Male sex assault is ok?

14-08-2011 06:44PM

What's wrong with being a homophobe? Men touching other men is disgusting!

Joking! Although I wouldn't like a man grabbing my arse.

Dyr · 14-08-2011 06:50PM

Grab the guys nose with your teeth OP, quid pro quo and all that

waxon-waxoff · 14-08-2011 06:58PM

Ok calling it a sex assault might be a bit much but too late now. Maybe im old fashioned but i think its weird for a stranger to touch another mans ass as he walks by. I was minding my own business, watched the game and on the piss, typical Saturday fare. I asked him what the fcuk he was doing and he said nowt. If you did it to a mate as a laugh its ok as you know them. Maybe some people, including the bouncer, think its normal but i dont. Its not a big deal just thought id throw it out there

slimjimmc · 14-08-2011 07:02PM

looky loo wrote: »

Actually it is, someone touching you without your consent is assault.

Merely touching or even bumping into someone is not necessarily assault.

Legalese

2.—(1) A person shall be guilty of the offence of assault who, without lawful excuse, intentionally or recklessly—

(a) directly or indirectly applies force to or causes an impact on the body of another, or

(b) causes another to believe on reasonable grounds that he or she is likely immediately to be subjected to any such force or impact,

without the consent of the other.

(2) In subsection (1) (a), “force” includes—

(a) application of heat, light, electric current, noise or any other form of energy, and

(b) application of matter in solid liquid or gaseous form.

(3) No such offence is committed if the force or impact, not being intended or likely to cause injury, is in the circumstances such as is generally acceptable in the ordinary conduct of daily life and the defendant does not know or believe that it is in fact unacceptable to the other person.

(4) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £1,500 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6 months or to both.

dsmythy · 14-08-2011 07:07PM

I don't know where this homophobe/sexist stuff is coming in.

If a man has a different reaction to an old man in a wheelchair grabbing his ass versus a 16 stone hulk of a man doing the same, is he ageist if his reaction is stronger against the bigger threat?

ResearchWill · 14-08-2011 07:09PM

Rambo83 wrote: »

FFS Get a life! Sex assault, your taking the piss.

Sure I often grabbed my mates arse in a club for the craic, when he turns around he though it was the lady behind him. Great craic! And no mention of sex assault!

Well while Sexual Assault is not defined as such it is any assault of a sexual nature, in the above case the statutory defence in a section 2 assault would arise.

(3) No such offence is committed if the force or impact, not being intended or likely to cause injury, is in the circumstances such as is generally acceptable in the ordinary conduct of daily life and the defendant does not know or believe that it is in fact unacceptable to the other person.

One of the things about sexual assault is that when the person is attractive to us it's only a bit of flirting, and when the person is not attractive it's an assault.

A19B1C12 · 14-08-2011 07:15PM

It's done in nightclubs quite a bit, I've done it on occasion when I'm drunk and having a laugh with my friends trying to look cool.

Probably not my proudest moments.

PhiloCypher · 14-08-2011 08:00PM

Got my ass smacked by some bloke on my way out of a club last night , if it had been at the bar and he was full on hitting on me I'd have set him straight but as things stood I just paused on the stairs and gave him a WTF look before heading out the door .

While it's a presumptuous and annoying thing to do its not assault imo and not worth getting someone kicked out over(unless its persistant) just because they have shown a lack of judgment and a functioning gaydar .

lecker Hendl · 14-08-2011 08:02PM

Is male sexual assault ok? No

However, in this case a man is touching a man's pert bottom. This cause the OP to create a thread on male sexual assault.

If it was a lady with a rotten head on her and a body like jabba the hut, would it be seen as male sexual assault? Yes, because she's manky.

If it was by a lady considered to be of the stunner variety, would it be considered sexual assualt? No, it would be a great success and the OP would be creating a thread on his marvelous achievement with his pert bottom.

It all comes down to consistency with what is sexual assault for the person shouting about it. Goes for both men and women.

Unless the OP would report a stunner for groping him too? Then he's just weird.

k4kate · 14-08-2011 08:26PM

I agree with the OP on this. If a stranger grabs you by the arse then that is a sexual assault. And I think yes the bouncer would have treated the case differently if it was a woman. If a woman complained in a similar situation and the bouncer said "What's your problem, are you frigid?" then she would quite rightly feel agrieved.

Lot of posters are concentrating on how the OP should feel. For me that is not the point. The point is the reaction of the person who was working in the place and whose job it is to protect patrons and treat them with courtesy. That didn't happen here and yes I think it was because it was a man it happened to.

CallMeFlo · 14-08-2011 08:28PM

If he had of been more forward with you then it would be serious but he just grabbed your ass for a bit of fun. The bouncer would have reacted the exact same way if a female complained about it

looky loo · 14-08-2011 08:33PM

slimjimmc wrote: »

Merely touching or even bumping into someone is not necessarily assault.

Legalese

I'll say this....any person who pinches another persons arse......just give them a slap across the face....its not assault...:rolleyes:

paulmclaughlin · 14-08-2011 08:42PM

All this sexist rubbish is in fact rubbish.

I'm not sexist if I don't want a guy's hand touching my ass. That's like saying I can't be heterosexual because that would be sexist too.

Sexual Assault:
a statutory offense that provides that it is a crime to knowingly cause another person to engage in an unwanted sexual act by force or threat;

Did he make you engage in an unwanted sexual act by force or threat? I believe not.

Sexual Harassment:
Harassment in a workplace, or other professional or social situation, involving the making of unwanted sexual advances or obscene remarks.

It was sexual harassment. In my personal opinion the first harassment (where the perpetrator was unaware of your sexuality) is okay. Any further unwanted advances would deem it either worthy of complaint or acceptable of my use of the ancient art of drunken boxing.

SuperInfinity · 14-08-2011 09:09PM

later10 wrote: »

Would a man be kicked out of a nightclub for grabbing a woman's ass?

I'm not totally convinced about that. If she worked there, sure, but otherwise, perhaps not, no.

Just randomly grabbing a stranger girl's ass as she's walking by? A really beautiful luscious girl just hanging out, and you think it would be okay to just grope her?

What kind of nightclubs do you go to?

....any that you know of in the Cork region?

SuperInfinity · 14-08-2011 09:14PM

later10 wrote: »

Absolutely - if they'd have no problems with a random woman motorboarding them then they have no reasonable argument.

later10, I'm trying to think of the nicest possible way to say this....

You are so full of crap.

It's 100% within a person's rights to be biased toward a certain gender when allowing what to allow and what not to allow. Your viewpoint is ridiculous.

twinQuins · 14-08-2011 09:17PM

k4kate wrote: »

I agree with the OP on this. If a stranger grabs you by the arse then that is a sexual assault. And I think yes the bouncer would have treated the case differently if it was a woman. If a woman complained in a similar situation and the bouncer said "What's your problem, are you frigid?" then she would quite rightly feel agrieved.

Lot of posters are concentrating on how the OP should feel. For me that is not the point.

Except going by the way the OP has phrased what happened he wasn't upset he was touched he was upset he was touched by another man.

SuperInfinity · 14-08-2011 09:23PM

twinQuins wrote: »

Except going by the way the OP has phrased what happened he wasn't upset he was touched he was upset he was touched by another man.

Soooo????

I can say that I would allow every female human in the world to molest me in any way, shape or form but I wouldn't allow any male to do likewise. It's my body, I can allow whoever I want to touch it (at least in theory).

I can say I will not have sex with a person of a particular race. This does not make me racist. In fact some prostitutes decline people of certain races based on their race. This is perfectly acceptable, it is just a choice they make. It is NOT racist, NONE of this stuff is. You are totally confusing matters in all ways, and it's the ridiculous PC world we live in. But no respectable/thinking person even if they are extremely PC would even think to argue that a person should not do differently depending on "gender". In a free society you can create a club that doesn't allow <insert victimized minority> and you do not need any reasons for it, you can create a club that doesn't allow Joneses. With employment and other official types of things you may not, though that's different because then you enter into a contract with the government.

Have people really become this "politically correct"? In After Hours?

geetar · 14-08-2011 09:40PM

this thread is outrageous.

there is no sexual assault here.

a gay lad touched your bum, you got upset because he thought you were gay, and went to the bouncer to tell tales. you have to be pretty precious if you complain about that sort of stuff. just give him a look that says "no im not gay sorry", and get on with it, he's not going to pursue it.

the fact that you tried to get a homosexual kicked out of a club for trying to fish out if you were infact gay is disgusting. the fact that you admit pointing him out is even worse.

you're on a night out, forget about it, laugh and get on with the night and leave the bloke alone.

wear a sign next time that says your sexuality, because for him its hard to tell.

dsmythy · 14-08-2011 09:54PM

geetar wrote: »

this thread is outrageous.

there is no sexual assault here.

a gay lad touched your bum, you got upset because he thought you were gay, and went to the bouncer to tell tales. you have to be pretty precious if you complain about that sort of stuff. just give him a look that says "no im not gay sorry", and get on with it, he's not going to pursue it.

the fact that you tried to get a homosexual kicked out of a club for trying to fish out if you were infact gay is disgusting. the fact that you admit pointing him out is even worse.

you're on a night out, forget about it, laugh and get on with the night and leave the bloke alone.

wear a sign next time that says your sexuality, because for him its hard to tell.

Is ass pinching the new chatting people up or something?

orourkeda · 14-08-2011 09:55PM

waxon-waxoff wrote: »

I was in a well known basement late bar on Dublins Baggot St this evening and some man grabbed my ass as i walked by. I stopped a bouncer who happened to be the manager and complained to him. He said it was just some fun and then asked was i homophobic? I pointed out the culprit, he spoke to him but didnt ask him to leave. If i was female would it be the same? I left then, i couldnt believe it.

Ahh. The aul Baggot Inn

geetar · 14-08-2011 10:14PM

dsmythy wrote: »

Is ass pinching the new chatting people up or something?

no not at all.

all im saying is look at it from the other guys point of view.

he was probably gay, and gave a friendly pinch to a lad on the ass and gauging his reaction. he was probably attracted to the OP and was trying to decipher his sexuality.

as a result the OP tried to kick him out and started pointing him out, exposing his sexuality that may not be known to anyone else.

all im trying to do is give a different point of view, one that seems to be lacking in this thread.

the OP clearly over reacted. he was obviously offended, and thats fair enough but i dont think he appreciates the consequences of what he was doing. he also seems to be quite homophobic considering he clearly said he was hoping that it was a girl, and only saw it as harrasement when he found out it was a guy.

that guy approached him with the same mentallity as the girl, the only difference in the equation is the OP's reaction to the gender of the pincher. The OP is could have simply said no and ignored it. instead he went on a crusade to have the lad kicked out and make a show out of absoltely nothing.

dsmythy · 14-08-2011 10:23PM

geetar wrote: »

no not at all.

all im saying is look at it from the other guys point of view.

he was probably gay, and gave a friendly pinch to a lad on the ass and gauging his reaction. he was probably attracted to the OP and was trying to decipher his sexuality.

as a result the OP tried to kick him out and started pointing him out, exposing his sexuality that may not be known to anyone else.

all im trying to do is give a different point of view, one that seems to be lacking in this thread.

the OP clearly over reacted. he was obviously offended, and thats fair enough but i dont think he appreciates the consequences of what he was doing. he also seems to be quite homophobic considering he clearly said he was hoping that it was a girl, and only saw it as harrasement when he found out it was a guy.

that guy approached him with the same mentallity as the girl, the only difference in the equation is the OP's reaction to the gender of the pincher. The OP is could have simply said no and ignored it. instead he went on a crusade to have the lad kicked out and make a show out of absoltely nothing.

He must have been doing it quite a bit to quite a few people during the night possibly then. The chances of firstly the guy being gay is quite low then he has to fancy the other guy in question in return. I wouldn't find this acceptable. You can forgive one pinch and put it down to drink but if it's a habit I don't think it should be treated lightly. It's liable to cause aggro in the pub/club too.

I gave an example of asking if it's ageist if a man has a different reaction to a wheelchair bound old man pinching his behind as opposed to a 15 stone beast of muscles doing the same. It's all about the threat level of someone doing this to you. Rather than being homophobic I think men don't like being pinched on the ass by men for the same reason women don't like it. I'm sure some gay men wouldn't like it either.

astonaidan · 14-08-2011 10:25PM

Wow don't really see the big deal is, Like I do get it from girls and lads in the club all the time, Its usually just people having a laugh id wink and walk on its not the end of the world, P.S probably should stay away from playing football this sort of assault happens all the time, My coach is a curse for it

SuperInfinity · 14-08-2011 10:49PM

geetar wrote: »

he was probably gay, and gave a friendly pinch to a lad on the ass and gauging his reaction. he was probably attracted to the OP and was trying to decipher his sexuality.

as a result the OP tried to kick him out and started pointing him out, exposing his sexuality that may not be known to anyone else.

How the hell do you figure all this? Unless you have further information on it, all we can go by is by what OP says. Did OP even say "pinch"? "probably" this and "probably" that. Give me a break.

You can't come into a topic accusing OP of being a liar, based on what you just made up yourself, making it out to be a completely innocuous thing, and then by extension saying that he must be narrow-minded and a crybaby. Why does OP bother posting at all when you seem to know so much more than him and give such a much better description and details of what happened? Does OP have to say it exactly, in meticulous detail or you will make this stuff up?

Maybe you should become a lawyer. No idea what happened, painting your own picture of it to suit yourself "it was a mere pinch to see what sexuality he was". Also, I really hate people pinching me. I would rather be groped than be pinched.

Once in public I tapped someone on the shoulder to ask them a question that was very important at the time and I had no way otherwise of finding out, and he gave me an outrageous look when he turned around. I haven't tapped any stranger on the shoulder since... under the circumstances it seemed like the best course of action because of the situation, don't assume you know exactly what it was like for me now.

Millicent · 14-08-2011 11:13PM

Oh, FFS. Someone grabbed the OP's arse without his consent and people are telling him to get over it. Why should he? If he didn't invite any sexual contact, he has every right to be offended or annoyed by it.

There's a fecking double standard on AH with this stuff and it's annoying. Doesn't matter what gender the OP is or the gender of the person who grabbed his arse, that was out of order and the guy who grabbed his backside should have been kicked out. Simple as.

geetar · 14-08-2011 11:22PM

dsmythy wrote: »

He must have been doing it quite a bit to quite a few people during the night possibly then..

your assuming he was doing it to everyone? the OP could have been the only one it happened to.

SuperInfinity wrote: »

How the hell do you figure all this? Unless you have further information on it, all we can go by is by what OP says. Did OP even say "pinch"? "probably" this and "probably" that. Give me a break.

so you think when a man "sexually assualts" another man, he most likely isnt gay?

dsmythy wrote: »

You can't come into a topic accusing OP of being a liar, based on what you just made up yourself, making it out to be a completely innocuous thing, and then by extension saying that he must be narrow-minded and a crybaby.

i know i made it up, i never claimed it to be fact. i was just giving a possible reason, and highlighting the double standard of the situation.

SuperInfinity wrote: »

Once in public I tapped someone on the shoulder to ask them a question.... he gave me an outrageous look when he turned around... I haven't tapped any stranger on the shoulder since...

what a bizarre mentality you have.

paulmclaughlin · 14-08-2011 11:30PM

It's invasion of personal space too. What happened to starting a conversation instead of groping a person in an area where no-one should place any part of their body without consent to discover their sexuality? How about some lad coming up on a night out and kissing you to 'gauge your reaction'?

geetar · 14-08-2011 11:42PM

paulmclaughlin wrote: »

It's invasion of personal space too. What happened to starting a conversation instead of groping a person in an area where no-one should place any part of their body without consent to discover their sexuality? How about some lad coming up on a night out and kissing you to 'gauge your reaction'?

ok, just to clarify, i dont think its entirely acceptable behaviour at all.. it isnt acceptable and it is invasive, but my main point was the blatant double standard from the OP.

that cant be argued because he himself said he grabbed the wrist hoping it was a girl.

i was merely stating that the guy acted the same way as the hypothetical girl was acting, and the OP's reactions were miles apart.

because of that, its clear that its not the invasive part that upset the OP, but the gender of the offender, and possibly the sexuality.

dsmythy · 14-08-2011 11:46PM

geetar wrote: »

because of that, its clear that its not the invasive part that upset the OP, but the gender of the offender, and possibly the sexuality.

Or as I mentioned earlier the perceived threat.

geetar · 14-08-2011 11:55PM

dsmythy wrote: »

Or as I mentioned earlier the perceived threat.

you're then suggesting that he feels threatened because of the mans sexuality, and attraction to him. not the invasive touching part, which is the same as what i said.

so you agree, whether you know it or not.

Male sex assault is ok?

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