Opening a safe buried in concrete

zagmund · 03-01-2011 2:36pm #1

Does anyone have any ideas how to go about opening a floor safe buried in concrete ? I know I can (and will) contact a professional to have it opened, but I'm happy to try out some DIY steps first to see if I can open it.

We moved house recently and the old owner told me there was a floor safe buried in the garage floor but he hasn't been able to open it since he bought the house over 15 years ago.

I have the key but it doesn't turn. It's more than a little bit likely that a lot of dust and sundry garage crud has fallen into the opening and is stopping the key from going all the way into the mechanism, although it does go a fair bit of the way in.

I have tried a hoover to suck as much out as I can, but still no joy. If I can find anyone with one of those special small places hoovers I will try that and see if the suction is better.

I could possibly try putting in some sort of liquid to dissolve the crud and, errr . . . I dunno, manage to get the liquid out somehow. Maybe that's not such a good idea afterall.

Does anyone have any wise ideas they can pass on ?

The safe is tube shaped - about the size of one of those cardboard containers for a bottle of whiskey. All that's exposed on the top is the keyhole and a handle to lift the safe out with. The safe itself is about 2 or 3 inches below the surface of the garage floor, so even to get anywhere near the sides of the safe would involve some very major (for me anyway) concrete removal. Why do they make these things so darn hard to open . . . :eek:

As is usual in the zag household, the camera batteries are kaput so I can't upload a photo, but I will later. The key is marked "S. Griffith & Sons, Wolverhampton, Safe Makers", in case that helps . . .

z

Buford T Justice · 03-01-2011 4:30pm

Ah, now in fairness... it wouldn't be a very good safe if you could get into it that easily now would it.....

tbh, you're looking at digging it up if you don't want to call a locksmith....

listermint · 03-01-2011 4:32pm

Have you tried high pressure air to clean out the dirt?

like a compressor or similar?

might need that and a wee bit of oil to lube up the mechanisim. Applying some heat and cooling also might free up the mechanism inside. (light blow torching)

michael999999 · 03-01-2011 4:53pm

WD40 might break down the gunk and clean the key mechanism!

gsxr1 · 03-01-2011 6:48pm

antiskeptic · 03-01-2011 9:47pm

zagmund wrote: »

Does anyone have any ideas how to go about opening a floor safe buried in concrete ? I know I can (and will) contact a professional to have it opened, but I'm happy to try out some DIY steps first to see if I can open it.

We moved house recently and the old owner told me there was a floor safe buried in the garage floor but he hasn't been able to open it since he bought the house over 15 years ago.

I have the key but it doesn't turn. It's more than a little bit likely that a lot of dust and sundry garage crud has fallen into the opening and is stopping the key from going all the way into the mechanism, although it does go a fair bit of the way in.

I have tried a hoover to suck as much out as I can, but still no joy. If I can find anyone with one of those special small places hoovers I will try that and see if the suction is better.

I could possibly try putting in some sort of liquid to dissolve the crud and, errr . . . I dunno, manage to get the liquid out somehow. Maybe that's not such a good idea afterall.

Does anyone have any wise ideas they can pass on ?

The safe is tube shaped - about the size of one of those cardboard containers for a bottle of whiskey. All that's exposed on the top is the keyhole and a handle to lift the safe out with. The safe itself is about 2 or 3 inches below the surface of the garage floor, so even to get anywhere near the sides of the safe would involve some very major (for me anyway) concrete removal. Why do they make these things so darn hard to open . . . :eek:

As is usual in the zag household, the camera batteries are kaput so I can't upload a photo, but I will later. The key is marked "S. Griffith & Sons, Wolverhampton, Safe Makers", in case that helps . . .

z

Get a piece of small diameter tubing and tape it airtight to the nozzle on your hoover and you've a small space hoover. Perhaps a straw picked up in McDonalds - squished flat at the suction end to slide into the key slot. A needle poked around as well to loosen up the dirt. Then the wd40?

After that, I'd go angle grinder.

mad m · 03-01-2011 11:09pm

Now the important question....Whats do you think might be in it? What did last fella tell you....

zagmund · 04-01-2011 12:18am

mad m wrote: »

Now the important question....Whats do you think might be in it? What did last fella tell you....

Not sure, but he said the guy before him was named Silver. Long John Silver I think it was. Dodgy leg he had, and a parrot on his shoulder. It be treasure I think, arrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

z

Davy · 04-01-2011 12:28am

What if you pay a locksmith to open it and their is nothing inside :pac:

looksee · 04-01-2011 12:54am

Davy wrote: »

What if you pay a locksmith to open it and their is nothing inside :pac:

Especially since we all now know where it is, you won't even be able to use it.

Buford T Justice · 04-01-2011 2:11pm

Now we're all interested and want to know what's in it. You'll have to get it open and tell us now

gsxr1 · 04-01-2011 2:53pm

im bursting to know whats in it.

I suspect it will be a......

Buford T Justice · 04-01-2011 4:54pm

zagmund · 04-01-2011 5:35pm

Update -
*I hoovered it out again - nothing - so it wasn't garage crud
*I shone a torch down it and could see metal at the bottom
*I stuck a toothpick into it and it went down further on the side where the key is longer than on the other side, so there definitely doesn't appear to be anything stuck in it
*I added in some WD40 - waited - nothing.
*I will wait again and try later to see if it has freed up yet.
*The heating/cooling sounds interesting, but sadly I don't have any sort of meaningful heat source. Unless I could use the clicky-thing for lighting the gas on the cooker - that would definitely heat it up a little. Hmm . . .
*While explosives would seperate the house from the safe I think the house might fare the worse of the two, so I won't be trying that any time soon.

I've mailed the manufacturers to see if they can help resolve the problem for me - I know it's a Hamber safe and I think it's a Minder which you can see here - http://hambersafes.com/filedownload.php?file=hamber%20under%20floor%20safes.pdf

Will let you know how it pans out.

Thanks for the suggestions,

z

zagmund · 05-01-2011 3:06pm

Further update.

The safe manufacturer tells me that the key I'm using isn't the correct one. That explains the fact that it won't turn the mechanism alright. I find the correct key is always a good starting place when trying to open a lock. In fairness, it did say it was a safe key and there aren't a whole heap of other safes around the house so it was a reasonable assumption to make.

I'm going to have a poke around and see if I can find any other similar keys floating about. At least I know what size & shape I need as the other key fits the slot perfectly.

z

cgarrad · 05-01-2011 3:17pm

Great post ;-)

stapeler · 05-01-2011 11:16pm

Great post, I have a similar safe but I haven't as yet installed it. Any pointers on what not to do?
I'll loan you my key, if it works we can half the contents. Then again, half of nothing is nothing

finnyj · 06-01-2011 9:25am

stapeler wrote: »

Great post, I have a similar safe but I haven't as yet installed it. Any pointers on what not to do?
I'll loan you my key, if it works we can half the contents. Then again, half of nothing is nothing

I recently installed
2 of these in concrete floors. The safes I installed were 9" under floor safes
similar to http://www.allsafes.ie/store/Burton_Claymore_9_Underfloor_Safe.

They had a 9" square
body with an 8" square neck. I cut the concrete floor*and dug a hole 4"
wider all around the overall size of the safe and an extra 6" deeper than the
height of the safe. I then lined this hole with plastic to act as a moisture
barrier and prevent any water ingress from the surrounding ground. I then
purchased 5mm diameter steel mesh and lined the bottom and the sides of the
hole. I made up a strong mix of concrete and placed 4" of this in the bottom of
the hole ensuring that the bottom mesh was located in the centre of the
concrete. I then placed the safe into the hole sitting on the concrete and
surrounded by the steel mesh and back filled all around with concrete. I then
bent the top of the steel mesh around the neck of the safe and finished the
concrete to the top level of the safe. I installed a manhole cover over the top
and set into the concrete so that the level of cover was flush with the
surrounding floor level. I also installed a 4 core alarm cable to the underside
of the manhole cover and wired it back to the alarm panel. When the concrete had
set I returned and wired in a magnetic contact to the alarm cable at set it to
24hr protection. Therefore anytime the man hole cover is lifted to access the
safe the alarm goes off and texts the home owner and a few others living outside
the house telling them some one is trying to access the safe. I then finished by
covering over the manhole cover with a suitable floor finish i.e a tile, carpet
or wooden floor. A small bit of advice, A floor safe is fire proof by its design
( buried in the floor) but is not waterproof. Wrap everything in cling film
incase there is a flood in the house etc. Also never keep the key in your own
house. Ask a family member to hold it for you.

Sparkpea · 06-01-2011 12:29pm

angle grinder?

Nozebleed · 06-01-2011 12:30pm

gsxr1 wrote: »

TNT..Oi Oi Oi...TNT. Oi Oi Oi.

Discodog · 06-01-2011 6:50pm

A friend in England got a night job in a 24 hour petrol station. Third day & a guy put a shotgun to the hatch & another breaks the door lock. They had some explosive packed into a tube as you would do with money. They lowered it into the safe & managed to incinerate all the money.
The funny part is that when you walk in the shop you can feel yourself walking uphill as there is a big bulge in the floor where the safe had been.

I really hope that the safe companies don't offer help without being very sure that you are the owner. It would be a good headline. Safe company helps burglar steal a fortune !.

michael999999 · 07-01-2011 9:07pm

zagmund wrote: »

Further update.

The safe manufacturer tells me that the key I'm using isn't the correct one. That explains the fact that it won't turn the mechanism alright. I find the correct key is always a good starting place when trying to open a lock. In fairness, it did say it was a safe key and there aren't a whole heap of other safes around the house so it was a reasonable assumption to make.

I'm going to have a poke around and see if I can find any other similar keys floating about. At least I know what size & shape I need as the other key fits the slot perfectly.

z

Get down to your local hire shop tomorrow and get a blow torch!

Discodog · 08-01-2011 10:33am

"Now would this torch be powerful enough to open a safe". "Just wait here sir whilst we get the torch" - call the Guards !

antoinolachtnai · 08-01-2011 10:48am

If you want to leave the safe there and actually use it, why not just call a locksmith? He will also sort you out with a new key. Depending where you are, I'd say that'll cost you about 300 or 400 euros, probably less if you don't need the new key.

You need a locksmith who actually knows how to open safes though. A lot of them don't.

memomy · 01-02-2011 5:40pm

Were still waiting to hear what was in the safe???

dnme · 01-02-2011 6:53pm

yea what's the story?

memomy · 01-02-2011 7:24pm

I recon he found Maggie Tatcher's face..

zagmund · 01-02-2011 7:30pm

Still waiting to find out myself.

Mrs Zag was dispatched off to a locksmiths today for a different issue and she was going to ask what they could do.

I'll find out later what the story is.

z

mad m · 01-02-2011 8:58pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8g_GeQR8fJo

enfield · 01-02-2011 9:21pm

Drill an 8mm hole through the middle of the door. This will tell you the thickness of the door and allow you to fill the safe with water through the same hole. Then cut a square out of the door with an angle grinder and remove the contents. They will not be damaged by the sparks from the grinder as they will be under water.
Signed.
Safeman in the 'joy

Sparkpea · 02-02-2011 8:19am

and if theres a load of cash in it then it will be soaked :-)

Plazaman · 02-02-2011 8:38am

I could get my bud Smitty to help you open it. He lives in Portlaoise but is been released moving home next week. Nice lad, but jaysus whatever you do keep him away from safes squirrels.

s_carnage · 02-02-2011 8:57am

Never mind that safe I think you should put all your effort into finding the safe that the key you have belongs to!!

weiland79 · 02-02-2011 9:14am

Following thread.

How exciting!

Capt'n Midnight · 02-02-2011 9:48am

enfield wrote: »

Drill an 8mm hole through the middle of the door. This will tell you the thickness of the door and allow you to fill the safe with water through the same hole. Then cut a square out of the door with an angle grinder and remove the contents. They will not be damaged by the sparks from the grinder as they will be under water.
Signed.
Safeman in the 'joy

If it's a good safe then there will be a glass plate behind the door to prevent drilling. The glass plate holds back spring loaded locking pins. When the drill shatters the glass these pins will lock the door and the key won't open them. Probably doesn't apply to this one, but if it does then you've just painted your self into a corner.

mikemac · 02-02-2011 9:53am

Brilliant thread

We need to know what it is.
You know the Irish Crown Jewels went missing in 1907 and were never recovered

Capt'n Midnight · 02-02-2011 10:09am

feelingstressed wrote: »

Brilliant thread

We need to know what it is.
You know the Irish Crown Jewels went missing in 1907 and were never recovered

I thought we sold them to Russia or was that later on ?

mikemac · 02-02-2011 10:19am

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

I thought we sold them to Russia or was that later on ?

Nope, the new Russian Republic wanted a loan from the Free State goverment so Mick Collins arranged it and the Russian Crown Jewels used as security.
They were left in a safe and forgotton about in Ireland and later found and sent back to Russia in 1950

Maybe you're thinking of this?
The Irish Crown Jewels have never been found

Come on OP, what's in that safe?

And is there another safe with that key you have?

Capt'n Midnight · 02-02-2011 10:50am

feelingstressed wrote: »

Nope, the new Russian Republic wanted a loan from the Free State goverment so Mick Collins arranged it and the Russian Crown Jewels used as security.
They were left in a safe and forgotton about in Ireland and later found and sent back to Russia in 1950

Maybe you're thinking of this?
The Irish Crown Jewels have never been found

Come on OP, what's in that safe?
And is there another safe with that key you have?

So we didn't default back then

still there were the Shannon stopovers and the cheap fuel for CIE

zagmund · 03-02-2011 12:05pm

Unbelievable riches found.

Have moved to Cayman Islands.

Won't be coming back.

z

zagmund · 03-02-2011 12:12pm

But seriously, things move slowly in the Zag household. If there was definitely something in there I would be chasing it a lot faster, but it's on the back burner at the moment.

The locksmiths said they don't do safes but passed on details of a safe specialist. Will be contacting him shortly.

I have to presume that the idea of drilling a hole and filling it with water was a joke. First, it's a safe, so you can't just drill a hole. It's supposed to be secure. Second, as someone pointed out, if you could drill a hole and filled it with water then all those valuable £500 notes would go all soggy and the share certificates might need a spin in the drier. If they were Irish bank share certs I mightn't be too worried.

As for the Irish Crown Jewels - the house was only built in the 1950s I think, so while it's possible they are in there, I reckon it's unlikely.

z

Dermo · 03-02-2011 12:37pm

zagmund wrote: »

As for the Irish Crown Jewels - the house was only built in the 1950s I think, so while it's possible they are in there, I reckon it's unlikely.

z

But was the house deliberately built on top of the safe as a way to hide it?

cgarrad · 03-02-2011 2:01pm

Get one of theses in the hire shop, then angle grind it open slowly so as to minimize heat transfer.

memomy · 03-02-2011 2:34pm

Dermo wrote: »

But was the house deliberately built on top of the safe as a way to hide it?

Who needs movies such as 'The Jewel in the Nile' when we have our very own 'Jewel under the Tile' right here..

zagmund · 03-02-2011 2:37pm

The man has been contacted and will be coming in a few days. All will be revealed shortly. Popcorn and soft drinks will be available in the foyer.

z

bastados · 03-02-2011 2:47pm

zagmund wrote: »

Further update.

I'm going to have a poke around and see if I can find any other similar keys floating about. At least I know what size & shape I need as the other key fits the slot perfectly.

z

Good...careful not to wake the home owners

:D

nophd08 · 04-02-2011 4:58pm

I think everyone should post a guess as to whats inside.
My guess is.... The spare key..:D

u140acro3xs7dm · 04-02-2011 5:22pm

nophd08 wrote: »

I think everyone should post a guess as to whats inside.
My guess is.... The spare key..:D

My guess is that the guy took a dump in the safe as a bit of a practical joke.

memomy · 04-02-2011 6:29pm

Rhys Tart Chimpanzee wrote: »

My guess is that the guy took a dump in the safe as a bit of a practical joke.

And the air tight seal may have preserved its gooey richness and a smell that has only matured with age.. Brace yourself. :eek:

zagmund · 04-02-2011 6:48pm

The man came today.

But we weren't able to open the safe. It seems to be quite seized. We're going to try again next week after the WD40 has had a chance to work.

z

michael999999 · 05-02-2011 1:22am

zagmund wrote: »

The man came today.

But we weren't able to open the safe. It seems to be quite seized. We're going to try again next week after the WD40 has had a chance to work.

z

I told you a month ago to put in wd40!

Opening a safe buried in concrete

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