New Social Welfare ID cards introduced.

CoolHat · 07-10-2011 12:51AM

Belly_Dancer wrote: »

not if you need the same BIOMETRIC ID to get a job/your wages. a properly functioning system should alert the authorities that something is not right.
fingers crossed.:eek:

I've had dozens of jobs... Only ones that asked for ID asked for my passport. I HIGHLY doubt asking for your social welfare card will become the norm. Not in the next few years anyway.

But heres the things, theres cracks in the system. As much as data on people is more advanced than ever. Its not just one big system that can automatically detect discrepancies. Automatically cross-checking ones photo against a database.

It is possible for one to have 5 different drivers licenses. As mental as it sounds :pac:

Belly_Dancer · 07-10-2011 12:53AM

well if it interfaced with the Garda Pulse system, then might be a start.
http://www.advertiser.ie/mullingar/article/21704

LAZYIRISH · 07-10-2011 12:55AM

Brilliant they'l stop citizens and non citizen's scamming our welfare system but what about our scamming greedy goverment! Who'l stop them? Has anyone anything to say about this:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76VOnzXQMsU

Mike 1972 · 07-10-2011 12:58AM

CoolHat wrote: »

It is possible for one to have 5 different drivers licenses. As mental as it sounds :pac:

I once had 3 different RSI (old name for PPS) numbers. I didnt ask for them just got issued one by the dole office, one from the tax office and one when I started college. I was honest stupid enough to inform the dole office who took months to sort it all out.

Belly_Dancer wrote: »

well if it interfaced with the Garda Pulse system, then might be a start.

You want to link up with the same cutting edge PULSE system theyve had for the last 20+ years ???

They probably dont make the cable to do that anymore.

Belly_Dancer · 07-10-2011 12:58AM

LAZYIRISH wrote: »

Brilliant they'l stop citizens and non citizen's scamming our welfare system but what about our scamming greedy goverment! Who'l stop them? Has anyone anything to say about this:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76VOnzXQMsU

that's an oiltogether different topic i believe.:rolleyes:

Cee-Jay-Cee · 07-10-2011 12:58AM

CoolHat wrote: »

I dont understand how they will come into play next week?

How are they going to get everyones photo? (passport database?)

They'll use photofits at first. They will probably ring up the last person to deal with them at the dole office and get them to come down to the 'photofit office' and give a description of the person, then they'll construct a picture of that person, put it on the identity card and post it out to the person with instructions for them to examine the photofit photo for likeness to themselves, if they're happy they dont need to do any more but if its not a likeness they will be required to send in a drawing of themselves and that will be put on the ID card instead. Then when the person comes in to sign on the likeness will be checked and if its not like the person they'll take a photograph of the person and use that instead.

busyliving · 07-10-2011 12:58AM

mikemac wrote: »

Well they know you by now, you're a local

You don't need it if the post-mistress knows you

4 times and each time a different person dealing with me

LAZYIRISH · 07-10-2011 01:03AM

Belly_Dancer wrote: »

that's an oiltogether different topic i believe.:rolleyes:

The scam isn't

Belly_Dancer · 07-10-2011 01:07AM

LAZYIRISH wrote: »

The scam isn't

what kinda Burke would do that?:(

floorpie · 07-10-2011 01:35AM

mikemac wrote: »

Hurray, an end to the battered pieces of cardboard I see on Dublin Bus.

Many evenings the 78A has more pass holders then fare payers

Sure many of them are genuine and maybe on disability but considering an annual ticket costs several hundred, the potential savings are huge here

What are you talking about man, i hope i'm misunderstanding something..? The identity cards are for cutting down on social welfare payment frauds. You know that people on jobseekers benefit and allowance don't get free travel?

And aside from that, i've pretty much been a consistent dublin bus user for 20 years (jesus

), and i've *never* seen more disabled passengers or old aged pensioners or whatever getting on the bus than fare payers along the whole route.

amacachi · 07-10-2011 01:38AM

Mike 1972 wrote: »

I once had 3 different RSI (old name for PPS) numbers. I didnt ask for them just got issued one by the dole office, one from the tax office and one when I started college. I was honest stupid enough to inform the dole office who took months to sort it all out.

My mother was given a new RSI number when she first switched jobs after being married I think. Only got one PPS number even though she always used her original RSI number.
Like you said, when they make a fcuk up that doesn't adversely affect you it's best to leave it be.

beagle001 · 07-10-2011 01:49AM

If they don't bring in a finger print ID then it's a waste of time the scam artists will apply through Irish for a new ID and have double payments.
It would be worth investing 50 million into a proper system that would cross check your finger print everytime you signed on you had to scan your finger or retina.
Fook the liberals and the law society it's about time we tracked the cash payments,the only folk worrying about ant infringements on human rights are the ones who are milking the country both foreign nationals and our own indeginous tribes.

Enda Murphy · 07-10-2011 01:58AM

I was talking to a taxi driver about these new welfare id cards the other day he said sure all those blacks look the same and its them that are doing 80% of the Fruading. Gotta love taxi drivers

LH Pathe · 07-10-2011 02:01AM

Why can't they just keep the picture on database

maybe because someday we will be prosecuted for not carrying these cards. Just chip me, you bastards. run a barcode scanner down my bollox

CoolHat · 07-10-2011 02:24AM

I've just been thinking about this ...

These cards are a load of bo*lix. What percentage of fraudsters will they stop? Sure some, but how many?

If I was African. Why not enter Ireland pretending I was from Somalia. which Ireland allows you to become a refugee (Taking advantage of the fact one african looks exactly the same as the other for most white people in terms of origins)
Once in I get on the social welfare. Shortly after I p*ss off home again for a week (unbeknowingly to the government) I re-enter Ireland as my real name. Then my real identity never leaves the country and 'disappears'. Wait out 7 years on the social and or working illegally at the same time. Then apply for Irish Citizenship and get granted.

What did that new card stop?
Sure my face would be associated with my fake name. And as for my real name, sure i only entered Ireland on a holiday and never left. Did they take a copy print out of my passport? no they wouldnt. So my real name and D.O.B. is flagged. But i'll never resurface as it until I can apply for citizen status.

stoneill · 07-10-2011 02:34AM

The back street workshops of Lagos are already in full swing preparing your brand new social welfare card.

Chuck Stone · 07-10-2011 02:57AM

I'll take three please!

Let's say I was claiming dole in two counties; in one county in my own name and in the other county in the name of someone else.

If I got an ID card for both locations with different names how would it stop me from continuing to defraud the system?

marco_polo · 07-10-2011 02:57AM

CoolHat wrote: »

I doubt that :P

But I can see that this wont stop everyone from frauding.
Say I was a Nigerian bloke with 3 indentities over here. Who is to say I give/take 3 photos with 3 different names. Slightly altering my appearance (clean shaven, gotee etc)

Need a bit more than a hair cut and a shave to fool a biometric scanner.

CoolHat wrote: »

I've just been thinking about this ...

These cards are a load of bo*lix. What percentage of fraudsters will they stop? Sure some, but how many?

If I was African. Why not enter Ireland pretending I was from Somalia. which Ireland allows you to become a refugee (Taking advantage of the fact one african looks exactly the same as the other for most white people in terms of origins)
Once in I get on the social welfare. Shortly after I p*ss off home again for a week (unbeknowingly to the government) I re-enter Ireland as my real name. Then my real identity never leaves the country and 'disappears'. Wait out 7 years on the social and or working illegally at the same time. Then apply for Irish Citizenship and get granted.

What did that new card stop?
Sure my face would be associated with my fake name. And as for my real name, sure i only entered Ireland on a holiday and never left. Did they take a copy print out of my passport? no they wouldnt. So my real name and D.O.B. is flagged. But i'll never resurface as it until I can apply for citizen status.

It is a public services card, nothing to do with immigration for a start.

As for your real identity which has spend 7 years under the radar, you have to prove both your entire reckonable period of residence on application, and that you have been and can continue to support yourself, so your citizenship application would not even get past the initial processing stage.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/moving_country/irish_citizenship/becoming_an_irish_citizen_through_naturalisation.html

saywhatyousee · 07-10-2011 04:00AM

I cant wait till i am sent out one of these cards so i can break it in half and throw it in the fire were it belongs.Mark of the beast indeed....

castie · 07-10-2011 04:07AM

What biometrics are the using??

In Hong Kong everyone gets a national ID and its stored with your thumb print.

Raze_them_all · 07-10-2011 04:11AM

people on dole, more closely policed than paedophiles.

Go Ireland

LH Pathe · 07-10-2011 04:19AM

Raze_them_all wrote: »

people on dole, more closely policed than paedophiles.

Go Ireland

peopadoles

danniemcq · 07-10-2011 08:36AM

I think the only thing this is gonna stop is people picking it up for other people.

I can only see this working if there is crazy scutiny at the photo taking bit or face recognition software scanning every picture.

I had 2 PPS numbers years ago, no idea how or why just had 2 cards, both with different numbers, I was signed on at the time and not wanting to be a total c*nt i only used one.

Lost both though when i decided to drive a quad off a pier though so only have the one now that i reapplied for.

Would the government get away with using facial recognition software on them though?

would there be a massive outcry?

if not then i could see it working, a lot of work would be needed though so there would be a major hit in terms of money Ireland has left but in the long run it could work

danniemcq · 07-10-2011 08:43AM

actually on the topic of facial recognition software, would that be any different to biometric checks like fingerprints like people have said could work?

Is there a difference? Would this data be stored on secure servers and NOT used by guardai for anything else?

stupidusername · 07-10-2011 08:48AM

What a load of bollix.so this will have your photo on it? So you can't get away with claiming someone elses dole.you mean like the way the post office staff are meant to ask for ID? Yeah,well worth the millions this is no doubt costing to implement.

sunflower27 · 07-10-2011 08:49AM

I don't see the problem with it. I have an ID garda card that has my photo on it that I have to renew every year (150e) and need to have it with me if I ever fly into Ireland. I am a non-national.

I was picking up my payment yesterday (en-route to my first week of my Jobbridge internship) and was dressed up to the nines. The woman at the counter - granted, I am not sure if I have seen her there before - asked if the card belonged to me. I said yes and she then asked me to verify it with my date of birth.

I no longer have to go collect the payment - it will go into my bank account from next week so aphot-ID card is not something I will have to actually use.

I've been paying taxes in Ireland for 10 years before anyone says I am bludging off the system and my aim is to get back into paid work ASAP.

PAULWATSON · 07-10-2011 08:54AM

first step to a national ID card, sure pick on the easy targets first.

No matter how many times the masses are fooled, they "don't stop belevin'"

CreepingDeath · 07-10-2011 09:04AM

With one small addition to the process, this card could cut down on some fraud.

--> you must present your passport to get the card. At least for non-nationals.

No passport, no benefits.

danniemcq · 07-10-2011 10:07AM

sunflower27 wrote: »

I don't see the problem with it. I have an ID garda card that has my photo on it that I have to renew every year (150e) and need to have it with me if I ever fly into Ireland. I am a non-national.

sorry for asking but is this the National Garda ID card? what ID costs 150 a year?

mikemac · 07-10-2011 11:06AM

It's the GNIB card, Garda National Immigration Bureau Card

Non-nationals from outside the EU have to register with the gardaí

Some don't have to like the Swiss

Anyway, that's the card dannie

New Social Welfare ID cards introduced.

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