New York introduces outdoor smoking ban in public places.

Wompa1 · 04-02-2011 02:08PM

seamus wrote: »

The clean air claim is nonsense, obviously. Cigarette butts are an issue as smokers universally seem to think that cigarette butts aren't rubbish and throw them on the ground as soon as they're done. Go anywhere that smokers congregate and you'll see butts everywhere.

It's much easier to catch someone who's actually smoking than someone who's after throwing a butt on the ground, so banning smoking a way easier than catching people littering, but it does seem to be needlessly prohibitive. Just make it a massive fine (say $5,000) for throwing a fag on the ground and most people will cop on.

Yes, it's all to do with the smoking ban. Nothing to do with insane prices and piss-poor customer awareness.

That's true. It's similar to the ban on chewing gum in Singapore. Easier to ban the selling of chewing gum than catch people throwing in on the foot paths.

DublinWriter · 04-02-2011 02:09PM

They came for the smokers,
I am a smoker,
Oh sh*t.

Now it's only a hop, skip and jump to enforced Tai Chi and compulsory granola.

It's amazing how prophetic The Dead Kennedy's California Uber Alles really is.

Dr. Baltar · 04-02-2011 02:13PM

seamus wrote: »

The clean air claim is nonsense, obviously. Cigarette butts are an issue as smokers universally seem to think that cigarette butts aren't rubbish and throw them on the ground as soon as they're done. Go anywhere that smokers congregate and you'll see butts everywhere. .

Congratulations on stereotyping all smokers. :mad:

I'll have you know, that when I am done smoking I always throw into the top of a bin/stub it out and put in the bin/stub it out and put it in my pocket until I find a bin.

dark crystal · 04-02-2011 02:13PM

seamus wrote: »

Yes, it's all to do with the smoking ban. Nothing to do with insane prices and piss-poor customer awareness.

The smoking ban has had a huge effect on the demise of the pub trade, actually - you may dismiss this as a fallacy, but many smokers don't enjoy being banished into the cold whilst trying to enjoy their drinks. It's not so bad in the summer, but during the winter, many smokers opt to stay in the comfort of their own homes, rather than brave the arctic conditions of the Irish weather!

I'm a smoker myself and would very, very rarely go out for a drink for this reason alone. It's the same for many other smokers I know, too.

My name is URL · 04-02-2011 02:16PM

If they're gonna do it they should do it for the right reasons without relying on the health concerns which people have about second hand smoke. New York isn't exactly free from industrial and automotive pollutants, and those things damage the air quality far more than cigarette smoke. The smog over the city is as thick as cloud on some days.

People really are fools.. they'll praise this as if it's genuinely going to have a positive impact on their lives while at the same time remain seemingly oblivious to the other toxins they breathe on a daily basis.

Canis Lupus · 04-02-2011 02:17PM

Dr. Baltar wrote: »

Congratulations on stereotyping all smokers. :mad:

I'll have you know, that when I am done smoking I always throw into the top of a bin/stub it out and put in the bin/stub it out and put it in my pocket until I find a bin.

Ah come on you're in the vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaast minority on this one. But well done, medal is in the post.

Pherekydes · 04-02-2011 02:17PM

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

New York has gone a step further with smoking bans and has now provoked lighting up in public parks, plazas and beaches.

Don't know about those Yanks, but no one is going to provoke me into smoking, anywhere, any time.

RichieC · 04-02-2011 02:17PM

dark crystal wrote: »

By the way, slightly off topic, but is it legal to smoke a herbal cigarette in a public space? All natural ingredients, no chemicals etc...

These type of cigarettes don't have any of the same risks assosciated with the normal kind, so it would seem pointless banning them as they pose no risk to the non smoker, no?

I'd imagine it's not ideal putting any kinda smoke in your lungs tbh.

pwd · 04-02-2011 02:18PM

seamus wrote: »

The clean air claim is nonsense, obviously. Cigarette butts are an issue as smokers universally seem to think that cigarette butts aren't rubbish and throw them on the ground as soon as they're done. Go anywhere that smokers congregate and you'll see butts everywhere.

It's much easier to catch someone who's actually smoking than someone who's after throwing a butt on the ground, so banning smoking a way easier than catching people littering, but it does seem to be needlessly prohibitive. Just make it a massive fine (say $5,000) for throwing a fag on the ground and most people will cop on.

Yes, it's all to do with the smoking ban. Nothing to do with insane prices and piss-poor customer awareness.

or or or
provide enough bins with ashtrays.

A cigarette butt isn't like a bit of paper you can stick in your pocket until you come across a bin. That's why people often drop them on the ground, even if they would otherwise never litter.

Personally I make an effort not to drop butts on the ground; which means I know how very inconvenient it can be to avoid this.

I agree with you in principle though!

seamus · 04-02-2011 02:19PM

Dr. Baltar wrote: »

Congratulations on stereotyping all smokers. :mad:

I'll have you know, that when I am done smoking I always throw into the top of a bin/stub it out and put in the bin/stub it out and put it in my pocket until I find a bin.

You're one of the statistically negligible few. Even where specific bins are provided for cigarette butts, you will see them all over the ground.

When I bought my current place, the previous owners were smokers but smoked outside cos they had a child. The balcony upstairs was littered with cigarette butts - all over the floor, and jammed into various nooks and crannies on the balcony. The bin was 3m away. That's the general mentality of smokers in my experience. Littering on their own homes because butts just aren't considered litter for whatever reason.
I walk by the houses of neighbours who smoke outside, and the path outside their front door is covered in cigarette butts. All of them, without exception. They wouldn't throw coffee cups or crisp bags there, so I don't know why cigarettes are OK.

dark crystal wrote: »

I'm a smoker myself and would very, very rarely go out for a drink for this reason alone. It's the same for many other smokers I know, too.

I don't know any smokers who have opted out of their usual pub visits because of the smoking ban. Most non-smokers I know attend pubs more often now than before the smoking ban.

A cigarette butt isn't like a bit of paper you can stick in your pocket until you come across a bin.

Of course it is, it just takes a tiny bit more effort. Stub it out properly, check that it's not still smouldering and stick it in your pocket.

RichieC · 04-02-2011 02:20PM

seamus wrote: »

You're one of the statistically negligible few.

where are you getting these statistics? would you mind citing them?

seamus · 04-02-2011 02:25PM

Yes, it's from the Observational evidence report, 2011. I can provide you with a copy of this report, but you will have to pay me €10,000 to transcribe it from my brain.

Canis Lupus · 04-02-2011 02:25PM

RichieC wrote: »

where are you getting these statistics? would you mind citing them?

Pendantic much.......

dark crystal · 04-02-2011 02:29PM

RichieC wrote: »

I'd imagine it's not ideal putting any kinda smoke in your lungs tbh.

Seems there's a loophole alright:

http://www.castlebar.ie/news/smoking-ban.shtml

Can't see it being worth the hassle, though and they are utterly vile things anyway

RichieC · 04-02-2011 02:30PM

Canis Lupus wrote: »

Pendantic much.......

Quite.

dsmythy · 04-02-2011 02:32PM

Whoa, I'm all for the ban in indoor public places but this is too far.

positron · 04-02-2011 02:33PM

I for one support it. We had a thread here about doing the same here in Ireland, and a poll, and I think it came out 50:50, so yes, Well done NY, and hope others will follow.

TanG411 · 04-02-2011 02:33PM

I don't smoke, but still think this ban may be a bit too much.

strobe · 04-02-2011 02:42PM

seamus wrote: »

You're one of the statistically negligible few. Even where specific bins are provided for cigarette butts, you will see them all over the ground.

When I bought my current place, the previous owners were smokers but smoked outside cos they had a child. The balcony upstairs was littered with cigarette butts - all over the floor, and jammed into various nooks and crannies on the balcony. The bin was 3m away. That's the general mentality of smokers in my experience. Littering on their own homes because butts just aren't considered litter for whatever reason.
I walk by the houses of neighbours who smoke outside, and the path outside their front door is covered in cigarette butts. All of them, without exception. They wouldn't throw coffee cups or crisp bags there, so I don't know why cigarettes are OK.

Then it should be dealt with in the same way all littering is.

seamus · 04-02-2011 02:50PM

strobe wrote: »

Then it should be dealt with in the same way all littering is.

As in, not dealt with at all?

€5,000 minimum fine sounds good to me.

Reillyman · 04-02-2011 02:53PM

This stuff makes me so angry:mad:

Not only the news of the law in NY but also the consistent attitude of certain non-smokers. I don't understand how it's completely acceptable to ridicule and lecture smokers. Would you do the same to an overweight person who enjoys fast-food? I don't know what problem ye have with other people smoking but it sickens me.

How can anyone think this law is okay? It's prohibiting smoking OUTSIDE. Ever heard the expression "dissapeared like a fart in the wind"? Same concept applies here, the smoke just dissapears ffs? This is a step way too far for the "free-world". But apparently it's okay to take away the rights of smokers...

If it's the ciggarette butts ye're worried about that's fine, I understand the problem, but why not call for more bins or bio-degradable butts etc? No, let's just go as far as we can to stop people smoking instead because we know what is best for everyone.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 04-02-2011 02:55PM

I'll pipe up here and say I'd be support a ban on smoking in ALL public places, including streets, parks, beaches etc.

If for one reason only - in my experience the vast majority of smokers are manky whores and don't give a rats arse where they discard their butt ends.. At best some of the cleaner smokers make a half hearted effort to flick their butts towards the gutter, but don't care really if the butt falls on the path or not - its like "Feck it, I tried".

A very small minority will dispose of the butt in a bin provided - and their all over Dublin, you can't walk more than a few meters without finding a litter bin with a tray on top or a container screwed to a wall outside a pub or café/restaurant.

Good on ya NYC.

Jesus Wept · 04-02-2011 02:59PM

Noah Unsightly Trash wrote: »

I'll pipe up here

I see what you did there.

Duggy747 · 04-02-2011 03:00PM

I always dispose of my fag butts in bins, not the hardest thing to do. If no bin is near me I just hold onto it until I do.

If anything, dog shìt is what bothers me the most in public areas. Can't walk anywhere without scanning the path in front of me for gloopy poo.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 04-02-2011 03:00PM

The-Rigger wrote: »

I see what you did there.

I threw the rest of the bullsh*t up as a smoke screen

dr.bollocko · 04-02-2011 03:00PM

Yeah.
It's a good thing we fought the nazis.

Canis Lupus · 04-02-2011 03:04PM

Reillyman wrote: »

This stuff makes me so angry:mad:

Not only the news of the law in NY but also the consistent attitude of certain non-smokers. I don't understand how it's completely acceptable to ridicule and lecture smokers. Would you do the same to an overweight person who enjoys fast-food? I don't know what problem ye have with other people smoking but it sickens me.

How can anyone think this law is okay? It's prohibiting smoking OUTSIDE. Ever heard the expression "dissapeared like a fart in the wind"? Same concept applies here, the smoke just dissapears ffs? This is a step way too far for the "free-world". But apparently it's okay to take away the rights of smokers...

If it's the ciggarette butts ye're worried about that's fine, I understand the problem, but why not call for more bins or bio-degradable butts etc? No, let's just go as far as we can to stop people smoking instead because we know what is best for everyone.

Man up and smoke at home. Or give up, it'll be better for you in the long run than getting your blood pressure up over this

dark crystal · 04-02-2011 03:06PM

Noah Unsightly Trash wrote: »

I'll pipe up here and say I'd be support a ban on smoking in ALL public places, including streets, parks, beaches etc.

If for one reason only - in my experience the vast majority of smokers are manky whores and don't give a rats arse where they discard their butt ends.. At best some of the cleaner smokers make a half hearted effort to flick their butts towards the gutter, but don't care really if the butt falls on the path or not - its like "Feck it, I tried".

A very small minority will dispose of the butt in a bin provided - and their all over Dublin, you can't walk more than a few meters without finding a litter bin with a tray on top or a container screwed to a wall outside a pub or café/restaurant.

Good on ya NYC.

By that reasoning, we should also ban dogs being walked outdoors, chewing gum and boys/men who phlegm on the street.

I see no difference between cigarette butts and dog wee/poo, chewing gum and phlegm on the streets, all of which people walking on a public street are exposed to every day.

Reillyman · 04-02-2011 03:11PM

Canis Lupus wrote: »

Man up and smoke at home. Or give up, it'll be better for you in the long run than getting your blood pressure up over this

But do you not see how daft that is? If I'm at work/college and have 30mins off, you expect me to go home to have a smoke?

The only consolation I take from this is the anti-smoking brigade are only a vocal minority. Most non-smokers I know have no problem whatsoever with people smoking, but as the silent majority they just wouldn't feel strongly about it to counter the "smoking is the devil" lot...

arybvtcw0eolkf · 04-02-2011 03:11PM

dark crystal wrote: »

By that reasoning, we should also ban dogs being walked outdoors, chewing gum and boys/men.

Well my dogs never chew gum, although occasionally they'll chew boys/men.

New York introduces outdoor smoking ban in public places.

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