14-year-old shoots himself after bullying

as125634do · 13-01-2012 02:11PM

So...a pedo chats up a 14 year old and has sex. Death to him. A bully bullies a 14 year old who kill themselve. It was the victims fault. Where is death to the bully. bat**** crazy is what this worldis full of ignorance

Duggy747 · 13-01-2012 02:11PM

There's no universal fix for kids being bullied. Non-violent means works for some, violent means (fighting) works for others as I'm sure people here can vouch for either method. It's hard for a kid when they're up against a group mentality that strive to impress each other, no matter who they trample on, to succeed socially in school.

I've seen plenty of cases where both do and don't work.

It's a sad case when a person as young as this sees taking their life as the only solution available to them. Quite worrying when it's become far more frequent in the past decade here.

I Heart Internet · 13-01-2012 02:14PM

Degsy wrote: »

Exactly what the bully will say to them when they find out that they told the teacher or whatever...

Yes. Yes it is.

Degsy wrote: »

at the heel of the hunt the kid should be able and willing to make a stand for himself...it sets a precedent for later on in life..if you get used to being a victim you will get good at being a victim.

How many are? It's fine for you and me. I'm a grown man, I don't take ****. What about a 14 year old boy who should but can't. You might have been a tough, insightful, no-nonsense young person.....we weren't all like you.

Degsy wrote: »

Yes..if people looked and acted less like victims then they will become victims less often.

Maybe they should carry swords? Although, I was told a story by the mildest, most sound guy who happened to be an evangelical christian that he shaved his head because people think your a bit rough and won't give you ****. But I didn't see then and I don't see now why people need to give off an aura of physical strength to avoid abuse in a civilised society.

Degsy wrote: »

I recently had to intervene on behalf of some bloke on the luas who was being robbed of his ipad..he was probably the only person on the carraige oblivious to the fact that two junkies were staring at him as he browsed away merrily.

He had no sense of spatial awareness and wasnt employing the slightest shred of common sense...basically he looked like he wasnt going to resist and as it turned out he didnt,me and another person had to come to his rescue..

Fair play - not everyone is up to looking out for/after themselves. Totally agree there.

Degsy wrote: »

What do you suggest? That the bullied child pleads with them or starts crying in teh hope they'll leave him alone?
It doenst work like that..bullies thrive on weakness and weakness only.

That they walk into the principals office and explain exactly what is happening and tell their parents as well. If handled properly, the bullies whole charade of power should come crumbling down and the bullying stops.

But for some kids on the receiving end of very bad bullying convincing them to tell those in authority is, I'm sure, almost as hard as convincing them to fight back (verbally or physically).

Degsy · 13-01-2012 02:14PM

as125634do wrote: »

So...a pedo chats up a 14 year old and has sex. Death to him.

Mr. CooL ICE · 13-01-2012 02:15PM

Degsy wrote: »

I Heart Internet wrote: »

You use "squealing" the same way a bully would.
.

Exactly what the bully will say to them when they find out that they told the teacher or whatever...

I Heart Internet wrote: »

It's not a bad thing to explain to those in authority (parents/teachers/principal) that another person is making your every waking moment a living hell.

No its not a bad thing to explain whats going on but at the heel of the hunt the kid should be able and willing to make a stand for himself...it sets a precedent for later on in life..if you get used to being a victim you will get good at being a victim.

I Heart Internet wrote: »

Would you extend your argument to society in general?

"Think the gardai want to protect weak people 24/7?" .

Yes..if people looked and acted less like victims then they will become victims less often.

I recently had to intervene on behalf of some bloke on the luas who was being robbed of his ipad..he was probably the only person on the carraige oblivious to the fact that two junkies were staring at him as he browsed away merrily.

He had no sense of spatial awareness and wasnt employing the slightest shred of common sense...basically he looked like he wasnt going to resist and as it turned out he didnt,me and another person had to come to his rescue..

I Heart Internet wrote: »

But your notion that fighting off a bully (even if that were possible for the teen/child) is the best way forward is ridiculous.

What do you suggest? That the bullied child pleads with them or starts crying in teh hope they'll leave him alone?
It doenst work like that..bullies thrive on weakness and weakness only.

Degsy, your rbullying solutions in this tread would work if every bullying case that ever existed was a scene from a sh1t american high school movie.

Bullying is not just acts of violence. It is mostly psychological. Bullies are cowards because they usually intimidate in a way where there is no evidence. If a bully victim lashes out and a fight ensues, the question that always crops up is "who startdd it?".

As previously stated, most bullying cases are not black and white. Violence is certainly not always the answer

Degsy · 13-01-2012 02:17PM

LordChessington wrote: »

. Bullies are cowards because they usually intimidate in a way where there is no evidence. If a bully victim lashes out and a fight ensues, the question that always crops up is "who startdd it?".

And who really cares?

Fights happen all the time in school..its completely natural.

Degsy · 13-01-2012 02:21PM

I Heart Internet wrote: »

That they walk into the principals office and explain exactly what is happening and tell their parents as well. If handled properly, the bullies whole charade of power should come crumbling down and the bullying stops.

So from an early age kids are using adults to fight thier battles for them?

This has its place but it cant be resorted to every single time or the child will grow up weak and lazy with no self-esteem,probably with a sneaky nature too.

The peole who were known as "tattle tales" in my schools were usually Mummy's boys with an axe to grind about thier own lack of character.

norrie rugger · 13-01-2012 02:25PM

My first experience with depression was triggered by constant torment about having red hair. The fact that it is seen as socially acceptable made me dread school every day. I used to lie awake every night wondering how bad it would be the next morning.

To this day everyone still thinks that it is ok to have a go and if I say anything shur is it not only "Harmless messing"

I Heart Internet · 13-01-2012 02:25PM

Degsy wrote: »

So from an early age kids are using adults to fight thier battles for them?

This has its place but it cant be resorted to every single time or the child will grow up weak and lazy with no self-esteem,probably with a sneaky nature too.

The peole who were known as "tattle tales" in my schools were usually Mummy's boys with an axe to grind about thier own lack of character.

Best response to this has already been given by others above -

This is not gladiator school.

Nor is our society a jungle.

Degsy wrote: »

probably with a sneaky nature too

Am I the only one who read this and heard Martin McGuiness? Damn informers.

sunflower27 · 13-01-2012 02:28PM

Degsy wrote: »

So from an early age kids are using adults to fight thier battles for them?

This has its place but it cant be resorted to every single time or the child will grow up weak and lazy with no self-esteem,probably with a sneaky nature too.

The peole who were known as "tattle tales" in my schools were usually Mummy's boys with an axe to grind about thier own lack of character.

If a child is being bullied, they should be telling adults. It seems a ridiculous notion to me that kids will just be kids and should always fight their own battles. As said already, not every kid has the physical strength to take on another kid (especially if the bully is bigger and psychologically already in a bettter position).

And again, as said, bullying isn't just physical.

Something has to be done for these children that see no way out but to take their lives and leave behind a lifetime of suffering and guilt with their families.

Seachmall · 13-01-2012 02:33PM

I Heart Internet wrote: »

Nor is our society a jungle.

But it is damn close to it.

We constantly tell people to stand up for themselves, take the direct approach and not to be afraid but when that might mean violence, especially among kids, a lot of people will back down from it.

The world can be a harsh place and these kids are learning it young, suggesting they stand up for themselves isn't the worst of ideas. I'd rather a kid learn how to throw a punch from a young age then never learn how to throw one at all because in reality if you're afraid to take the direct approach someone will try to victimize you.

pickarooney · 13-01-2012 02:38PM

RachaelVO wrote: »

Now I don't care what anyone says, but 200 children between 10 and 14 in 6 years for the tiny population we've got is a worrying number.

The article mentions Chicago several times.

Overheal · 13-01-2012 02:39PM

Degsy wrote: »

The only way to defeat bullies is to make the kid stand up for his/herself..it can be hard the first time but it always works..bullies will always pick on an easy target and tbh i think kids and parents are getting softer.

Children being bullied dont need counselling..they need to be shown how to throw a punch.

You're on the right track, but bullies can be stopped without throwing a punch.

I was bullied plenty in secondary school. By a bunch of you scraggy Irish feckers no less, and mostly for being American (to those associated: F*ck You).

But really it all became as simple to me as reporting everything when it happened. If there was no teacher present it went to the main office, Headmaster, or that turkey-necked bloke who was trying to get the Headmaster's position. Throwing papers at the back of my head in class? I had no problem after a point of standing up - interrupting class - turning around and telling everyone behind me, that whoever is throwing **** at the back of my head can please stop. Because what's the teacher going to do, give out to me for interrupting class? Pfft. I wasn't the interruption. I didn't even discriminate if it happened on college grounds or not: somoene tried to kick me while I was tying my shoe across the street at lunch, and he was in the office 20 minutes later.

Don't get me wrong, one dude tried to put a lighter up to my leg one time and he got immediately facepunched for it rightly so. But thats not a workable solution to every problem.

In the end I had a great time at school once all the troublemakers were rightly flagged by the staff for what they were. Before long the bullies were too busy complaining that the teachers were being too 'mean' to them (The teachers picking on me WAAAAAAAAHHH!) to think about bullying other people.

jobless · 13-01-2012 02:43PM

gemma188 wrote: »

Confront the bully without using violence. Get class discussions started on the topic of bullying. Push for stories such as this poor child in Australia to be published in the school newsletter to make bully realise what their actions could drive someone to do. Talk to a parent. Report the bullying to a teacher. Lots of ways to resolve it without using your fists.

Bully's solve things by fighting. Why should someone who is better than this be forced to reduce themselves to such thuggery?

Get real would you.... get class discussions going?... push for school newsletter to publish articles etc?... that isnt going to to help the victim one bit....in fact they'd probably be scared ****less of the extra attention on them...

i know bullying of boys and girls can be different but i second the whole fighting fire with fire approach.... i have a lot of grown up friends who now realise how they could have nipped everything in the bud with a whallop instead of putting up with it...

Mr. CooL ICE · 13-01-2012 02:45PM

Degsy, i really dont understand your mindset. You strike me as being somebody who has never experienced or witnessed childhood bullying.

As a case example, can you please explain to me what use teaching a physically small child how to throw a punch when he is being bullied by a gang of 5 or more?

Big difference between teaching a kid how to throw a punch and how to be a bloody ninja

Overheal · 13-01-2012 02:46PM

Degsy wrote: »

So from an early age kids are using adults to fight thier battles for them?

By 'kids' I think you mean People, and by 'adults' I think you mean Authority Figures.

You think this "Fight your own battles" attitude helped out this 14 year old? Not every battle can be fought by yourself. Nobody is suggesting you have to fight all of your battles or none of them, but cop on: there is too much importance placed in Irish society on handling things internally. "Keep it in the family", etc. is why kiddie fiddlers and rapists rarely go reported.

You make it sound like a shameful thing for a kid to have to ask an adult for help. Bullies don't fight fair, why should the victim?

sunflower27 · 13-01-2012 02:52PM

Overheal wrote: »

Bullies don't fight fair, why should the victim?

Great point, overheal.

Degsy · 13-01-2012 03:03PM

LordChessington wrote: »

As a case example, can you please explain to me what use teaching a physically small child how to throw a punch when he is being bullied by a gang of 5 or more?

Because a group of 5 or more bullying one child will usually have a leader of sorts..if you punch the leader in the nose the rest will melt away like snow.

It maybe distasteful to people who call their child Max or Lewis or Tristram but it has worked sionce the dawn of time.

norrie rugger · 13-01-2012 03:08PM

Degsy wrote: »

Because a group of 5 or more bullying one child will usually have a leader of sorts..if you punch the leader in the nose the rest will melt away like snow.

Errrmmm, right.
I am sorry but your comment there is a complete load of bollocks and I am beginning to think that you are just trolling here TBH.
More likely they will all beat the living crap out of you.

Your reasoning would only work if the bullied kid is physically able to beat the agressor AND be enough of a psychopath to do enough damage to frighten the feck out of the group

Overheal · 13-01-2012 03:09PM

Degsy wrote: »

Because a group of 5 or more bullying one child will usually have a leader of sorts..if you punch the leader in the nose the rest will melt away like snow.

Antiquated logic. Especially when most of the problematic bullying occurs online, not in the handball alleys.

ch750536 · 13-01-2012 03:10PM

LordChessington wrote: »

Degsy, i really dont understand your mindset. You strike me as being somebody who has never experienced or witnessed childhood bullying.

As a case example, can you please explain to me what use teaching a physically small child how to throw a punch when he is being bullied by a gang of 5 or more?

Big difference between teaching a kid how to throw a punch and how to be a bloody ninja

From my own experience:
Gang of kids thought I had 'grassed them up' for selling things in school they shouldnt. Each night met me on the way home and gave me pastings. Each night I made sure I really hurt at least one of them.
When you nearly bite someones finger off eventually they give up beating you.
Have given the same advice to my kids. "If you're going to get a beating make sure you really hurt one of them." No ninja required, just means you have to attack them first.

ch750536 · 13-01-2012 03:14PM

norrie rugger wrote: »

Errrmmm, right.
I am sorry but your comment there is a complete load of bollocks and I am beginning to think that you are just trolling here TBH.
More likely they will all beat the living crap out of you.

Your reasoning would only work if the bullied kid is physically able to beat the agressor AND be enough of a psychopath to do enough damage to frighten the feck out of the group

I can guarantee you 1 thing. If any kid saw a group of bullies approaching and they decided to launch an attack on the bullies before they got chance the bullying would soon stop. Equally if every time they saw one of them on their own no matter where. Sure, you're going to get a beating but after a couple of days do the same thing again.
It's how the world works unfortunately. Who gets the jobs, the nice guys or the confident agressively chasing goals guys?

norrie rugger · 13-01-2012 03:18PM

ch750536 wrote: »

From my own experience:
Gang of kids thought I had 'grassed them up' for selling things in school they shouldnt. Each night met me on the way home and gave me pastings. Each night I made sure I really hurt at least one of them.
When you nearly bite someones finger off eventually they give up beating you.
Have given the same advice to my kids. "If you're going to get a beating make sure you really hurt one of them." No ninja required, just means you have to attack them first.

And what if there was a way out of it without getting beaten up?
Would you not try that first?

The retalitory violence should be the means to defend yourself in a specific situation. You should not expect a child to be constantly on the look out for a gang that is about to attack them. What happens if a particularly nasty fecker decides that he did not like you biting his finger and decided that fists are no longer enough and decides to use a hurley, bat, knife?

mongoman · 13-01-2012 03:20PM

OP - pity that young lad didn't turn the gun on his bullies. If victims struck back more often, it might make the bullying profession less appealing.

Degsy · 13-01-2012 03:21PM

Overheal wrote: »

Antiquated logic. Especially when most of the problematic bullying occurs online, not in the handball alleys.

No it doesnt..school is where proper bullying has always taken place.

norrie rugger · 13-01-2012 03:21PM

ch750536 wrote: »

I can guarantee you 1 thing. If any kid saw a group of bullies approaching and they decided to launch an attack on the bullies before they got chance the bullying would soon stop. Equally if every time they saw one of them on their own no matter where. Sure, you're going to get a beating but after a couple of days do the same thing again.
It's how the world works unfortunately. Who gets the jobs, the nice guys or the confident agressively chasing goals guys?

You must have had some fairly weak bullies TBH.
I am 6ft1' and more than cabable of handing out a pasting.

On more than one occasion I did just that to individuals or small groups of bullies. What I got was a hurley to my face, while unawares, and a massive kicking on the ground. It is called escalation and no matter what you do, if it is 1VsCrowd you will lose if they are determined to make your life hell.
There is nothing wrong in asking for help, when you need it. There is a reason why the suicide rate, in Ireland, is as high as it is. We see asking for help as a sign of weakness, for some fecked up reason

gemma188 · 13-01-2012 03:28PM

Degsy wrote: »

Because a group of 5 or more bullying one child will usually have a leader of sorts..if you punch the leader in the nose the rest will melt away like snow.

As someone already said I think this guy has been watching far too many American high school movies or episodes of Glee. And I suppose by your logic once the victim defeats the lead jock, the head cheerleader will fall for the guy who was bullied and against all odds they'll end up being voted the prom King and Queen. :rolleyes:

Bully's have no issue with causing physical harm to others. So how can you expect a child who was brought up with better morals than this to engage in acts of violence when this is more than likely something a bully thrives on.

Mr. CooL ICE · 13-01-2012 03:28PM

Degsy wrote: »

LordChessington wrote: »

As a case example, can you please explain to me what use teaching a physically small child how to throw a punch when he is being bullied by a gang of 5 or more?

Because a group of 5 or more bullying one child will usually have a leader of sorts..if you punch the leader in the nose the rest will melt away like snow.

Complete and utter bollox tbh

Seachmall · 13-01-2012 03:49PM

gemma188 wrote: »

As someone already said I think this guy has been watching far too many American high school movies or episodes of Glee. And I suppose by your logic once the victim defeats the lead jock, the head cheerleader will fall for the guy who was bullied and against all odds they'll end up being voted the prom King and Queen. :rolleyes:

As someone who was bullied and eventually fought back I can tell you fighting back does work, even if you don't get the girl.

I was lucky enough to have a good friend who was a bit of a nut-job, and I'm sure many kids who are bullied wouldn't necessarily have such a friend but a good kick-in will deter bullies.

Groups of bullies I don't know, but for that one scumbag who likes to make you his punchbag a bloody and bruised face will make him think twice.

Degsy · 13-01-2012 03:54PM

LordChessington wrote: »

Complete and utter bollox tbh

Are you speaking from experience?..i know i am.

14-year-old shoots himself after bullying

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