Do non-parents REALLY understand what it's like to be a parent?

thomasm · 03-08-2011 04:14PM

Father of 3 under the age of three and the one thing I never anticipated was how relentless it was. Your own time does not exist anymore.

TheZohanS · 03-08-2011 04:14PM

Some people are not cut out to raise kids and make shìt parents. They blame their shìt parenting skills on the likes of "kids will be kids" and other nonsense.

If you're having trouble raising kids ask for help off someone that's good with kids. If you're still having trouble wear a fùcking condom in future, the last thing we need is more unruly antisocial scrotes running around.

Shpuds · 03-08-2011 04:15PM

In 2008 My sister got very sick, i had full custody of her four children for 18 months. It hit my like a ton of bricks, sure i was only 24 i didnt have plan on raising a baby, a toddler an eight year old and an 11 year old. It was the most rewarding thing i have ever done, but it was SO hard. I never ever thought it would be that hard and all credit to parents who do a good job!

03-08-2011 04:16PM

I am a non parent who thought I knew what to expect until my sister had her daughter 8 months ago. After living with both for 8 months I can not imagine having full responsibility for a child.

thebigbiffo · 03-08-2011 04:19PM

Up de Barrs wrote: »

Parents are often very patronising to non parents, implying that unless you have children of your own you are not able to empathise with certain situations. I'm not sure if this is a deliberate way of putting people down or inadvertent but it is extremely annoying.

mikemac wrote: »

"As a parent......" is used a lot on boards

I'll read your post and consider your opinion but it doesn't automatically make it more valid then a non parent

But ask a question and the reply might be
"One day you'll understand...."

As Up de Barrs says, it can come across as patronizing

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

No real idea as to what it's like to be a parent, seeing as i am not a parent.

I still reserve the right to dislike parents who make no effort to control errant children though.

The other thread must have hit you hard OP.

This is the crux of the matter for me – it may be annoying and it may be patronising but it’s the truth. In threads relating to bad parenting and s’hitty children, people hate the line – but it’s more than valid. A story about a child who has wrecked your head in a restaurant can have a completely different meaning to a parent than it does to a non-parent and stating that as part of a post, and assuming another post you are quoting or referring to is a non-parent is more than valid, no matter how patronising or annoying it is – it’s simply the truth that yes, when it comes to having an opinion about errant children parents may very well have the more insightful viewpoint!!

donalg1 wrote: »

Right I will answer this question once and for all. I am a non parent and i do appreciate it is very hard to raise a child. However if it is as bad as every parent makes out why do any of them have more than 1?
Maybe the OP can answer that as he has a 2 yr old and 4yr so if the 4yr old was so hard to raise why have the other one?

I’d say in most cases it’s so the child is not an only child. Was with us and the decision to have another came in the middle of a bad evening with the first – we thought we may as well have two together and get it over with instead of putting up with this s’hit again in a few years time! We were wrong L

Malari · 03-08-2011 04:22PM

I'm not sure how to answer this poll, as it sort of pre-supposes everyone either has kids, or will have at some point.

So I'm a non-parent, and yeah, I think I have a pretty good idea of what it would entail so I'm never going to be one.

Jeez, having a demanding cat is enough. At least you can put it outside or go out for a meal and just leave it at home. People really frown upon doing that with kids.

Logical Fallacy · 03-08-2011 04:23PM

Dudess wrote: »

I don't think that's fair LF. I completely understand where the OP is coming from - and I'm not even a parent. It must be so frustrating to be told you're a failure as a parent etc by people who don't have kids yet are self proclaimed experts. Yes, you have the right to get irked by kids older than toddler age whose parents blatantly don't make an effort to stop them acting up in public, but some people on threads like that other one go much further. They practically view a baby crying as failed parenting.

Myself and this threads OP were basically saying the same thing in the other thread...because he was a parent and i wasn't he viewed what i was saying as arrogant.

That kind of strikes me that he was taking it a bit personal and just doesn't seem to like when non-parents would dare to say anything negative about parents.

I mean seriously, we said pretty much exactly the same thing. It was ****ing hilarious.

hightower1 · 03-08-2011 04:27PM

nevaeh-2die-4 wrote: »

if you dont have kids there is no way of knowing whats its like to be a parent,

same with if you have cancer, i might think i know how you feel but until your in there shoes you have no idea.

So ..... much... WIN!!

"Kids = cancer" ...

Personally, never having kids. Seen too many of my family have their quality of life drained in nearly every way by kids to want them.

Pros -
Might turn out to be good important people
Helps march the human race forward

Cons -
Smelly
Noisy
Generally degredation of sex life
Money pits
Might turn out to be wastes of space people
Terrible sense of humour

That and I like my spare time / money wayyyyy too mch to give them over to snotty nose children

thebigbiffo · 03-08-2011 04:32PM

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Myself and this threads OP were basically saying the same thing in the other thread...because he was a parent and i wasn't he viewed what i was saying as arrogant.

That kind of strikes me that he was taking it a bit personal and just doesn't seem to like when non-parents would dare to say anything negative about parents.

I mean seriously, we said pretty much exactly the same thing. It was ****ing hilarious.

I didn’t like your post that – basically – told me to stuff the fact I’m a parent. And this thread is an expansion of that because of the amount of people who thanked that post. I am seriously just curious as to how people think this is valid. If I was a rape victim and the thread was about rape, you would accept my opinion might matter more than yours. War vet. Deep sea diver. Astronaut. Why is then that you believe you know better than a parent about raising kids? And why are you so annoyed by my stating such a simple point?

Big Knox · 03-08-2011 04:33PM

My girlfriend is currently expecting and this thread has not done me any favours.

:pac:

Emoi · 03-08-2011 04:33PM

minidazzler wrote: »

To be honest, the "do you know what it's like to be a parent" has been trotted out to me when I complain about parents being ****. I'm not a parent, but I am a carer for my 16 year old sister, who happens to be wheelchair bound, and I have been for around 6 years. It's hard yeah, but if you let your kids run riot in public places such as trains and buses, you suck as a parent.

So I would say I am mostly clued into what it's like.

This is exactly why any parent of a healthy child who uses that 'you just don't know how hard it is' line, needs to shUt up and put up.

I have a family member with an autistic child of about 8, he never sleeps, goes mental if somebody looks at him, in strange houses he goes under tables and won't come out.

His parents NEVER complain about how hard their life is, they just get on with it.

Do non-parents REALLY understand what it's like to be a parent?

No, they're not parents, how would they??

What non-parents and parents can't stand is the parents of badly behaved, spoilt children, who go around in their own world feeling sorry for themselves and telling everyone who will listen how hard there lives are trying to raise HEALTHY children, who have no mental or physical issues.

thebigbiffo · 03-08-2011 04:35PM

Big Knox wrote: »

My girlfriend is currently expecting and this thread has not done me any favours. :pac:

you poor bastard, your life is over...and I'm a parent so i'd know best :pac:

IvyTheTerrible · 03-08-2011 04:39PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

I didn’t like your post that – basically – told me to stuff the fact I’m a parent. And this thread is an expansion of that because of the amount of people who thanked that post. I am seriously just curious as to how people think this is valid. If I was a rape victim and the thread was about rape, you would accept my opinion might matter more than yours. War vet. Deep sea diver. Astronaut. Why is then that you believe you know better than a parent about raising kids? And why are you so annoyed by my stating such a simple point?

Why do you think you know more about child-rearing than another person because you are rearing YOUR OWN children? You have no experience of what it is like for other parents. You can only speak FOR YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE. I think that's one reason why your point irritated some people.

K_P · 03-08-2011 04:40PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

it’s simply the truth that yes, when it comes to having an opinion about errant children parents may very well have the more insightful viewpoint!!

Absolutely not. You may have a different viewpoint as a parent. It's no more or less insightful or vaild than mine or anyone else's.

If we go by the scenario in that other thread, my viewpoint would be that the children are brats and they are that way because they've been consistently allowed to misbehave by parents who are mercifully (for them) able to tune out their noise and bad behaviour. I don't know what your viewpoint would be exactly, but it seems you'd be more tolerant.

You have your opinion and I have mine. But please don't think that because you have kids of your own, that it makes your opinion of children behaving atrociously any more vaild than mine.

Akrasia · 03-08-2011 04:41PM

I've got a 2 year old boy and a 3 month old girl.

When our second baby was born, we had almost forgotten how extremely demanding new born babies are.

Not even parents know what it's like to be a parent because our own experiences are always filtered through the lens of our current state of mind.

By the time my kids are starting secondary school, I will have almost totally forgotten what it's like to be a parent of two small babies (I will have the memories of events that happened, but that's not the same as knowing what it's actually like in the hear and now.)

I have no concept of what it must be like to be the parent of twins or triplets in the first few years, I have no concept of what it must be like to be a single parent of young children other than by extrapolation of my own experiences.

Judging other people's experiences is impossible. However, judging their actions is something that we all do all the time. (parents constantly talk amongst themselves about what other parents are doing wrong raising their children)

Being a parent is extremely hard work, it requires patience, tolerance enthusiasm, empathy, foresight and a lot of energy. If even one of these elements is missing then the children will suffer. Some people find themselves in a situation where they can't pick themselves up every day and devote the necessary care and attention to their children. As a society, we should first try to support and help these parents as best we can. but at a certain point, if the parents are not prepared or capable to fulfil their responsibilities we should try and help the children in a more direct manner up to and including foster care in the most extreme cases.

minidazzler · 03-08-2011 04:44PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

I didn’t like your post that – basically – told me to stuff the fact I’m a parent. And this thread is an expansion of that because of the amount of people who thanked that post. I am seriously just curious as to how people think this is valid. If I was a rape victim and the thread was about rape, you would accept my opinion might matter more than yours. War vet. Deep sea diver. Astronaut. Why is then that you believe you know better than a parent about raising kids? And why are you so annoyed by my stating such a simple point?

Really, you brought rape victims and war veterens into a thread to explain how you have been there and lived through it, that's bad.

Being a parent doesn't give you some wonderful insight into kids or anything like that, if they run riot in a restaurant calm them the fcuk down, it's that simple, if you fail to calm them down...leave. Have some consideration for other diners, but don't ask them to have consideration for you because it's not their fault you have kids.

mariaf24 · 03-08-2011 04:46PM

I just had my second child a few weeks ago and it has been a walk in the park compared to no.1. Emotionally even more so than physically. I had absolutely no idea what having a baby/child meant when i was expecting number 1. Nothing can prepare you for the shock/change that parenthood will bring. Your whole life completely changes overnight. I remember the exhaustion for the first few months on baby no.1 was something i had never experienced before. Up until then if you're tired you can have a rest, sleep in at weekends etc etc...Not possible when you have kids. With baby no.2 now im no where near as tired but i know it's because i've done it before so it's not a shock to the system and i knew what i was in store for while pregnant.

My friends who have no children have no idea what being a parent is (especially of a baby). We are all mid-late 20's by the way. Just the other day one friend said i must be bored because im at home with my 3 week old baby (Even though i didnt get a chance to brush my hair til mid day today). Another said she knew how i felt as she has a puppy :rolleyes:

Sorry if this comes across as patronising

diamondp · 03-08-2011 04:49PM

i am a parent of a 16 yr old, just one and i can tell ye never again, to all of you parents out der who have kids under 11 good luck to ye, to all who have kids over 11 like myself im going the pub does anyone wana join me????? you will always love your kids but from the age of about 11 to im hoping it ends at 18 you wont like dem.
oh and if you dont have kids do yourself a fav and stay dat way.

Eve_Dublin · 03-08-2011 04:49PM

I don't know but I can imagine it's tough. My sister has a very hard time with my niece from the day she was born. She's a GREAT mother...but she spoils her and she does get away with a fair bit of murder. I'm not allowed to give out to her because I'm only the auntie, apparently.

and I get in trouble if I do. Still, I have a lot of respect for her as it's tough.

Worked in a Summer camp with 25 Spanish children for a month this Summer and it was the most difficult thing I've ever had to do. Thing is, I got two complaints from two seperate parents complaining their kids didn't get to do something or other....and they just so happened to be the moaniest, spoiltest, rudest little brats I've ever come across in my life so they suffered consequences..and I think it might've been the first time in their lives by how they reacted. You haven't taught your kid manners, she punched another student so I sent her outside so she didn't get to watch the film...and I get the complaints?? Are you not even the slightest bit aware how naughty your child is??

Sorry, I had to vent there.....

Still, parenting in 2011 must be tough...doesn't turn me off it though. I'm just not going to spoil my own kids and I'll be consistant with punishment (easier said than done I know).

Ray Palmer · 03-08-2011 04:49PM

As a non-parent I particularly dislike the attitude of some parents. They seem to think that they have got to defend their child's actions regardless. They fail as reasonable humans and do their kids no favors.

People who generally think their life choices override others tend to annoy me.

Haven't a clue about parenting but I can tell when a child is being a brat and if they are like that all the time I will blame the parent.

Logical Fallacy · 03-08-2011 04:57PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

I didn’t like your post that – basically – told me to stuff the fact I’m a parent. And this thread is an expansion of that because of the amount of people who thanked that post. I am seriously just curious as to how people think this is valid. If I was a rape victim and the thread was about rape, you would accept my opinion might matter more than yours. War vet. Deep sea diver. Astronaut. Why is then that you believe you know better than a parent about raising kids? And why are you so annoyed by my stating such a simple point?

Where did i say stuff the fact that you are a parent, or anything like it. You rolled out the old "only a parent knows" line and i pointed out that seeing as the thread was about getting two happy kids to sit quietly in a restaurant then surely people who have been in that situation in any circumstances (babysitting, looking after family members kids etc), i was working within your own structure there.

Despite my user name i rarely do this, but you are basically implying genetic fallacy to dismiss points you don't like, ideas should be viewed on their own merit, you seem to be pretty intent on implying the source of the idea is the most important factor.

It's flawed thinking.

Also, please find where i said my opinion matters more than anyone else's...all i ever did was offer my opinion and then defend the offering of it in the face of YOU telling people that effectively their opinion doesn't matter.

It's odd, i never said i felt it was easy raising kids, i never said anything that a good and active parent could take any issue with.

What i said was "people who make no effort to control their kids get no respect". The below is your response to it, yet you claim i was the person telling you that your opinion didn't count.

Selective memory no?

Nobody, absolutely nobody has any idea what it's like raising kids till you've done it yourself

wild_cat · 03-08-2011 05:21PM

Some parents don't seem to realise that some other peoples lives don't revolve around children.

For some people it seems that children blind them from the real world.

I'm not a parent. I don't particularity like children.. I will accommodate them during my day but when it starts to get to "taking the piss" levels and then the "you're not a parent so you wouldn't understand" line is rolled out it makes me even more annoyed... you're ruining other peoples evenings out, shopping trips etc....

Very patronising. I've chose not to know what its like be a parent... I'll be understanding up to a certain point but at the end of the day you had the child not me so I don't understand why it should be impacting on my life.

Gandhi · 03-08-2011 05:41PM

I was one of the 10% that said I DID know what it would be like. The one thing I underestimated was how persistent and manipulative kids can be so early.

I remember seeing examples of both crappy and good parenting before I had kids, and now that I do have kids, I still stand by those same opinions. Any time I have seen a kid misbehaving badly (I don't mean crying or whining for a few seconds), it is usually pretty obvious very quickly that their parent(s) are either ignoring them or rewarding bad behaviour.

Karona · 03-08-2011 05:53PM

I have 2 nephews, and I fully understand what it is like to be a parent, I will often bring them out for the day or they will stay with me while their parents go away and let me tell you its tough work.

My sister always told me to treat them like they were my own, so if they are bold I give out to them. But I do be glad to hand them back when she is home.

I dont think I want kids anytime soon.

Dudess · 03-08-2011 10:29PM

curlywurly26 wrote: »

I don't know what you expected from his thread - as said below, it sounds patronising as if you just want to get another chance to say "ohhh no you'll never understand unless you have them..."

To me it's raising the point that there are so many parenting "experts" on here who aren't parents, and "no child of theirs would make noise in public" (discipline, control - won't always stop a child under three from making noise) - now THAT is patronising. And this thread also makes for a good counter to the myriad of "Parents are arseholes" threads.
Saying "Wait 'til you're a parent" is dead right.

donalg1 wrote: »

The point of the other thread is failed parenting is doing nothing while the child cries

No, there are plenty here who won't even admit babies just cry, good parents or not.

K_P wrote: »

Absolutely not. You may have a different viewpoint as a parent. It's no more or less insightful or vaild than mine or anyone else's.

When it comes to parenting matters, it is more insightful - simple as. More valid? Depends on what it's in relation to. If it's in relation to something like the Oslo atrocity, well yeah, it's arsey for any parent to view their horror at it to be more "worthy" because they're parents (although it does give them a new insight).

minidazzler wrote: »

Being a parent doesn't give you some wonderful insight into kids or anything like that

But it really does. And I think it's sh1tty for people to effectively state parents shouldn't go for a bite to eat, in places that are noisy anyway, if they have their kid(s) with them. Parents have to get out sometimes, and babysitters aren't on tap. I'm not saying parents should leave kids misbehave, but they can't always stop the kid from getting hyper, even when they try to. Tolerance and consideration should be a two-way street.

I don't have kids btw.

Ghost Buster · 03-08-2011 10:32PM

Im a parent of two and I had a fair idea of discipline and how to interact with toddlers upwards from working with children. Wasnt quite prepared for the pooing, peeing, pukeing crying stage:eek: which preceeds the toddler stage but I got there!

PeterIanStaker · 03-08-2011 10:45PM

I'm so glad I'm never having kids after reading this. I don't think I could ever do it. Nothing against people who have em, just not for me.

mfceiling · 03-08-2011 10:55PM

I have 3 under 5.

Brother in law spent 5 days with us on holidays this year.
He told me one night after they'd gone to bed that he genuinally didn't realise how difficult it is to mind them.
As he said "you're basically watching them constantly so they don't f*cking kill themselves".

Show Time · 03-08-2011 11:33PM

Having been the main male influence in my Godsons life as his Dad did a runner before he was even born which was over nine years ago i can say with hand on heart i do have an idea what it is to be a parent.

Eoin_Sheehy · 03-08-2011 11:36PM

Maybe we don't but it still wrecks our head when parents start every sentence with "Well, as a parent. . . "

Do non-parents REALLY understand what it's like to be a parent?

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