under British occupation/rule in the North of IRELAND, I'm Irish. Suck it up.

grenache wrote: »

They are United Kingdom as far as i'm concerned and should be treated as so.

Again. what concerns you is neither here nor there. The reality is otherwise.

grenache wrote: »

If we're going to try to claim the North's sports stars, why don't RTE start to give us regular updates on the fortunes of the North's soccer team.

They do, but I agree, it would be nice if they did a bit more of it.

grenache wrote: »

It's a total farce that we would try to claim people that were neither born or schooled here. Ditto British people who have Irish links e.g. Daniel Day Lewis. Lost count of how many times i've seen him described as an "Irishman". He might live in Wicklow and have an Irish passport, but he's not Irish. He is British.

He too has the passport and citizenship and is Irish. Who are you to deny his or my Irishness? Nobody is who.

grenache wrote: »

This nonsense and "plastic paddy syndrome" has to stop.

Grow up.

Why must we claim non-Irish people for Ireland?

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