Racism - Mod Note on 1st Post - Read before posting.

21-12-2011 03:08PM

http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2896/premier-league/2011/12/21/2812614/patrice-evra-could-sue-liverpool-for-defamation-and-luis

‘Patrice Evra could sue Liverpool for defamation and Luis Suarez won't win appeal unless he shows some contrition’ - sports legal expert Stuart Miller reflects on race row.

Lawyer Stuart Miller tells Goal.com that Liverpool are "skating on thin ice" and likely to face disciplinary procedures from the FA after suggestions of an agenda against the club...

tommyhaas · 21-12-2011 03:11PM

peterswellman wrote: »

http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2896/premier-league/2011/12/21/2812614/patrice-evra-could-sue-liverpool-for-defamation-and-luis

‘Patrice Evra could sue Liverpool for defamation and Luis Suarez won't win appeal unless he shows some contrition’ - sports legal expert Stuart Miller reflects on race row.

Lawyer Stuart Miller tells Goal.com that Liverpool are "skating on thin ice" and likely to face disciplinary procedures from the FA after suggestions of an agenda against the club...

Knowing goal.com, they've probably taken legal advice off a ''No win, no fee'' lawyer, the type that spend their days trying to sue the NHS because a plaster was put on to tight and caused the patient to be out of work for 7 years because of trauma

JimsAlterEgo · 21-12-2011 03:12PM

SlickRic wrote: »

the only thing that I, and anyone still intelligently debating this, should be concerned with in terms of the verdict, is whether Liverpool's claim that it was simply Evra's word against Suarez, is accurate.

if it is, the FA have a lot of explaining to do.

if it's not, Liverpool look childish and ridiculous.

there is no middle ground there.

Suarez himself admitted saying something so its an odd claim by Liverpool, especially if said what has been reported. So in reality by giving the interview he hung himself as I am sure the FA asked what did you say, rather than did you say anyting?

bobmalooka · 21-12-2011 03:13PM

I think the JT case could be more serious than the Suarez one, we will find out today if there is to be criminal proceedings against JT.

I think we need a new thread to discuss this because the Racism one is defined by club loyalties and all reason and debate has gone out the window.

What sanctions could JT be looking at here from the CPP?

JimsAlterEgo · 21-12-2011 03:14PM

SlickRic wrote: »

oh yes, it's all about context, i should've made that clear.

sure Suarez has admitted using a word...be it negro, negrito or whatever.

context would be visible on video evidnce, body language, actions, reactions etc.

JimsAlterEgo · 21-12-2011 03:15PM

eigrod wrote: »

Again, that's just a journalist's report on the events. Maybe it was leaked, maybe it was not. If that article was written a week earlier, it would have used the term "negrito" so there's clearly some confusion there. The FA haven't specified, as yet, the word that was used in relation to Evra's skin colour.

isnt the author the same guy who wrote Daglish bio?

mixed up · 21-12-2011 03:16PM

It's a f**king joke 8 games for f**k all just because the F.A want to make an example of him just so people won't hurt the poor black mans feelings.

J. Marston · 21-12-2011 03:16PM

John Terry will be prosecuted.

Blatter · 21-12-2011 03:16PM

Breaking - John Terry WILL face criminal charges

Sappy404 · 21-12-2011 03:17PM

peterswellman wrote: »

Liverpool are "skating on thin ice" and likely to face disciplinary procedures from the FA after suggestions of an agenda against the club...

They never suggested there was an agenda against the club, did they? I don't have the statement to hand, but I'm pretty sure they only suggested that the FA were determined to find Suarez guilty.

It's a bold claim either way, but I don't think they're claiming the FA have an anti-Liverpool agenda. My take on that was they were determined to make an example of Suarez to show a strong anti-racism stance.

Will I Amnt · 21-12-2011 03:17PM

Terry prosecution to go ahead according to sky

YouTookMyName · 21-12-2011 03:17PM

CPS @cpsuk 2m
CPS authorises John Terry prosecution #johnterry
Retweeted by Dan Roan

Well Well

jonnyfingers · 21-12-2011 03:17PM

DDC1990 wrote: »

Also why should the fact that he's been in Europe change anything. He would still return home regularly, and be in contact with other Spanish speaking players in Holland. The word Negrito is used between Spanish speaking players, read Tim Vickary's article on the BBC Sport website to see the extent its used in Uruaguay without a thought of racism. It is literally like calling Kuyt Blondie.

Total heresay, but I would guess that the fact that the conversation was in Spanish, that he presumed Evra wouldn't take offence, like his teammates in South America. But Evra quite understandably took offence to this word, which was in his mind, said with intent to put him down.

Well the second point in my post addressed this. If Suarez used the word initially with no ill meaning and Evra took offense the question is then if he continued to use the word knowing that offense is being taken. If that is the case then it shows intent to cause offense.

However I don't know how many times the word was said. As SlickRic has said we all really have to see the official report to see what the evidence is.

All I'm saying is if there is evidence that the word was used multiple times the whole "not knowing the word was offensive" argument goes out the window.

tommyhaas · 21-12-2011 03:18PM

JimsAlterEgo wrote: »

isnt the author the same guy who wrote Daglish bio?

Patrick Barclay, amongst others have written Alex Ferguson biographies. That doesn't necessarily mean him or the others are kept informed on all decisions and incidents related to Man Utd

J. Marston · 21-12-2011 03:19PM

Terry will be in court on the 1st of February.

mike65 · 21-12-2011 03:20PM

Breaking news
webfeed

* CPS: John Terry will face criminal charges over alleged racist abuse of Anton Ferdinand

Ah well, that'll distract from Suarez for a little while.

What's the minimum sanction under the law I wonder?

That_Guy · 21-12-2011 03:20PM

Next on the racism merry go round.... Mr John Terry.

GavRedKing · 21-12-2011 03:21PM

bobmalooka wrote: »

I think the JT case could be more serious than the Suarez one, we will find out today if there is to be criminal proceedings against JT.

I think we need a new thread to discuss this because the Racism one is defined by club loyalties and all reason and debate has gone out the window.

What sanctions could JT be looking at here from the CPP?

Racism is racism, should be merged with the Racism thread.

No doubt that Suarez v Evra debate will sneak in here if its kept seperate, for instance, if by some miracle JT doesnt get the book thrown at him then both parties will be in here complaining, and rightfully so.

IMO JT has to get a similar length of ban in line with the Suarez ban, now if the CPP decide to press charges he'll have to live with the punishment, and thats coming from a Chelsea fan.

newballsplease · 21-12-2011 03:22PM

Sickened the. ............ Needs to be banned and striped of england captaincy.

Sappy404 · 21-12-2011 03:22PM

JimsAlterEgo wrote: »

context would be visible on video evidnce, body language, actions, reactions etc.

That's circumstantial evidence. By definition, it's not enough to prove anything. If this is how the FA reached the conclusion they did, Liverpool have a very good shout at clearing his name.

Can't think of a decent Law & Order joke here. Damn.

GLaDOS · 21-12-2011 03:23PM

Blatter wrote: »

Breaking - John Terry WILL face criminal charges

mike65 wrote: »

Breaking news
webfeed

* CPS: John Terry will face criminal charges over alleged racist abuse of Anton Ferdinand

Ah well, that'll distract from Suarez for a little while.

What's the minimum sanction under the law I wonder?

Link?

Blatter · 21-12-2011 03:24PM

tommyhaas wrote: »

Patrick Barclay, amongst others have written Alex Ferguson biographies. That doesn't necessarily mean him or the others are kept informed on all decisions and incidents related to Man Utd

It's true but you have to question journalists motives at all times. For example, this is from Winter's piece this morning.

Liverpool’s statement held no punches towards Evra: “It is also our opinion that the accusation by this particular player was not credible – certainly no more credible than his prior unfounded accusations.’’

Liverpool were referring to Evra’s evidence being deemed “unreliable” after his run-in with a Chelsea groundsman. The bad blood flows along the Manchester Ship Canal.

Now he fails, possibly deliberately, to mention that Evra made NO claims of racial abuse in that case, a fact that's pertinent.

That's not good journalism for me.

argosy2006 · 21-12-2011 03:24PM

newballsplease wrote: »

Sickened the. ............ Needs to be banned and striped of england captaincy.

Thats a given,
But will its happen , FA is two faced when it comes to English players and ones who are not

GavRedKing · 21-12-2011 03:24PM

From here : http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2077071/John-Terry-prosecuted-race-row-Anton-Ferdinand.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

John Terry WILL face criminal charges over his alleged racist comments towards Anton Ferdinand.
The Crown Prosecution Service announced this afternoon that they have authorised his prosecution.

The England captain has denied racially abusing the Queens Park Rangers defender during the Barclays Premier League match on October 23.
Terry is alleged to have called Ferdinand a 'f******* black c***' in last month's defeat at QPR.

Terry has been interviewed by the police, as have a number of witnesses, and the CPS will decide if there is the evidence, which includes extensive video footage supplied by Sky, to bring charges.

Terry is supported by Chelsea manager Andre Villas-Boas, and the Football Association have allowed him to remain England captain, agreeing with boss Fabio Capello he should be presumed innocent until proven guilty.

The FA will complete their inquiry into the incident once the police investigation is concluded.

Shortly after the allegations were made, Terry issued a statement saying: 'I've seen that there's a lot of comments on the internet with regards to some video footage of me during the game.
'I'm disappointed that people have leapt to the wrong conclusions about the context of what I was seen to be saying to Anton Ferdinand.

'I would never say such a thing, and I'm saddened that people would think so.'
Last week it emerged that prosecutors had asked police for more information regarding the incident.
Terry is due to play for Chelsea away to Tottenham on Thursday night as his club attempt to stay in contention for the Barclays Premier League title.
He picked up a minor achilles injury during an open training session at Stamford Bridge on Monday.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2077071/John-Terry-prosecuted-race-row-Anton-Ferdinand.html#ixzz1hBAicTQK

tommyhaas · 21-12-2011 03:24PM

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Link?

channel 405, SSN

He's up in February

SlickRic · 21-12-2011 03:25PM

and Poyet isn't fúcking helping...

keep your South American nose out of it.

argosy2006 · 21-12-2011 03:25PM

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2077071/John-Terry-prosecuted-race-row-Anton-Ferdinand.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Turtyturd · 21-12-2011 03:25PM

gavredking wrote: »

Racism is racism, should be merged with the Racism thread.

No doubt that Suarez v Evra debate will sneak in here if its kept seperate, for instance, if by some miracle JT doesnt get the book thrown at him then both parties will be in here complaining, and rightfully so.

IMO JT has to get a similar length of ban in line with the Suarez ban, now if the CPP decide to press charges he'll have to live with the punishment, and thats coming from a Chelsea fan.

Considering the amount of United/Liverpool fans in here this would be just overlooked in favour of tit for tat digs between them....we couldn't have that.;)

Blatter · 21-12-2011 03:26PM

Sappy404 wrote: »

That's circumstantial evidence. By definition, it's not enough to prove anything. If this is how the FA reached the conclusion they did, Liverpool have a very good shout at clearing his name.

Can't think of a decent Law & Order joke here. Damn.

What if they used that evidence for context, along with Evra's word and Suaraz admitted to using the term negro?

Is it still circumstantial evidence?

bobmalooka · 21-12-2011 03:26PM

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Link?

Its on SSN right now, due in court February 1st.

What punishment could he face if found guilty?

FA ban could be the least of his worries

Racism - Mod Note on 1st Post - Read before posting.

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