14-year-old shoots himself after bullying

sunflower27

Saw something on the news about this morning as I was dashing out. Can't find anything online about it. Does anyone know where it happened?

I always find these stories horrific. I was never a victim of bullying, thank God. Teenage years are tough enough without being made to feel like an outsider.

I don't know what sort of policies are in place in schools, but I wonder how seriously bullying is considered. Do schools all have their own protocol?

I went to an all-girls school and there were different cliques, but I don't ever recall serious bullying where people would just gang up on someone. There was b*tchiness alright, but never bullying and threats to my knowledge.

RIP that poor little boy, what a total waste.

Freddie59

sunflower27 wrote: »

Saw something on the news about this morning as I was dashing out. Can't find anything online about it. Does anyone know where it happened?

I always find these stories horrific. I was never a victim of bullying, thank God. Teenage years are tough enough without being made to feel like an outsider.

I don't know what sort of policies are in place in schools, but I wonder how seriously bullying is considered. Do schools all have their own protocol?

I went to an all-girls school and there were different cliques, but I don't ever recall serious bullying where people would just gang up on someone. There was b*tchiness alright, but never bullying and threats to my knowledge.

RIP that poor little boy, what a total waste.

It happened in the North East of the Republic Of Ireland.

So very tragic. We can't even begin to scratch the surface of school bullying. Our daughter was badly bullied for the first three years of secondary school. For all the 'procedures' that are in place the schools can't really handle it. I don't think anyone can. May he Rest In Peace and may God be with both his parents.

chin_grin

Horrible.

EDIT: Ok that's weird. Just noticed that the title of the thread..............And this is a different story.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/health/family-of-suicide-teen-urge-parents-to-watch-childrens-internet-use/story-fn59nokw-1226242931928

Family of suicide teen Sheniz Erkan urge parents to watch children's internet use

by: PIA AKERMAN
From: The Australian
January 13, 2012 12:00AM



THE family of a teenage girl who committed suicide after being bullied online and at school have pleaded for parents to keep a close watch on their children's internet use, echoing calls from former Victorian premier Jeff Kennett for parents to take more responsibility with their children.

Melbourne schoolgirl Sheniz Erkan, 14, took her own life on Monday after suffering bullying unknown to her parents.

Her older brother Aykut yesterday said Sheniz had appeared to be "a bundle of joy", and her few friends who knew something was wrong did not speak out.

"Parents need to keep more track of Facebook and the internet," he said on talk station 3AW. "There are problems that they might not know about that are being kept online.

"These days there is so much technology and cyber stuff going on it's like a whole other world.

"Kids can just hide behind their keyboards, write whatever they want without worrying about the repercussions."
The full digital experience

Mr Kennett, who is chairman of beyondblue, said cyber-bullying was "happening all the time" and parents should play the key role in monitoring their children's internet behaviour.

"The easiest thing in the world is to blame the school," he said. "It's not the school's responsibility about how another child behaves to another person - that is about upbringing, it's about parental responsibility.

"As parents I think you need to make sure that your children's access to the internet computers is in the family room, so that you can be sort of looking at what they're doing, rather than having them doing it in their own room."

Legislation providing jail terms of up to 10 years for cyber-bullying has been in place in Victoria since June last year, with a charge of stalking applicable if the bullying is part of a pattern of conduct likely to cause physical or mental harm, or fear of it.

Known as Brodie's Law, the amendments sprang from the death of 19-year old Brodie Panlock who committed suicide after being bullied by colleagues at the Melbourne cafe where she worked.

A police spokeswoman said investigators were preparing a report on Sheniz's death for the state coroner.

"We're aware of bullying allegations, however we have had no official complaint," the spokeswoman said.

State and territory government are monitoring the use of Brodie's law to determine whether similar legislation should be replicated nationally.

Sheniz's funeral will be held in Melbourne today.

If you are depressed or contemplating suicide, help is available at Lifeline on 131 114.

Brendog

They really should make it easier for kids to talk to someone. They aren't mature enough to deal with theyir feelings and for a lot of them suicide seems the easy solution.

I know when I was in school our teachers always made us aware that councelliing was available to us if we needed it. Even if we just wanted to talk to someone in confidence.

Degsy

The only way to defeat bullies is to make the kid stand up for his/herself..it can be hard the first time but it always works..bullies will always pick on an easy target and tbh i think kids and parents are getting softer.

Children being bullied dont need counselling..they need to be shown how to throw a punch.

sunflower27

I think it is becoming more epidemic now with social media networks. These days a child can be literally crucified online.

What the hell is being done to stop this? Do bullies just get a slap on the wrist (figuratively)?

I am fairly sure that there are schools out there that turn a blind eye. It actually makes me sick. I was lucky to get through school unscathed so I am not sure what my motivation is behind this. it just makes my blood boil that any child should be put through this on a daily basis and think ending their life is the only option.

Something needs to change and Ireland needs to seriously look at the policies it has - if any - to make it known that bullying on any level (that usually only escalates) has grave consequences.

chin_grin

Degsy wrote: »

The only way to defeat bullies is to make the kid stand up for his/herself..it can be hard the first time but it always works..bullies will always pick on an easy target and tbh i think kids and parents are getting softer.

I agree to this to a point. Give the kid some confidence but not get the ultimate sh!te bet out of him/her for doing so.

Freddie59

Degsy wrote: »

The only way to defeat bullies is to make the kid stand up for his/herself..it can be hard the first time but it always works..bullies will always pick on an easy target and tbh i think kids and parents are getting softer.

It can work sometimes. Other times not. In the end our daughter gave the bully concerned a few slaps (with our blessing) after she had, once again, been attacked. She and the bully were suspended. And she was ostracised even further. So not as cut and dried as you may think.
Unfortunately.

Seachmall

I was bullied in Primary School, an old friend of mine and myself ended up jumping him and kicking the **** out of him after school one day.

Fortunately I wasn't bullied in Secondary but I still didn't enjoy it much either.

Poor kid, it ain't nice.

Freddie59

sunflower27 wrote: »

I think it is becoming more epidemic now with social media networks. These days a child can be literally crucified online.

What the hell is being done to stop this? Do bullies just get a slap on the wrist (figuratively)?

I am fairly sure that there are schools out there that turn a blind eye. It actually makes me sick. I was lucky to get through school unscathed so I am not sure what my motivation is behind this. it just makes my blood boil that any child should be put through this on a daily basis and think ending their life is the only option.

Something needs to change and Ireland needs to seriously look at the policies it has - if any - to make it known that bullying on any level (that usually only escalates) has grave consequences.

A lot of it is down to the bully's own social environment. We asked the school liaison if there was any point in us talking to her parents. We were told we'd be lucky to find them sober.

Other children in the class who would have socialised with our daughter were then themselves bullied into not socialising with her. Until, thankfully, one of those girls went to a teacher one day to inform her that our daughter was being ostracised, eating lunch breaks on her own, etc.

The interesting thing was that the bully then tried it on a younger sibling, who was a completely different personality. She 'took her aside', words were had, and there were no further attempts made.

SarahBeep!

Often the.problem is teachers underestimate the seriousness of some incidents.
'Oh, she just.got a shove.in a corridor because her friend is pissed at her.'

No, someone who is making her life miserable pushed her to remind her.of whats gonnahappen after school.

And a lot of teachers couldnt care less.

sunflower27

Freddie59 wrote: »

A lot of it is down to the bully's own social environment. We asked the school liaison if there was any point in us talking to her parents. We were told we'd be lucky to find them sober.

Other children in the class who would have socialised with our daughter were then themselves bullied into not socialising with her. Until, thankfully, one of those girls went to a teacher one day to inform her that our daughter was being ostracised, eating lunch breaks on her own, etc.

The interesting thing was that the bully then tried it on a younger sibling, who was a completely different personality. She 'took her aside', words were had, and there were no further attempts made.

Why aren't bullies suspended and moved to a different school for problem children where their behaviour can be monitored?

Freddie59

Seachmall wrote: »

I was bullied in Primary School, an old friend of mine and myself ended up jumping him and kicking the **** out of him after school one day.

Fortunately I wasn't bullied in Secondary but I still didn't enjoy it much either.

It lingers with you. Our daughter, now thankfully a very well-adjusted 24 year-old, still talks about it to this day. And she maintains that being able to confide in us during the whole affair is what kept her sane. Thank God.

sunflower27

SarahBeep! wrote: »

Often the.problem is teachers underestimate the seriousness of some incidents.
'Oh, she just.got a shove.in a corridor because her friend is pissed at her.'

No, someone who is making her life miserable pushed her to remind her.of whats gonnahappen after school.

And a lot of teachers couldnt care less.

Then the teachers should be damn well ashamed. Honestly, I'd be absolutely disgusted at a teacher with that attitude. Children are in their care when they are at school.

Freddie59

sunflower27 wrote: »

Why aren't bullies suspended and moved to a different school for problem children where their behaviour can be monitored?

You actually can't do it legally I think. Our daughter was in a great class all the way through primary - a lovely bunch of kids. There was another class which consisted of a lot of troublemakers. They merged the two in secondary, the attitude being that the good ones would rehabilitate the bad ones. Fatal error. It's like moving problem families into quiet housing estates. Lovely idea in principle. Cannot - ever - work.

MagicSean

sunflower27 wrote: »

Why aren't bullies suspended and moved to a different school for problem children where their behaviour can be monitored?

Because the Irish system has the most liberal view of children in the world. They are all victims, even the psychopaths.

SarahBeep!

sunflower27 wrote: »

SarahBeep! wrote: »

Often the.problem is teachers underestimate the seriousness of some incidents.
'Oh, she just.got a shove.in a corridor because her friend is pissed at her.'

No, someone who is making her life miserable pushed her to remind her.of whats gonnahappen after school.

And a lot of teachers couldnt care less.

Then the teachers should be damn well ashamed. Honestly, I'd be absolutely disgusted at a teacher with that attitude. Children are in their care when they are at school.

What I saw.on teaching practise was a case.of 'if I.dont see it, its not.happening.'

MagicSean

SarahBeep! wrote: »

What I saw.on teaching practise was a case.of 'if I.dont see it, its not.happening.'

I challenge your assertion you were on teaching practise.

Seachmall

Freddie59 wrote: »

It lingers with you. Our daughter, now thankfully a very well-adjusted 24 year-old, still talks about it to this day. And she maintains that being able to confide in us during the whole affair is what kept her sane. Thank God.

That it does. When my parents found out they told the principal (who was a family friend) but unfortunately there wasn't much he could do and things got worse. I'm still glad I told them but just the way things turned out at the time I wished I hadn't.

Luckily I had a nut-job for a best friend back then.

When I was 13 or 14 I ran into my bully, I called him a ****. He kicked the **** out of me and threatened to blind me with a fag if I didn't I apologise. Still glad I did it.

MagicSean

sunflower27 wrote: »

Then the teachers should be damn well ashamed. Honestly, I'd be absolutely disgusted at a teacher with that attitude. Children are in their care when they are at school.

What can a teacher actually do? What would you expect them to do?

sunflower27

MagicSean wrote: »

What can a teacher actually do? What would you expect them to do?

What do I expect? I expect the teacher to inform the authorities and following a thorough investigation, the bully to be removed from the school.

If bullies know that they will be removed from the school then I think it would stop the majority of them letting it escalate to the extent that a vicitim feels there is no option but to kill themselves.

Mr. CooL ICE

Degsy wrote: »

The only way to defeat bullies is to make the kid stand up for his/herself..it can be hard the first time but it always works..bullies will always pick on an easy target and tbh i think kids and parents are getting softer.

Children being bullied dont need counselling..they need to be shown how to throw a punch.

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

In my school years, there were plenty of bullying cases none were the same. The only time that violence solved a bullying case was when the bully in question had no support. Victim attacked the bully and nobody backed him up.

Bullies mostly look for a reaction and a reason to escalate their torment. If someone is ostracised for whatever reason kids have and decide to lash out, it gives the bully a reason to use violence in return with their mates to back them up.

Teaching a kid to fight back is in the majority of cases going to make things ten times worse. Its not a black and white issue

MagicSean

sunflower27 wrote: »

What do I expect? I expect the teacher to inform the authorities

Which authorities? They should inform the parents and the principal.

sunflower27 wrote: »

and following a thorough investigation, the bully to be removed from the school.

A teacher can't remove someone from school.

sunflower27 wrote: »

If bullies know that they will be removed from the school then I think it would stop the majority of them letting it escalate to the extent that a vicitim feels there is no option but to kill themselves.

Teachers have no input on this. Rules in regards to expulsions are set my the Department of Education and Board of Management of the school.

I got bullied throughout secondary school. Never violently, just through words and taunting, which can hurt a lot more and last longer. Sometimes I wish I was the person I am now then, I know I wouldn't give a crap and even stand up for myself.

CreepingDeath

Degsy wrote: »

The only way to defeat bullies is to make the kid stand up for his/herself..it can be hard the first time but it always works..bullies will always pick on an easy target and tbh i think kids and parents are getting softer.

Children being bullied dont need counselling..they need to be shown how to throw a punch.

The kid isn't in gladiator school. :rolleyes:

sunflower27

MagicSean wrote: »

Which authorities? They should inform the parents and the principal.



A teacher can't remove someone from school.



Teachers have no input on this. Rules in regards to expulsions are set my the Department of Education and Board of Management of the school.

Authorities as in the principal. I am well aware a teacher doesn't have the jurisdiction to remove a child. I am not an idiot.

YFlyer

MagicSean wrote: »

I challenge your assertion you were on teaching practise.

Maybe not in English.

Eric Cartman

chin_grin wrote: »

Horrible.

EDIT: Ok that's weird. Just noticed that the title of the thread..............And this is a different story.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/health/family-of-suicide-teen-urge-parents-to-watch-childrens-internet-use/story-fn59nokw-1226242931928

Mr Kennett, who is chairman of beyondblue, said cyber-bullying was "happening all the time" and parents should play the key role in monitoring their children's internet usage.

Cyberbulling is bullshít. Who honestly gets upset by words on the internet . In all honesty suicide is a horrible, selfish , terrible thing and it should be taken seriously . But if your kid is the type to commit suicide because of words on the internet then even if you stopped that happening , a week in the real world after school would set them off far worse than any 'cyber bullying' ever could

DEFTLEFTHAND

Imagine a 14 child could be made feel that worthless and small that they see no other option but to take their own young lives. If that was my son/daughter I wouldn't be responsible for what I'd do to the perpetrator's of the bullying.

I Heart Internet

A close relative of mine was "cyber-bullied" for a short while (maybe a few months) in 5th or 6th year. Wasn't strictly school related - it was a former friend and that person's easily led acolytes (idiots). Was very vicious and very, very hard to deal with - hi-jacking social network accounts, emails, etc (as I said - former friend who was (foolishly) given access/passwords).

Luckily, my close relative was a sensible and together enough person to report it to their parents who set the wheels in motion to stop it (meeting with other parents, etc). Led to rifts, bad-feeling amongst parents that is ongoing.

I said it at the time, you'd want a glimmer of pure evil in you to carry that out....such hateful, hateful stuff.

RIP that poor young fella
Only message - speak up, sort it out.

sunflower27

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Cyberbulling is bullshít. Who honestly gets upset by words on the internet . In all honesty suicide is a horrible, selfish , terrible thing and it should be taken seriously . But if your kid is the type to commit suicide because of words on the internet then even if you stopped that happening , a week in the real world after school would set them off far worse than any 'cyber bullying' ever could

Hang on, we are talking about children here. They aren't mature adults able to grasp that a few words are meaningless.

In school, being liked is paramount to most children. They don't have the maturity and experience to know that there is nothing wrong with being an individual. At that age, all they want is acceptance.

Gumbi

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Cyberbulling is bullshít. Who honestly gets upset by words on the internet . In all honesty suicide is a horrible, selfish , terrible thing and it should be taken seriously . But if your kid is the type to commit suicide because of words on the internet then even if you stopped that happening , a week in the real world after school would set them off far worse than any 'cyber bullying' ever could

I agree, but it generally happens in cases where it is added torment, ie the bullying at school can now continue at home, thus exacerbating the situation for the person in question.

Personally, I don't agree with a lot of what Facebook entails.

sunflower27

I'd love to see a campaign rolled out.

We see so many about drink driving - why not something for kids?

Obviously not every child that is bullied kills themselves (thank God), but for many their school years are fraught with suffering and sadness.

I post a good bit in PI and the amount of young people that post in their early 20s that are socially inept and insecure because of schoolyard bullying is rife.

I Heart Internet

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Cyberbulling is bullshít. Who honestly gets upset by words on the internet . In all honesty suicide is a horrible, selfish , terrible thing and it should be taken seriously . But if your kid is the type to commit suicide because of words on the internet then even if you stopped that happening , a week in the real world after school would set them off far worse than any 'cyber bullying' ever could

No, it's not bull****.

Especially when, as a child, your world is quite small so people taking it over sending emails "from you" talking **** to people you know or writing obscence things on your facebook has a seemingly HUGE impact on them.

Of course, some kids/teens can stand up to it better but some can't handle it at all.

Degsy

CreepingDeath wrote: »

The kid isn't in gladiator school. :rolleyes:

What do you suggest then?

Going squealing to the teachers and making things worse?

Think they want to protect weak children 24/7?

You might never have stood up fopr yourself but its the only way to avoid being a victim..in school and in life generally.

Gumbi

I Heart Internet wrote: »

No, it's not bull****.

Especially when, as a child, your world is quite small so people taking it over sending emails "from you" talking **** to people you know or writing obscence things on your facebook has a seemingly HUGE impact on them.

Of course, some kids/teens can stand up to it better but some can't handle it at all.

This is a solid reason why children should NOT be allowed on social networking sites. If you meant teen, then I agree with you.

Dravokivich

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Cyberbulling is bullshít. Who honestly gets upset by words on the internet . In all honesty suicide is a horrible, selfish , terrible thing and it should be taken seriously . But if your kid is the type to commit suicide because of words on the internet then even if you stopped that happening , a week in the real world after school would set them off far worse than any 'cyber bullying' ever could

By saying cyberbullying, it sounds they are trying to make the internet sound like a beast that's part of the problem. But in essence all it is, is another schoolyard.

I can agree in part that the parents should be watching over their kids while online to be aware of what level of interaction is occurring and their kids know how to react/respond to it. Just as you would with kids in a playground/schoolyard/wherever.

This would not address the issue of bullying though as it is not held solely to any one medium and is most likely to be done where the bully does not expect to be challenged, which is a very real issue "In the real world."

MagicSean

sunflower27 wrote: »

Authorities as in the principal. I am well aware a teacher doesn't have the jurisdiction to remove a child. I am not an idiot.

So if you are aware of all this then why do you blame the teachers?

Gumbi

Degsy wrote: »

What do you suggest then?

Going squealing to the teachers and making things worse?

Think they want to protect weak children 24/7?

You might never have stood up fopr yourself but its the only way to avoid being a victim..in school and in life generally.

Don't be so naive. You honestly think that such a black and white solution can solve such a complicated problem?

First of all, I don't think a child has the capacity to rationally defend himself if needs be, so in virtually all cases involving children, I would think that this solution would be incorrect.

Standing up for yourself doesn't necessitate physical violence. You've made several assertions in that post to which I simply couldn't be bothered responding.

gemma188

Degsy wrote: »

What do you suggest then?

Going squealing to the teachers and making things worse?

Think they want to protect weak children 24/7?

You might never have stood up fopr yourself but its the only way to avoid being a victim..in school and in life generally.

Or maybe some kids just have more class than to lower themselves to the level of a bully by engaging in a physical altercation. And how naive of you to suggest that its the only way to prevent bullying.

tiny_penguin

MagicSean wrote: »

So if you are aware of all this then why do you blame the teachers?

Cant speak for sunflower - but if the teachers sees something happen and does not tell the principal who is in a position to do something about it, then they are facilitating it.

msg11

RIP to the poor young lad. He/It should never have come to him taken his own life.

On a side note, I am not joking here either. If this was America , he would have gone into the school and started shooting. Thankfully this is not America.

Hope the family pull together , such a sad time. A few more years he would have been out of school or sorted the situation out.

Degsy

gemma188 wrote: »

Or maybe some kids just have more class than to lower themselves to the level of a bully by engaging in a physical altercation. And how naive of you to suggest that its the only way to prevent bullying.

What then do you suggest for the classier child?

Wattle

Degsy wrote: »

What do you suggest then?

Going squealing to the teachers and making things worse?

Think they want to protect weak children 24/7?

You might never have stood up fopr yourself but its the only way to avoid being a victim..in school and in life generally.

Going squealing to the teachers may be the solution. Guy in our school was constantly bullied by five or six other guys. He told the form master. The bullies, along with their parents, were hauled up in front of the school authorities, suspended and warned if it ever happened again they'd be expelled. The guy never got bullied again.

CreepingDeath

Degsy wrote: »

What do you suggest then?

Going squealing to the teachers and making things worse?

Think they want to protect weak children 24/7?

Not all problems can be solved with your fists.

That approach might work in some rough inner city school where the bullies are a product of scumbag parents and the teachers don't care.
But most schools and parents would prefer a more civilised approach that addresses the issue of the bullies aggression.

ch750536

Its a funny one because society tells us we should 'work things out' with others without violent means but that is not how the real world works.
I have 2 rules in life. Never live in fear. Never be led.
If you are living in fear then do something about it. With regards to bullies this is a tough one for parents but generally speaking giving as good as you get is the answer for kids. I have not known a bully yet that didn't respond to this. A good example is my son who is 7. He wasn't really being bullied but he had a friend who would constantly hit him even if he asked not to. He told the teachers about it and he just got hit when the teachers weren't there. I told him to hit them back but he refused to do this as it was against the school rules (and no amount of persuation would work on this one.) Finally he bumped into him outside school and gave him a good beating. He no longer gets hit.
The same is true with verbal \ social bullying. Get in their faces, dont back down. They soon stop. Match everything they do with a little more venom.
Appreciate this is not what many parents want to hear but once your kid makes a stand they feel fantastic and they walk a few inches taller. Having others solve their issues simply leaves them concerned at when the next bully will come along as they do not have the tools to sort the issue themselves.

Lanaier

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Cyberbulling is bullshít. Who honestly gets upset by words on the internet .

Kids.

Degsy

CreepingDeath wrote: »

That approach might work in some rough inner city school where the bullies are a product of scumbag parents and the teachers don't care.
.

Is that where you went to school?

How long were you bullied for?

XenaLady

this is so sad I cant find the words :´(

Degsy

ch750536 wrote: »

Its a funny one because society tells us we should 'work things out' with others without violent means but that is not how the real world works.
I have 2 rules in life. Never live in fear. Never be led.
If you are living in fear then do something about it. With regards to bullies this is a tough one for parents but generally speaking giving as good as you get is the answer for kids. I have not known a bully yet that didn't respond to this. A good example is my son who is 7. He wasn't really being bullied but he had a friend who would constantly hit him even if he asked not to. He told the teachers about it and he just got hit when the teachers weren't there. I told him to hit them back but he refused to do this as it was against the school rules (and no amount of persuation would work on this one.) Finally he bumped into him outside school and gave him a good beating. He no longer gets hit.
The same is true with verbal \ social bullying. Get in their faces, dont back down. They soon stop. Match everything they do with a little more venom.
Appreciate this is not what many parents want to hear but once your kid makes a stand they feel fantastic and they walk a few inches taller. Having others solve their issues simply leaves them concerned at when the next bully will come along as they do not have the tools to sort the issue themselves.

+1

Parents and teachers cannot fight the childrens battles forever,the kid has got to learn to stick up for itself at some stage.

If the child doesnt then it will be haunted by feelings of inadequacy where it was aware of adults intervening all teh time because it couldnt sort out its own problems.

As i've already said,bullies will only pick on people who have proved themselves unwilling to defend themselves either verbally or physically and a child will always feel better after standing its own ground.

Bringing councillers and teachers and guards and focus groups into a childs development is wrong and will only result in esteem issues later on in life.

I Heart Internet

Degsy wrote: »

What do you suggest then?

Going squealing to the teachers and making things worse?

Think they want to protect weak children 24/7?

You might never have stood up fopr yourself but its the only way to avoid being a victim..in school and in life generally.

You use "squealing" the same way a bully would.

It's not a bad thing to explain to those in authority (parents/teachers/principal) that another person is making your every waking moment a living hell (because that's what it becomes for those on the receiving end of the most severe bullying).

Would you extend your argument to society in general?

"Think the gardai want to protect weak people 24/7?"

There is a lot to be said for wtanding up for yourself and giving back some of what you get. But your notion that fighting off a bully (even if that were possible for the teen/child) is the best way forward is ridiculous.