Tipperary Venue

Nevermind_ · 13-06-2011 10:42PM

beertons wrote: »

Does he pay any income tax? We all know he has a cash business. What's stopping him to say his machines only make 50 cent a day each, when he's absolutely rolling it in. It's just the same as taxi drivers from years ago, and driving instructors these days.

the revenue aint dumb, and they are far more technology orientated than people realise, I'd be fairly certain they have audited Quirkeys before, they like targeting cash businesses.

Dempsey · 13-06-2011 10:44PM

Kevin Duffy wrote: »

Have you a source for that?

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/plans-for-460m-tipperary-development-revealed-431886.html

The rest of the funding for what will be known as the Tipperary Venue is expected to come entirely from Mr Quirke and another private investor abroad.

“He already has a number of investors willing to come onboard and the reality is that this venture will float on its own commercial merit,” said Mr Lowry.

mikemac · 13-06-2011 10:44PM

rantie wrote: »

Why a copy of the White House?

Why, do you find that tacky?

Maybe read up on some history, it was an Irishman who designed the White House

President Washington visited Charleston, South Carolina in May 1791 on his "Southern Tour," and saw the under-construction Charleston County Courthouse designed by Irish architect James Hoban. He is reputed to have met with Hoban then, and summoned the architect to Philadelphia and met with him there in June 1792.[6]
On July 16, 1792, the President met with the commissioners of the federal city to make his judgment in the architectural competition. His review is recorded as being brief, and he quickly selected Hoban's submission.[7]

If anything, the White House copied Leinster House.

The building Hoban designed is verifiably influenced by the upper floors of Leinster House, in Dublin, Ireland, which later became the seat of the Oireachtas (the Irish parliament).[

So it's the Americans who are tacky

Also, it'll be the original White House before it was burned down by the British. Not what you see on the news nowadays

policarp · 13-06-2011 10:44PM

The White House.
Moneygal.
Ballyporeen.
Wexford.
Two Mile Borris.
What have they all got
in common?

Absurdum · 13-06-2011 10:48PM

I will boycott this thing on account of that kunt Lowry being involved in it.

Plus, Tipperary birds ain't got nothing on the Monte Carlo ones

Dempsey · 13-06-2011 10:48PM

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I find the objection to the arena very bizarre. 15,000 would be bigger than the o2 arena. The south needs an arena that size. Interesting to know that the o2 arena is owned by livenation who are in co-ops with the prophets of evil MCD. It would be in both of their interests for that not to be built.

Has the reasons for refusing permission been stated publicly yet? I dunno how MCD/Livenation could 'influence' the decision without getting caught tbh

ArmaniJeanss · 13-06-2011 10:50PM

I'm a poker player, general gambler and semi-regular visitor to Las Vegas.

And whilst I'm happy to see them get planning permission and hope they do build it, I'd be very pessimistic about it working.

I don't see where they are going to get the visitors from.
LV works because it has an option to suit every budget. You can stay in a hotel room that costs $800 dollars or can also stay in a $20 room down the road. You can choose between spending $1000 on table service in a top niteclub, or have fun in a small bar paying $3 a drink. You have 2000 restaurants, 1000 clothes shops, 300 handbag shops, 100 jewellers.
You can bring the other half with a promise of a different Cirque De Soleil show every night or a Beatles musical or a Celine Dion concert.

Whereas The Venue is one hotel, one casino, one showroom (which they don't even have pp for yet). How are Pierre or Fritz or random American guy going to convince their non-gambling wife or friends to come to Borris.

No-one would go Vegas if it was just The Bellagio hotel, casino and niteclub. We'd probably never have heard of Vegas.

Good luck to them, I hope it works but I don't see it.

Kevin Duffy · 13-06-2011 10:56PM

Dempsey wrote: »

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/plans-for-460m-tipperary-development-revealed-431886.html

Dempsey wrote: »

The rest of the funding for what will be known as the Tipperary Venue is expected to come entirely from Mr Quirke and another private investor abroad.

“He already has a number of investors willing to come onboard and the reality is that this venture will float on its own commercial merit,” said Mr Lowry.

A breakingnews story from 2009 (before the full extent of the banking problem was widely known), the qualification "expected", an unnamed foreign investor and the statement you highlighted is the ultimate in political vagueness, saying that it the venture will succeed as though it were fact, but not addressing the source of finance which is what you made a categorical statement about.
If that's the extent of your source, then you don't know anything about where the money is coming from. If you have any real info, I for one would be interested to hear it.

Dempsey · 13-06-2011 11:06PM

Kevin Duffy wrote: »

A breakingnews story from 2009 (before the full extent of the banking problem was widely known), the qualification "expected", an unnamed foreign investor and the statement you highlighted is the ultimate in political vagueness, saying that it the venture will succeed as though it were fact, but not addressing the source of finance which is what you made a categorical statement about.
If that's the extent of your source, then you don't know anything about where the money is coming from. If you have any real info, I for one would be interested to hear it.

I have seen the prospectus for this project when Quirke was consulting with the two-mile borris area, there is an arab company involved. How much they are investing wasnt made clear at the time.

Unless you have information to contradict what I'm saying you are just peddling a conspiracy theory without anything to back it up bar a vivid imagination.

Richard Hillman · 13-06-2011 11:06PM

Dempsey wrote: »

Has the reasons for refusing permission been stated publicly yet?

It was refused because of it was deemed inappropriate considering the rural location. Thats strange considering they are building a large horse racing track that will host a larger amount. The arena (which would of had a retractable roof) would most likely be cheaper than than renting the o2 arena. If for example AC/DC were to come to Ireland. They would sell out instantly for a venue the size of the proposed one or the o2. The person booking the venue would go for the cheaper/larger venue and it would attract more people from Limerick,Kerry,Clare,Tipp,Cork,Waterford and other places close by and would give people from further a field the chance to go to a gig and spend the night at the venue and spend money in the local area. It makes sense to have the venue. The venue would attract 15,000 people and a large number of them would go to the casino.

I dunno how MCD/Livenation could 'influence' the decision without getting caught tbh

Really

Nevermind_ · 13-06-2011 11:08PM

Kevin Duffy wrote: »

A breakingnews story from 2009 (before the full extent of the banking problem was widely known), the qualification "expected", an unnamed foreign investor and the statement you highlighted is the ultimate in political vagueness, saying that it the venture will succeed as though it were fact, but not addressing the source of finance which is what you made a categorical statement about.
If that's the extent of your source, then you don't know anything about where the money is coming from. If you have any real info, I for one would be interested to hear it.

By 2009 the banks were already fubared, they had stopped functioning as banks and had stopped almost all lending.

do you really think an Irish financial institution
a) has access to this kind of funding these days
b) that the government/ecb would allow it
c) That the banks given their humongous property losses and portfolio of loss making hotels/golf courses to date would want to fund this?

The only possible way this could ever be built is with foreign funding from private equity, venture capital groups etc. The promoters dont have it in cash, but they wouldnt have gone this far without a reasonable expectation of raising the money once planning is granted.

My bet is on of the larger Gambling corporations from the U.S. Middle East or Asia bankrolling this for possibly the majority stake, using the irish lads to front it and secure the planning.
It would make sense for both sides.

Dempsey · 13-06-2011 11:13PM

Richard Hillman wrote: »

It was refused because of it was deemed inappropriate considering the rural location. Thats strange considering they are building a large horse racing track that will host a larger amount. The arena (which would of had a retractable roof) would most likely be cheaper than than renting the o2 arena. If for example AC/DC were to come to Ireland. They would sell out instantly for a venue the size of the proposed one or the o2. The person booking the venue would go for the cheaper/larger venue and it would attract more people from Limerick,Kerry,Clare,Tipp,Cork,Waterford and other places close by and would give people from further a field the chance to go to a gig and spend the night at the venue and spend money in the local area. It makes sense to have the venue. The venue would attract 15,000 people and a large number of them would go to the casino.

Really

Sounds like they did get to them alright! :pac:

The success of the feile's should be grounds to get a dedicated arena in the area. Sounds like a bull**** reason to me aswell. Also the flexibility of the arena should have seen it jump that hurdle with little fuss.

mikemac · 13-06-2011 11:26PM

Michael Lowry;responsible for the Trip to Tipp and clearing the debt on Semple Stadium

Of course he wasn't solely responsible but while many politicians played it safe and county boards wallowed in debt, Tipperary took a risk and it paid off.

Semple Stadium is the best GAA stadium in Munster.
I swear there will be fatalities in Páirc Uí Chaoimh some day, what a kip

daddydick · 13-06-2011 11:29PM

rebel without a clue wrote: »

well done to you. getting the exact milage correct. id say youre great fun at parties?

I am actually, im tremendous fun

Beats blatently lying to try to win an argument

easyeason3 · 13-06-2011 11:37PM

Absurdum wrote: »

I will boycott this thing on account of that kunt Lowry being involved in it.

Plus, Tipperary birds ain't got nothing on the Monte Carlo ones

I'm sure Dr Quirkey is shaking in his boots at not getting his hands on your money :rolleyes:

Seriously though, no matter where this was going to be built a politician was going to latch onto it like a fly to **** & make it look like they, & they alone, have somehow managed the impossible by getting permission granted.

Dempsey · 13-06-2011 11:45PM

easyeason3 wrote: »

I'm sure Dr Quirkey is shaking in his boots at not getting his hands on your money :rolleyes:

Seriously though, no matter where this was going to be built a politician was going to latch onto it like a fly to **** & make it look like they, & they alone, have somehow managed the impossible by getting permission granted.

Well, I think Quirke got Lowry involved because of the problems around gambling laws and help get through all the planning stages. There has been alot of stuff done just to get to this point, not a chance it would have gotten to this stage without a politician involved.

mikemac · 13-06-2011 11:52PM

This nonsense goes on in Tipperary and realy in every county in Ireland

Nenagh had a terrible train service, leaving Nenagh the biggest town for Limerick Colbert at 11:20 and coming back at 3:30. Irish Rail drivers working a 9-5

So a lobby group was setup and surveys taken and lots of work taken from volunteers. And when Irish Rail delievered a commuter service, our FF, FG and independent TD jumped in and claimed credit.
Fook them all, they did nothing. Though our Fianna Fáil TD did marginally more work then our Fine Gael TD from Templemore. He's not on the branch railline so didn't care

Same here, you see Michael Lowry and associate it with him but it's private money and businessmen doing the work.
So give it a chance

Son Of A Vidic · 13-06-2011 11:55PM

A pretty ambitious plan and if it generates the jobs, then it's well worthwhile in our current climate.

liamygunner29 · 13-06-2011 11:58PM

I love Lowry. Always number one.

mikemac · 14-06-2011 12:04AM

Michael Lowry, the only TD who does anything for the area

Some call him a gombeen and parish pump politician

Hey we look at Tony Gregory who held the government to ransom for his inner city voters.
Tony Gregory was the original parish pump politician but got held up as a saint, nobody does parish pump politics like the Dubs

Rhys Essien · 14-06-2011 12:06AM

Viva las Two Mile Borris.:D

I think the figure that there will be 2000 people working there when it will be completed was pulled out of a hat.Id say more like 200.

How often will there be horse racing.once every month?
Greyhound racing.Weekly?

easyeason3 · 14-06-2011 12:09AM

Dempsey wrote: »

Well, I think Quirke got Lowry involved because of the problems around gambling laws and help get through all the planning stages. There has been alot of stuff done just to get to this point, not a chance it would have gotten to this stage without a politician involved.

I think Lowry got involved because he has huge support in the area. Quirke probably knows plenty of politicians, or could at least get to know them for a project of this scale.

King of Kings · 14-06-2011 12:19AM

personally I don't think the idea is viable but let them go and ruin tipp if they want - the tipp folk seem mad for jobs...JOBS..JOBS....JOBS they roared all over the radio today.
"WE'LL SACRIFICE THE FATTEN CALF FOR JOBS" they could have but didn't roar also.

On other issue I couldn't give a hoot about the drugs, hookers, drinking and gambling it will bring - well I might actually go for all the non gambling vices.

My main worry is NAMA - I hope the private funding is true and not one jot of this ends up on the taxpayer.

swordofislam · 14-06-2011 01:04AM

Pauline Fitzpatrick made the initial report for An Bord Pleanala
I have footnotes for Tipp people

Pauline_Fitzpatrick wrote:

...
such a major [1] facility[2] should be located within[3] or in close proximity[4] to a designated [5] gateway as identified in the National Spatial Strategy [6]

...the site [is] outside any designated urban area, remote from public transport infrastructure and other complementary facilities, ... would be reliant primarily on private transport.

... the proposed development would therefore be contrary to the proper planning and sustainable development of the area.

Pauline_Fitzpatrick wrote:

2. ... the proposed development, ... includes a number of uses that
have a stated regional recreational/cultural dimension, on an unserviced rural site ... and thus would be contrary to the proper planning and sustainable development of the area.

Pauline_Fitzpatrick wrote:

3. ... large volumes of additional traffic onto the M8, [1] adversely affect the use of and contribute to congestion on the national road network. The proposed development would contravene national policy to preserve the level of service and carrying capacity of thenational road network and to protect the public investment in the road.
The proposed development would, therefore, be contrary to the proper planning and sustainable development of the area.

Pauline_Fitzpatrick wrote:

an unsustainable car dependent development.

prejudicial to the protection of the archaeological heritage of the area and would, therefore, be contrary to the proper planning and
sustainable development of the area

[1] Big
[2] Thing
[3] put in
[4] near
[5] already called
[6] Ireland Places Plan [7]
[7] Planning is trying to think about things that haven't happened yet. The Future[8]
[8] Tomorrow ans the day after Not just Wednesday and Thursday ...

Firefox11 · 14-06-2011 01:43AM

WindSock wrote: »

I hope there is no alcohol served on the premises either. You know, just in case it attracts alcohol addicts....

Well in Las Vegas the booze if free as long as you keep gambling, so i don't know if it will be the same here somehow.

Paully D · 14-06-2011 03:39AM

Personally I think it's a great idea!

OPENROAD · 14-06-2011 03:40AM

Paully D wrote: »

Personally I think it's a great idea!

It's a long way to Tipperary though.

Dangerous Man · 14-06-2011 04:06AM

mikemac wrote: »

Michael Lowry, the only TD who does anything for the area

Some call him a gombeen and parish pump politician

Hey we look at Tony Gregory who held the government to ransom for his inner city voters.
Tony Gregory was the original parish pump politician but got held up as a saint, nobody does parish pump politics like the Dubs

Lowry is a tax-evading rat. He tried to rob the Irish people.
Received illegal payments from Ben Dunne.
Made unethical interventions in the awarding of the largest ever private contract in the history of the state.

AH SURE HE'S A GREAT MAN! DOES WONDERS FOR TIPP. Keep your rat.

Dempsey · 14-06-2011 12:19PM

swordofislam wrote: »

Pauline Fitzpatrick made the initial report for An Bord Pleanala
I have footnotes for Tipp people

[1] Big
[2] Thing
[3] put in
[4] near
[5] already called
[6] Ireland Places Plan [7]
[7] Planning is trying to think about things that haven't happened yet. The Future[8]
[8] Tomorrow ans the day after Not just Wednesday and Thursday ...

An Bord Pleanala have made many fúck ups themselves, when did their word become gospel?

Most mass transit outside of cities is private anyways. JJ Kavanagh HQ is only a 10 minute drive down the road, I doubt he's going to turn up his nose at business. Plenty of smaller operators who do school runs in the local area to thurles could handle shuttling people from the train station in thurles out to the site.

As for

prejudicial to the protection of the archaeological heritage of the area

The site has already been searched and archaeological digs have been done on the site last year so this is actually waffle.

goose2005 · 14-06-2011 01:38PM

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I find the objection to the arena very bizarre. 15,000 would be bigger than the o2 arena. The south needs an arena that size. Interesting to know that the o2 arena is owned by livenation who are in co-ops with the prophets of evil MCD. It would be in both of their interests for that not to be built.

But if "the south" needs such a venue, surely Cork is better than 2MB?

Tipperary Venue

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