Four Irish students deported from US for altering passports

Killer Wench · 19-08-2011 01:00AM

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

It would be more in the line of America to sort out its gun and gang problem that harass a few people that want a few beers.

Watch one too many episodes of "The Wire", did we?

Sungodbr · 19-08-2011 03:29AM

Michelle Wet Whey wrote: »

Dunno about that. My name is in English on my birth cert but my name's in Irish on my passport, my birth cert name is displayed under "notes" though. So I'm not sure if I'm still disagreeing with you...

but your english name doesnt have to be in the notes, thats your choice to avoid hassle, you can just have your Irish name on your passport, its your right as an irish citizen

Run_to_da_hills · 19-08-2011 05:40AM

Since 16 October 2006 all Irish passports contain a biometric chip which would hold details such as date of birth, photo id, criminal records, medical info and what other information the authorities may want to know.

It wouldn't have taken much for the authorities to compare the two from a computer screen. They might have gotten away with it on one of the older pre 2006 passports. So its back to the drawing board again.

jill_valentine · 19-08-2011 05:45AM

Sitec wrote: »

I made a fake drivers license going to the states when I was younger, why didn't they do that?

It's my understanding that you would, theoretically, get in even bigger, significantly gianter, trouble for being caught carrying a fake ID as opposed to an altered one through the airport. I might be wrong, but that's what I've been told. It's one thing to alter a legitimate document a little bit, with a clear - albeit illegal - intent, but it's another entirely to falsify the whole thing, you could be up to all sorts of shenanigans then...

Balfie · 19-08-2011 05:47AM

pity? No. To fake a document in the us, if caught, is somethin like 10 year in federal prison. Feck mount joy or port laois, federal prison over there is the feckin worst. An they deserve it if they wanna be 17 year olds tryin to prove that they are 21.. Is 10 year in federal prison worth one night?? No.

Mellor · 19-08-2011 05:54AM

What exactly did they do?
If it was just a bit of nail varnish to make 91 into 90 then I don't think its as severe as he forging documents people are suggesting.

Altering is a lot different to altering and trying to use it as a passport
(and befroe somebdy says showign it as ID is still using it. It isn't, its a travel document, and you aren't supposed to use it for ID)

Saila · 19-08-2011 06:32AM

Mellor wrote: »

What exactly did they do?
If it was just a bit of nail varnish to make 91 into 90 then I don't think its as severe as he forging documents people are suggesting.

Altering is a lot different to altering and trying to use it as a passport
(and befroe somebdy says showign it as ID is still using it. It isn't, its a travel document, and you aren't supposed to use it for ID)

Im sure thats what they thought too :rolleyes:
read the thread man!

Dardania · 19-08-2011 07:00AM

Why is the legal drinking age 21? Seems somewhat old to me, although once you're over it, you have much less kids in clubs.

And yeah, I agree they are idiots for modifying their passport. Fake ID would have been a better move...

upandcumming · 19-08-2011 07:08AM

Fake Driver's licence is the only way.

Run_to_da_hills · 19-08-2011 08:22AM

Balfie wrote: »

pity? No. To fake a document in the us, if caught, is somethin like 10 year in federal prison. Feck mount joy or port laois, federal prison over there is the feckin worst. An they deserve it if they wanna be 17 year olds tryin to prove that they are 21.. Is 10 year in federal prison worth one night?? No.

!0 years would only applied in extreme cases such as illegal aliens altering their passports / documents to gain naturalisation or a fugitive wanting to change his identity.

The last thing the US authorities would want would be to lock up a few young Paddy's at tax payers expense for 10 years. It would be easier just to send them packing with a warning not to come back again.

jester77 · 19-08-2011 09:11AM

Idiots. They'll never be let back into the US again, they probably won't even be able to make stop overs for connecting flights to other countries and their chances of working for any multi-national US company is as good as zero. Just so they could have a few beers... hope they enjoyed them!

jack presley · 19-08-2011 09:17AM

upandcumming wrote: »

Fake Driver's licence is the only way.

It worked for McLovin

OMG Its EoinD · 19-08-2011 10:14AM

We were told the US Government doesn't take it as a local crime , that they view it as a federal crime. Dunno how serious it really is.

19-08-2011 10:33AM

The more I think about it the more I think the US authorities are making too big of a deal out of this. It was obvious enough they changed the date of birth for use as ID and it had nothing to do with trying to get past customs under false pretenses. If everything else matched between the bio metric data and the passport except the date they should have had a bit of cop on a let them away with it after giving them a serious fright in an interrogation room.

I still cant understand why they didnt change it back when they were going travelling again though, they could just change it back again when they got to their destination.

seamus · 19-08-2011 10:43AM

Kyler Most Firefly wrote: »

If everything else matched between the bio metric data and the passport except the date they should have had a bit of cop on a let them away with it after giving them a serious fright in an interrogation room.

We complain about our justice system in many respects, but in the US a lot of weight is given to the "potential" results of a behaviour, and very little leeway is given to excuses of just messing around or "not meaning any harm".

In this case, regardless of what they were actually using the passports for, the US authorities view it as such a serious crime because they could potentially have used the documents to travel within the US under false identities.

It was a monumentally stupid thing for these guys to do. Everyone knows that when you're away, the two most important things to have are your wallet and your passport. Everything else can be easily replaced. You don't fnck around with your passport. Most J1 students get their hands on a forged driving licence or student ID. The cops are generally unable to tell the difference between a real one and faked one.

UglyBolloxFace · 19-08-2011 11:37AM

We Need Community wrote: »

It was a silly thing to do but it was for innocent enough reasons, they were simply doing it so that they could go out for a few drinks which is the norm at that age in Ireland. Deportation is enough of a punishment

Silly is not the word. Do these people not appreciate the severity of what they did? They altered government documents. Now, that's bad enough, but to do it while going to the US is just downright fucking idiotic.

I went to the US when I was 18. Did I alter my passport? No, I didn't..and the thought never entered my mind (I just blagged my way into clubs/went to Mexico!).

It's their own fault and they deserve everything that comes their way because of it.

Killer Wench · 19-08-2011 12:08PM

jill_valentine wrote: »

It's my understanding that you would, theoretically, get in even bigger, significantly gianter, trouble for being caught carrying a fake ID as opposed to an altered one through the airport. I might be wrong, but that's what I've been told. It's one thing to alter a legitimate document a little bit, with a clear - albeit illegal - intent, but it's another entirely to falsify the whole thing, you could be up to all sorts of shenanigans then...

It is usually a misdeamnor offense defined by each state. This is a state level crime, them altering their passports is a federal level offense.

They would have been better making a cool American friend (older) who was enamored by their Irishness. This friend could have purchased them alcohol. This would be illegal if the friend was caught but this is much harder to prove.

Pretty_Pistol · 19-08-2011 12:19PM

American bars and nightclubs are not even worth that.

House parties are a lot better, the people are friendlier and no need for ID.

Killer Wench · 19-08-2011 12:19PM

OMG Its EoinD wrote: »

We were told the US Government doesn't take it as a local crime , that they view it as a federal crime. Dunno how serious it really is.

In the US, we have different levels. We have city ordinances, state level crimes, and federal crimes. Crimes such as murder, theft, battery, etc. are usually state level crimes. Altering government documents and tax evasion are federal level crimes.

To put it into perspective, the government believes that terrorist have used fake passports to gain entry into the US and to obtain visas to allow them to stay. Doubtful that those kids are terrorists but what they did was pretty far up there in some of the dumbest things they could do.

I am not sure if forging a passport (or altering it) is considered a crime against the government (which forgery of money is) or a crime against the administration of justice. I will have to look that up.

Killer Wench · 19-08-2011 12:24PM

Kyler Most Firefly wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I think the US authorities are making too big of a deal out of this. It was obvious enough they changed the date of birth for use as ID and it had nothing to do with trying to get past customs under false pretenses. If everything else matched between the bio metric data and the passport except the date they should have had a bit of cop on a let them away with it after giving them a serious fright in an interrogation room.

I still cant understand why they didnt change it back when they were going travelling again though, they could just change it back again when they got to their destination.

As mentioned in another post, it has been identified by the government that terrorists had obtained fake passports in order to obtain visas into the country.

The biggest question for me is how their act got tipped off. I would imagine that they probably tried to gain entry into an establishment or tried to purchase liquor alone. The passports probably looked so weird that the owner/clerk called the law. And it escalated from there. Because the government didn't know that these were just kids looking to get drunk, they may have perceived this in the very worst possible scenario.

Four Irish students deported from US for altering passports

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