Five held in €1m welfare fraud probe

sollar · 14-07-2011 08:47PM

Its mind boggling that we are paying 2/3 of our revenues on social welfare and we don't even have a basic system of photo id for claimants to prevent this type of fraud.

People were upset for Joan Burton when she got the social welfare brief... as if it was a nothing job - Its a massive job and i hope she takes it very very seriously.

tayto lover · 14-07-2011 08:52PM

Again drop them home to their own country from 50,000 feet .

Nodin · 14-07-2011 08:54PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Again drop them home to their own country from 50,000 feet .

...which would be Ireland.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0714/welfare.html#audio

January · 14-07-2011 09:02PM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I'm a civil liberties type but I would support finger printing for everyone collecting a welfare payment and not in the SW offices in the Post Office where everyone should collect their payments weekly.

This would include all payments (childrens allowance as well) which should be collected weekly too - if you're not there every week then you're considered absent from the state and cut off.

Don't like it? GTFO then.

You do realise that Child Benefit (not childrens allowance... that was years ago) is paid to EVERYONE with children in the state, not just social welfare recipients... how do you propose people who work 9-5 jobs to make it to the post office to collect their payment every week?

KINGVictor · 14-07-2011 09:55PM

Im Only 71Kg wrote: »

€5'r say's they're foreign naitonals!

Classic case of putting one's foot in the mouth....just admit it that is what you wished was the case.

KINGVictor · 14-07-2011 10:00PM

beagle001 wrote: »

Nigerian nationals is what a member of an Garda Siochaina told me,they got busted apparently applying for so many back to school allowances and welfare sniffed a fraud hence they were caught.

What do you do? I will be very interested why a police officer would offer such vital and confidential information to you ..thats all.

K-9 · 14-07-2011 10:53PM

beagle001 wrote: »

Nigerian nationals is what a member of an Garda Siochaina told me,they got busted apparently applying for so many back to school allowances and welfare sniffed a fraud hence they were caught.

I believe you beagle001, you great anonymous internet poster you, looks like your Garda informant was misinformed or was that what you wanted to hear?

Sizzler · 14-07-2011 10:54PM

TBH this is a great headline but its the stuff that you DON'T hear or read about that really worries me :eek::mad:

The system is obviously p*** poor if 5 people can exploit it to this degree, the exposure is simply mind boggling and makes a mockery of the so called "progress" that our politicians were so quick to brag about after their sugar daddy's were in town today :rolleyes:

With figures this week stating half of the population now claiming welfare in some form, even a fraud rate of 1% (which is entirely believable and optimistic) this would mean we have 22,000 people fraudulenty claiming....do the maths :eek::mad:

Closing down A&E units all over the country and cutting vital services across the board but yet they cant even manage their biggest expenditure item properly. Burton has a MASSIVE staff, get 30% of them working on fraud detection and interviewing and see what does as a starter for ten.

Absurdum · 14-07-2011 11:02PM

arrested, charged and convicted in a day; that's efficiency for you

WindSock · 14-07-2011 11:04PM

Omg, why do people do this!!?

Eh, because they ****ing can, all too easily. That's the problem. They know the system better than anyone.

GIve them jobs in the Citizens Advice Bureau.

deco nate · 14-07-2011 11:27PM

WindSock wrote: »

Omg, why do people do this!!?

Eh, because they ****ing can, all too easily. That's the problem. They know the system better than anyone.

GIve them jobs in the Citizens Advice Bureau.

em,cos its easy money:o
some people dont give a flyin f... bout the rest of us that have to pay for them.
its like..ah sure,its like stealing for a shop...no one gets hurt/has to pay for it mindsay muppets should be made work off what they owe.in their own time,plus no wellfare during that time.
that way it wont cost us more more money.fcuk em

aligator_am · 14-07-2011 11:37PM

Has it been confirmed yet which PC squad endorsed group was scamming the system?

brian ireland · 14-07-2011 11:37PM

RachaelVO wrote: »

How they can get away with that in this day and age is a wonder, someone in the SW office should be loosing their jobs!

Thought the title said five held in €1m welfare fraud probe. Does that not mean they where caught??

aligator_am · 14-07-2011 11:56PM

In fairness, I started a thread about a year ago suggesting that all dole recipients and incoming non nationals shoud be fingerprinted and retinal scanned but got ripped apart in it

Seems times may have changed.

I would also definately include travellers in this, we'll see how it goes.

tweedledee · 15-07-2011 12:06AM

http://www.sbpost.ie/news/ireland/numbers-are-up-for-pps-system-56980.html

Almost 8 MILLION PPS numbers issued in a country with less than FIVE million inhabitants!!!!!!!!!!!
What The Fcuk???????????????
Is anybody in Social Protection offices keeping track of this????????This country is a fecking joke!!!Seriously,is it any wonder there are sooooo many Welfare tourists here when the GOVERNMENT make it soooo bloody easy to scam the ehh "system"????What SYSTEM??????Its a free for all.
Back in 2009 they were thinking about bringing in Biometric,photo ID but as usual in Legoland it didn't happen.They are still "planning"it!!!!!!
I really don't blame the criminals and fraudsters,its the Government who make it soooo damn easy and do absolutely nothing to stop it.So what they nabbed FIVE people,FIVE people,there are 100's of thousands of fraudulant claims out there.

KINGVictor · 15-07-2011 12:08AM

aligator_am wrote: »

Has it been confirmed yet which PC squad endorsed group was scamming the system?

Are you just posting that for the shock value or you are been sarcastic. I suspect both..

In my opinion it doesnt matter which section of the society these criminals belong to. They should be punished and I hope it is the beginning of exposing other criminals who deliberately engage in such activities...

dvpower · 15-07-2011 12:11AM

joseph brand wrote: »

I was thinking of Travellers.

Is it true, btw, that travellers can claim SW in multiple places, between Ireland and the UK? Or is this just bullcrap?

They can claim where they live, one place at a time.
Only cloned travellers can make multiple claims

aligator_am · 15-07-2011 12:14AM

KINGVictor wrote: »

Are you just posting that for the shock value or you are been sarcastic. I suspect both..

In my opinion it doesnt matter which section of the society these criminals belong to. They should be punished and I hope it is the beginning of exposing other criminals who deliberately engage in such activities...

No, I posted it as there is a PC squad who resolutely defend all minorities, even if it's blatant that one of them has done wrong.

I've found however (through prior experience) that if it pans out the perpertrator was either traveller or non national that they essentially deserve special treatment.

Maybe I've misunderstood the situation?

tweedledee · 15-07-2011 12:17AM

Aligator EVERYBODY who is in this country holding an Irish passport or wanting one should face Biometric scanning.
Its common practice in most democratic nations and even in some not so democratic nations.
PPS application should include Biometric scan.
Ya see generally the Irish are a very naive bunch,Irish people like to think they are world weary and street smart,but they arn't really,very gullible especially the Government.
There are so many systems in place and regulations enforced in most other modern countries that just don't exist here.
Ireland always seems to be decades behind when it comes to regulations,rules,law enforcement and practices etc etc.
I dont know what it is,personally I think its laziness,this laissez faire attitude that most Irish people have has ruined this country in more ways than one.
We need to stop putting everything off until tomorrow because Ireland has become a European joke,that really isn't funny anymore.:mad:

Nijmegen · 15-07-2011 12:18AM

When Prime Time looked at the issue of social welfare fraud the agreed consensus - from politicians now in government and the secretary general of the department of social protection - was that it costs the state between 10-15% of all welfare, €2-3 billion a year at the time.

How much are they looking to cut this year...?

tweedledee · 15-07-2011 12:23AM

Welfare fraud takes an effort to combat.They gota get off their behinds and actually do someting.(Government).
Cutting welfare is much,much easier an option for them.Press some buttons on a computer keyboard and, done.No effort!!
Irish polititians (in power) aint well known for being pro-active or even active.They say a lot but do very little.

Merch · 15-07-2011 12:27AM

aligator_am wrote: »

In fairness, I started a thread about a year ago suggesting that all dole recipients and incoming non nationals shoud be fingerprinted and retinal scanned but got ripped apart in it

Seems times may have changed.

I would also definately include travellers in this, we'll see how it goes.

include everyone

jaredGalen · 15-07-2011 12:29AM

Interestingly, the department of Social Protection has started a tender process for the "Supply of Facial Image Matching Software"

http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/show/search_view.aspx?ID=JUL240355

Guess the aim for this would be to stop people claiming in multiple places.

Merch · 15-07-2011 12:32AM

so that would be in post offices at the point of collection?

Nijmegen · 15-07-2011 12:34AM

An aggressive welfare fraud investigations office would be a good idea, too.

Spend a few million to get investigators to hunt down fraudsters and save us hundreds of millions, if not billions.

tweedledee · 15-07-2011 12:36AM

Yeah right!!!
These clowns couldn't agree on biometric finger scans,which is much cheaper than Facial recognition systems.
Ohhh I forgot Irish Government always goes for the more expensive option for everything,especially when the taxpayer foots the bill.
If they cant work the facial scanners maybe they can put them into storage with the E-voting machines.Jesus wept.

jaredGalen · 15-07-2011 12:37AM

It's a start I suppose.
Pose for a quick snap to verify their identity and that they are the claiment, pay out the money and then they are logged as having been paid.

If they try and go somewhere else, even under a different name and hopefully the system should recognise them.

It would also stop the scam of people sending mates to sign on and pick up their money. Saw that on the Prime Time special a few weeks back.

aligator_am · 15-07-2011 12:37AM

Merch wrote: »

include everyone

I'm nearly sure that my original thread said that anyone (all nationalities, including Irish) who was collecting dole should have to submit to fingerprint scans, then other posters showed that it was fairly simple to scam this so we moved on to retinal scans.

tweedledee · 15-07-2011 12:58AM

Its not that simple to cheat bio finger scans anymore.With older systems yes but the modern next gen scanners use better readers and can tell if the finger is real (alive).Very difficult to fake it now.

T2daK · 15-07-2011 01:01AM

they should be made pay back half of each side and then a few years in slammer or else pay a massive fine with smaller sentence

Five held in €1m welfare fraud probe

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