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Abolish democracy in Ireland

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Comments

  • #62
    Biggins
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 34,567 ✭✭✭✭Biggins


    Merch wrote: »
    I agree that that cannot exist, we seem to be the polar opposite to some continental nations, Germany, Sweden, Denmark, maybe I have a romantic view of them, but while we seem short sighted, they seem to have a social conscience.
    So do we, a lot of Irish people do.
    Has anyone ever looked up the list of voluntary orgs in this country alone? Its social conscience behind those also that are willing and stepping up to act too.
    ..And they're just the groups, not just single individuals operating on their own also!
    I wouldn't be in a hurry to put our own down. One might be doing those out there on our own soil a dis-service for noble efforts too?


  • #63
    chalkitdown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭chalkitdown


    If we implemented an electronic voting system where everyone votes, we wouldn't have to give politicians a four mandate to do as they choose. We could make those decisions ourselves.
    I would employ representatives to manage on a four year contract, if they're crap, fire them.

    We only have representatives because we couldn't fit everyone in the same room. Now that is technically possible.


  • #64
    Merch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,322 ✭✭✭Merch


    chalkitdown wrote: »
    If we implemented an electronic voting system where everyone votes, we wouldn't have to give politicians a four mandate to do as they choose. We could make those decisions ourselves.
    I would employ representatives to manage on a four year contract, if they're crap, fire them.
    We only have representatives because we couldn't fit everyone in the same room. Now that is technically possible.



    I'd be a bit concerned about electronic voting, apart from the cost. I think there is nothing wrong with a paper based system if it is properly organised. An electronic system that is disorganised could equally be a disaster. I know it currently cant be organised as after a few attempts I gave up trying to stop getting multiple voting cards sent to me, how many people are abusing that I wonder?


  • #65
    ilovesleep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭ilovesleep


    They tax rain water in germany.
    whiteonion wrote: »
    It's obvious that democracy in Ireland has failed because of irrational voters and because of corrupt politicians. Therefore Ireland should be governed by rational people from Germany.
    Allow this to happen and galway will have the imf/ecb loans paid off within a year.


  • #66
    Merch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,322 ✭✭✭Merch


    ilovesleep wrote: »
    They tax rain water in germany.


    Allow this to happen and galway will have the imf/ecb loans paid off within a year.


    I thought they taxed you if you have a certain area square paved, as it means the run off needs to be dealt with, whereas its a bit greener to have grass on soil, which absorbs moisture.
    Millions of peoples run off needs to be dealt with and paid for, if I dont have my lawn paved and my neigbour does, it seems only fair he pays and I dont.

    Finland has taxes coming out the wazoo, but they get services in return. My understanding is there isnt a big tax pot as such, but each service has a tax, least you know what you are paying for and getting in return.


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  • #67
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,626 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    A system which incorporates elements of sortition would be better than the current model, imo.

    Iceland done something similar recently
    As part of a bold and ambitious initiative in active democracy, the first National Assembly was held in Reykjavik last month. Some 1,200 citizens randomly selected from the national register and 300 invited guests, including cabinet ministers and MPs, trade unions, representatives from the media and others, were brought together in a modern-style social partnership. The task of the National Assembly, comprising 0.5 per cent of the population, was to plan a future vision for the country. People were asked what sort of society Iceland should now build in the aftermath of bankruptcy.

    http://elaine.ie/2009/12/29/mad-as-hell-icelanders-wont-be-taking-it-any-more/


  • #68
    Merch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,322 ✭✭✭Merch


    My name is URL wrote: »
    A system which incorporates elements of sortition would be better than the current model, imo.

    Iceland done something similar recently



    http://elaine.ie/2009/12/29/mad-as-hell-icelanders-wont-be-taking-it-any-more/


    imagine a govt here inviting ordinary people to participate? instead of the party hacks and their mates?


  • #69
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,626 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Merch wrote: »
    imagine a govt here inviting ordinary people to participate? instead of the party hacks and their mates?

    One can dream =p


  • #70
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,017 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    ejmaztec wrote: »
    They've only been rational since 1945.

    Westen oder Osten ?


  • #71
    Merch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,322 ✭✭✭Merch


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    Westen oder Osten ?

    what do you mean?
    edit, I see what you mean
    Well from 1949, Id say west


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  • #72
    joshrogan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 855 ✭✭✭joshrogan


    It was abolished after we voted no on the lisbon treaty and we were made vote again until the result they wanted was received.

    I was in favour of a yes vote on the lisbon treaty but I was strongly opposed to the 2nd round of voting just because we "weren't informed/confused".


  • #73
    F1ngers
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 11,608 Mod ✭✭✭✭F1ngers


    Biggins wrote: »
    I'm tired of Whiteonions stupid threads!

    I'll give you this one as it's the "Thanks whore" post(even though you knew who the OP was)...but
    Biggins wrote: »
    :pac:

    You clearly haven't seen his other posts then. Utter baiting rubbish - repeatedly.
    No wonder this thread was kicked out of the politics forum.
    Biggins wrote: »
    Far from it.

    FAR, far from it!
    Biggins wrote: »
    I'll tell you one thing - you make me laugh! :pac:
    Biggins wrote: »
    In fairness, some me rational people that exist entirely in any country and you will be showing me utopia.

    Nice idea and one to head towards in aspiration, we are however human and thus fallible.
    Biggins wrote: »
    So do we, a lot of Irish people do.
    Has anyone ever looked up the list of voluntary orgs in this country alone? Its social conscience behind those also that are willing and stepping up to act too.
    ..And they're just the groups, not just single individuals operating on their own also!
    I wouldn't be in a hurry to put our own down. One might be doing those out there on our own soil a dis-service for noble efforts too?

    ...you came back for more???...loads more:confused::confused:


  • #74
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    Hookah wrote: »
    Nobody voted for the loosening of financial regulations.

    Nobody voted for NAMA.

    Nobody voted for the bank guarantee.

    Nobody voted for the EU/IMF deal.

    It's a little rich blaming the voters of Ireland for the economic mess.

    70% of people voted in favour of these in the last general election. When we had the opportunity to make a change, people overwhelming voted against that change. Those voters returned the previous FF/FG plan.


  • #75
    chalkitdown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭chalkitdown


    squod wrote: »
    70% of people voted in favour of these in the last general election. When we had the opportunity to make a change, people overwhelming voted against that change. Those voters returned the previous FF/FG plan.

    Indeed, the amount of scaremongering against the 'left' was astounding.


  • #76
    chalkitdown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭chalkitdown


    Merch wrote: »
    I'd be a bit concerned about electronic voting, apart from the cost. I think there is nothing wrong with a paper based system if it is properly organised. An electronic system that is disorganised could equally be a disaster. I know it currently cant be organised as after a few attempts I gave up trying to stop getting multiple voting cards sent to me, how many people are abusing that I wonder?

    Of course there is the possibility of fraud, but that has already happened with a pen and paper based system. I can remember a case of a village that had more Fianna Fail voters than populace (nearly). The phrase "vote early and vote often" wasn't a joke.

    It will be difficult for people to get over the previous politically inspired electronic voting debacle. The cost need not be high, ATM's, mobile phones and personal computers puts it within grasp.

    Obviously political turkeys will not vote for Christmas.

    People need to see the bigger picture, enough of this sheeple shtie.


  • #77
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    chalkitdown wrote: »
    Indeed, the amount of scaremongering against the 'left' was astounding.

    Wasn't even ''the left'' many right wing economists and commentators joined in don't forget.


  • #78
    chalkitdown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭chalkitdown


    squod wrote: »
    Wasn't even ''the left'' many right wing economists and commentators joined in don't forget.

    I agree, but I did think that the idea of default was the best suggestion and that was only coming from the left*.

    *Unless you believed the sihte coming from Fine Gael.


  • #79
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    It wasn't until the ROI loosened the rule from Roman Catholic church that democracy is able to really pay off now. Less rule from the church and less power for it.


  • #80
    squod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,702 ✭✭✭squod


    chalkitdown wrote: »
    I agree, but I did think that the idea of default was the best suggestion and that was only coming from the left.

    The best suggestion IMO was having the bastards jailed. Them, their' accomplices and their cronies.


  • #81
    Humans eh!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 403 ✭✭Humans eh!


    TML91 wrote: »
    Why hasn't whiteonion been banned for trolling yet?

    Read his posts, they are all troll.

    Whiteonion eh?
    Troll par excellence! :D


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  • #82
    chalkitdown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭chalkitdown


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    It wasn't until the ROI loosened the rule from Roman Catholic church that democracy is able to really pay off now. Less rule from the church and less power for it.

    Correct Keith, I've always noticed that the more churches, the more strife. Just count the steeples in Belfast.


  • #83
    chalkitdown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 691 ✭✭✭chalkitdown


    Who was the goose that moved this thread to AH? Personality judgement as opposed to substance? Some mods should read before they press the button.


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