Garda Siochana in Shell to sea sex shocker

LostinKildare · 06-04-2011 11:32AM

LostinKildare wrote: »

And why are you so certain of that?

prinz wrote: »

Some more from the Rape Crisis Network..

"The most up to date research, Rape and Justice in Ireland (RAJI) 2009, showed that most survivors of rape have a positive experience of the Gardaí."

I don't follow. I pointed out already the 40% have a negative experience with the gardai; you counter with "most" (i.e., 60% -- from the same report) have a positive experience of the gardai.

How does a 60% satisfaction rate make you CERTAIN that a rapey-jokey garda will treat a victim appropriately? You cannot know either way, so stop with your "certainty" that these "lads" are top-class aside from their questionable sense of humor. Maybe they are, but for all we know there are other complaints against them. No doubt the investigation will look at that.

K-9 · 06-04-2011 11:35AM

The other thing that I don't think anybody mentioned was the first woman wouldn't get in the car, "I'm not getting in there" or something like that, the second woman said she'd go with her to back her up. The female guard said "you'll be okay" or something like that. There was an insinuation that they weren't safe in the car and maybe this is were the rape reference came from?

_feedback_ · 06-04-2011 11:36AM

Poor Craythur wrote: »

Whilst I don't agree that the Guards did was acceptable, I DO agree that the reporting of the incident has been hyperbolic and sensationalist and a bit embarrassing for the media outlets involved.

I have no love for the protesters, but have no major agenda against them either.

They acted very irresponsibly too by feeding it straight to the media. They have commented saying they were worried for women and all that bullshít. But really, if they had given a second thought to potential rape victims, they would have known that releasing this in the way it has been will have more damage than merely reporting it through the correct channels.

Stench Blossoms · 06-04-2011 11:38AM

I know the whole point of them releasing this was to make the Gardai look bad but they've just made me hate Shell to Sea protesters even more.

Don Juan DeMagoo · 06-04-2011 11:40AM

fluffyorganic1 wrote: »

In fairness to the poster you qouted he didn't suggest any of the boldened bits at all!!!

Thank you

AudreyHepburn · 06-04-2011 11:43AM

fluffyorganic1 wrote: »

In fairness to the poster you qouted he didn't suggest any of the boldened bits at all!!!

I know, I was talking in general about the hysterical over-reacting on this topic.

I just used Don Juan's post as a starting point.

KittyeeTrix · 06-04-2011 11:50AM

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I know, I was talking in general about the hysterical over-reacting on this topic.

I just used Don Juan's post as a starting point.

Okay, my bad:)

Don Juan DeMagoo · 06-04-2011 11:50AM

Stench Blossoms wrote: »

I know the whole point of them releasing this was to make the Gardai look bad but they've just made me hate Shell to Sea protesters even more.

Hold on a sec, imo this has nothing to do with Shell to sea protest group malarkey. This is about the improper things these specific Gardai said, so why would hate another group over what they said. Rather confused now, are you saying did they set them up. If so it was rather uncovertly done, "here take this camera and hand it back after you are finished... and make sure you speak clearly in this mic" ..... :rolleyes:

prinz · 06-04-2011 11:51AM

squod wrote: »

Take a look at the poll. Bear in mind that was conducted in AH. Imagine how the general population of this or any other country feel about this story. Feeling safe on the streets is a goal of any police force in an area which attracts tourists. It's serious business.

Other countries have bigger problems to worry about. Did we all freak out about travelling to the UK after Jean Charles de Menezes? I have been on a metro and watched a handful of French cops use their batons on a lad and drag him off the train. Do I feel safe going back to France? Absolutely. Anyone with half a brain can see the vast majority of countries have far bigger issues with their own police forces than to worry about this incident.

LostinKildare wrote: »

How does a 60% satisfaction rate make you CERTAIN that a rapey-jokey garda will treat a victim appropriately? You cannot know either way, so stop with your "certainty" that these "lads" are top-class aside from their questionable sense of humor. Maybe they are, but for all we know there are other complaints against them. No doubt the investigation will look at that.

Maybe I am forming a picture based upon their actual policing which was spot on and totally professional? Personally I go with innocent until proven guilty, I assume members of AGS to be competent and professional, I don't sit on my arse playing with statistics that could mean anything. I assume a taxi driver to be normal, despite the fact that I have had experiences with some who were anything but. I assume shop keepers to provide a good service even though some haven't etc etc.

Don Juan DeMagoo · 06-04-2011 11:53AM

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I know, I was talking in general about the hysterical over-reacting on this topic.

I just used Don Juan's post as a starting point.

TheZohanS · 06-04-2011 11:55AM

Just saw a bandwagon and decided to jump on it, didn't read the entire thread.

Filthy scum for raping those two girls... (did this happen?)

Filthy scum for threatening those girls with rape... (did this happen?)

Filthy scum for talking about rape in a jovial fashion in front of these girls...(did this happen?)

Don Juan DeMagoo · 06-04-2011 11:58AM

fluffyorganic1 wrote: »

I'm just wondering Don Juan, what sanctions would you feel would be suitable????
I only ask as I feel the same way but am not sure what would be suitable:)

I don't know either, but I am not asking for their jobs or anything rash as that. A written apology to those women maybe and a dressing down by their superiors... Oh and they have to wear a dunces hat for a month

_feedback_ · 06-04-2011 11:59AM

Don Juan DeMagoo wrote: »

Hold on a sec, imo this has nothing to do with Shell to sea protest group malarkey. This is about the improper things these specific Gardai said, so why would hate another group over what they said. Rather confused now, are you saying did they set them up. If so it was rather uncovertly done, "here take this camera and hand it back after you are finished... and make sure you speak clearly in this mic" ..... :rolleyes:

But, the way the information was used is a major part of the whole thing. The impact on the reporting of rape that everyone is talking about doesn't just come as a result of a bad joke. A large part is down to how the Shell to Sea protesters did not report it correctly in the first instance, and as a result it is absolutely everywhere (in a very sensationalist way - like this), and will have a much bigger impact than if it was reported properly.

Don Juan DeMagoo · 06-04-2011 12:01PM

TheZohan wrote: »

Just saw a bandwagon and decided to jump on it, didn't read the entire thread.

Filthy scum for raping those two girls... (did this happen?)

Filthy scum for threatening those girls with rape... (did this happen?)

Filthy scum for talking about rape in a jovial fashion in front of these girls...(did this happen?)

Filthy scum for talking about rape in a jovial fashion in front of a recording camera and then for these girls and everyone else to hear...(did this happen?)

Checkmate

06-04-2011 12:02PM

They're only a great bunch 'o lads!!! :pac:

Don Juan DeMagoo · 06-04-2011 12:03PM

elviscostello wrote: »

But, the way the information was used is a major part of the whole thing. The impact on the reporting of rape that everyone is talking about doesn't just come as a result of a bad joke. A large part is down to how the Shell to Sea protesters did not report it correctly in the first instance, and as a result it is absolutely everywhere (in a very sensationalistway - like this), and will have a much bigger impact than if it was reported properly.

I suppose, but that isn't that the sensationalist media as much as that protest group I guess?

Dodge · 06-04-2011 12:04PM

Poor Craythur wrote: »

Whilst I don't agree that the Guards did was acceptable, I DO agree that the reporting of the incident has been hyperbolic and sensationalist and a bit embarrassing for the media outlets involved.

Are you new to the country? Indo/newstalk etc paint all civil and public servants as scum of the earth. All foreigners are potential terrorists. Same outlets have painted the priotestors as hippy scum in the past.

Sensationalism isn't reserved for this story

_feedback_ · 06-04-2011 12:06PM

Don Juan DeMagoo wrote: »

I suppose, but that isn't that the sensationalist media as much as that protest group I guess?

Correct, but who gave it to the media?

Should have been reported through the correct channels.

Killer Pigeon · 06-04-2011 12:13PM

Excerpt from conversation:

Sergeant: “Who is them two lassies, do you know the two of them?

Garda A: “I don’t know the second one, the first one is with blonde hair.”

Unidentified Garda: “She was up on the tractor earlier on.”

Sergeant: “It’d do no harm to get the second one’s name again?

Garda A: “She’s some Yank. I don’t know who the **** she is.”

Unidentified Garda: “ Is she a Yank?

Garda A: “It sounds like it, it sounds like it, the accent anyway

Unidentified Garda: “Sounds like a Yank or Canadian.”

Garda A: “Well whoever, we’ll get Immigration ****ing on her.”

Sergeant: “She refused to give her name and address and told she would be arrested.”

Garda A: “.......and deported”

Sergeant: “And raped.”

Garda A: “I wouldn’t go that far yet….. She was living down at that crusty camp, **** sake, you never know what you might get.”

Sergeant: “Give me your name and address or I’ll rape you.”

Unidentified Garda: “Hold it there, give me your name and address there, I’ll rape you.”

Sergeant: “Or I’ll definitely rape you.”

Unidentified Garda: “Will you be me friend on Facebook?”

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/99445

It's funny because the conversation seems like something you might read on AH. Honestly though, it's just a typical lads conversation - it's actually quite comical to be honest, in an insensative way. It's really a storm in a tea-cup tbh, brought on my some utter clowns who have the biggest grudge against gardaí.

And also, the protestors are really after shooting themselves in the foot by releasing the video because it shows them resisting arrest and refusing to give their names and addresses, which is an offense, so the video can actually be used against them to a greater degree than it can be used against the Gardaí. I guess it shows you how utterly stupid some of those protestors are.

06-04-2011 12:18PM

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

it's just a typical lads conversation - it's actually quite comical to be honest,

.

:pac::pac::pac:

Phill Ewinn · 06-04-2011 12:29PM

squod wrote: »

Take a look at the poll. Bear in mind that was conducted in AH. Imagine how the general population of this or any other country feel about this story. Feeling safe on the streets is a goal of any police force in an area which attracts tourists.

It's serious business.

The ten euro airport tax was ''no big deal'' either. Oh wait............ yes it was. No doubt it will have some effect on tourism here.

doolox · 06-04-2011 12:31PM

Because the cops were in a car on their own with no member of the public present they presumed they were on private time and no one would hear them. I am not naive enough to think that service providers do not use some choice names and perjorative terms for members of the public especially those who cause difficulties, no matter how just the cause, especially when they think they cannot be overheard.

The lads should be educated forcefully as to the seriousness of rape and its effect on victims, both male and female. I wonder do they have daughters of their own and how would they like them to be the butt of jokes about rape???

I'd say the authorities will not be able to press for a formal disciplinary process because of the way the info was obtained and the absence of a member of the general public in the car in question, or are we to assume that every workplace is bugged and all we say at work can be used against us?

Don Juan DeMagoo · 06-04-2011 12:35PM

elviscostello wrote: »

Correct, but who gave it to the media?

Should have been reported through the correct channels.

By correct you mean the Gardai, don't you?

Well that would put the conspiracy theorist in me in a right hypothetical quagmire.....

prinz · 06-04-2011 12:37PM

Phill Ewinn wrote: »

The ten euro airport tax was ''no big deal'' either. Oh wait............ yes it was. No doubt it will have some effect on tourism here.

Are you trying to compare this incident to an actual monetary tax on flights? Jesus, new low.

prinz · 06-04-2011 12:39PM

Don Juan DeMagoo wrote: »

By correct you mean the Gardai, don't you? Well that would put the conspiracy theorist in me in a right hypothetical quagmire.....

Garda superiors, who are doing an invesitgation anyway. After that the Office of the Ombudsman which is independent of AGS were complaints are supposed to go.

Padkir · 06-04-2011 12:40PM

Don Juan DeMagoo wrote: »

By correct you mean the Gardai, don't you?

Well that would put the conspiracy theorist in me in a right hypothetical quagmire.....

I would say he means the Ombudsman, who is not connected to the Gardai.

qwytre · 06-04-2011 12:40PM

Joking about rape is bad enough but in fairness there was obviously no intention and it was a private conversation. It was in bad taste etc and misjudgement on their behalf to joke about it but I think this is being blown up into more than it is.

Give them a slap on the wrist. I don't think anyone should be loosing their jobs over this.

lecker Hendl · 06-04-2011 12:44PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

I have never ever joked about rape with a work colleague even when it was our off time, do you know why? Cos joking about rape ain't remotely funny.

It really shows character. And good character is a must when you are a defender of peace.

Have you ever used the phrase 'blast them with piss'. It's no more disgusting than what you are implying. 'Yore Ma' is a response alot of people use here. It can be in reference to anything, usually something involving having sex with the posters mother. People then go along and thank these posts. I will have no doubt that you thanked one of these or at least one of the posters above, yet ye are going mental over a joke made in similar taste by a guard.

People are getting up on their high horses here. The guard was joking. Some people are easily offended. Look at the jokes made about Harvey Price. Shock humour. Some people can't handle it. I for one was not offended, simply because there was no intent in what the guard said.

MagicSean · 06-04-2011 12:46PM

Just from listening to the full thing it would seem the girl had been inferring the gardai might assault her friend if she was arrested. So basically they were just taking the piss following on from this. Storm in a teacup doesn't come close to how out of hand this thing has gotten.

2 stroke · 06-04-2011 12:47PM

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

Honestly though, it's just a typical lads conversation

Typical immature teenage conversation maybe. These Gardai were just after taking these ladies into custody and should have been more respectful.
(yes, I do know the ladies were in a different car)

Garda Siochana in Shell to sea sex shocker

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