Where do you get off...

minidazzler · 15-03-2011 03:19AM

I've dated an American, and I am in fact going to see her in WA in 51 days. Also hung out with a good few when they were over here. In general a nice bunch, most could handle their drink and were good fun.

Dudess · 15-03-2011 03:34AM

There seems to be an "I hate America" camp that compare it to a dictatorship (and other silliness) and an "I love America" camp that cannot find fault with it (it has quite a few faults). Most people I'd imagine though think it's a diverse country with a lot of bad, but a hell of a lot of good. And it's been good to many emigrants from here. So, America - you're all right.

Ruu_Old · 15-03-2011 04:22AM

Live in the US a little over 6 years now, hard to believe it has been that long. I live in a small college town about 2 hours south of Chicago. The city government are like, the state, bankrupt but they still spend money stupidly. Aside from that, I am fairly happy.

I find people that I deal with day to day are grand most of the time and friendly but one thing I have always found was that people are scared of eye contact. I find it hard to read people any more.

I couldn't tell you much about politics, I don't follow the news, maybe a little bit on public television which you are better off watching than anything else. If you don't mind Bob Ross is on and I'm off to paint some happy, little clouds.

donfers · 15-03-2011 04:49AM

pragmatic1 wrote: »

I've never visited but I dont subscribe to the stereotypes. Any Americans I've met were generally well educated, friendly and actually very reserved.

friendly or with a veneer of friendliness

with americans more than any other nation per capita I've noticed that there is a real eagerness to appear happy or positive, if they are happy and positive then grand but half the time it seems so faked, all the big smiles and rather over enthusiastic platitudes kind of makes me feel uneasy at times, too much focus on exhibiting popularity and coolness and a real fear of expressing sadness or straying from the crowd or the trendy consensus of the day as well as too much emphasis on career

oh and yes they generally very earnest and polite and i respect that but it sometimes does cause confusion with the quite blunt or cynical or teasing Irish sense of humour

i recommend the book smile or die by barbara ehrenreich, it suggests they perhaps worship at the altar of positive thinking too much to the detriment of revealing their true selves

df1985 · 15-03-2011 05:03AM

j1 in boston, ive been 5 other times on holidays, my uncle lives in LA...may aswell be a yank!

southsiderosie · 15-03-2011 06:12AM

dashboard_hula wrote: »

My other half was raised in the US and lived there for 25 years, and as he was only just home when I met him, I think I got a good eyeful of American until I sanded down some of the edges. One thing that stood out a country mile when I met him was that if he had something to say, by Christ he said it. To compare, in Ireland for instance if food was late coming out, one might mutter something to the other, or cast beady eyes around for the waitress. Americans (and I'm including the full family and friends package I got with him) will very, very clearly state "Where is my food? Why is it taking so long?", no matter how small or quiet the restaurant. Good or bad, it's just something I noticed.

Haha, this is so true! Slow restaurant service makes me crazy! Irish people are very polite, and will rarely tell the waiter if anything is wrong with the meal; they'll just complain on the way home. Which is a shame, because most restaurants (particularly in Dublin) are so overpriced that you would expect excellent service. If you're paying 35 euro for meat and potatoes, should the meat at least be served hot and your water glass kept full?

/cranky Yank rant

dashboard_hula wrote: »

Although I still maintain the country is full of f*cking nutcases, especially in the South and Midwest. Georgia recently introduced a bill holding women who miscarry accountable under the law unless it can be proven medically that she had "no hand in it". Seriously. wtf.

Yeah. Our gun laws are particularly nutty.

Eve_Dublin · 15-03-2011 07:29AM

donfers wrote: »

friendly or with a veneer of friendliness

with americans more than any other nation per capita I've noticed that there is a real eagerness to appear happy or positive, if they are happy and positive then grand but half the time it seems so faked, all the big smiles and rather over enthusiastic platitudes kind of makes me feel uneasy at times, too much focus on exhibiting popularity and coolness and a real fear of expressing sadness or straying from the crowd or the trendy consensus of the day as well as too much emphasis on career

oh and yes they generally very earnest and polite and i respect that but it sometimes does cause confusion with the quite blunt or cynical or teasing Irish sense of humour

i recommend the book smile or die by barbara ehrenreich, it suggests they perhaps worship at the altar of positive thinking too much to the detriment of revealing their true selves

I find this too sometimes. I mentioned in my main post that I find it difficult to keep up with the standard of friendliness expected of me at the initial stages, not because I'm unfriendly...I'm very good at being friendly as I teach everyday and have travelled a lot alone and moved here alone as well so I've had to be...but sometimes I feel unfriendly by American standards just for being a bit off sometimes or not being all smiles. I know one girl here in Madrid...all round lovely and beautiful American woman and in theory we should be friends because she is very nice....but I've been out with her a few times with mutual friends and I just can't warm to her. She tries her very best to maintain an air of perfection and she reminds me of one of those beauty queens on stage. I get the impression she believes she's being watched all time and is afraid to show a bit of her true self. It's unnerving as I tend to say the "wrong" thing quite often

I don't find this generally I might add but I come across it in America more than other nationalities and it's those types that I generally can't click with. You just want to shout at them to loosen up a bit sometimes.

gosuckonalemon · 15-03-2011 07:38AM

southsiderosie wrote: »

Well, we are the land of "everyone is special". Perhaps we could use a little bit less of that!

I would totally agree, in a Special Olympics kinda way, right?

Phony Scott · 15-03-2011 07:42AM

I've only met a few Americans in my life and they're generally very nice, intelligent people, but ask them anything about pop-culture in Ireland and most of them will draw a blank beyond names that made it big in America.

Pdfile · 15-03-2011 07:44AM

ronnie3585 wrote: »

Usually in bed with a moist towel.

creepin alone i see.

Creep hard or go home !

lifelongnoob · 15-03-2011 08:57AM

the problem with most americans is that most of them dont really know what is going on outside of their own country. this is because their media is highly censored. Freedom of speech my ass.

they are routinely fed the patriotism crap by their gov cos its an easy means to control them.

in canada (i lived there for a few months) the news is nowhere near as censored... and most canadian really have a fair idea on what is really happening out there.

cock robin · 15-03-2011 09:17AM

I witnessed poverty in the states that I never thought I would. Around Pahokee and Bel Glade the people seem to be forgotton. Travel for around two hours south and Miami is like another world. Generally I loved the Americans and they seem normal enough to me.

15-03-2011 09:27AM

dashboard_hula wrote: »

My other half was raised in the US and lived there for 25 years, and as he was only just home when I met him, I think I got a good eyeful of American until I sanded down some of the edges. One thing that stood out a country mile when I met him was that if he had something to say, by Christ he said it. To compare, in Ireland for instance if food was late coming out, one might mutter something to the other, or cast beady eyes around for the waitress. Americans (and I'm including the full family and friends package I got with him) will very, very clearly state "Where is my food? Why is it taking so long?", no matter how small or quiet the restaurant. Good or bad, it's just something I noticed.

lol
I always love the story of my grandfather asking for water in a restaurant one day (he's pure Mayo by the way, not American)
I'd say he asked for it twice and nothing was happening so he calls the fella over and says loudly and crossly "has this establishment run out of drinking water?"
Oh, I thought that was hilarious.

Ok anyway america, well there's fast food places EVERYWHERE omg :eek: I was shocked. Also at the portion sizes. I asked for a "medium" icecream expecting a couple scoops. I nearly got a vat of the stuff :rolleyes:
There were very few footpaths in the suburbs area I was staying (in Boston).
Other than that I duno, I was a member of gaiaonline for years and it's swarmed with americans. I think the sheer size means you get more of every type

southsiderosie · 15-03-2011 08:14PM

lifelongnoob wrote: »

the problem with most americans is that most of them dont really know what is going on outside of their own country. this is because their media is highly censored. Freedom of speech my ass.

they are routinely fed the patriotism crap by their gov cos its an easy means to control them.

in canada (i lived there for a few months) the news is nowhere near as censored... and most canadian really have a fair idea on what is really happening out there.

We do have access to non-American media, you know! Even Hillary Clinton referenced Al-Jazeera recently.

TBH, I'm not so sure that Americans are less knowledgeable about their neighbors than, say, the Irish are about theirs. How much does your average Irish person really know about Portuguese politics, for example (other than the fact that their economy is fcuked too)? The bigger issue here is, almost everybody reports on American news, but the American news doesn't necessarily report on everyone else. So there is a lot of asymmetrical knowledge: non-Americans know a hell of a lot about our political leaders (because we are a superpower and often stick our nose in places where it doesn't belong) and our celebrities (because most people globally have access to American movies and music). But we're watching the same politicians and celebrities, so we are less aware of what the other 160+ countries are doing.

Azureus · 15-03-2011 08:23PM

I haven't been to the States (yet). My boyfriend has family over there and they are the nicest friendliest people you could meet, aswell as being very intelligent and well educated. I do work in tourism though and meet with a lot of Americans every day, and a lot of the stereotypes ring true 90% of the time. That isnt representative of an entire nation all the same, but it can be hilarious. Stereotypes are created for a reason though, Im sure the Irish live up to a lot of there's abroad aswell, they had to come from somewhere.

longhalloween · 15-03-2011 08:25PM

Once met a girl who asked me if the reason i didnt like seafood was because i came from a landlocked country.

southsiderosie · 15-03-2011 08:26PM

Azureus wrote: »

I haven't been to the States (yet). My boyfriend has family over there and they are the nicest friendliest people you could meet, aswell as being very intelligent and well educated. I do work in tourism though and meet with a lot of Americans every day, and a lot of the stereotypes ring true 90% of the time. That isnt representative of an entire nation all the same, but it can be hilarious. Stereotypes are created for a reason though, Im sure the Irish live up to a lot of there's abroad aswell, they had to come from somewhere.

I agree that there is usually a grain of truth to most stereotypes.

I'm curious: what are some of the ones that you deal with when it comes to American tourists?

sagat2 · 15-03-2011 08:36PM

Lived here 8 years this month, honestly it's no different than I thought it would be before I came over here and not too much different than what most people back home who haven't lived here think it is. Irish people are aware that the coasts are rather civilised as is much of the Midwest although many people confuse the Midwest with everything between the coasts when really it is just the northern area and is not quite as infested with bible bashing racists as the Bible belt to the south. What people tend not to be aware of is the poverty as mentioned a couple of posts up particularly in parts of the country where you wouldn't expect to find a Third World standard of living for example North Philadelphia or just across the river in Camden, New Jersey. Baltimore is known thanks to the Wire but West Englewood Chicago is a horrible slum and NYC even has a number of ****holes like Bedstuy.

MetalDog · 15-03-2011 09:07PM

Never been, might go someday though.

Feeona · 15-03-2011 10:21PM

I've liked any Americans I've met so far. They had great people skills, were good listeners and were broad minded. I get embarrassed when I hear an Irish person going on about how dopey Americans are. I think it really shows how insecure we Irish can be.

Big Nasty · 15-03-2011 10:46PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

Hm - that's kind of a testament to your country more than anything else: Canada is an obvious example of it being possible to have sane banking regulations and universal health care without becoming a communist totalitarian hell-hole. You guys are like the anti-Fox News. No wonder some Americans hate you? :rolleyes::p

First and foremost I find that post a little hypocritical when starting a thread asking where one nation get off being opinionated about another.

Secondly, most peoples opinion of places they have not been is based on what they see in the media. I have a friend married to a girl from Beirut. He has been there many times and says it is a lovely place - I was shocked as I thought it was a totally war stricken region. While in NY a number of years back I ended up in a cop bar and got chatting to this really cool NYC Homicide Dick, who was packing, told me he would be afraid to visit Ireland as it is war torn! :eek:

In fairness CNN is hardly gonna broadcast at the top of the hour that it's a beautiful sunny day in Ireland and everything is just fine and dandy - i.e. we only hear about the bad bits!

Moving on I've been to the states a couple of times and loved every minute of it. I've met some great people, so welcoming and open and willing to take you in as one of their own. I'm going back this year to do some of Route 66, catch a NASCAR Race, get married in Vegas, the whole nine yards. Would move there in the morning if I had the chance.

Lastly, I've seen some serious US bashing threads on this forum over the last couple of years but for some strange reason the general sentement on this thread has been fairly positive. This I welcome!

liah · 15-03-2011 11:19PM

I think you see a difference because while there's a lot of America-bashing, there's not a lot of American-bashing. By that, I mean the majority of bashing of 'America' is just bashing the government (and imo, in a lot of cases, with very good reason) rather than the citizens themselves, and this gets misconstrued as hatred of Americans when it really isn't, just criticism of their government and foreign policy. I know my hate for a lot of their current politics has been misconstrued as anti-American-- but any criticism I give is simply with a hope for the nation to improve, not because I hate anyone there, but rather because I quite like them!

I mean, there obviously is the stereotype that a lot of Americans are dumb/fat/religious/whatever, but nobody actually thinks they're all[ like that; any time I've heard anyone say things along those lines it's generally just for the sake of humour rather than an honest opinion.

Jaxxy · 15-03-2011 11:33PM

Feeona wrote: »

I've liked any Americans I've met so far. They had great people skills, were good listeners and were broad minded. I get embarrassed when I hear an Irish person going on about how dopey Americans are. I think it really shows how insecure we Irish can be.

I'd have to agree with this. I've lived in the States, my parents own property in FL and I have extended family there. Every time I visit I'm shocked by how open, friendly and self-possessed the people are. And oh, they just love listening to me talk, and they love hearing all about me, where I'm from and about Ireland.

They also love talking about themselves; you'd have a stranger's life story in the time it would take you to smoke a cigarette on a park bench.

But on the whole, yes, the majority of Americans I meet are very ignorant to anything going on outside America. That doesn't mean to say they're not interested though, just mostly misinformed.

grenache · 16-03-2011 03:01AM

In general i like Americans, i find most to be relatively friendly if somewhat conservative. One thing that really vexes me though is that they never tip. I worked in Adare Manor for a year and carried god knows how many suitcases down several flights of stairs for American guests. I never got one penny from them, yet ever other nationality - British, German, Irish, even Dutch (who are normally very tight) people tipped me. Yet when we go to the states we are expected to tip for nearly everything, even the most menial of customer care duties. But when they come here they wont do the same. Its not right!

liah · 16-03-2011 03:40AM

In Ireland, I thought you get a set wage before tips? In which case, if they're aware of that, it seems understandable. I remember my mom researching her trip to Ireland and finding people saying not to tip as much because the wages are okay without tips.

In America, it's a bit different-- typically the guts of whatever money you get is solely from tips. Servers wouldn't be able to support themselves if they didn't get any as their actual pay is incredibly low.

pragmatic1 · 16-03-2011 04:17AM

liah wrote: »

In Ireland, I thought you get a set wage before tips? In which case, if they're aware of that, it seems understandable. I remember my mom researching her trip to Ireland and finding people saying not to tip as much because the wages are okay without tips.

In America, it's a bit different-- typically the guts of whatever money you get is solely from tips. Servers wouldn't be able to support themselves if they didn't get any as their actual pay is incredibly low.

Its still nice to tip people in the service industry though. They're only on the minimum wage and this country is expensive.

liah · 16-03-2011 04:20AM

pragmatic1 wrote: »

Its still nice to tip people in the service industry though. They're only on the minimum wage and this country is expensive.

Oh I agree, I was just trying to figure out the line of thinking. They probably aren't aware that they're supposed to tip over here.

grenache · 16-03-2011 06:52AM

liah wrote: »

Oh I agree, I was just trying to figure out the line of thinking. They probably aren't aware that they're supposed to tip over here.

Surely the average American tourist isn't that naive? Tipping in service industries is universal in whatever country you visit. If somebody does a good job and the service is good, i'll always tip. I think its just tightness and mean not to.

Manic Moran · 16-03-2011 06:54AM

Maybe you've just been running into a lot of Republicans? Canada = Some kind of Commie state.

Don't think so. I'm on a couple of fairly right-wing boards, they give the Canuckians a good-natured ribbing, but there's no outright hatred or dislike. It's like infantry vs tankers. We'll give each other all sorts of crap, but when it comes down to the wire, we get on great.

NTM

Copper23 · 16-03-2011 03:35PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

...thinking you know about the US?

Seriously, I know US media is pervasive in Ireland, and there are plenty of Irish people who watch American television or read American newspapers, but I'm a bit curious: what are peoples' first-hand experiences with Americans in the US? Sometimes it seems like people have a very warped idea about the American people based on what they see on Fox News or what the government does, but as an American, I wouldn't like to judge Ireland based on Joe Duffy or Bertie Ahern. And although there is some truth to the stereotypes about us (I will freely acknowledge that we are a nation of lard-asses, although this varies by state), some of the perceptions of Americans I see on boards are truly warped.

Are folks here basing their opinions on their actual experience engaging with Americans in America, or just the media portrayal of us? Are the only Americans you've ever talked to wide-eyed tourists looking for leprechauns and their grandfather's cottage off in the wilds of Mayo? Or have you actually lived and worked in the US (and still come away with the idea that we are a bunch of lunatics)?

Back and forth living and working between there and Ireland. I'm over since after Christmas now for a while working away and seeing the girlfriend.

I think its a great place, best thing about it is that they don't allow people with a criminal record to enter the country.

Where do you get off...

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