Gay couple kicked out of bar for kissing on the dancefloor

MagicSean · 24-08-2011 12:56AM

Is there any evidence at all that the bouncer was a "homophobe" or that they were discriminated against based on their sexual orientation? Or are all these defamatory remarks based purely on the fact that a straight couple wasn't asked to leave at the same time? Was anything said to then that could be construed as homophobic? Is it not possible that the bouncer was in a bad mood and these guys just happened to get in his way? I've often seen bouncers act very unreasonably without any apparent provocation. Could this not be one of those incidents? Why do people have to look for human rights violations in every little incident.

Monty. · 24-08-2011 12:57AM

Will it become a gay bar now ?

geetar · 24-08-2011 01:03AM

yupyup7up wrote: »

This kind of story wrecks my head. Sometimes I might get refused for no reason whatsoever from a pub or a club without a reason given at all, but this makes national news just because they are gay?

How is "No, you're not allowed in." to a pub that a frequent in and hadn't even had a drink before hand, any less discriminatory than this?

because bouncers refuse entry all the time to everyone, except girls obviously, however in this case two gay people were "singled out" for being gay and told to leave.

i say singled out in inverted commas because we dont know what happened and we are all talking a bunch of hypothetical bs.

and more to the point....both parties admitted guilt. :rolleyes:

IrishEyes19 · 24-08-2011 01:05AM

I'd actually like to hear the exact story from the two lads in question, and then see who is to blame. Only because if they were told to stop kissing because of their sexual orrientation, then obviously it would be unfair. But I find it number one odd that a bouncer would risk his job and do that, when anti gay actions cause serious scandals in this day and age, and second it's odd that the dispute has been settled and the two lads have accepted they could have handled it better. Seems to me there is a story here.

ResearchWill · 24-08-2011 01:11AM

Seanbeag1 wrote: »

Is there any evidence at all that the bouncer was a "homophobe" or that they were discriminated against based on their sexual orientation? Or are all these defamatory remarks based purely on the fact that a straight couple wasn't asked to leave at the same time? Was anything said to then that could be construed as homophobic? Is it not possible that the bouncer was in a bad mood and these guys just happened to get in his way? I've often seen bouncers act very unreasonably without any apparent provocation. Could this not be one of those incidents? Why do people have to look for human rights violations in every little incident.

I am going to have to assume you have not been in the old oak, it's an experience, I will just say there is no chance of a girl and guy kissing been asked to stop or leave, or to put it another way I have never seen a guy and girl mauling the face off each other in there causing the slightest problem for staff or punters.

TylerIE · 24-08-2011 01:14AM

lastlaugh wrote: »

I really couldn't be arsed reading up on licensing laws, but I'll stay in the thread thanks Boss.
The place wasn't a Gay Bar. End of.
If they want to get off with each other, go to a Gay Bar.

Regarding your 'silly point', wasn't as silly as your below post doncha think?

Hmmm.

Not end of, if the premises has an alcohol license then they are obligated to treat patrons equally. Remember the B&B in the UK - and they were actually sleeping in the same room (or wanting to).

AFC_1903 wrote: »

Maybe you should drink less, that can't be good for your health! :pac:

Apologies it was in an official capacity (not as the customer / victim) one way or another, good catch though :P.

lastlaugh wrote: »

No need to get so nasty.

Is there a particular post I added that has offended you in some way?

The nastiness is someone feeling a gay couple can only kiss in a bar thats specificially for gay people, "end of"!

sean1141 wrote: »

have to laugh at all the people giving out about the 'bouncers'. if the two lads happened to be set upon the same people would be complaining that they should have done something to prevent it!! i bet not one of ye has ever worked as security in a pub/club.

I have had plenty of dealings security wise in clubs - including the hiring of security and picking up the pieces after people were set upon. Its great for a club to warn - "By the way our clientele are dangerous and could attack you so I suggest you quit" - its inappropriate for a venue to kick people out for doing something that isnt damaging anyone else. The appropriate people to remove are those that would threaten or injure the gay couple (if they do so).

If an Englishman was in the pub have security the right to tell him to keep quiet because some customers might be offended by his accent? Can they kick him out if he refuses to do so?

Seanbeag1 wrote: »

Is there any evidence at all that the bouncer was a "homophobe" or that they were discriminated against based on their sexual orientation? Or are all these defamatory remarks based purely on the fact that a straight couple wasn't asked to leave at the same time? Was anything said to then that could be construed as homophobic? Is it not possible that the bouncer was in a bad mood and these guys just happened to get in his way? I've often seen bouncers act very unreasonably without any apparent provocation. Could this not be one of those incidents? Why do people have to look for human rights violations in every little incident.

If a bouncer is in a bad mood its inappropriate that they take it out on a gay couple because they are gay. Exact same as it would be inappropriate for them to take it out on a Priest for wearing a collar.

Cianos · 24-08-2011 01:14AM

IrishEyes19 wrote: »

I'd actually like to hear the exact story from the two lads in question, and then see who is to blame. Only because if they were told to stop kissing because of their sexual orrientation, then obviously it would be unfair. But I find it number one odd that a bouncer would risk his job and do that, when anti gay actions cause serious scandals in this day and age, and second it's odd that the dispute has been settled and the two lads have accepted they could have handled it better. Seems to me there is a story here.

Maybe the guys were being fairly flamboyant for sh!ts and giggles, who knows and who cares, and this was getting on the nerves of the security staff and a few boyos around them on the dance floor who were horrified by the sight of two males kissing.

The bouncers probably saw the tension rising and whether out of deescalation or conformity they decided the easiest thing to relieve the mounting awkwardness was to just get the two guys out of there, not really thinking of the repercussions.

miss no stars · 24-08-2011 01:30AM

how sad. This really makes me sad...

The world out there is filled with misery, suffering and violence and people take issue with two people displaying love and affection for each other (and I'm not talking about just the pub here, some of the comments in this thread are appalling). Why does it matter about the gender of the people? Seriously, why does it matter? What is supposedly so bloody awful about two lads kissing that people feel the need to hush it up and put them out of sight. The world would be such a nice place if we didn't all feel the need to hate each other for things we can't change about ourselves.

Pace2008 · 24-08-2011 01:44AM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Can I point something else out:
The dancefloor is for dancing on. It's very possible that any couple would be asked to stop or get off the dancefloor if they were scoring, for the same reason as they'd be asked to get off it if they had a drink in their hand. It's dangerous for themselves and others on a dancefloor is everyone is jumping around and one couple are standing still on it. The potential for someone to inadvertently get bashed is huge, and when that happens, a proper drunken fight could develop.

Most clubs will ask you to get off the dancefloor if you stop to text or something like that, it's usually "either dance or go to another part of the room"

Meeting someone on the live minefield that is a club dancefloor is a serious health hazard. This thread is absolute gold.

minidazzler · 24-08-2011 02:28AM

I was actually in the old oak on saturday night, so a couple of points I'll make for context.

The place was packed beyond belief, it was so packed it was a fire hazard, the dance floor was even worse, TBH, kissing and all that goes with it would have been even more of an issue given you can't judge the ebb and flow of a crowd when your sticking your tongue down someones throat. To stand there kissing you are gonna get pushed about and could get hurt.

The Old Oak does have a general policy against PDA I think, I've been asked to stop by bouncers before, but only when on the dance floor, never when sitting down. Which to me makes sense.

The Old Oak tends to cater for an older crowd, MUCH older. It's pretty much everyone over 21, but the average age is somewhere in the mid thirties I would guess. Even on a Saturday night. On the one hand that's not strictly relevant information, on another, older folk are more likely to be put out by PDA in general.

If the lads want to have a dance, great, dance. If you want to have a kiss, then go in a corner somewhere or to a seat or somewhere out of peoples way. Because no matter what, when you are kissing someone on a packed dancefloor you are in the way.

ShaunC · 24-08-2011 02:45AM

As my friend Ted would say "down with that kind of thing".

SayWhaaat · 24-08-2011 03:36AM

lastlaugh wrote: »

No need to get so nasty.

Is there a particular post I added that has offended you in some way?

There's one that certainly offended me!

lastlaugh wrote: »

I really couldn't be arsed reading up on licensing laws, but I'll stay in the thread thanks Boss.
The place wasn't a Gay Bar. End of.
If they want to get off with each other, go to a Gay Bar.

I'm a gay, out 18 year old (not the "I'm gay DEAL WITH IT!" kind), just a quiet lad who happens to like other lads.

The fact that it wasn't a bar soley dedicated for gay people does not mean that two lads cant kiss each other. In the same sense that gay bars dont tell straight couples to not kiss, less it offend homosexual people. Because it doesn't. NO gay person I know would ever spout bullsh*t like "I just don't want to see straight people kissing in gay bars, flaunting their sexuality". They don't f*cking care. And the tiny minority that might are taking their sexual identity way too seriously.

My mates are predominantly straight people, meaning my nights out usually consist of "straight" pubs or clubs. If me and my boyfriend go out with my circle of friends to a pub like the old oak, HOW is it fair that my friends can kiss their girlfriends on the dancefloor, but I cant kiss my boyfriend. My straight mates wouldn't encounter any such bigotry in a gay bar (and never have)

I don't give a f*ck if some think that "society is'nt ready for this" because as far as I can tell, society was never fond of abolishing slavery, equality for black people, divorce etc. Society ADAPTS and its ignorance such as yours that delays this adapting and makes my life more difficult.

end a eknny wrote: »

its a bit **** you cant stop pda's by gays. you cant ban travellers so basically if you own a bar you have to cater for the minority while you watch your customers dissappear and your buisness go down the swanny

Is this guy f*cking serious?! Please replace the word travellers with black people and watch the sh*tstorm you create.

frankly, I'm done appeasing people by toning it down with my boyfriend to not cause trouble. It's people like those two lads in Cork that create change by going against the status quo.

So yes, I don't give a toss if you want me banned from kissing my boyfriend just so youre not put off your pint. Complain to the next straight ugly couple who kiss while youre at it, because NOTHING will stop me from showing abit of affection (not wearing the face off) to my boyfriend, something you can do in any bar, gay or straight.

Finally, I'll finish with something I said in the Cork thread. It's people with the views of the two above that caused me to consider commiting suicide at 12 because I wasn't normal, that I'd never have a normal life. What 12 year old deserves this?

If me kissing my boyfriend in front of a young gay kid in a straight environment encourages him to think that he can live a normal life and find love, then I can gladly say you can shove your opinions right up your holes.

jive · 24-08-2011 03:58AM

SayWhaaat wrote: »

So yes, I don't give a toss if you want me banned from kissing my boyfriend just so youre not put off your pint. Complain to the next straight ugly couple who kiss while youre at it, because NOTHING will stop me from showing abit of affection (not wearing the face off) to my boyfriend, something you can do in any bar, gay or straight.

Finally, I'll finish with something I said in the Cork thread. It's people with the views of the two above that caused me to consider commiting suicide at 12 because I wasn't normal, that I'd never have a normal life. What 12 year old deserves this?

If me kissing my boyfriend in front of a young gay kid in a straight environment encourages him to think that he can live a normal life and find love, then I can gladly say you can shove your opinions right up your holes.

Cool story bro. What pisses me off about gay people (yes, i said it, a sweeping generalisation is coming up which doesn't apply to the majority of gay people but does apply to a very vocal minority) is that they make a big deal out of stuff like this. I'm all for equality but if you can't kiss in a certain pub, who the phuck cares? Honestly. Talk about first world problems. Did it ever occur that this situation arose due to circumstances irrelevant to their sexual orientation? If it were 2 straight black people kissing who got thrown out would they have been thrown out for being black? The whole situation has been blown out of proportion and everyone is still harping on about it even after the 'victims' and the pub have reconciled their differences.

You contemplated suicide at 12 because a minority of people hold old fashioned views? I hate to break it to you but in the grand scheme of things that's not a big deal. A lot of people probably think I'm a kunt, will I kill myself over it? No. Who cares what people think? If you get banned from a pub then go to a pub where you are welcome, there are plenty. I know it's unfair, but life isn't fair so deal with it. Gay people can live perfectly normal lives whether you want to believe it or not. They can get a civil partnership, they can work, they can live and they can die together. So what if they get hassled for being gay, it's still a normal life. People get hassled for all sorts of things... in fact I'd say being ginger is a much larger plight than being gay in this fúcking day and age.

/rant over

SayWhaaat · 24-08-2011 04:23AM

jive wrote: »

Cool story bro. What pisses me off about gay people (yes, i said it, a sweeping generalisation is coming up which doesn't apply to the majority of gay people but does apply to a very vocal minority) is that they make a big deal out of stuff like this. I'm all for equality but if you can't kiss in a certain pub, who the phuck cares? Honestly. Talk about first world problems. Did it ever occur that this situation arose due to circumstances irrelevant to their sexual orientation? If it were 2 straight black people kissing who got thrown out would they have been thrown out for being black? The whole situation has been blown out of proportion and everyone is still harping on about it even after the 'victims' and the pub have reconciled their differences.

You contemplated suicide at 12 because a minority of people hold old fashioned views? I hate to break it to you but in the grand scheme of things that's not a big deal. A lot of people probably think I'm a kunt, will I kill myself over it? No. Who cares what people think? If you get banned from a pub then go to a pub where you are welcome, there are plenty. I know it's unfair, but life isn't fair so deal with it. Gay people can live perfectly normal lives whether you want to believe it or not. They can get a civil partnership, they can work, they can live and they can die together. So what if they get hassled for being gay, it's still a normal life. People get hassled for all sorts of things... in fact I'd say being ginger is a much larger plight than being gay in this fúcking day and age.

/rant over

A straight black couple would not have been thrown out of that pub. The facebook photo album shows many a straight couple tongue deep in one another. Fail arguement is fail.

And my gripe isn't with the cork incident itself, but with the ignorant opinions of the likes of the people I quoted. You don't know the trials homosexual children brought up in anti homosexual environments. It messes with your head. Such is that causes such as "it gets better" were created.

And no, I won't deal with it, same way I won't tolerate dealing with hasstle for being gay.

And gingers wouldn't get stopped from kissing in a club. Gingers dont get the **** kicked out of them and there hasn't been great concerns over the suicides of ginger kids for being ginger. What are you talking about?

Resi12 · 24-08-2011 05:05AM

I hear they don't let black people sit on the seats in there.. :eek:

mikemac · 24-08-2011 05:13AM

You may find them in the toilets as staff

The Highwayman · 24-08-2011 05:59AM

We Need Community wrote: »

Disgraceful behaviour from the security and they should be punished for discrimination, this type of thing should not happen in this day and age

nah fecking queers should keep their back alley shananigans to queer pubs. I'v been turned away from the george bingo for being straight and was with two poofters at the time. Life not fair............................................. build a bridge and get over it.

minidazzler · 24-08-2011 06:05AM

The Highwayman wrote: »

nah fecking queers should keep their back alley shananigans to queer pubs. I'v been turned away from the george bingo for being straight and was with two poofters at the time. Life not fair............................................. build a bridge and get over it.

While the way you posted is stupid, you bring up an interesting point.

I was in Dublin a few months back and got turned away from the George myself and 2 friends. We are all straight, but it's a good bar, I've been there before and I like the place. Bear in mind this is at 630 in the evening, just a couple of warmers and we couldn't get in because we're straight. A little suspect.

That said, the lads weren't kicked out for kissing, they were kicked out for not taking the warning. people kissing on a dance floor as packed as the old oaks need to be removed from the dance floor.

later12 · 24-08-2011 06:12AM

minidazzler wrote: »

While the way you posted is stupid, you bring up an interesting point.

I was in Dublin a few months back and got turned away from the George myself and 2 friends. We are all straight, but it's a good bar, I've been there before and I like the place. Bear in mind this is at 630 in the evening, just a couple of warmers and we couldn't get in because we're straight. A little suspect.

I call BS on this.

I've been in the George 3 or 4 times with my girlfriend and a family member who is gay.

And how on Earth did this bouncer even know you were straight? I can't imagine door staff query the sexuality of everyone who walks through there.

minidazzler · 24-08-2011 06:20AM

later10 wrote: »

I call BS on this.

I've been in the George 3 or 4 times with my girlfriend and a family member who is gay.

And how on Earth did this bouncer even know you were straight? I can't imagine door staff query the sexuality of everyone who walks through there.

3 lads, 21 and 22, coming up to the door having a laugh celebrating a friends birthday. First thing he says, "lads ye know this is a gay bar right?" I say "Yep, was here a few months ago". He says "sorry not tonight". We had had 2 pints each while eating dinner, we were sober. I guess me and my friends look like a general group of lads going for a night out, nothing particularly straight or gay about us, but it could definitely be presumed we are.

later12 · 24-08-2011 06:23AM

minidazzler wrote: »

3 lads, 21 and 22, coming up to the door having a laugh celebrating a friends birthday. First thing he says, "lads ye know this is a gay bar right?" I say "Yep, was here a few months ago". He says "sorry not tonight". We had had 2 pints each while eating dinner, we were sober. I guess me and my friends look like a general group of lads going for a night out, nothing particularly straight or gay about us, but it could definitely be presumed we are.

How on Earth did you take it that you were refused because you're straight?

So 3 lads coming up to the door of a gay bar, and have been there before... I'm pretty sure the bouncer wasn't assuming you were straight. Why would he?

Maybe there was another reason you were turned away.

minidazzler · 24-08-2011 06:25AM

later10 wrote: »

How on Earth did you take it that you were refused because you're straight?

3 lads coming up to the door of a gay bar, I'm pretty sure the bouncer wasn't assuming you were straight. Why would he?

Maybe there was another reason you were turned away.

Very unlikely it would be another reason TBH. We were dressed well, don't look like knackers, and were well mannered. I've met bouncers here who has worked gay clubs and he has turned groups of straight lads (not every group) away because he says they are probably going in for a laugh. I just wanted a couple of pints.

later12 · 24-08-2011 06:28AM

minidazzler wrote: »

Very unlikely it would be another reason TBH.

Really? You don't think there could be any other reason but that the bouncer must have telepathically known you were straight? Again - why should he have presumed that a group of guys presenting themselves at the George (not for the first time) were not gay? That seems entirely illogical.

geetar · 24-08-2011 07:35AM

jive wrote: »

Cool story bro. What pisses me off about gay people (yes, i said it, a sweeping generalisation is coming up which doesn't apply to the majority of gay people but does apply to a very vocal minority) is that they make a big deal out of stuff like this. I'm all for equality but if you can't kiss in a certain pub, who the phuck cares? Honestly. Talk about first world problems. Did it ever occur that this situation arose due to circumstances irrelevant to their sexual orientation? If it were 2 straight black people kissing who got thrown out would they have been thrown out for being black? The whole situation has been blown out of proportion and everyone is still harping on about it even after the 'victims' and the pub have reconciled their differences.

You contemplated suicide at 12 because a minority of people hold old fashioned views? I hate to break it to you but in the grand scheme of things that's not a big deal. A lot of people probably think I'm a kunt, will I kill myself over it? No. Who cares what people think? If you get banned from a pub then go to a pub where you are welcome, there are plenty. I know it's unfair, but life isn't fair so deal with it. Gay people can live perfectly normal lives whether you want to believe it or not. They can get a civil partnership, they can work, they can live and they can die together. So what if they get hassled for being gay, it's still a normal life. People get hassled for all sorts of things... in fact I'd say being ginger is a much larger plight than being gay in this fúcking day and age.

/rant over

you sir, are a cúnt, and also an idiot.

you cant belittle someone's personal problems that takes them to contemplatig suicide and say that a common problem for many people is no big deal.

you cant ban anyone from a pub, regardless of what/who they are. fact. it's not about getting on and getting over it and moving to a different pub, why the **** should they!?

The Master · 24-08-2011 08:51AM

Everybody kindly moderate your language in this thread
Terms like "queers" "poofters" and "cunt" are not acceptable

COYW · 24-08-2011 10:14AM

later10 wrote: »

How on Earth did you take it that you were refused because you're straight?

A female friend of mine and her mates were turned away on a Saturday night for this exact reason. It was said to them straight out. They just laughed it off and went elsewhere. I'd do the same to be honest and think nothing more of it.

LeeHoffmann · 24-08-2011 11:14AM

I've never seen a gay couple walk down the street holding hands, cuddling or kissing in public, and that makes me sad. Why should they have to hide it? I guess many do because they'd probably get abuse from idiots if they did. Still though, the attitude is changing (albeit slowly) and I'm very much looking forward to a day when being gay is a non-issue - i.e. when they're not in higher danger of public ridicule and physical attacks, when gay people can marry and that marriage is equally recognised, when gay couples are seen holding hands etc as often as straight people.

It's a pity if people were refused entry to clubs/bars because they're straight but I guess there's not too many gay pubs so they give priority to gay people?

Cianos · 24-08-2011 11:27AM

LeeHoffmann wrote: »

It's a pity if people were refused entry to clubs/bars because they're straight but I guess there's not too many gay pubs so they give priority to gay people?

I'd imagine gay bars have to deal with groups of immature people going in as some kind of dare or treating it like a safari tour. If they're pointing and laughing at couples in the bar it's kinda ruining it for everyone else. If a bar kept letting in people behaving like this they'd quickly lose their regular clientele I'm sure.

saywhatyousee · 24-08-2011 11:50AM

LeeHoffmann wrote: »

I've never seen a gay couple walk down the street holding hands, cuddling or kissing in public, and that makes me sad.

Cheer up there is loads of material on the internet

TylerIE · 24-08-2011 12:04PM

jive wrote: »

You contemplated suicide at 12 because a minority of people hold old fashioned views? I hate to break it to you but in the grand scheme of things that's not a big deal........ Gay people can live perfectly normal lives whether you want to believe it or not. They can get a civil partnership, they can work, they can live and they can die together. So what if they get hassled for being gay, it's still a normal life. People get hassled for all sorts of things... in fact I'd say being ginger is a much larger plight than being gay in this fúcking day and age.

/rant over

Id address the rest of your post but the most important parts are above.

Arent gay people lucky to have inequality enshrined in law.

They can get a civil partnership, wow. Not married now, no way. Civil Partnership[, none of this old adopting lark or that.

We even let them work, women werent expected or allowed to work if they were married up until the 70s... We are progressive in that we let the gays work.

Best of all, they are privileged to be allowed live? We dont go round killing them regularly any more? Matthew Shepard (1998) and Nicolas West (1993) show that its not too long ago that these things happened. Only a few months ago a gay couple were told to get off a bus in the States. If its acceptable to stop gay couples kissing, what else is it acceptable to do to them.

Edit: Only last Friday Marcellus Andrews, 19, was beaten to death in Iowa by a group who used anti gay taunts... So you still say gay people are allowed live?

Gay couple kicked out of bar for kissing on the dancefloor

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