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Spray Foam Instalation Pics

  • 18-04-2011 06:54PM
    #1
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,824 ✭✭✭✭


    I decided to get both the attics spray foamed today
    The company,<SNIP> arrived at 9am this morning.I chose <SNIP> as they use an Irish made bio foam and its also NSAI certified too.
    They took about 1 hour to set the system up as the spray foam is a 2 part chemical that is mixed together and then heated to around 50 degrees C before being spraying into the attic spaces.
    The foam is a biofoam and its breathable which allows the roof structure to breath yet its fireproof,water tight and has very good thermal and accoustic properties.

    It was mad seeing a spray of foam expanding to 100 times it size in a matter of seconds. :D

    I also had special vent cards installed to keep an air gap in the roof.
    The actual wall plates and gable walls were also sprayed.

    I take my hat off to the 2 lads who got up into the attics to spray the foam in,as the heat off the stuff was unreal at the time.The heating comming down out of both attics was enough to make me go back downstairs and sit in the garden.
    So between the house being fully insulated internally and now the attics spray foamed,is should mean no massive heating bills ion the winter time and the heat retaining its heat for hours and hours.Im very happy with the end result and how <SNIP> approached the job and their manner too.
    Pics.:)
    <SNIP>
    DSCF8151.jpg
    DSCF8147.jpg
    DSCF8156.jpg
    DSCF8162.jpg
    DSCF8166.jpg
    DSCF8173.jpg


«13

Comments

  • #2
    Poor Uncle Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,547 ✭✭✭✭Poor Uncle Tom


    You know better than that paddy147,

    14 day ban.....


  • #3
    sinnerboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭sinnerboy


    Those vent cards don't look breathable. If they are not condensation will form on them , on their underside and the vent gap they create will have no meaningful function....


  • #4
    Carlow52
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,389 ✭✭✭Carlow52


    I am a bit confused here

    Post 4 in the link below
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=71766626

    shows a before and after pic of the old attic space with what looks like the trad black felt and it seems to have been a full fill job with the foam.

    In the pics in this thread the black 'spacers' were used, with SB raising the question as to their fit for purpose(ness) or lack there of.

    hence my confusion:(

    Ps IMO it would be best if all these pictures were posted in either one thread or the other.
    With suitable tags the information will be findable


  • #5
    Duffbeer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42 ✭Duffbeer


    Could anyone tell me what are the implications of spraying this open cell 800 direct to the breathable felt, i.e. leave out the drip cards? I just got a price from a supplier and they told me that there is no need for the black drip cards.
    This is from a BIO FOAM recommended installer by the way, not a "cowboy"!
    Thanks


  • #6
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,924 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    BTW thats not what id call a tidy job at all!!!

    have they never heard of cleaning off the excess to the rafter level??


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  • #7
    BryanF
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,147 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    Duffbeer wrote: »
    Could anyone tell me what are the implications of spraying this open cell 800 direct to the breathable felt, i.e. leave out the drip cards? I just got a price from a supplier and they told me that there is no need for the black drip cards.
    This is from a BIO FOAM recommended installer by the way, not a "cowboy"!
    Thanks

    As the name suggests the idea of the vent cards is to retain natural ventilation in your roof space (good for timber structure etc).

    As Sinnerboy said, I'd like to know how breathable these vent cards are.


  • #8
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,924 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Duffbeer wrote: »
    Could anyone tell me what are the implications of spraying this open cell 800 direct to the breathable felt, i.e. leave out the drip cards? I just got a price from a supplier and they told me that there is no need for the black drip cards.
    This is from a BIO FOAM recommended installer by the way, not a "cowboy"!
    Thanks

    maybe have a read of this


  • #9
    heinbloed
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    Don't worry, it has a NSAI certificate ......(smiley).

    But work out the diffusion rate yourself, try wufi or the like, NSAI propably didn't ask for it.....

    @ Duffboy:

    The card boards seen in the OP's thread are there to allow the felt to sag in the center, between two beams. To create a channel between the loadbearing timber beams where the blown-in water can run down.

    If the card boards wheren't installed the expanding foam would push-up the felt and the blown-in water would have to run down on resp. over the load bearing timber.
    And since there are nail holes passing through the felt (nails are used to fix the battens on the beams) there are holes in the felt, allowing the water to penetrate the timber.
    And load bearing timber must be kept dry, hence the felt.

    The man who told you there is no need for these card boards or a similar meassure is a cowboy.


  • #10
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,824 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    BTW thats not what id call a tidy job at all!!!

    have they never heard of cleaning off the excess to the rafter level??


    I will be reply to your rather presumptious and smart reply.

    I was asked by the company if I wanted it shaved/trimmed back to rafter level,but I said leave it,as the attic is too small to use as a room or habbitable space.

    It was my choice not to have it trimmed back.


  • #11
    Poor Uncle Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,547 ✭✭✭✭Poor Uncle Tom


    It's interesting that a company asks whether it should tidy up after itself....

    Regardless of who determines whether a clean up is necessary or not, it doesn't change the outcome, that a job being portrayed as top-notch is actually very messy.


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  • #12
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,828 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »
    It's interesting that a company asks whether it should tidy up after itself....

    Regardless of who determines whether a clean up is necessary or not, it doesn't change the outcome, that a job being portrayed as top-notch is actually very messy.

    Maybe the OP got a discount for not having the clean up! ;)


  • #13
    Poor Uncle Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,547 ✭✭✭✭Poor Uncle Tom


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Maybe the OP got a discount for not having the clean up! ;)

    Maybe, but the question still has to be asked, what company would let pictures of an unfinished/messy job go out publically to represent it's work?


  • #14
    paddy147
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 15,824 ✭✭✭✭paddy147


    Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »
    Maybe, but the question still has to be asked, what company would let pictures of an unfinished/messy job go out publically to represent it's work?


    Are you able to read?????:rolleyes:

    read what I posted in my previous post,then actually let it sink into your brain for once.

    I DECIDED to post pics of the spray foam,this had nothing to do with the spray foam company,it was my decision to post them.

    Now if you have a problem with that,then thats your problem and not mine.

    Stop baiting and looking for a fight and try copping on instead and showing a little respect.Ive nothing more to say to you now,as Im not getting drawn into any stupid arguements


    regards.


    P.S.-I love all these keyboard warriors and "so called know it alls" (who actually know nothing) but who begrudge others for what they do or get done,I really do love these people.


  • #15
    Poor Uncle Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,547 ✭✭✭✭Poor Uncle Tom


    paddy, attack the post not the poster....(consider that your warning).

    I think I have valid concerns, your thread title is "Spray foam installation pics", not "Spray foam - the cheaper unfinished version" and when you put pics up for viewing/criticism then you should be able to take some.

    I don't consider your pictures to show a finished job, therefore I consider the job to be untidy and messy in appearance. This doesn't reflect well on the people who carried out the work, imo.

    I know if I was going to put up pics of an example of some work I would like it to be completed and reflect the work at it's possible best.


  • #16
    muffler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 47,486 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    paddy147 wrote: »
    I will be reply to your rather presumptious and smart reply.
    paddy147 wrote: »
    Are you able to read?????:rolleyes:

    read what I posted in my previous post,then actually let it sink into your brain for once.
    paddy147 wrote: »
    Stop baiting and looking for a fight and try copping on instead and showing a little respect.Ive nothing more to say to you now,as Im not getting drawn into any stupid arguements
    paddy147 wrote: »
    P.S.-I love all these keyboard warriors and "so called know it alls" (who actually know nothing) but who begrudge others for what they do or get done,I really do love these people.
    Paddy you are causing all types of problems here and making a mockery of our time and efforts that we dedicate to ensure the smooth running of the forum. You have been warned on numerous occasions to post in accordance with the forum charter but the warnings have fallen on deaf ears.

    You even went to a different forum and made a very serious allegation of being harassed by one of the mods here and that is completely unacceptable.

    Accordingly I am banning you from this forum permanently.


  • #17
    muffler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 47,486 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    I am going to lock this shortly but will leave it open for now to afford an opportunity for the company involved to respond if they so choose.


  • #18
    yop
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 16,716 Mod ✭✭✭✭yop


    The company were on the DIY section if anyone wants more detail. As said though its very messy.


  • #19
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    Hi Mods, Just seeing this now lads..thanks for the opportunity to reply. I will make a post tomorrow when I get a chance...


  • #20
    muffler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 47,486 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    Opportunity passed up.

    Thread locked.


  • #21
    muffler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 47,486 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    Thread opened following contact with macspower


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  • #22
    Topper74
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 ✭Topper74


    Just on those airflow panels that you tack against the felt,

    Can you get your roofer to double batten against the felt instead? I'm not sure how this this would work in principal seeing as the foam covers all/
    It was mentioned to me by a supplier.


  • #23
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    Ok guys bear with me here.. I will reply to each post individually... sorry for lack of response as my son was in hospital and I wasn't online...


  • #24
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    Topper74 wrote: »
    Just on those airflow panels that you tack against the felt,

    Can you get your roofer to double batten against the felt instead? I'm not sure how this this would work in principal seeing as the foam covers all/
    It was mentioned to me by a supplier.

    yeah double battening and scarting is perfectly acceptable but probably a lot more expencive..


  • #25
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    Carlow52 wrote: »
    I am a bit confused here

    Post 4 in the link below
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=71766626

    shows a before and after pic of the old attic space with what looks like the trad black felt and it seems to have been a full fill job with the foam.

    In the pics in this thread the black 'spacers' were used, with SB raising the question as to their fit for purpose(ness) or lack there of.

    hence my confusion:(

    Ps IMO it would be best if all these pictures were posted in either one thread or the other.
    With suitable tags the information will be findable

    Paddy had 2 parts of his house done.. The new part had the new breathable felt requiring the vent card installation. The older part of the house had a rigid bitumen felt that didn't require the vent card.. hence the 2 different pictures..


  • #26
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    Duffbeer wrote: »
    Could anyone tell me what are the implications of spraying this open cell 800 direct to the breathable felt, i.e. leave out the drip cards? I just got a price from a supplier and they told me that there is no need for the black drip cards.
    This is from a BIO FOAM recommended installer by the way, not a "cowboy"!
    Thanks

    the implications would be that it is possible for the felt to be pushed upwards creating a mound and valley effect leaving a palce for the water to sit and eventually break down your felt and get to your timbers.

    I can only speak for our company when I say we always recommend installation fo the vent card on breathable felt.. some people opt not to use them.. All we can do is give them the information.


  • #27
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    sinnerboy wrote: »
    Those vent cards don't look breathable. If they are not condensation will form on them , on their underside and the vent gap they create will have no meaningful function....

    the vent cards are made from high impact polystyrene so they themselves are not breathable... but they have nothing to do with breathability.. have a look this thread and it might explain better what their function is.. if not I will go into more detail later


  • #28
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    BTW thats not what id call a tidy job at all!!!

    have they never heard of cleaning off the excess to the rafter level??

    Spray foam by it's nature is not asthetic. It has a rough unsmooth finish to it. The cleaning off as you call it, is actually called shaving... this is only done when someone is going to slab over it...

    Insulation must be filled flush or over the timbers to prevent the occurance of cold spots.
    This was determined through our structural details and condensation risk evaluations.
    It is best practice in areas where the insulation is not been covered to leave the product untrimmed.
    The reasoning behind this is that the outer skin on the insulation acts as a vapour retarder not a vapour control layer
    In roof structures which generally get the slope of the roof insulated it is for the purpose of significantly reducing healt loss due to air intrusion. These households use their attics for light storage not for living areas.

    since leaving the skin on with an uneven finish provides the best insulation it is best proactice not to trim back unless turning the area inot a living space...

    this pic here shows a job that has been shaven back to the rafters. note the top part that is not living space is not shaven

    p8210129.jpg


  • #29
    BryanF
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,147 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    Macspower wrote: »
    This was determined through our structural details and condensation risk evaluations.

    The reasoning behind this is that the outer skin on the insulation acts as a vapour retarder not a vapour control layer

    In roof structures which generally get the slope of the roof insulated it is for the purpose of significantly reducing healt loss due to air intrusion.

    Can you provide the data and calculations for the 'condensation risk evaluation' with regards to the existing OP construction (with the bitumen felt). Thanks.


  • #30
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,924 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    macspower, i was under the impression that spray foam insulation required a vapour control layer on the warm side of the product as part of their NSAI certification.

    I have seen this explicitly stated for both the icynene product and the bio foam.

    Does your product not require this?


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  • #31
    Macspower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,201 ✭✭✭Macspower


    Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »
    It's interesting that a company asks whether it should tidy up after itself....

    Regardless of who determines whether a clean up is necessary or not, it doesn't change the outcome, that a job being portrayed as top-notch is actually very messy.

    Hi Tom... there was never a discussion with anyone about who cleans up... Cleaning us is our responsibility..

    See above reply regarding shaving back...

    In a non living area the foam doesn't look pleasing to the eye...

    eg here is an example of a well insulated and air tight attic

    1000744f.jpg

    Similar to paddys this is not pleasing to the eye.. however if your not living in it why cut off part of the insulation that you have paid for if your not slabbing it... it can always be shaved at a later date. I agree shaving it makes it look good but in it's original form is best for insulation.

    see pic in thread above for shaven version of the same...

    I can assure you all jobs that our company do pass our strict quality control procedure and are carred out to strict guidelines of best practice. This is also followed by testing by biofoam in their NSAI audit system..


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