Grand National - Animal cruelty posing as sport and entertainment?

Im not into horse racing at all but the people who are talking about animal cruelty wouldn't have a tenth of the love & care people involved in the sport have for the horses.

Cú Giobach wrote: »

The question of freedom is an interesting one alright, I know I would prefer a life of freedom but then I'm not a horse.
Most animals just want what their particular species needs to survive and reproduce and since most animals don't want to change what they are used to I guess we'll never really know the answer.

I'm off now to a Buddhist website to discuss and then contemplate the joy bliss of non-existence.

I don't think people understand how stubborn horses are. If a horse doesn't want to do something, it's bloody hard to get them to do it. Something as simple as walking a horse into a horsebox can take over an hour if the horse doesn't want to do it, then you get the horse in and he's happy as larry poking his head out over the back.

When I was a young fella, I used to have a fairly seasoned pony. I'd take him down to the beach and out through the fields, and he'd gallop like mad. I couldn't rein him in at all. Show him a bit of space and he'd be off. Take him up to a jump, even if it was only a poll lying on the grass, and he'd stop dead. Wouldn't go over the thing no matter what you do. He wouldn't jump for love nor money. Gallop him up to a ditch, and he'd jump over that no bother, could do it all day.

Basically, horses have a personality, and won't do anything unless they want to do it (separate to the running with a herd mentality.) There's plenty of horses who have been bred from the best of racing stock, been put with the best of trainers, and will never go near a race course, simply because they don't want to do it. And if a horse doesn't want to do something, you'll never get the level of performance out of them that you need at the levels needed to compete in a Grand National. So they either get kept for breeding, or are sold off to do go hunting, do dressage, work in a riding school, show jumping, whatever. But they definitely won't end up doing something they don't enjoy and don't want to do.

Paparazzo wrote: »

Really? Where?

the united arab emirates

Paparazzo wrote: »

That's only 1 country. And according to this you can bet on horses.

I was refering to the uae and america but it seems they have both made exceptions for horse racing so it is legal my bad you were right I was wrong

I remember at least one documentary explaining that horse racing is hugely popular in some middle eastern countries even though gambling is totally illegal but i doubt i will be able to find it so i accept i was wrong

PeakOutput wrote: »

beaten with a whip, are you serious? do race horses have shorter lives then other horses?

Yes, beaten with a whip. No one likes to be hit/struck/beaten/injured/glanced with anything. If we have the choice to harm a horse to any degree or not, we should choose not to.

PeakOutput wrote: »

what spinal injuries would these be?

Spinal injuries incurred in a race or training.

PeakOutput wrote: »

horses are put down when they have any sort of serious injury arent they? so there is no increased suffering

There is no need to put a horse down if we don't produce the setting in which they need to be put down.

PeakOutput wrote: »

if there was no horse racing none of the horses would exist in the first place which is the lesser of two evils?

Non-argument. Less of two evils? Animals not bred for human purposes= less animals we need to put down. (we should still look out for them,but they would not be in our primary care)

PeakOutput wrote: »

by the way I can probably count on one hand how many horse races I have watched ever i think its boring and only bet on it very very rarely but it is not even close to being cruelty to animals

Humans should not be so arrogant as to assume that they have the right to decide the fate of another sentient beings life. Your boredom and bets do not matter.

Snappy the Moose wrote: »

"Bred to race" - My point exactly, these horses are trained to compete in these events. It isn't animal cruelty. Your describing it as if they are like caged chickens. During the off season the horse is allowed out in the field for a few months to do as they please as such. Their whole lives don't consist of racing as you put it.

That's not very kind, 'allowed' in a field. That's where they're meant to live.

PeakOutput wrote: »

There is no "need" for it but it is a sport. Is there a need for soccer?

The apparatus used in a soccer game is not a sentient being i.e does not have the capacity to feel pleasure or pain.

PeakOutput wrote: »

As I said people who think horse racing is cruelty to animals probably lack a proper knowledge of the sport. The fact you think horses are beaten with whips confirms this. (Beaten with a whip FFS )

'Beaten' is subjective. I do not assume that all horses are left crippled after being struck with a whip. I also do not make the arrogant assumption that horses enjoy being hit with a whip.



If humans possess the capacity to reduce pain and suffering to any sentient being, they should do so accordingly.

Equally, if they possess the capacity in which they can increase the quality of life of another sentient being they should also do so accordingly.

(I'm just in from a [tame] night on the piss, excuse any spelling/grammar problems)

I never bet on Aintree for this reason. Its bollocks. I always liked horse-racing, as I really like horses. Magnificent creatures.
Aintree is a step too far, and I don't even watch it.
I am overcome with guilt when a horse falls.

I think I might quit betting on horses actually.

Can't we just make horse burgers out of the dead horses, then its just the same as the beef industry.

Also, friend of mine put 500 euro on the winner, bastard :mad:

PeakOutput wrote: »

the horses actually enjoy racing, its unfortunate that two were killed obviously but horse racing is not cruel

So the horses enjoy being whipped? :rolleyes: