Subsoiling, pan busting or spiking

jeff greene · 21-03-2011 04:19PM

vincenzolorenzo wrote: »

I did this on a field at home last year and it worked out fantastic, way better than we expected. Basically there was one field that always held a bit of water over the winter, certainly as far back as I can remember anyway. Then when the really wet weather came in Nov 09 there was probably the guts of 2 acres submerged so some work was long overdue.

I got a loan of a shake-aerator from a local tillage man (this day last year in fact). Basically it was a 5 leg sub-soiler with a PTO drive to a vibrating unit in the middle so that the whole thing shook when in the ground (drove it with a JD 6910). He told me the day I got it that the ground wasn't dry enough but i said i'd chance it anyway. There was no cutting disc in front of the leg so it did tend to pull and rip the sod a bit.

Took a couple of hours to do the whole field (~4acres) and a few other bits that had been holding water. Came along the next day with a light roller and it just closed in the ridges left by the subsoiler legs, not heavy enough to pack in the ground. I was very interested to see how it would turn out this winter when the rain came and it stayed bone dry, not a drop of water held anywhere on it. Made silage on it last summer and it turned out the finest. You can still see the lines on the ground after the shake-aerator but all in all we were very pleased with the job.

Summary: Used a shake-aerator on grassland, worked out very well!

A two leg grassland version new is £5,500 by Alexander Mills in the North, are the vibrations helpful, how big are they? 18770.jpg

vincenzolorenzo · 21-03-2011 04:22PM

Thats a smaller grassland version of the one I used last year. It would be a great job though. Having the cutting disc in front of the leg would be a far better job as it wouldn't drag the sod, and then the built in roller would level over afterwards. Very expensive though. The one i got was for opening up tramlines before ploughing, so was a bit rough on grass

reilig · 21-03-2011 04:43PM

jeff greene wrote: »

A two leg grassland version new is £5,500 by Alexander Mills in the North, are the vibrations helpful, how big are they? 18770.jpg

Be careful if you're going to buy off him. remember, It will be + VAT and make sure that you do the deal in Sterling - he will try to push you for to do it in Euro but he won't be very favourable with the exchange rate.

You might even buy a 3 or 4 leg panbuster down south at that price. There are several companies making them now.

aristo · 21-03-2011 06:01PM

New shakaerator legs are about €180 plus vat and €11 for the point so could be made up to a 3 leg cheaply, they're alot easier pulled with the pto on and when used in dry conditions it will form cracks well under the bottom of the point from the vibrations so no need to be burying it as deep.

Muckit · 21-03-2011 10:55PM

aristo wrote: »

New shakaerator legs are about €180 plus vat and €11 for the point so could be made up to a 3 leg cheaply, they're alot easier pulled with the pto on and when used in dry conditions it will form cracks well under the bottom of the point from the vibrations so no need to be burying it as deep.

Is it the frame or the individual legs that shake.
Just wondering if they'd be hard on a tractor's backend and lift arms
You make a good point aristo about them being easier to pull. When you think about it it's like trying to drill a hole in a wall with an ordinary drill or with an SDS, no comparsion

massey woman · 22-03-2011 12:25AM

reilig wrote: »

Be careful if you're going to buy off him. remember, It will be + VAT and make sure that you do the deal in Sterling - he will try to push you for to do it in Euro but he won't be very favourable with the exchange rate.

You might even buy a 3 or 4 leg panbuster down south at that price. There are several companies making them now.

Interesting Reilig one of these is on my wish list in a while
I had decided on the aerator made by erth engineering and sold by a company in Boyle-at least they were nearby in case of difficulty-but I will wait now and see how you get on, sounds promising ,dont think I can do much more drainage on this Leitrim soil!

reilig · 22-03-2011 10:32AM

massey woman wrote: »

Interesting Reilig one of these is on my wish list in a while
I had decided on the aerator made by erth engineering and sold by a company in Boyle-at least they were nearby in case of difficulty-but I will wait now and see how you get on, sounds promising ,dont think I can do much more drainage on this Leitrim soil!

I've looked at moreway's pan buster too Massey Woman. €10k is a hell of a lot of money to invest in something like that unless you were going to go out on hire with it.

I said I'd take my chance on the subsoiler. Hopefully it will work. If it doesn't, I'll convert it into a mole plough.

vincenzolorenzo · 22-03-2011 11:33AM

Muckit wrote: »

Is it the frame or the individual legs that shake.
Just wondering if they'd be hard on a tractor's backend and lift arms
You make a good point aristo about them being easier to pull. When you think about it it's like trying to drill a hole in a wall with an ordinary drill or with an SDS, no comparsion

The whole frame vibrates, the frequency depends on what revs you set the PTO to. I kept it at a fairly low speed and the whole tractor did shake along with it. I only used it for a few hours but they guy that owns it probably spends a couple of days a year with it and has done for a long time without any major problems that i've heard of anyway

massey woman · 22-03-2011 12:09PM

I bought a mole plough nearly 20 years ago and thought Id do the devil and all but the results were not impressive
Went down too deep and brought up too many stones
Hard to control the depth
Used it instead for laying hosing to drinkers
£700 at the time in Doggetts in Slane
Ideally if one could hire the panbuster to see the results then if succesful the €10k cost could be justified by buying in co like you did?
Might ring them and see if there is anyone hiring one out

westlander · 22-03-2011 01:00PM

There are so many different ones its hard to know which one is the best as they are not long around.

A few makes i've seen are:
erth, kme, soil mate (made by mastek in cavan, same leg as mconnel) to name a few.

And they're all up near 10k. But even if you were to pick one how would you know which one is the best!

massey woman · 22-03-2011 01:11PM

Thats why were all on here picking each others brains from experience I suppose!

reilig · 22-03-2011 01:34PM

massey woman wrote: »

I bought a mole plough nearly 20 years ago and thought Id do the devil and all but the results were not impressive
Went down too deep and brought up too many stones
Hard to control the depth
Used it instead for laying hosing to drinkers
£700 at the time in Doggetts in Slane
Ideally if one could hire the panbuster to see the results then if succesful the €10k cost could be justified by buying in co like you did?
Might ring them and see if there is anyone hiring one out

We had a mole plough in the past too and found that it worked well - but we needed to do it every 2 or 3 years for to be able to see a flow of water into the large drains from the "mole hole". Ours was a light enough mole plough and it bent into hoops the first time we used it on a 4wd.

I tried moreway about hiring one of them. It was a no go. They would gladly come out and do a demo for me on my land where I and all my friends and neighbours could look at it. But they weren't keen on me getting my hands on it for a day or 2. They did give me the name of a contractor in Roscommon who would do all my subsoiling for me for €40 an acre with one of their machines.

Muckit · 23-03-2011 04:05PM

reilig wrote: »

We had a mole plough in the past too and found that it worked well - but we needed to do it every 2 or 3 years for to be able to see a flow of water into the large drains from the "mole hole". Ours was a light enough mole plough and it bent into hoops the first time we used it on a 4wd.
.

Sorry now for being impatient and not waiting to see photos, but is the new machine you've purchased Reilig the same as your old one bar the fact it has 2 legs? Or does it have 'wings' aswel?

reilig · 23-03-2011 04:20PM

Muckit wrote: »

Sorry now for being impatient and not waiting to see photos, but is the new machine you've purchased Reilig the same as your old one bar the fact it has 2 legs? Or does it have 'wings' aswel?

Hi Muckit,

My mate that bought it for me sent me this picture of it:

picture.php?albumid=1565&pictureid=9052

As you can see, it is a double leg subsoiler and has depth wheels.
The deal is that the dealer that I'm buying it off will put new wings (shins) and cutters on it before delivery. Paint work isn't great on it, but there's no cracks or welds. Much heavier duty than my old mole plough

Muckit · 23-03-2011 04:41PM

reilig wrote: »

Paint work isn't great on it, but there's no cracks or welds. Much heavier duty than my old mole plough

It looks a good lump of a yoke alright. Should take plenty of abuse. I see you can adjust the positioning of the legs too... very nice.

If you got it at that money and he's doing all that work for you on it, you've bagged yourself a right bargain

I'm jealous.

I personally like to buy machinery without paint, it's usually only a cover up and you've no idea really of the work it's done.

reilig · 23-03-2011 05:01PM

Muckit wrote: »

It looks a good lump of a yoke alright. Should take plenty of abuse. I see you can adjust the positioning of the legs too... very nice.

If you got it at that money and he's doing all that work for you on it, you've bagged yourself a right bargain I'm jealous.

I personally like to buy machinery without paint, it's usually only a cover up and you've no idea really of the work it's done.

Its off a horticulture / Flower farm. Its been used quite a bit, but with the wearing parts replaced, I'll be happy. If you look closely at the picture, you'll see that it was originally a 3 leg subsoiler and still has a leg holder in the centre - In time, I will buy a mole plough leg for this and I will remove the 2 outer legs. I'm really happy with it. Hopefully I'll be as happy when it arrives

Uggoon · 16-06-2011 08:14AM

I was reading through the posts, I've a wet farm in Clare but it's stony underneath. I was thinking of buying a subsoiler something simple, a single leg type. Any suggestions ?? I have a 100 HP tractor with good tyres..

greek88 · 17-02-2016 04:58PM

Hi guys i know this is an old thread but hopefully one of you will be well experienced in subsoiling mole ploughing now

Was thinking of getting a single leg subsoiler with wings or making one we have heavy soil some earth onto clay a few inches down and some pete onto clay. we have done drains as well in the land about 5 feet down filled with 2inch stone nearly to the top and our land is sloping between 20-45 degrees.

my question is would subsoiling help me out with the fields travelling them is always an issue and our cows rearly eat out covers because we have to move them on because of damage. we have a case 885xl 2wd would this be powerful enough?
and how deep would i need to go with the subsoiler.literally hit clay in some places a few inches down other areas maybe 12inches and could it damage the drains?

and also would mole ploughing help me? i assume i would have to pull the mole uphill from the dikes at the bottom.

thanks

djmc · 17-02-2016 06:11PM

I have done a bit of subsoiling the past few years and it works well enough where you have red earth underneath I don't think it will work on clay
If its grey or blue mud you might be better trying a mole plough or drainage of some sort as you won't get the shattering effect from a winged subsoiler on blue clay or mud.

Attie · 17-02-2016 10:38PM

Used this mole plough last year on about two acres in two separate fields bit of rock about them.
Used a Zetor 8545 to pull it taking over good tyres very little wheel slip, so far looks like it made a good job as the water used to lie in it but no more

https://goo.gl/photos/54kzkh2j4DziRPBx7

Sunderz95 · 19-02-2016 12:09AM

Use a mole plough here on heavy gleys. Does a super job but need dry conditions to crack soil and collector drains on long runs. Plough should be set up level as well to pull and form moles correctly

greek88 · 19-02-2016 11:07AM

ATTIE: What hp is that Zetor and size of the mole?

My issue with mole plough is i dont think i have enough hp in the case we have as i would have to pull it uphill and thaught i might get away with a subsoiler. Then again i could just try a field and see how i get on in the summer when the weather is good.

Im assuming the best way is to pull it uphill?

Attie · 19-02-2016 06:54PM

greek88 wrote: »

ATTIE: What hp is that Zetor and size of the mole?

My issue with mole plough is i dont think i have enough hp in the case we have as i would have to pull it uphill and thaught i might get away with a subsoiler. Then again i could just try a field and see how i get on in the summer when the weather is good.

Im assuming the best way is to pull it uphill?

Greek the tractor is 90hp have her screwed a bit from the 85hp she came with.
The mole itself was about the size of a letter coke battle the depth varied from
18 inch to 6 inch I got away well as it was a nice dry year.
Myself i'd try the case unless it's very steep, I was on the flat and as I say I pulled it taking over hope this is of some help Attie.

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipOd-JxpmDCQTV8Iq_D0WMR4spRA7XPIolvCmlLL

greek88 · 25-02-2016 11:18AM

Attie wrote: »

Greek the tractor is 90hp have her screwed a bit from the 85hp she came with.
The mole itself was about the size of a letter coke battle the depth varied from
18 inch to 6 inch I got away well as it was a nice dry year.
Myself i'd try the case unless it's very steep, I was on the flat and as I say I pulled it taking over hope this is of some help Attie.

Thanks lad. I'll prob go with buying a second hand subsoiler with wings or something that will shatter the ground underneath that way I can drive down hill if I don't have the power as its only 2wd as well. Our land is very heavy and to be fair we have only one "flat"field. I can always buy a mole attachment and try that out as an experiment and I would have access to a 100hp 4wd if I did need it I suppose.

marcoz · 06-06-2018 11:20PM

Hi all, I’ve a half acre of a front garden on a new build that’s got disastrous drainage. The feild the house is built on has always had bad drainage and I need to get someone in with a subsoiler or mole plough with a 4wd with serious grunt to break up this half acre so I can move forward and harrow of disc it and the rotavate it myself. I’m in north county Dublin And not in farming myself although my mothers family all are. Anyway, it’s tillage time of the year and there seems to be some lads with subsoilers and big machines pulling them around the area but I can’t seem to pin anyone down to come over and break my ground up. It would be half hour max. Would anyone of here know of a farmer of anyone in Rush, Lusk, Skerries are the would have a subsoiler and tractor to do my quick job. Obviously a few quid has to be agreed on and it has to be near by please

Subsoiling, pan busting or spiking

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