Feral children and their do-nothing parents

Aldebaran · 30-07-2011 05:52PM

Cut down all the swings.

Mike 1972 · 30-07-2011 05:53PM

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

Throw acid in their little faces

Turpentine wrote: »

You're getting soft man.

Knee cappings are so last decade

holystungun9 · 30-07-2011 06:01PM

Aldebaran wrote: »

Cut down all the swings.

I agree. And concrete the whole country and put broken glass in the play areas. That'll learn 'em real good.

southsiderosie · 30-07-2011 06:20PM

Pherekydes wrote: »

Either your kids are "demon spawn " or you're a child -beating monster. Who'd be a parent these days?

Well, the delusional parents don't realize (or don't acknowledge) that they have demon spawn, so they don't think anything is wrong. And the child-beating monsters are in the minority. But the other 20% are ok...ok, maybe 50%. Maybe.

Millicent · 30-07-2011 06:28PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

Well, the delusional parents don't realize (or don't acknowledge) that they have demon spawn, so they don't think anything is wrong. And the child-beating monsters are in the minority. But the other 20% are ok...ok, maybe 50%. Maybe.

I've been thinking about this more and I really do think a lot of the conventional parenting thinking is to blame.

I know someone who is using this school of thought on her kids that you reward the good behaviour and ignore the bad. That way, the thinking goes, you give attention to the good actions and not the bad.

I mean, what sort of bollocksology is that? If you do something bad in adult life, you can bet your ass that you'll receive some negative consequences. Steal something? Go to jail. Grope someone? Get a punch in the face.

I don't think it's necessarily the parents' fault that they buy into this bad advice. A lot of parenting "experts" are really perpetuating some batshit pseudo-psychology that is affecting kids.

The person I described? Her kid is a little brat sometimes and she has no idea why.

southsiderosie · 30-07-2011 06:33PM

Millicent wrote: »

I've been thinking about this more and I really do think a lot of the conventional parenting thinking is to blame.

I know someone who is using this school of thought on her kids that you reward the good behaviour and ignore the bad. That way, the thinking goes, you give attention to the good actions and not the bad.

I mean, what sort of bollocksology is that? If you do something bad in adult life, you can bet your ass that you'll receive some negative consequences. Steal something? Go to jail. Grope someone? Get a punch in the face.

I don't think it's necessarily the parents' fault that they buy into this bad advice. A lot of parenting "experts" are really perpetuating some batshit pseudo-psychology that is affecting kids.

The person I described? Her kid is a little brat sometimes and she has no idea why.

There was a very popular article in the NY Times a few years ago that advocated this approach (reward good behavior; ignore bad) for managing husbands. Apparently she learned it from watching animal trainers:

...I listened, rapt, as professional trainers explained how they taught dolphins to flip and elephants to paint. Eventually it hit me that the same techniques might work on that stubborn but lovable species, the American husband.

The central lesson I learned from exotic animal trainers is that I should reward behavior I like and ignore behavior I don't. After all, you don't get a sea lion to balance a ball on the end of its nose by nagging. The same goes for the American husband.

Back in Maine, I began thanking Scott if he threw one dirty shirt into the hamper. If he threw in two, I'd kiss him. Meanwhile, I would step over any soiled clothes on the floor without one sharp word, though I did sometimes kick them under the bed. But as he basked in my appreciation, the piles became smaller...

mickydoomsux · 30-07-2011 06:36PM

The problem today is that kids are told they have a problem like ADD or somesuch when they are in fact, just little ****s. Once again our society has to find someone or something else to blame besides the person just being an asshole.

Also, hit your kids. They'll learn manners quickly.

I was in the cinema this morning and for the entire film there was 5 or 6 guys around 15 or 16 years old sitting behind me throwing stuff at each other and talking. I'd never have done that at their age and neither would any of my friends because we had manners because when we screwed up, our parents slapped the **** out of us.

Rabies · 30-07-2011 06:36PM

amacca wrote: »

I refuse to vote if theres no atari jaguar option!

would you like one?

edit:
feck it.... added

Millicent · 30-07-2011 06:38PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

There was a very popular article in the NY Times a few years ago that advocated this approach (reward good behavior; ignore bad) for managing husbands. Apparently she learned it from watching animal trainers.

LOL! Still, I don't buy it for children. When they're not fully cooked, they need someone to teach them boundaries and the principles of right and wrong. Might work on a husband who knows well when he's being a lazy slob but is refusing to acknowledge it.

Also, how patronised must that husband have felt after reading that? Only funny if you're not the husband in question!

hatrickpatrick · 30-07-2011 06:41PM

Define "feral"?
Boards.ie will massacre me for this, but there are two sides to it. One is that there are SOME generally obnoxious kids out there....... The other is that there are a lot of completely intolerant, resentful, cranky muppets out there who will moan about absolutely anything a kid does. Boards is home to many of the latter, it would seem.

amacca · 30-07-2011 06:45PM

Millicent wrote: »

I mean, what sort of bollocksology is that? If you do something bad in adult life, you can bet your ass that you'll receive some negative consequences. Steal something? Go to jail.

not necessarily...

Kevin Duffy · 30-07-2011 06:46PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

There was a very popular article in the NY Times a few years ago that advocated this approach (reward good behavior; ignore bad) for managing husbands. Apparently she learned it from watching animal trainers:

..I listened, rapt, as professional trainers explained how they taught dolphins to flip and elephants to paint. Eventually it hit me that the same techniques might work on that stubborn but lovable species, the American husband.

The central lesson I learned from exotic animal trainers is that I should reward behavior I like and ignore behavior I don't. After all, you don't get a sea lion to balance a ball on the end of its nose by nagging. The same goes for the American husband.

Back in Maine, I began thanking Scott if he threw one dirty shirt into the hamper. If he threw in two, I'd kiss him. Meanwhile, I would step over any soiled clothes on the floor without one sharp word, though I did sometimes kick them under the bed. But as he basked in my appreciation, the piles became smaller...

I think all that proves is that Scott was imature and his mammy should have kicked his arsé a bit more instead of leaving it to his wife to raise him

amacca · 30-07-2011 06:54PM

Kevin Duffy wrote: »

I think all that proves is that Scott was imature and his mammy should have kicked his arsé a bit more instead of leaving it to his wife to raise him

or it could just prove that Scott likes sex

a reward his mother could never provide (hopefully)...at least personally

I can see the headlines now

the hooker method......listen mothers, forget putting cheerios in the toilet and getting your teenage son to aim at it to avoid splashy splashy

establish a line of credit with the local brothel when little scott does something good for change rent him a hooker....the more good he does the more hookers.....also no more pent up sexual frustration......hell be a dream to deal with

(disclaimer: make sure your little darling is adequately protected + no skanky hoes)

hdowney · 30-07-2011 07:01PM

the mother and i were discussing this point earlier. our local tidy towns committee planted lovely flowerbeds and put up hanging baskets all round the town to make the place nicer looking. good job.

then last nite a bunch of little gets decided to rip them up, throw them all over the road etc (see here: http://www.wicklownews.net/index.php/2011/07/vandals-target-tidy-towns/ )

people on facebook are asking anyone who knows who it was to come forward etc, that some parents must have noticed their spawn covered in muck, but the chances of anyone reporting these kids is pretty slim.

mother was saying in the old days you woulda been given a clip round the ear (be it by your own parent, or another adult if they found you first), frogmarched up to say sorry, be made replant the lot yourself, paying for replacement flowers out of your pocket money or whatever. you would have been punished for this.

but these days the children are treated like little darlings, like they can do no wrong, that they cannot be held responsible for their actions etc. biggest load of bollix i have ever heard. if i had done that i would be named, shamed and punished and would most deffo not have done it again. also i would have been highly unlikely to have done something like that in the first place as i was reared correctly. my mother knew where i was (most of the time), who my friends were etc. she taught me how to behave, how to treat both others and their property. she taught me about respect.

kids these days are not taught these things (now i know some kids are, before some parent swoops in and accuses me of generalizing). they are considered little angels, they are spoilt beyond all recongition. then parents wonder why their children are acting out. but also the first few times they try discipline, it doesn't work, because the child has been spoiled. so they give up. so the child grows up with this sense of they can do whatever they please.

URGH

pragmatic1 · 30-07-2011 07:02PM

Give the parents a fcukin kicking.

Whispered · 30-07-2011 07:20PM

Buceph wrote: »

You just sound like a grumpy fecker.

Nothing wrong with that though.

Could you have seen this coming? Estate agents have a tendency to advertise the age profile of an estate, so if there's a few families with young kids, they'll play that up to other families thinking of buying. Eventually you reach a critical mass of screaming hordes. Obviously they'll sell to older people, and people without kids as well and tell them whatever they want to hear, so you need to ask your questions sneakily.

I don't want kids kicking my plants around the garden or leaving their rubbish in my garden. I don't want them banging my door at least 3 times a day (keeping in mind I work nights, and they will keep knocking until I answer). I don't want them coming up to my sitting room window for a good nosey and causing my dogs to bark, then running away crying that the dogs were barking (:rolleyes:). I don't want them racing into the garden and cornering the dogs, when we bring them out. I want to be able to reverse out of the garden without having to walk back to check one of them is not hiding behind the pillar to race past at the last second for a laugh. If that makes me grumpy then just call me victor.

Only a few days ago our neighbours visitor was leaving, he had opened the car door and went back in to get something. A little kid had climbed into the car :eek: Could you imagine the uproar had he accidently drove off with him.

Same neighbour had a row one evening with another parent over her sending her kids down to the house for the night without checking. She had sent him down, and he couldn't go home because she then went out.

It's not an issue with the age profile of the estate, it's an issue with parents allowing their kids out all day without supervision. The noise of them playing on the road doesn't bother me, but the things which directly effect me do. I can't understand how parents can allow young kids off to do what they want. It's so dangerous as well as being hassle for other people.

MagicSean · 30-07-2011 07:23PM

Legally a child under twelve cannot commit a crime (except rape or murder). So parents should be legally accountable for their childs (Under 12) actions. There should also be a 9 p.m. curfew for children under 12.

There should be an 11 p.m. curfew for teenagers between 12 and 18. Parents should be held partly responsable for their teenagers actions and the teenager referred to the juvenile diversion program. A teenager should get a maximum of three chances on the Juvenile Diversion program before being prosecuted.

ASBOs need to be given out more frequently and a breach of an asbo should result in a fine for the parent as well as mandatory attendance at parenting classes.

Mike 1972 · 30-07-2011 07:28PM

Seanbeag1 wrote: »

There should be an 11 p.m. curfew for teenagers between 12 and 18..

You do realise a 17 year old can have completed their education and be working at that hour ?

MagicSean · 30-07-2011 07:34PM

Mike 1972 wrote: »

You do realise a 17 year old can have completed their education and be working at that hour ?

Not many places open at that hour in which a seventeen year old can work. The odd shop or restaurant maybe. Wouldn't be too hard to have a system of exemption from the curfew for work reasons.

carlybabe1 · 30-07-2011 07:59PM

Seanbeag1 wrote: »

Legally a child under twelve cannot commit a crime (except rape or murder). So parents should be legally accountable for their childs (Under 12) actions. There should also be a 9 p.m. curfew for children under 12.

There should be an 11 p.m. curfew for teenagers between 12 and 18. Parents should be held partly responsable for their teenagers actions and the teenager referred to the juvenile diversion program. A teenager should get a maximum of three chances on the Juvenile Diversion program before being prosecuted.

ASBOs need to be given out more frequently and a breach of an asbo should result in a fine for the parent as well as mandatory attendance at parenting classes.

:eek: my daughter is 12, heading for thirteen, shes in at 9.30 at the very latest, and thats on the hols. When she goes back to school it will revert back to 8.00pm, and in before dark in the winter, i dont care if thats 4.30 in the afternoon, she can have her friends in and they can listen to music in her room, (no boys :mad:)

I do agree with the curfew thing, unfortunately, the savages where i live do as much damage (if not more) during the day. Its hard to be a parent, ( a decent one at least), we regularly have to put up with teenage tantrums, sulks banging doors, and lets not forget, being called a stalker...I dont give a sh(t, I'll stalk ye to within an inch of your life if thats what i need to do. And when you're in the company of undesirables, its guilt by association, so i'll be right there every single time you look over your shoulder.

My parents had no problem reprimanding me in public or private, whether it was verbal, or a clip round the ear. I tell ye one thing, i learned from a very young age to repect peoples property, and ye didnt dare set foot in someone elses garden without an invite

MagicSean · 30-07-2011 08:44PM

carlybabe1 wrote: »

:eek: my daughter is 12, heading for thirteen, shes in at 9.30 at the very latest, and thats on the hols. When she goes back to school it will revert back to 8.00pm, and in before dark in the winter, i dont care if thats 4.30 in the afternoon, she can have her friends in and they can listen to music in her room, (no boys :mad:)

I do agree with the curfew thing, unfortunately, the savages where i live do as much damage (if not more) during the day. Its hard to be a parent, ( a decent one at least), we regularly have to put up with teenage tantrums, sulks banging doors, and lets not forget, being called a stalker...I dont give a sh(t, I'll stalk ye to within an inch of your life if thats what i need to do. And when you're in the company of undesirables, its guilt by association, so i'll be right there every single time you look over your shoulder.

My parents had no problem reprimanding me in public or private, whether it was verbal, or a clip round the ear. I tell ye one thing, i learned from a very young age to repect peoples property, and ye didnt dare set foot in someone elses garden without an invite

Too many parents try to be a friend to their kid at the expense of being a parent. Sometimes it's necessary to be the bad guy.

hatrickpatrick · 30-07-2011 08:51PM

Seanbeag1 wrote: »

There should also be a 9 p.m. curfew for children under 12.

There should be an 11 p.m. curfew for teenagers between 12 and 18.

Great, just what we need. A police state.
It's in threads like these that I can finally understand how things like industrial schools ever came to exist in this country. The bitterness and crankiness is still there with a lot of people, it seems.
Jesus Christ, this thread is depressing.

holystungun9 · 30-07-2011 08:54PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Define "feral"?
Boards.ie will massacre me for this, but there are two sides to it. One is that there are SOME generally obnoxious kids out there....... The other is that there are a lot of completely intolerant, resentful, cranky muppets out there who will moan about absolutely anything a kid does. Boards is home to many of the latter, it would seem.

t...t...t...tw....tw.....two....sides??????? hatrickpatrick (if that's even your real name), you are in AH, express your own opinion (sprinkle with some sexual innuendo* and racism* for good measure) and then state that everybody else's opinions are sh1te*. That's how it works round here.

...almost forgot!

Every estate should have 'parent police' doing a neighbourhood watch thing. They could have uniforms and handcuffs (*meow!!!) and should go round keeping an eye on the kids and their antics. Very quickly they will get a good picture of the kids' behaviour and then can call to parents to suss out how they respond to any problems their kids are causing. If you live in the estate you are obliged to respond to questions by these police, regardless of age, race, religion etc. (*but most problems will probably be from non-nationals).

*All the other posts and opinions are sh!te!:pac:

Jericho. · 30-07-2011 08:59PM

I would be very much in favour of conscription as a national policy. It would at least instill a sense of discipline and responsibility into the youth of our nation. It would be of benefit to the the rich kids who've never had to do a tap as much as it would be of use to the little scummers.

This however doesn't really do anything until they are 17/18.

MagicSean · 30-07-2011 09:04PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Great, just what we need. A police state.
It's in threads like these that I can finally understand how things like industrial schools ever came to exist in this country. The bitterness and crankiness is still there with a lot of people, it seems.
Jesus Christ, this thread is depressing.

Obviously you don't have an elderly relative who is victimised by kids to the point of having to move. Maybe you've never had your car trashed or windows smashed by lads having a laugh. Perhaps your kid hasn't gotten a hiding for no reason other than the young lads were bored. I've seen all this happen. Places destroyed. People terrorised. Property stolen and vandalised. The problem is extrememly bad.

A curfew on kids is far from a police state. By that logic a parent who grounds their kid is a prison warden.

hatrickpatrick · 30-07-2011 09:05PM

holystungun9 wrote: »

t...t...t...tw....tw.....two....sides??????? hatrickpatrick (if that's even your real name), you are in AH, express your own opinion (sprinkle with some sexual innuendo* and racism* for good measure) and then state that everybody else's opinions are sh1te*. That's how it works round here.

No seriously.
The number of threads b!tching about kids is quite frankly unbelievable on this website. Shockingly so, in fact. I genuinely find it quite hard to believe that so many people could be so incredibly uptight, and furthermore that so many would advocate living in a police state where all kids are tarred with the same brush and there are mandatory curfews etc.

Don't know about you, but I'd rather live in a free country where the government keeps its nose out of people's lives.

Teyla Emmagan · 30-07-2011 09:25PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

No seriously.
The number of threads b!tching about kids is quite frankly unbelievable on this website. Shockingly so, in fact. I genuinely find it quite hard to believe that so many people could be so incredibly uptight, and furthermore that so many would advocate living in a police state where all kids are tarred with the same brush and there are mandatory curfews etc.

Don't know about you, but I'd rather live in a free country where the government keeps its nose out of people's lives.

People aren't uptight, or cranky. They are simply sick and tired of having to put up with rotten behaviour from other people's badly raised children. A gang of kids screaming and being abusive can be a nightmare for anyone to have to deal with. Blaiming the person who gets upset for not being 'tolerant' enough is rubbish.

languagenerd · 30-07-2011 09:42PM

I hate the "they're just kids" or "kids will be kids" excuses!

I got the ferry back to Ireland from France a while ago and there were so many brats on board, it was unbelieveable. Running up and down the boat, shouting at their parents, fighting with each other, hanging out of (almost pulling down) speaker stacks in the bar, jumping onstage during the (admittedly awful) show... I wouldn't have been allowed act like that as a child! If we were out anywhere, I'd have to sit with my parents or at least somewhere where they could see me, and I'd never have been allowed run around banging into people and knocking things over.

Yet if anyone said anything to the parents, they answered "They're just kids, what do you expect?". And that is exactly why many of these kids will grow up into scumbags harrassing people on the street/public transport :mad:

I'm only 19, so it's not that long ago since I was a child either!

Whispered · 30-07-2011 10:04PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Don't know about you, but I'd rather live in a free country where the government keeps its nose out of people's lives.

I don't know about you but I'd like to live in a country where the government keeps their nose out of peoples lives and parents take responsibility for their kids behaviour. Unfortunately, a lot of the time it's a case of the kids are not bothering the parents when they're off bothering the neighbours, so the parents don't care.

Where I used to live there was a lady with an illness which made it difficult for her to walk, and she had very poor eyesight. (I think it was polio but I'm not sure). From the time she moved in she was seen as an easy target and was hassled by a certain group of kids, all innocent stuff. But as they got older it got more and more sinister until eventually they were shoving dead rodents through her letter box, setting up obstacles in her garden and lighting small fires under her windows. Eventually her husband snapped and kicked the crap out of one of the kids (who at this stage were in their mid teens, about 17 I'd say). He had spoken to the parents, he had spoken to the guards, nothing worked. The man who did it was a very very quiet man and it's a shame he was driven to such lengths. This was in a quiet little town.

carlybabe1 · 30-07-2011 10:09PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

No seriously.
The number of threads b!tching about kids is quite frankly unbelievable on this website. Shockingly so, in fact. I genuinely find it quite hard to believe that so many people could be so incredibly uptight, and furthermore that so many would advocate living in a police state where all kids are tarred with the same brush and there are mandatory curfews etc.

Don't know about you, but I'd rather live in a free country where the government keeps its nose out of people's lives.

Ahhh indeed, im interested to know if you have kids, cause Ive got two and I understand completely the gripes in this thread.
If you do have kids, are you one of these wonderful parents who, when your child does something wrong, give out the standard, responsibility shrugging "ah they're only kids for gods sake, sure we all done it when we were young", or perhaps you're more of a "it wasnt my (insert name here), he/she wouldnt do somethin like that".

I love my kids, and regardless of how thier friends are raised, I try to instill in my children respect for adults/other peoples property and their friends. I do that because I want them to be the best people they can be, to be stable and functioning, to want better for themselves, and to have respect for themselves. Im not blinded by thier good behaviour indoors all the time, I know they can have lapses in judgement under certain circumstances, as can other kids, but I reprimand my kids for that. The "feral" kids are the ones whose parents are
a) to lazy to monitor what thier kids are doing
b) dont give a sh(te what they are doing as long as thier not indoors wrecking said parents head OR
c) selfishly want to be the childs "friend" because it makes them feel better, regardless of the fact that kids need a parent as a peer,someone to give them guidance and take the lead when things go pearshaped for them, not another friend.

It p(sses me off when I hear someone sh(ting on about cranky intolerable adults, imo they are the parents whose children are the ones causing the trouble. If they were on the recieving end of the vandalism, or thier kids on the recieving end of the hiding, you can bet thier attitude would change :mad::mad:

rant over

*shuffles off to fill whiskey glass*

Feral children and their do-nothing parents

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