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Cloynes Report, Christianity, etc etc

123578

Comments

  • #122
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    strobe wrote: »
    What are you asking me for? I'm no law talking guy.

    So you don't understand the golden principle of justice, that you are innocent until proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt in a court of law ?


  • #123
    zeris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 401 ✭✭zeris


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    So let me get this right, in your opinion, the crux of your point is that being a Catholic is equivalent to being a Nazi ?

    No. I was responding to your comment on all Germans being Nazi's. You should have been able to tell this by the way I quoted your comment.

    I can't tell if you're an idiot, a troll or you have a persecution complex.


  • #124
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    Happyman42 wrote: »
    Successive popes for starters. Then any number after that.

    Proof ? (BTW accusations and assumptions are not proof)


  • #125
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    zeris wrote: »
    No. I was responding to your comment on all Germans being Nazi's. You should have been able to tell this by the way I quoted your comment.

    Comment ? It was a question.
    zeris wrote: »
    I can't tell if you're an idiot, a troll or you have a persecution complex.

    False delima I'm afraid. Is ad homiem a valid argument ?


  • #126
    strobe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    So you don't understand the golden principle of justice, that you are innocent until proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt in a court of law ?

    Nah, explain it to me.


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  • #127
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    Which hierarchy are guilty of covering up Child abuse ? What % ?
    You may have forgotten this post:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=73298206&postcount=87

    from around an hour ago.


  • #128
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    strobe wrote: »
    Nah, explain it to me.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presumption_of_innocence


  • #129
    Happyman42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,066 ✭✭✭✭Happyman42


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    Proof ? (BTW accusations and assumptions are not proof)

    The present pope is guilty of hiding evidence, John Paul 2 and 1 and Pope Paul ? knew that abuse was taking place by dint of numerous reports and the moving around of paedophiles ....that is collusion with criminals.

    When you take your head out of the sand then I might engage further with you...until then I'm out.


  • #130
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    robindch wrote: »
    You may have forgotten this post:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=73298206&postcount=87

    from around an hour ago.

    Hierarchy is a much broader term than bishops.


  • #131
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    Happyman42 wrote: »
    The present pope is guilty of hiding evidence, John Paul 2 and 1 and Pope Paul ? knew that abuse was taking place by dint of numerous reports and the moving around of paedophiles ....that is collusion with criminals.

    When you take your head out of the sand then I might engage further with you...until then I'm out.

    I asked for Proof (BTW accusations and assumptions are not proof)
    I'd be happy to see them all thrown in gaol if they were proven guilty.


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  • #132
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    Hierarchy is a much broader term than bishops.
    Are you saying that the bishops weren't responsible for the priests under them, or simply didn't know whey they had to keep moving certain priests around all the time?

    Weird.


  • #133
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    happyman42 wrote:
    The present pope is guilty of hiding evidence [...]
    I asked for Proof
    You may have forgotten this post:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=73298555&postcount=103

    from around an hour ago.


  • #134
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    robindch wrote: »
    Are you saying that the bishops weren't responsible for the priests under them, or simply didn't know whey they had to keep moving certain priests around all the time?

    Weird.

    Where have I said that ?


  • #135
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    robindch wrote: »
    You may have forgotten this post:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=73298555&postcount=103

    from around an hour ago.

    If there is proof, why has the state not prosecuted them ?


  • #136
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    If there is proof, why has the state not prosecuted them ?
    Because Ratzinger is head of a (questionably legitimate) state. And by international convention, heads of state are not arrested when on foreign travel.

    And despite his pious talk about the evils of what he calls "moral relativism", I don't believe he feels his actions of 30 years ago are sufficient cause for (a) him to need to hand himself over to the German police, or for (b) him to launch a prosecution against himself in the Vatican.


  • #137
    zeris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 401 ✭✭zeris


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    Comment ? It was a question.

    Indeed. :rolleyes:
    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    False delima I'm afraid. Is ad homiem a valid argument ?

    In response to accusing me of calling you a Nazi? Wow!


  • #138
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    zeris wrote: »
    Indeed. :rolleyes:



    In response to accusing me of calling you a Nazi? Wow!

    Where did I accuse you of that ?


  • #139
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    robindch wrote: »
    And by international convention, heads of state are not arrested when on foreign travel.

    Where did you hear that bull ?


  • #140
    zeris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 401 ✭✭zeris


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    Where did I accuse you of that ?

    You are a practicing Catholic?


  • #141
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    zeris wrote: »
    You are a practicing Catholic?

    You need to look back carefully, you'll find I was asking a question.


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  • #142
    zeris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 401 ✭✭zeris


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    You need to look back carefully, you'll find I was asking a question.

    Answer the question. Are you a practicing Catholic?


  • #143
    Byron85
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭Byron85


    Here's a choice quote I grabbed off Twitter in relation to the Cloynes Report.

    "I've no issue giving the Church more money to help with that compensation".

    With members like that, the Church can feel secure in its position. Rest assured, despite their diminishing numbers, the Church will remain a law unto itself.


  • #144
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    So let me get this right, in your opinion, the crux of your point is that being a Catholic is equivalent to being a Nazi ?
    zeris wrote: »
    No. I was responding to your comment on all Germans being Nazi's. You should have been able to tell this by the way I quoted your comment.
    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    Comment ? It was a question.
    zeris wrote: »
    I can't tell if you're an idiot, a troll or you have a persecution complex.
    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    False delima I'm afraid. Is ad homiem a valid argument ?
    zeris wrote: »
    Indeed. :rolleyes:

    In response to accusing me of calling you a Nazi? Wow!
    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    Where did I accuse you of that ?
    zeris wrote: »
    You are a practicing Catholic?
    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    You need to look back carefully, you'll find I was asking a question.
    zeris wrote: »
    Answer the question. Are you a practicing Catholic?

    What has my religion or lack of got to do with this ?

    Again, can you clearly point out where I accused you of calling me a Nazi ?

    I asked "let me get this right, in your opinion, the crux of your point is that being a Catholic is equivalent to being a Nazi ?" - Hint that's a question, you got that the first time, and you answered it.


  • #145
    zeris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 401 ✭✭zeris


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    What has my religion or lack of got to do with this ?

    Again, can you clearly point out where I accused you of calling me a Nazi ?

    I asked "let me get this right, in your opinion, the crux of your point is that being a Catholic is equivalent to being a Nazi ?" - Hint that's a question, you got that the first time, and you answered it.

    Because when you claim I gave the rough equivalence of "being a Catholic is equivalent to being a Nazi ?" and you are a catholic then are you are not accusing me of calling you a Nazi. Stop playing Peter and answer the question. Are you a catholic?

    Besides, this is all a game for you to distract from the title of the thread and I am a fool for playing your troll games for which to everyone else I apologise.


  • #146
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    zeris wrote: »
    Because when you claim I gave the rough equivalence of "being a Catholic is equivalent to being a Nazi ?" and you are a catholic then are you are not accusing me of calling you a Nazi. Stop playing Peter and answer the question. Are you a catholic?

    Besides, this is all a game for you to distract from the title of the thread and I am a fool for playing your troll games for which to everyone else I apologise.

    I think i've proved my point about who's playing the games and I'll leave you to the mods.


  • #147
    Turtwig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    So you don't understand the golden principle of justice, that you are innocent until proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt in a court of law ?

    You do realise that no Catholic actually believes that?:D


  • #148
    Bob Cratchet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 401 ✭✭Bob Cratchet


    Malty_T wrote: »
    You do realise that no Catholic actually believes that?:D

    Can you explain ?


  • #149
    axer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,517 ✭✭✭axer


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    I asked "let me get this right, in your opinion, the crux of your point is that being a Catholic is equivalent to being a Nazi ?" - Hint that's a question, you got that the first time, and you answered it.
    I believe this has been pointed out to you already but I will humour you.

    The point being made that continued support of the catholic church after so much badness has been revealed is like continuing to support the Nazi's after finding out that they are doing bad things.

    i.e. supposedly good people continuing to support an organisation that has been proven to be bad from top to bottom like the RCC.
    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    How can you stil be an Irish citizen when Ireland inc. is rotten to the core ?
    Ireland is not an organisation. Do you mean the Irish government? If yes then I can say that the Irish government is elected by the people and only have a max term of 5 years. The RCC's leader who has shown himself as being a very immoral person and what I would consider a criminal will remain in his position until he dies. Then the new pope/CEO will be selected by a small number of people who have seemingly are ok with criminal behaviour. That is a massive difference when it comes to accountability.
    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    How can you stil bank with Irish banks when they are rotten to the core ?
    When it comes to banks I dont have a choice unfortunately.


  • #150
    Morgans
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,438 ✭✭✭Morgans


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    So you don't understand the golden principle of justice, that you are innocent until proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt in a court of law ?

    What happens if you dont recognise state law? Whose law are you talking about here?

    Those who continue to throw stones at those with rightful abhorrance of the church's role in Irish abuse scandals over the past 50 years are part of the problem.

    Obfuscating the facts is a defence. This includes you, Bob Crachet.


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  • #151
    smokingman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭smokingman


    Bob Cratchet wrote: »
    I for one would be delighted to see any guilty hierarchy and those who knowingly facilitated them convicted and thrown in gaol.

    I think what Bobby means here is that he thinks the Pope should be locked up.
    I, for one, would agree with him here.


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