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Advantages/ Disadvantages of Joining The Reserves before Full Time AGS

245678

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,673 ✭✭✭✭senordingdong


    Geansai wrote: »
    Thats just my opinion. Obviously it isn't going to suit everybody, but I don't think it should be knocked becasue the GRA aren't 100% behind it.

    The GRA are for want of a better term, the voice of the Gardaí...so basically put, AGS are by and large, against the reserve force.

    You don't think that carries any merit?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 934 ✭✭✭C-J


    eroo wrote: »
    That's fine, but I am right in saying you don't really know anything about the Garda Reserve, regardless of who you know or what you are. So I don't think it's fair for you dismiss it as a failed concept that should be scrapped when it is actually a great resource for blooding potential full time members.

    i never said it's a failed concept, i'm saying that if it went to a vote of serving ags members then a high majority would vote against the reserves. That's just my opinion and i thought that's what these boards are here for. It's seeming a bit dictatorial at the moment, your way or the highway


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,673 ✭✭✭✭senordingdong


    eroo wrote: »
    it is actually a great resource for blooding potential full time members.

    If that's the case then surely AGS training should have been reformed instead?

    My original understanding was that GR was to take over things like clerical and administrative station work, traffic managment etc...

    As a member can you clarify if this is the case?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 265 ✭✭Tyron Jara


    I think reserves should get full garda powers of arrest but only when on duty. However they are not a substitute for the full time Gardai!! I joined the reserves for the expierence I could earn before joining the full time Gardai. (Although im still waiting for medical)

    Think about it would a full time member be happier with a reserve who has his back and can arrest someone with full garda powers are the reserves now who are limited in what they can do. Which ive read makes some guards uncomfortable on patrol with them. Even reserves from what ive read are frustrated at the lack of help they can give.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 430 ✭✭da__flash


    Tyron Jara wrote: »
    I think reserves shouls get full garda powers of arrest but only when on duty. However they are not a substitute for the full time Gardai!! I joined the reserves for the expierence I could earn before joining the full time Gardai. (Although im still waiting for medical)

    Think about it would a full time member be happier with a reserve who has his back and can arrest someone with full garda powers are the reserves now who are limited in what they can do. Which ive read makes some guards uncomfortable on patrol with them. Even reserves from what ive read are frustrated at the lack of help they can give.

    Go easy lads, new to the forum..:D:cool:

    Flash gets on knees and prays for tyron jara:P


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 265 ✭✭Tyron Jara


    da__flash wrote: »
    Go easy lads, new to the forum..:D:cool:

    Flash gets on knees and prays for tyron jara:P
    haha :P Well this is a forum to voice opinions it be nice to hear other peoples :D

    What do you think yourself?:)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,084 ✭✭✭eroo


    C-J wrote: »
    i never said it's a failed concept, i'm saying that if it went to a vote of serving ags members then a high majority would vote against the reserves. That's just my opinion and i thought that's what these boards are here for. It's seeming a bit dictatorial at the moment, your way or the highway
    Yes you are entitled to your opinion, and I am entitled to disagree with it. You claim a 'high majority' would vote against it? On what basis? Your not a member, full time or reserve, and are going on pure speculation. Any member I have met fully supports the GR as a way of getting people experience for the full time, and as extra manpower on units.
    The GRA are for want of a better term, the voice of the Gardaí...so basically put, AGS are by and large, against the reserve force.

    You don't think that carries any merit?
    No I disagree because the majority of Gardai diagreed with their calls for looking into strike action.
    My original understanding was that GR was to take over things like clerical and administrative station work, traffic managment etc...

    As a member can you clarify if this is the case?

    Reserve Gardai can undertake some administrative work such as passport and age card applications, as well as working in communications(dealing with 999 calls etc). Reserves can also be involved in traffic management, but as with most duties outside the station must be accompanied by a full time member.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 64 ✭✭mbeire


    As a former Garda reserve, now full time member I can happily say that there are no disadvantages to been a competent Garda Reserve.
    I spent over a year as a reserve, and I was the first ever reserve on the unit I was assigned. Prior to my arrival to the station there was one other reserve, and this was a Divisional headquarters, not some small rural station.

    I had to build up the trust, gain the respect of my unit, and prove to them that whatever stereotype image they had of reserves in their head was not me.
    The regular members judged me on my abilities, firstly to protect their back, protect myself, and at the same time do the job in a professional and competent manner. When I proved this they never had any issues.

    The more hours I had under my belt the more rope I was given. I was mainly either on the beat or observer in an extra third car. That was usually a proactive patrol and backing up other cars so we never really had to take any calls, unless they were urgent, therefore the driver would never be left with the paperwork of two Gardaí. The driver would love the opportunity to get on mobile patrol, so it was never like he was been sent out with me.

    I built up a good relationship with my unit and the station itself. I also assisted specialist units on specific tasks which was a great opportunity and privilege for a reserve to do.
    At no point did I feel used or left out while been a reserve. I was invited out to every event that the unit went to, birthdays, barbeques, Christmas parties, or just a general night on the town.

    When I finally got the call to start full time the unit organised a Leaving party for me before I left which I feel shows their acceptance to me. To this day they still keep in contact with me.

    The advantage of been a reserve prior to joining fulltime showed up hugely while in fulltime training. When we were been front loaded and taught all the laws, which I hadn’t be taught as a reserve, I could relate back to it from my experience on the streets as a reserves. This meant that I was able to learn all the legislation and procedures much quicker and remember it easier, compared to the person who sat either side of me.

    They would often just blank out and go what the “What the hell is he on about?” I would go explain to him how, it would be used operationally, and it would give him some understanding of what he was been taught.

    If you’re thinking of joining Fulltime then I suggest that you join the reserves first. It will be an invaluable investment in your career as a Garda or even just in your life in general. You don’t have even a slight idea of the work the Gardaí do, looking in from the outside. You have to join to see what happens in the communities and towns around Ireland.

    Every new Garda to a station, whether he or she has transferred from another station or just fresh from Templemore is judged on their way they ability to do the job. This is the same for the fulltime members and reserves members. If you can’t do the job then it doesn’t matter whether you’re a reserve or full timer.

    The only disadvantage to joining the reserve is not joining, as you lose out. If you can’t join to family commitments then you’re in for a wakeup call when you join fulltime, it’s not really a family friendly job unless you get into a specialised area after 4-5 years. And that’s with fierce competition.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,673 ✭✭✭✭senordingdong


    eroo wrote: »
    No I disagree because the majority of Gardai diagreed with their calls for looking into strike action.
    Yeah I'll give you that. Though I don't think we'll ever get a definite figure on this.
    Reserve Gardai can undertake some administrative work such as passport and age card applications, as well as working in communications(dealing with 999 calls etc). Reserves can also be involved in traffic management, but as with most duties outside the station must be accompanied by a full time member.

    So they're not really alleviating Gardaí on station duty to be put out on the streets more? They are infact being put on the streets themselves?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,128 ✭✭✭Geri Boyle


    Yeah I'll give you that. Though I don't think we'll ever get a definite figure on this.
    So they're not really alleviating Gardaí on station duty to be put out on the streets more? They are infact being put on the streets themselves?
    Well, that was never really the point. Afaik there have been civilians recruited to assist in some of the less sensitive paperwork to allow more gardai on the streets. This might be what you're referring to as opposed to the garda reserve?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,084 ✭✭✭eroo


    Blue Belle wrote: »
    Well, that was never really the point. Afaik there have been civilians recruited to assist in some of the less sensitive paperwork to allow more gardai on the streets. This might be what you're referring to as opposed to the garda reserve?
    Got it one Blue Belle!
    So they're not really alleviating Gardaí on station duty to be put out on the streets more? They are infact being put on the streets themselves?

    That was the aim all along.

    Thanks mbeire for a very informative post. Hope to follow in your footsteps someday!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 64 ✭✭mbeire


    eroo wrote: »
    Thanks mbeire for a very informative post. Hope to follow in your footsteps someday!

    Glad to be of some sort of assistance eroo. Feel free to ask any question you have.

    You should have no problems...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11 reg121corp


    regarding the title of this topic just to let ye know there is no disadvantge of joining the reserve to join the full time it is practically the best way possible and anyone lucky enough to get selected to join the reserve will have a great chance as you are aware there is talk of nearly 10000 people applying for the next recruitment i will gaurentee you one thing it will do no harm what so ever


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 51 ✭✭adrian2


    im in it myself at the moment and i definitely think it gives you an eye opener on whether this job is suited for you,the variety of the job and the specialist units have always been my dream aspect of the job and so i dont know if it will help those of us waiting to get in to the full times come interview day but it should surely be used as a litmus test to see whos had an interest in the organisation apart from someone who needs a job desperately and likes the sound of the job security aspect!im new to this so dont be too critical!


  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    Devil08 wrote: »
    Maybe do a first aid course, get your driving licence, practice the apptitude tests, join a gym and get fit and strong. Maybe do a lifesaving course. All costs money but if you have a few quid to spare and have the time id do everything you can.

    Good move to apply to the GR. Am sure that when you finally get in front of the Public Service interview board that they ask the following:

    1 Are you member of the Garda Reserve
    2. Have you applied to the Garda Reserve

    And if the answer is No you will need to have a good reason for not doing so.

    Stands to reason that somone who has gone to great lenghts to join the GR and gain some valuable experience will be a better candidate that somone who has not. A lot less chance of them leaving the training process or the job when they graduate as their experience within the Reserve will have prepared them for the rigours of the full time position. This will avoid the situation where expenditure is wasted on trainees in Templemore who decide after a short time that its not for them and will ensure that places go to those who are really interested in pursuing a career in policing.

    It may become a pre-requisite in the future that you must be a member of the Reserve in order to be considered for the full time. Not saying that this is the case just a possible maybe.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 587 ✭✭✭itsallgood


    Raider190 wrote: »
    Good move to apply to the GR. Am sure that when you finally get in front of the Public Service interview board that they ask the following:

    1 Are you member of the Garda Reserve
    2. Have you applied to the Garda Reserve

    And if the answer is No you will need to have a good reason for not doing so.

    Stands to reason that somone who has gone to great lenghts to join the GR and gain some valuable experience will be a better candidate that somone who has not. A lot less chance of them leaving the training process or the job when they graduate as their experience within the Reserve will have prepared them for the rigours of the full time position. This will avoid the situation where expenditure is wasted on trainees in Templemore who decide after a short time that its not for them and will ensure that places go to those who are really interested in pursuing a career in policing.

    It may become a pre-requisite in the future that you must be a member of the Reserve in order to be considered for the full time. Not saying that this is the case just a possible maybe.

    Afraid your wrong. They dont ask about Garda Reserve it would be up to you to raise the issue when you fill in the form about your experience and various skills.
    Also in the passed with some older retired gaurds on the interview panel it was not a good thing to be a reserve as they have a different look at an organisation they see as taking work away from full time gardai.
    There are also loads of reasons why people cant join reserves, ie work or family issues so it will never become a "pre-requisite" in the future.
    Not my own opinion but I know people it has gone against and when I did interview I wasnt asked once about reserves.


  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    itsallgood wrote: »
    Afraid your wrong. They dont ask about Garda Reserve it would be up to you to raise the issue when you fill in the form about your experience and various skills.
    Also in the passed with some older retired gaurds on the interview panel it was not a good thing to be a reserve as they have a different look at an organisation they see as taking work away from full time gardai.
    There are also loads of reasons why people cant join reserves, ie work or family issues so it will never become a "pre-requisite" in the future.
    Not my own opinion but I know people it has gone against and when I did interview I wasnt asked once about reserves.

    Thats why the panel is made up of 3 individuals ,civil servants and one retired senior officers so that the decision is a consencus and not based on 1 individuals biased opinion. And lets face it public service is public service and if you want to differentiate yourself from the other hundreds of candidates then the GR is a good place to start.

    And yes there are lots of reasons why people cant join the GR but it will always be a plus it you can prove to a panel that you are committed to your career and how better than to be devoting some of your free time to gain experience in order to assess if this is the career for you.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 934 ✭✭✭C-J


    itsallgood wrote: »
    Afraid your wrong. They dont ask about Garda Reserve it would be up to you to raise the issue when you fill in the form about your experience and various skills.
    Also in the passed with some older retired gaurds on the interview panel it was not a good thing to be a reserve as they have a different look at an organisation they see as taking work away from full time gardai.
    There are also loads of reasons why people cant join reserves, ie work or family issues so it will never become a "pre-requisite" in the future.
    Not my own opinion but I know people it has gone against and when I did interview I wasnt asked once about reserves.

    couldn't agree with this post more. You basically tick a box on your form as to whether you're in reserves, i wasn't ever asked anything remotely connected to reserves in my interview and i don't know a single person who was asked about it. It's a personal choice but i wouldn't force membership down anyone's throat. I personally have no interest in joining reserves whatsoever, but that's just me. Go for it if you think it'll help your application but i think your interview should be based on your achievements on a personal level, your general demeanour and suitability for the job


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,659 ✭✭✭Devil08


    I was asked about the reserves in my interview. Was asked if I wanted to be a Garda so much why didnt I try the reserves...I just told them that I had too many other commitments and that I didnt have the time to join the reserves. They said that was fine and moved on...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 108 ✭✭Galway Elvis


    If you are lucky enough to be on this famous panel of 160 or so with everything done, then being a Reserve Garda is not an issue.

    If you are waiting to start the whole process then being one or at least having applied could be the small difference between your interview making the grade ahead of other applicants.

    The interview panel was made up of two people in May '08, not three.

    They have the discretion of asking the question about the Reserves. It could be as simple as they deciding that your interview was as good as they wanted and asking extra questions, that they already knew the answer to anyway, was unnecessary.

    The Reserve force is different now in lots of small ways compared to when it first started. It will no doubt be different in a lot of ways in 5 or 10 years time. There could be a strong link between the Reserves and recruitment to the full time force by then. Nobody really knows.

    It is wrong to dismiss the possible benifits that being a Reserve Garda would bring to the selection and training process for becoming a full time member. Dont knock it until you have tried it.

    The way the country is at the moment and for the next 10 years by the looks of things, the Reserves could be as close as many of us in this "waiting room" get to Templemore.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 91 ✭✭michealc_87


    Devil08 wrote: »
    I was asked about the reserves in my interview. Was asked if I wanted to be a Garda so much why didnt I try the reserves...I just told them that I had too many other commitments and that I didnt have the time to join the reserves. They said that was fine and moved on...



    I got asked about the reserves in my interview also. I too answered it in pretty much the same way, he acccepted it and moved on. If I wasnt waiting for my med and pct but was waiting to apply for the next competition I would join the GR, well try to anyway ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,778 ✭✭✭WilcoOut


    Reserve Garda members are always going to be ahead of non garda members in the interview for the fulltime

    simply because,

    Reserve members have experience as operational gardai, they have been trained by the Garda College, they have a working knowledge of the law and operational policing and they have dedicated their own time to this cause

    any retired member who sits on the panel or what ever civil servant who also sits there on the panel will realise, that a reserve member who is willing to give up his/her own time in order to be better prepared for a fulltime position, is worth more than someone who isnt.

    any previous prejudice against the reserve should become null and void due to their desire to join fulltime.

    and thats the only way it should be


    anyone who cant join the reserve due to other commitments, family life etc - well thats fine. no problem. but accept that your not as experienced within the realms of operational policing and due to that, your at a disadvantage compared to attested reserve members

    makes perfect sense


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,659 ✭✭✭Devil08


    There is a seperate thread set up for Garda Reserve debate.

    However, It doesnt come into it at all though duing the recruitment process.

    The requirements are clearly set out. Once you meet them, pass the initial testing, and do well at interview then you will be placed on the panel. You are at no point being judged against other candidates in terms of their experience in Garda Reserve etc.

    Being in the Reserves will not get you into the full time force any easier. Those who think it will, are simply brown noses.

    FACT.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 587 ✭✭✭itsallgood


    WilcoOut wrote: »
    Reserve Garda members are always going to be ahead of non garda members in the interview for the fulltime

    simply because,

    Reserve members have experience as operational gardai, they have been trained by the Garda College, they have a working knowledge of the law and operational policing and they have dedicated their own time to this cause

    any retired member who sits on the panel or what ever civil servant who also sits there on the panel will realise, that a reserve member who is willing to give up his/her own time in order to be better prepared for a fulltime position, is worth more than someone who isnt.

    any previous prejudice against the reserve should become null and void due to their desire to join fulltime.

    and thats the only way it should be


    anyone who cant join the reserve due to other commitments, family life etc - well thats fine. no problem. but accept that your not as experienced within the realms of operational policing and due to that, your at a disadvantage compared to attested reserve members

    makes perfect sense

    Thats all wishful thinking but it doesn't and wont work like that. All candidates are judged as equal.
    Sorry to say but all these people that think they will do better than others not in the reserves wait till you sit down and get through the aptitude tests and rank high enough to qualify for interview stage before you can even talk to anyone about being a reserve.
    I understand that in a perfect world being a reserve would set you up for full time work and maybe that should be the case, but until they introduce a more stringent recruitment campaign for the reserves with aptitude testing it will never work like that.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 934 ✭✭✭C-J


    There were people with me for interview who were in the reserves who weren't successful. It's presumptious and somewhat childish to think reserve membership will put you ahead of anyone else, in the interview you need two things, a bit of cop on and a passion for what you're hoping to do.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,084 ✭✭✭eroo


    Think cop on is lacking around here at the moment.

    No the Reserves does not guarantee you entry into AGS as a Garda.

    Yes you do have a major advantage over non Reserves for the simple fact you have experience of the job, it's various roles and AGS members, and this will stand to you when, hopefully, you get in.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,659 ✭✭✭Devil08


    The only advantage I would say reserves have is that if they do get into the full time force, they will be familiar with procedures etc more than someone who isnt a reserve.
    But this isnt a problem to me. Everyone is put through good training both in the college and in a designated station. You arent expected to know everything once you start. Its not like you get extra money because you were a reserve and you know a little more than everyone else! You are still expected to take the same orders and do the exact same job. You have no extra qualifications than any other recruit.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,084 ✭✭✭eroo


    But you have experience. Experience can't be taught.

    Anyways, not getting into a p1ssing contest.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,659 ✭✭✭Devil08


    Yes reserves have experience. But its experince that any new recruit will easily gain once they start the job. They will catch up in no time. All Gardai have different levels of experience. It doesnt mean they are any better at their jobs. Its all about each individuals character IMO. Not looking for an arguement either so we can just agree to disagree. :p


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  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    C-J wrote: »
    couldn't agree with this post more. You basically tick a box on your form as to whether you're in reserves, i wasn't ever asked anything remotely connected to reserves in my interview and i don't know a single person who was asked about it. It's a personal choice but i wouldn't force membership down anyone's throat. I personally have no interest in joining reserves whatsoever, but that's just me. Go for it if you think it'll help your application but i think your interview should be based on your achievements on a personal level, your general demeanour and suitability for the job

    Taken from the Department of Justice powerpoint presentation on thier website. Makes sense if you have had taining and on the street experience that you will be miles ahead of a candidate who hasnt...
    Q. Will service with the reserve be taken into account when people are
    being recruited to full-time service with An Garda Síochána?
    A. Yes. Future Garda Interview Boards will be required to take into account
    the experience gained by candidates who have worked with the Garda Reserve.


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