Tibet, 11 self-immolations since the start of the year

EI_Flyboy · 08-11-2011 03:33PM #1

When celebrity trials take over the headlines I often wonder what isn't making the news.

Tibetan nun burns to death (BBC)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-15571017

Tibetan Nun Who Set Herself On Fire Dies (Sky)
WARNING THIS VIDEO CONTAINS DISTURBING IMAGES
http://news.sky.com/home/world-news/article/16095074

Dalai Lama: 'Cultural genocide' behind self-immolations (BBC)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-15617026

Study points to heavy handed repression of Tibetan area in China (The New York Times) (including HRW report)
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/13/world/asia/study-points-to-heavy-handed-repression-of-tibetan-area-in-china.html

China is fueling the fires of Tibetan resistance (Guardian)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/oct/17/china-tibetan-resistance-self-immolation

Rare footage of Tibetan monk post-immolation in April
WARNING THIS VIDEO CONTAINS DISTURBING IMAGES
http://www.avaaz.org/tibet_immolation_footage

Video of heightened police presence days ago in Ngaba (AFP)
http://www.avaaz.org/Ngaba_police_footage

Tesco Massacre · 08-11-2011 03:40PM

It's just not a "sexy" topic for the Western media.

They'll sell more copies of a paper with Micheal Jackson's doctor on the front cover than one about ritual suicide in Tibet. I know it's kind of stating the obvious, but that's it in a nutshell.

El Weirdo · 08-11-2011 03:40PM

EI_Flyboy wrote: »

I often wonder what isn't making the news.

From all the links provided, it quite obviously is making the news.

strobe · 08-11-2011 03:47PM

Gobshites. Sometimes we tend to forget it's not just the Abrahamic religions that make people act retarded. At least these poor deluded nuts are only hurting themselves though I guess...

Does anyone that's handy with photoshop feel like doing me up a hipster Thich Quang Duc to post in YLYL with the news links?

Sergeant · 08-11-2011 03:48PM

How are the Americans and Israelis involved in all this?

Nodin · 08-11-2011 03:49PM

EI_Flyboy wrote: »

When celebrity trials take over the headlines I often wonder what isn't making the news.

..........

Theres improved road and rail links to Tibet in the last few years, which have greatly increased the rate of colonisation.

Jagle · 08-11-2011 03:49PM

strobe wrote: »

Gobshites. Sometimes we tend to forget it's not just the Abrahamic religions that make people act retarded. At least these poor deluded nuts are only hurting themselves though I guess...

:rolleyes: small mind, closed mind

gurramok · 08-11-2011 03:51PM

China is a huge trading partner for most countries and govts do not want to upset them. Basically money and jobs take precedence over human rights.

smash · 08-11-2011 03:53PM

EI_Flyboy wrote: »

When celebrity trials take over the headlines I often wonder what isn't making the news.

did you see that guy that grabbed 1,000 women's boobs on youtube?

strobe · 08-11-2011 03:55PM

Jagle wrote: »

:rolleyes: small mind, closed mind

Big feet, long feet :rolleyes:

This is fun, now you go again.

Fishooks12 · 08-11-2011 03:59PM

Tesco Massacre wrote: »

It's just not a "sexy" topic for the Western media.

They'll sell more copies of a paper with Micheal Jackson's doctor on the front cover than one about ritual suicide in Tibet. I know it's kind of stating the obvious, but that's it in a nutshell.

Did you even look at any of the links in the OP?

I Heart Internet · 08-11-2011 04:00PM

strobe wrote: »

Gobshites. Sometimes we tend to forget it's not just the Abrahamic religions that make people act retarded. At least these poor deluded nuts are only hurting themselves though I guess...

Emmm...I'm not sure their religion is really the prime motivation behind them doing this. More their countries political situtation...or their understanding of it.

Wattle · 08-11-2011 04:05PM

strobe wrote: »

Gobshites. Sometimes we tend to forget it's not just the Abrahamic religions that make people act retarded. At least these poor deluded nuts are only hurting themselves though I guess...

Does anyone that's handy with photoshop feel like doing me up a hipster Thich Quang Duc to post in YLYL with the news links?

Dumbest post of the week. Congratulations. Do you think that the Chinese are treating these people with kid gloves? I mean what is wrong with them? Why do they have to draw attention to themselves? :rolleyes:

Saila · 08-11-2011 04:07PM

maybe someone should burn themselves alive to bring attention to this

Davidth88 · 08-11-2011 04:13PM

Flaming heck !!!

Tesco Massacre · 08-11-2011 04:14PM

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Did you even look at any of the links in the OP?

Yeah, I did.

But I think what the op was trying to say wasn't that stories like this don't appear in the media (they obviously do- he's posted links), it's that they don't take prominence. Instead, you get stories about Michael Jackson's former doctor.

strobe · 08-11-2011 04:15PM

I Heart Internet wrote: »

Emmm...I'm not sure their religion is really the prime motivation behind them doing this. More their countries political situtation...or their understanding of it.

Their religion is what facilitates it unfortunately. The belief in the death re-birth cycle and the need to escape this cycle is very conducive towards torching yourself when compared to people lacking this belief. Hence the disproportionate number of Tibetan Buddhist self-immolations compared to Christian or atheist or Rastafari self-immolations.

Sure why not burn yourself, you will be re-incarnated 49 days later and more than likely the experience it's self will help you achieve a level of transcendence.

I wonder how many of these poor ****ers came up with the idea to do this all on their own and how many were egged on by their lama as it being a perfect way to help liberate themselves from the death-re-birth cycle...

Duke Leonal Felmet · 08-11-2011 04:17PM

Self immolation is soooo 196.....3?

Fishooks12 · 08-11-2011 04:17PM

Tesco Massacre wrote: »

Yeah, I did.

But I think what the op was trying to say wasn't that stories like this don't appear in the media (they obviously do- he's posted links), it's that they don't take prominence. Instead, you get stories about Michael Jackson's former doctor.

Well that's just how it works

Most papers are private companies looking to make a profit and the fact is that Michael Jacksons murder trial (and that is a big story by the way, he was one of the most famous people on the planet) is always going to be a better seller than political suicide in Tibet.

Another thing that limits the amount of coverage is the nature of restriction in China itself, the Sky News video in the OP shows just how hard it can be to report properly in a communist country

Tesco Massacre · 08-11-2011 04:24PM

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Well that's just how it works

Most papers are private companies looking to make a profit and the fact is that Michael Jacksons murder trial (and that is a big story by the way, he was one of the most famous people on the planet) is always going to be a better seller than political suicide in Tibet.

That's pretty much what I said in my first post.

It's a sales-driven decision to put Jackson's doctor on the front page, whereas the Tibet stories are in the sub sections of the BBC, NY Times & Guardian websites. I have no idea if they even made the print editions of the papers.

Wattle · 08-11-2011 04:25PM

strobe wrote: »

Their religion is what facilitates it unfortunately. The belief in the death re-birth cycle and the need to escape this cycle is very conducive towards torching yourself when compared to people lacking this belief. Hence the disproportionate number of Tibetan Buddhist self-immolations compared to Christian or atheist or Rastafari self-immolations.

Sure why not burn yourself, you will be re-incarnated 49 days later and more than likely the experience it's self will help you achieve a level of transcendence.

I wonder how many of these poor ****ers came up with the idea to do this all on their own and how many were egged on by their lama as it being a perfect way to help liberate themselves from the death-re-birth cycle...

There's been plenty of Christian and Muslim martyrs down the years, far more than Buddhist martyrs. And your contention that Buddhism is some sort of suicide cult is just laughable.

strobe · 08-11-2011 04:28PM

Wattle wrote: »

Dumbest post of the week. Congratulations. Do you think that the Chinese are treating these people with kid gloves? I mean what is wrong with them? Why do they have to draw attention to themselves? :rolleyes:

No I think China have treated the Tibetans atrociously for a long long time and continue to do so. I am fully supportive of Tibet's claim of statehood and I am utterly opposed to China's anti-freedom of religion policies both in Tibet and throughout China itself.

My view is one of sympathy for the poor dopes setting themselves on fire as I believe they view the outcome of doing so through a prism of fantasy about what comes next. I think it's extremely sad to see people ending their lives in this way, or any way. Suicide is extremely tragic, and even more so in these cases in my opinion, when it is not done simply because the person feels they can no longer continue to live, because they are in too much emotional or other pain, but as an ineffective political statement. I also think it would be very naive to believe that their aren't people encouraging these acts in other people for their own political ends.

It's fucking tragic is what it is.

But as you were, don't ask anyone to expand on their reasons for saying what they say, just write it off as stupid, that's much easier isn't it?

histories · 08-11-2011 04:28PM

strobe wrote: »

Their religion is what facilitates it unfortunately. The belief in the death re-birth cycle and the need to escape this cycle is very conducive towards torching yourself when compared to people lacking this belief. Hence the disproportionate number of Tibetan Buddhist self-immolations compared to Christian or atheist or Rastafari self-immolations.

Sure why not burn yourself, you will be re-incarnated 49 days later and more than likely the experience it's self will help you achieve a level of transcendence.

I wonder how many of these poor ****ers came up with the idea to do this all on their own and how many were egged on by their lama as it being a perfect way to help liberate themselves from the death-re-birth cycle...

What facilitates it is the illegal occupation of Tibet by China and the massive human rights abuse that are going on in the country. While of course the powers that be look the other way, trade being more important. The UK and America had recognised that Tibet is entitled to self-determination, the UN issued 3 mandates stating the China had no right to be there, but since Tibet is not an oil rich country or of political importance nobody does anything. What the nuns etc. are doing is an act of desperation, the world needs to start paying attention.

UglyBolloxFace · 08-11-2011 04:31PM

Although I am in no way a religious person and actually despise it, I can't help but feel extreme admiration for these people willing to do this act in the name of something they believe in.

Truly amazing.

strobe · 08-11-2011 04:34PM

Wattle wrote: »

There's been plenty of Christian and Muslim martyrs down the years, far more than Buddhist martyrs. And your contention that Buddhism is some sort of suicide cult is just laughable.

That is not my contention, are being deliberately obtuse? Don't try and put words in my mouth. It's a fact that the nature of the beliefs in Tibetan Buddhism mean that they view suicide differently to others and that this in part facilitates the act of self-immolation.

strobe · 08-11-2011 04:36PM

histories wrote: »

What facilitates it is the illegal occupation of Tibet by China and the massive human rights abuse that are going on in the country. While of course the powers that be look the other way, trade being more important. The UK and America had recognised that Tibet is entitled to self-determination, the UN issued 3 mandates stating the China had no right to be there, but since Tibet is not an oil rich country or of political importance nobody does anything. What the nuns etc. are doing is an act of desperation, the world needs to start paying attention.

You posted at the same time as me, see the post above yours for my view on China's involvement in Tibet.

mathie · 08-11-2011 04:37PM

Self-immolation = Lemmywinks?

I Heart Internet · 08-11-2011 04:45PM

UglyBolloxFace wrote: »

Although I am in no way a religious person and actually despise it, I can't help but feel extreme admiration for these people willing to do this act in the name of something they believe in.

Truly amazing.

I think you're assuming they do this because of their religion. I don't think this is the case. They presumably do it because they want to draw attention to the plight of their compatriots - not because they think it's the good, buddhist thing to do.

Their respected place in their society and links to supporters in the outside world must prompt some (thankfully a small few) to "step-up" and do this in order to get some international attention.

That's my understanding of it. Political - not religious.Very sad and desperate act.

Nodin · 08-11-2011 04:46PM

strobe wrote: »

That is not my contention, are being deliberately obtuse? Don't try and put words in my mouth. It's a fact that the nature of the beliefs in Tibetan Buddhism mean that they view suicide differently to others and that this in part facilitates the act of self-immolation.

Not really, as acts of suicide for political propoganda are far from restricted to buddihists.

Duke Leonal Felmet · 08-11-2011 04:49PM

Nodin wrote: »

strobe wrote: »

That is not my contention, are being deliberately obtuse? Don't try and put words in my mouth. It's a fact that the nature of the beliefs in Tibetan Buddhism mean that they view suicide differently to others and that this in part facilitates the act of self-immolation.

Not really, as acts of suicide for political propoganda are far from restricted to buddihists.

But is could be argued that religion is a factor in other examples, such as Islam. I don't know much about Buddhism, but perhaps some fringe sects encourage this?

Wattle · 08-11-2011 04:50PM

strobe wrote: »

Their religion is what facilitates it unfortunately. The belief in the death re-birth cycle and the need to escape this cycle is very conducive towards torching yourself when compared to people lacking this belief. Hence the disproportionate number of Tibetan Buddhist self-immolations compared to Christian or atheist or Rastafari self-immolations.

Sure why not burn yourself, you will be re-incarnated 49 days later and more than likely the experience it's self will help you achieve a level of transcendence.

Your version of their self immolation implies a selfish motive: trying to escape the death rebirth cycle. I don't agree with the suicides but I think these people are doing it out of desperation and on behalf of a culture that is being squeezed out of existence. To imply that they thought 'oh there's a handy shortcut to enlightenment' is misjudging their motives.

Tibet, 11 self-immolations since the start of the year

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