Is there Class Distinction in Ireland ?

Fulton Crown · 18-09-2011 08:24PM

RMD wrote: »

I've been a Leinster season ticket holder now for 6 years, I've been to all Leinster Vs Munster games in the last 4 years. I can speak from experience in saying when it comes to snobby supporters sadly Leinster takes it hands down, there's the "prawn cocktail brigade" as Roy Keane would put it who are the greatest shower of **** in the world.

The worst Munster supporters are the ones who moved to Dublin, found they now were earning a decent bit of money and decided to adopt a version of the "nouveau riche" D4 attitude while retaining their Munster heritage, turning them in a right dickhead.

Munster rugby is fairly classless, look at Moyross. It's a rugby stronghold yet a working class place with a reputation that rivals some of the worst parts in Dublin. You don't find any Rugby strongholds in the working class area of Dublin, it's pretty much Middle Class and above sadly.

What has Moyross to do with it pal ?

Saw that poser Earls with "special" boots with Moyross printed on them.

That poser never lived in Moyross and sure as hell is not livin there now.

I said Munster Rugby supporters were some of the most arrogant pricks I have ever come across and i stand by that.

Fulton Crown · 18-09-2011 08:27PM

temply wrote: »

Hallo Flutteringbantam - need an alias in here for back up, ya?

Bless ya, buddy

What are you on about Dude ?

See your getting thanks from your girlfriend as well......

previous user · 18-09-2011 08:28PM

D4 cnuts! Die

Auldloon · 18-09-2011 08:38PM

Haven't read all the thread but the young folk at the rugby they would be called immigrants.

Paddy Cow · 18-09-2011 08:44PM

Townie
Culchie
Bogger
Islander

Kidchameleon · 18-09-2011 09:17PM

Fulton Crown wrote: »

Ireland always had the name of a "classless" society ...unlike our neighbours across the pond.

I wonder though .....

Even just lookin at the TV coverage of the recent matches...Soccer and Rugby would seem to point up some differences.

Coverage of the recent soccer match in Russia showed mainly a cohort of middle aged irish Fans...most of them looking fairly "weathered" and flashing a fair collection of "Goalpost teeth" and good rounded bumps under their lycra tops.

Average height about 5.5 i would say ..with typical 40/30 measurements.

A viewer would be forgiven if he/she took them for fork lift drivers/taxi drivers/storemen/ general operstives.

On the other hand it was very noticable to this poster that the crowd pictures at the Rugby in NZ showed a much younger demographic.....good proportion of females and all well groomed with shiny well cared for gnashers.

So is there a class distinction here ...an where does the avg GAA person fit in...uber culchie ? Professional person or what......

Just arskin.....

Uneducated class.

18-09-2011 10:31PM

hamlet1 wrote: »

southside dubliners think they are better than northsiders
all soccer pundits seem to have a working class dublin accent,whereas rugby pundits sound much classier
tcd students are much snobbier than ucd ones
no class distinction in the gaa,they are all the same
most golf clubs are very uppercrust as are some sailing clubs
big class distinction between schools,especially in the cities and bigger towns.i went to an all girls secondary school and we considered ourselves to be above the local vocational school

Thats a pretty ridiculous statement to make...people from all classes have equal chances to get into these universities so the 'TCD is for snobs' cliche really shouldn't hold up anymore.

Melange · 18-09-2011 10:53PM

Of course there are class distinctions and stratifications in Ireland. I have yet to encounter a society which does not have them. They seem to be almost endemic in human nature. Of course, they tend to be very central to some cultures (English or Indian, for instance) and downplayed in others (Australian, for example). This relative difference can lead some to conclude there are no class divides in some societies (which often did not have a native and specifically aristocratic elite, historically), but they do exist if you look close enough.

Jess16 · 18-09-2011 10:58PM

Fulton Crown wrote: »

I said Munster Rugby supporters were some of the most arrogant pricks I have ever come across and i stand by that.

Unfortunately, I'd have to agree. The air of superiority that resonates around Thomond is really quite startling and not something I've ever noticed at Leinster or international matches.

I know there's a perception that Leinster fans are all Ross O'Carroll-Kelly relatives but the reality is quite different. In my experience, the Leinster fans are more interested in unwinding at the games and getting drunk in Searson's afterwards. Whereas the Munster crowd are incredibly reserved, cold and radiate a stand-offish self importance that I've never noticed elsewhere

Fulton Crown · 20-09-2011 10:16PM

Jess16 wrote: »

Unfortunately, I'd have to agree. The air of superiority that resonates around Thomond is really quite startling and not something I've ever noticed at Leinster or international matches.

I know there's a perception that Leinster fans are all Ross O'Carroll-Kelly relatives but the reality is quite different. In my experience, the Leinster fans are more interested in unwinding at the games and getting drunk in Searson's afterwards. Whereas the Munster crowd are incredibly reserved, cold and radiate a stand-offish self importance that I've never noticed elsewhere

Hit the nail there Buddy...nah ! Flushed it .....

Time to put that tired "working class" bullcrap to bed....

Eric Cartman · 21-09-2011 04:32AM

hamlet1 wrote: »

tcd students are much snobbier than ucd ones

thats a rediculous generalisation to make ,

theyre both full of stuck up cúnts

StephenHendry · 21-09-2011 09:34AM

i think there is , there is a upper class albeit not a lot , the majority include middle class and the working class. the gap between the middle and working class isn't as obvious as it once was. there is such a thing as upper middle class as well. in terms of sports , rugby for example in limerick is followed/played by all 3 classes , in dublin in recent times a lot more traditional working class people now follow, play the game so the class distinction isn't straightforward. a lot of this would be to the success of the irish rugby team from 2000 onwards and that of munster and leinster.

soccer now has a much strongher foothold in the rural areas , italia 90 being a catalyst for this with players in the irish team atm from traditional gaa strongholds such as tipperary, wexford, waterford.

Fratton Fred · 21-09-2011 09:47AM

Dudess wrote: »

Ireland a classless society me bum-hole. When the country was in the grip of the catholic church, there was an absolute hatred of the poor encouraged.

I read an article (which I will try and dig out) regarding the Catholic Church's attempts to create a middle and upper class in Ireland, to replace the Protestant ascendancy with a Catholic one.

If anyone wants to see the Irish class system in operation, try joining a sailing club in Dun Laoghaire. The National will welcome anyone, the Royal will welcome anyone with money and the St George will welcome anyone who comes from a long line of Surgeons, university professors or Bank executives and has the correct background/education/breeding.

fryup · 21-09-2011 10:54AM

ireland used to have a mish mash of classes no one really gave a sh*t

until the celtic tiger and everything changed over night, we've become more class aware since then

(i also maintain that the middle class irish make the worst snobs..very stand offish)

21-09-2011 11:17AM

So what would you be if you were a teenager who played handball ( outside school ) and basketball ( in school ) and at home watched and supported every sport going.

My partner grew up in Wales and moved here in his forties and one off the things he couldn't get his head round was how rugby was considered very middle class here, because in Wales its a very classless sport.

steelcityblues · 21-09-2011 06:06PM

The worst snobs I have often encountered are the middle class 'culchies' from outside of Dublin (sons/daughters of solicitors, doctors, bankers, big farmers), many of them who don't like Dubliners in general because they are either 'skangers' or 'D4 heads'. Nothing in between, of course.

Yet, the glaring thing is that a lot of them seem themselves as too sophisticated to ever go back living in Limerick, Galway, or wherever. This does not apply to all middle class Irish though.

The non-Dublin people who come from humble stock seem to get on better with ordinary Dubliners in general IMHO.

21-09-2011 06:35PM

Fulton Crown wrote: »

Ireland always had the name of a "classless" society ...unlike our neighbours across the pond.

I wonder though .....

Even just lookin at the TV coverage of the recent matches...Soccer and Rugby would seem to point up some differences.

Coverage of the recent soccer match in Russia showed mainly a cohort of middle aged irish Fans...most of them looking fairly "weathered" and flashing a fair collection of "Goalpost teeth" and good rounded bumps under their lycra tops.

Average height about 5.5 i would say ..with typical 40/30 measurements.

A viewer would be forgiven if he/she took them for fork lift drivers/taxi drivers/storemen/ general operstives.

On the other hand it was very noticable to this poster that the crowd pictures at the Rugby in NZ showed a much younger demographic.....good proportion of females and all well groomed with shiny well cared for gnashers.

So is there a class distinction here ...an where does the avg GAA person fit in...uber culchie ? Professional person or what......

Just arskin.....

To throw a wide blanket over it, One sport is predominantly played throughout the world by the middle/upper class and the other by the working class. Ireland is no different and this is reflected in the make-up of the crowd.

mariaalice wrote: »

My partner grew up in Wales and moved here in his forties and one off the things he couldn't get his head round was how rugby was considered very middle class here, because in Wales its a very classless sport.

They are in the minority not Ireland.

The only places where rugby is predominantly played by the working class as well as the middle class is New Zealand, Wales and Limerick. In South Africa, Australia, England,Scotland and Ireland (outside of Limerick) it is predominantly the pursuit of private schools and the middle class.

This is changing though especially in rugby because of recent success both a provincial level and Internationally.

RichieC · 21-09-2011 06:47PM

woodoo wrote: »

But we have a middle class, working class and now an underclass.

Oh, that's new, is it?

fryup · 21-09-2011 09:25PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siqhsuXYO1o

AskMyChocolate · 21-09-2011 10:57PM

temply wrote: »

with regards to the rugby scene, the only place I've seen no class distinction is at Thomand Park.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Thomond Park is it?

I've seen the Cork crowd with their UCC scarves and pursed mouths, being quite haughty , if I may observe.

temply wrote: »

that was probably just their attitude towards yourself, in fairness

Fulton Crown wrote: »

Attitude in general pal....seen thes goons as well...Munster Rugby claims to be clasles but in reality is the most closed shop ever.

Arrogant shower and i can back up that ....travelling back from Asia arrived in Heathrow....got to the Irish terminal Wetherspoons....full of braying Munster supporters ...who were the rudist most objectionable bunch of pricks i have seen in a long time .

Thats fact !

Wow! Get your print screen function going, I think I may be about to take Flutt's side in an argument. Collector's item.:pac:

No. Actually, what I would say, is that, up until about twenty years ago, there used to be an element of elitism to rugby and Limerick was the only county where it was, both a vibrant and, an egalitarian sport.

Mainly, down to the fact that it was a club sport rather than associated with local rivalries between competing private educational facilities.

The worst (and most underbred) elitist/classist behaviour I have ever seen at rugby matches, has nearly always been at schools' Junior Cup matches.

I have rarely seen it at inter-provincials, and thankfully, almost never at internationals.

It is leaving the game; and rugby,thanks,in no small part, to the behaviour of men like Brian O'Driscoll and Paul O'Connell and the rest of the outstanding group of athletes and gentlemen, both on and off the pitch, who have represented us over the past ten years, is becoming the inclusive game and meritocracy that all sports should be for all children.

And I think this inclusiveness (rather than exclusivity) will serve us far better as a society and as a nation into the future.

In closing, Go lads, Don't fook it up against Italy! I couldn't bear if that lost bonus point against the USA came back to haunt us.:pac:

AskMyChocolate · 21-09-2011 11:51PM

hamlet1 wrote: »

southside dubliners think they are better than northsiders
all soccer pundits seem to have a working class dublin accent,whereas rugby pundits sound much classier
tcd students are much snobbier than ucd ones
no class distinction in the gaa,they are all the same
most golf clubs are very uppercrust as are some sailing clubs
big class distinction between schools,especially in the cities and bigger towns.i went to an all girls secondary school and we considered ourselves to be above the local vocational school

Apart from this, I have no real problem with your post, except for the obvious generalisations. After all, generalisations and stereotypes tend to stem from somewhere.

But, if you think this is how Dublin works, you're not from Dublin.

Priviliged Eastside (coastal) Dubliners with capital and a lot of political (and often judicial) influence, who went to the "right schools",and can often be incredibly lazy, yet "succeed" through nepotism, look down on hardworking Westside Dubliners who have achieved a moderately happy life through their own dilligence, cos they're jealous and insecure.

These Westside Dubliners say "Meh", leaving it to the under-achieving silverspoon crowd, and the druggies, to take whatever comfort they can from blaming each other for the ills of society, while the relative achievers go about their daily lives, rightfully oblivious.

If I indulged in generalisations, I would say, this is far closer to the truth than a Northside-Southside thing.

Btw, I don't like Peter Sutherland or John Gilligan. Damn this underachieving jealousy masquerading as values.:(:pac:

markesmith · 21-09-2011 11:55PM

I used to work with a guy from around Donnybrook who would mutter 'scum' under his breath as we walked to and from lunch in and around Thomas Street.

He truly saw them as lesser beings than himself. There's a bit of that in Dublin, not so sure about Cork. There's people on Thomas Street/Vicar Street would never venture up around Baggott Street, and vice versa.

AskMyChocolate · 22-09-2011 03:10AM

markesmith wrote: »

I used to work with a guy from around Donnybrook who would mutter 'scum' under his breath as we walked to and from lunch in and around Thomas Street.

He truly saw them as lesser beings than himself. There's a bit of that in Dublin, not so sure about Cork. There's people on Thomas Street/Vicar Street would never venture up around Baggott Street, and vice versa.

I used to work in a menial job in Donnybrook. Probably didn't know the bloke you're talking about. From a pretty good area in south county dublin meself. Not D4 or anywhere near that rich. Went to a national school.

Have to say though, never felt looked down upon or threatened in either Thomas Street or Eglington Road.

Guess there are priviliges to being a barman.:pac:

Nowhere near as good as being a Guard though.:(:mad::pac:

pickarooney · 22-09-2011 09:53AM

Arjun Shapely Fig wrote: »

The only places where rugby is predominantly played by the working class as well as the middle class is New Zealand, Wales and Limerick. In South Africa, Australia, England,Scotland and Ireland (outside of Limerick) it is predominantly the pursuit of private schools and the middle class.

Rugby's not a toff's sport in France either. Pretty sure the Pacific Islands are the same, and Argentina. I'm not sure about Japan, Russia, Georgia...

22-09-2011 06:19PM

pickarooney wrote: »

Rugby's not a toff's sport in France either. Pretty sure the Pacific Islands are the same, and Argentina. I'm not sure about Japan, Russia, Georgia...

I only mentioned the traditional forces, not tier 3 nations.

I didnt know about France hence me not mentioning them, the islands would be classed in the same breath as NZ and in Argentina it isnt a working class sport.

Is there Class Distinction in Ireland ?

Comments