I feel like Irish society has completly exaggerated the recession.

Downlinz · 24-07-2011 03:43PM #1

Reminds me a bit of that south park global warming episode, a complete over-reaction to what is a real situation and admittedly a nuisance but far from life changing or warranting of the reaction given.

We're still a first world country, we still have one of the highest minimum wages in the world and while the situation has declined I can honestly say no other country in the world would respond to it with the furore of hate directed at politicians/bankers, the mass despair of the public or rampant emigration that Ireland has. Amazing how in some peoples minds a mere 9% unemployment swing changes their mood from "partying in the good times" to "emigrate, no future in this country".

But then I guess this will and always has been a country that revels in misery and will work with what it can get?

landsleaving · 24-07-2011 03:46PM

Come back to us when you've lost your job. Thanks.

Naikon · 24-07-2011 03:47PM

landsleaving wrote: »

Come back to us when you've lost your job. Thanks.

Jobs come and go. Now losing your house or assets is another matter entirely...

youtube! · 24-07-2011 03:48PM

9% :rolleyes:

ilovesleep · 24-07-2011 03:48PM

Wait until january 2012 after decembers budget. You won't be so smug then.

Cuts and tax hikes are going to happen. Which means less money to spend in the local economy which will lead to higher unemployment. We'll be chasing our tails in circles.

Trhiggy83 · 24-07-2011 03:51PM

you clearly still have a job, take off your blinkers

CatFromHue · 24-07-2011 03:51PM

i have a job but would very much like to change it but ive had no luck over the last year. im in effect an unemployed employed person!

then there is the cuts that have been applied to peoples wages. they dont affect me to much as i earn less than 28,000. i do know these cuts have affected my family alot.

then there is the reduced spending by people which has affected the family business.

plus you know the whole bail out thing isnt too good

ballsymchugh · 24-07-2011 03:51PM

it's not just about losing a job. it's seeing more deductions from your pay packet, or if your job is dependent on other people spending money then things just get quieter.

TiGeR KiNgS · 24-07-2011 03:51PM

Downlinz wrote: »

Reminds me a bit of that south park global warming episode, a complete over-reaction to what is a real situation and admittedly a nuisance but far from life changing or warranting of the reaction given.

We're still a first world country, we still have one of the highest minimum wages in the world and while the situation has declined I can honestly say no other country in the world would respond to it with the furore of hate directed at politicians/bankers, the mass despair of the public or rampant emigration that Ireland has. Amazing how in some peoples minds a mere 9% unemployment swing changes their mood from "partying in the good times" to "emigrate, no future in this country".

But then I guess this will and always has been a country that revels in misery and will work with what it can get?

You clearly have no understanding of the situation, rendering your argument null and void.
QED

westies4ever · 24-07-2011 03:51PM

Downlinz wrote: »

mere 9% unemployment

??????????? last i heard it was 14.8%?? just because you're not suffering doesnt mean the rest of us arent!!!!

Einhard · 24-07-2011 03:52PM

Downlinz wrote: »

Reminds me a bit of that south park global warming episode, a complete over-reaction to what is a real situation and admittedly a nuisance but far from life changing or warranting of the reaction given.

People have lost their jobs, careers, homes, families, and even taken their own lives. That sounds pretty life changing to me.

we still have one of the highest minimum wages in the worl

And the high prices which go with it. You make it sound like Irish wages are spent against South East Asian prices!

and while the situation has declined I can honestly say no other country in the world would respond to it with the furore of hate directed at politicians/bankers,

Right... so obviously the whole furore in Spain, Greece, Portugal has entirely passed you by then?

the mass despair of the public or rampant emigration that Ireland has.

I don't think there's mass despair in general, more mass despair at the state of the economy, which isn't unwarranted.

Amazing how in some peoples minds a mere 9% unemployment swing changes their mood from "partying in the good times" to "emigrate, no future in this country".

A mere 9%?? Seriously...

krudler · 24-07-2011 03:53PM

Its depends tbh, people are genuinely struggling and then you have people who think "recessionary times" means going out only 1 night a week and, the poor things, taking one not two holidays a year is hardship. I was out of work ill for about 9 months and was on 800 quid a month give or take from the social welfare, just lived within my means, still had rent, esb, car payments, all my other bills to be paid, just stopped with some of the luxuries, its easily done in most cases.
Lack of personal accountability wrecks my head these days, I get people all the time who run up massive phone bills then complain they cant afford it because they lost their job or took a paycut, err stop using your fcuking phone so much then?

TheBegotten · 24-07-2011 03:53PM

It's not like that. During the Celtic Tiger even the most lazy, unskilled of workers could look foward to a good wage and an almost garuanteed mortgage to get a good home. Now that same person is unemployable in Ireland as well as most of the rest of the world without re-training.

Downlinz · 24-07-2011 03:53PM

If you lost your home thats down to taking out an unsustainable mortgage due to overconfidence in your employment security. This can happen at any though the fault here is just that, the recession is used as a convenient excuse by most for foolish transactions.

If you lost your job, well less than 1 in 10 could even claim to be in that situation because of the recession in a country with 86% employment. A lot of those were in construction which was an industry in an understood temporary boom period prior to this, the housing market was going to deflate with or without a recession that was inevitable. Even being generous and attributing each and every one of these job losses to the recession that still leaves 90% of the country unaffected and in the same state of employment they were previous to the recession.

Agricola · 24-07-2011 03:53PM

Downlinz wrote: »

Reminds me a bit of that south park global warming episode, a complete over-reaction to what is a real situation and admittedly a nuisance but far from life changing or warranting of the reaction given.

We're still a first world country, we still have one of the highest minimum wages in the world and while the situation has declined I can honestly say no other country in the world would respond to it with the furore of hate directed at politicians/bankers, the mass despair of the public or rampant emigration that Ireland has. Amazing how in some peoples minds a mere 9% unemployment swing changes their mood from "partying in the good times" to "emigrate, no future in this country".

But then I guess this will and always has been a country that revels in misery and will work with what it can get?

Yeah right buddy! I couldnt afford to get a new car last January and I now have to make do with one holiday a year from now on. This recession bites.

Donal Og O Baelach · 24-07-2011 03:54PM

I know people who could barely put food on the table if they suffered another pay cut, driving around today in 2011 cars.
Look at all the '09, '10 & 11 cars on the road - there is still plenty money around.

Downlinz · 24-07-2011 03:55PM

Unemployment rate in Ireland in 2006 was 5%, it is currently 14%. Thats a 9% swing

krudler · 24-07-2011 03:56PM

Donal Og O Baelach wrote: »

I know people who could barely put food on the table if they suffered another pay cut, driving around today in 2011 cars.
Look at all the '09, '10 & 11 cars on the road - there is still plenty moneydebt around.

fyp

westies4ever · 24-07-2011 03:57PM

Downlinz wrote: »

If you lost your home thats down to taking out an unsustainable mortgage due to overconfidence in your employment security. This can happen at any though the fault here is just that, the recession is used as a convenient excuse by most for foolish transactions.

If you lost your job, well less than 1 in 10 could even claim to be in that situation because of the recession in a country with 86% employment. A lot of those were in construction which was an industry in an understood temporary boom period prior to this, the housing market was going to deflate with or without a recession that was inevitable. Even being generous and attributing each and every one of these job losses to the recession that still leaves 90% of the country unaffected and in the same state of employment they were previous to the recession.

your logic is terminally flawed!!!!!!!! the unemployment rate isnt based on the whole population of the country - just the 'employable' people. It excludes those unable to work such as children, the elderly etc. For every unemployed person, think of the people dependant on that person.

It alos doesnt include the people such as the self employed not entitled to welfare. The figure equates to a lot more than '1 in 10'.

mikemac · 24-07-2011 03:57PM

westies4ever wrote: »

??????????? last i heard it was 14.8%?? just because you're not suffering doesnt mean the rest of us arent!!!!

You misread it
The OP didn't state 9% unemployment, just a swing of 9%

Even during the boom there were over 100,000 unemployed so add the swing and you've todays figure

Downlinz · 24-07-2011 03:59PM

Donal Og O Baelach wrote: »

I know people who could barely put food on the table if they suffered another pay cut, driving around today in 2011 cars.
Look at all the '09, '10 & 11 cars on the road - there is still plenty money around.

Of course there is, all I'm hearing from all these sob stories is people completely incapable of managing their finances. Am I supposed to feel sympathy for people who took out unsustainable mortgages or those who were trying to put kids through college without funds set aside?

The situation in Greece is far worse than it is here, Portugal is comparable and the negativity in their media and public is virtually non-existant compared to what we have to put up with here, as is their emigration figures. Again I'm not saying this isn't a regrettable situation, I'm saying its not an end of the world situation, its not a topic of such underlying significance we need to be discussing it in our media on a daily basis or attributing our life decisions around it.

Darkginger · 24-07-2011 03:59PM

Maybe a 'mere' 9% over all, but some parts of the country are worse than others - in our rural community, there are simply no jobs available, new developments are being reposessed by the banks before they're even finished, the pubs are deserted apart from tourists, and those on social welfare are trying to feed themselves, pay their mortgages (unless renting, which I wish we were, cos then we might get some help!), fuel their cars and pay their household bills on €300 per week per couple. Earning 'less than €28,000'?? I wish!

NWPat · 24-07-2011 03:59PM

A recession can not be exaggerated. It is a statement of fact, the economy is always in one of three states; growing, stagnant or in recession. The effects of recession are generaly not good. I find it hard to believe that you do not know of anyone who has been adverseley effected by the present crisis.

Einhard · 24-07-2011 04:02PM

Downlinz wrote: »

If you lost your home thats down to taking out an unsustainable mortgage due to overconfidence in your employment security. This can happen at any though the fault here is just that, the recession is used as a convenient excuse by most for foolish transactions.

The transactions have only come back to bite though in because of the recession. Had we not been hit by tis financial crisis, then people would still be able to afford their inflated lifesyles. So, the recession is directly impacting on such people.

If you lost your job, well less than 1 in 10 could even claim to be in that situation because of the recession in a country with 86% employment. A lot of those were in construction which was an industry in an understood temporary boom period prior to this, the housing market was going to deflate with or without a recession that was inevitable. Even being generous and attributing each and every one of these job losses to the recession that still leaves 90% of the country unaffected and in the same state of employment they were previous to the recession.

LOL are you for real? So, unless you're made redundant, you're on the same pay and conditions as previously? FFS, get real fella! Many of my friends still have their jobs, but have been made temporary, or put on shift work, and ALL have had their wages reduced. On top of which, the tax burden has increased considerably.

You also, when it suits your narrative, conveniently ignore the tens of thousands who have emigrated, whose numbers would bring the unemployment rate above 20%.

westies4ever · 24-07-2011 04:02PM

mikemac wrote: »

You misread it
The OP didn't state 9% unemployment, just a swing of 9%

Even during the boom there were over 100,000 unemployed so add the swing and you've todays figure

my bad. the blood boiling in my veins must have affected my eyesight.

Einhard · 24-07-2011 04:03PM

Downlinz wrote: »

Of course there is, all I'm hearing from all these sob stories is people completely incapable of managing their finances. Am I supposed to feel sympathy for people who took out unsustainable mortgages or those who were trying to put kids through college without funds set aside?

No, of course you don't have to feel sympathy, but that's not the point. You claimed the recession isn't having that big an impact, and yet when pointed to a sector of society on whom it's impacting massively, you shift the goalposts entirely.

Steodonn · 24-07-2011 04:04PM

Its depends tbh, people are genuinely struggling and then you have people who think "recessionary times" means going out only 1 night a week and, the poor things, taking one not two holidays a year is hardship

Recessionary times they sound like Celtic tiger times to be. Had a foreign holiday in 2008 one in Ireland in 2009 and none this year or last. Two hoildays I could only dream off even at the height of the boom

Downlinz · 24-07-2011 04:05PM

Einhard wrote: »

The transactions have only come back to bite though in because of the recession. Had we not been hit by tis financial crisis, then people would still be able to afford their inflated lifesyles. So, the recession is directly impacting on such people.

LOL are you for real? So, unless you're made redundant, you're on the same pay and conditions as previously? FFS, get real fella! Many of my friends still have their jobs, but have been made temporary, or put on shift work, and ALL have had their wages reduced. On top of which, the tax burden has increased considerably.

You also, when it suits your narrative, conveniently ignore the tens of thousands who have emigrated, whose numbers would bring the unemployment rate above 20%.

Considering our population is a net-rise in the last census it'd be also discarding young people entering the workforce and immigration. I don't have total employment figures but considering our population is rising in general I would assume the number of people in employment isn't in decline.

NWPat · 24-07-2011 04:07PM

Downlinz wrote: »

Of course there is, all I'm hearing from all these sob stories is people completely incapable of managing their finances. Am I supposed to feel sympathy for people who took out unsustainable mortgages or those who were trying to put kids through college without funds set aside?

The situation in Greece is far worse than it is here, Portugal is comparable and the negativity in their media and public is virtually non-existant compared to what we have to put up with here, as is their emigration figures. Again I'm not saying this isn't a regrettable situation, I'm saying its not an end of the world situation, its not a topic of such underlying significance we need to be discussing it in our media on a daily basis or attributing our life decisions around it.

Assim você pode falar o português e ler os papéis diários? Não, eu pensei não!

Einhard · 24-07-2011 04:09PM

Downlinz wrote: »

Considering our population is a net-rise in the last census it'd be also discarding young people entering the workforce and immigration. I don't have total employment figures but considering our population is rising in general I would assume the number of people in employment isn't in decline.

The rise in the last census was, for the most part, attributable to natural increase. Considering that the census is held every five years, and 5 year old kids generally don't enter the workforce, you're not actually discarding anything...

Also, I do have the figures:

In April 2005, there were 2,034.9 people emplyed in Ireland. April 2006 saw a rise to 2,113.9, followed by a slight dip the following year to 2,112.8. The fall accelerated dramatically in the following two years, dropping to 1,938.5 in 2009, and 1,859.1 in 2010. I can only assume that the decline has not been reversed in the meantime...

(http://www.cso.ie/statistics/empandunempilo.htm)

So, within 4 years, the numbers employed in this country dropped by almost 300k, at a time when tens of thousands were emigrating and, as you pointed out yourself, there was a rise in the numbe rof people in the country. So, wven by your own standards, you're wrong.

westies4ever · 24-07-2011 04:09PM

Downlinz wrote: »

assume

TMOAFU'S

I feel like Irish society has completly exaggerated the recession.

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