Why the disregard of Sinn Féin?

bonerjams03 · 20-01-2011 07:31PM #1

This is based on the assumption people have had similar experiences as I have. This is a genuine question, with the election imminent I'm weighing up my options and without thinking I wrote off Sinn Féin. I've never really considered voting for them and probably won't, but why is their a casual disregard of their status as a viable party to vote for.

And I don't want the first post after this to be "They're murdering Scum" and get a million thanks. (Which someone will definitely do now that I've written that).

Okay, so we have Adams who vehemently denies leading the IRA when it's plain he had more than any old casual involvement. But Fiann Fáil are a party built on violence, and the War was won by tactics similar to that employed by the IRA of modern times, with 1916 having less of a mandate. (I'd presume).

I am not advocating this, or saying I supported it. My point is, is there something beyond the paramilitary history that warrants the sneer at the 'Sinners'? Especially now that there is a vacuum in Irish politics for a credible alternative to the main parties? If I'm honest I wouldn't be too up to speed with any SF policies, but is there reason to believe they may perform well in this election if people begin to look at them in a different light, as a political part with political policies?

Dr. Baltar · 20-01-2011 07:37PM

I'm also curious about this.

I've never been old enough to vote in a general election before, but I've always had an interest in politics. I am still weighing up who to vote for myself, but I would never consider writing of Sinn Féin immediately just because of past links to the IRA. After all, didn't both Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil have links to the IRA in the past also?

I don't understand how we can set one standard for one party and not the other.

The reason why I would be dubious about Sinn Féin is their economic policies. I believe in a conservative economy and Sinn Féin is the opposite of that. I can understand people who would write them off instantly because of their left-wing affiliations, but once again, I do not understand their past being a reason....

mcwhirter · 20-01-2011 07:40PM

If sinn fein get in then forget about ireland doing business with UK

jeepers101 · 20-01-2011 07:43PM

I don't immediately write them off and I would probably vote for them if they gave me a reason to. I always question candidates when they're doing the rounds and have consistently met Sinn Féiners who really haven't a clue.

jeepers101 · 20-01-2011 07:45PM

mcwhirter wrote: »

If sinn fein get in then forget about ireland doing business with UK

Bloody Nipples · 20-01-2011 07:50PM

They place massive emphasis on the 6 counties comprising Northern Ireland, whereas the vast majority of people in the rest of Ireland couldn't actually give too much of a fuck about it. That and they have known links with a terrorist organisation.

Wolfe Tone · 20-01-2011 07:50PM

They already do lots of business with the UK, some would say too much.

People disregard them because of their past actions, while they ignore the actions of other political parties. The media smear against them for decades has made people do that.

paky · 20-01-2011 07:51PM

people didnt vote for them in the past because they've only become a serious party in the last 12-13 years. abstentionist policies dont appeal to the vast majority of people. most people want to get on with their lives. sinn fein are evolving very fast and are now becoming a serious alternative to the traditionalist parties. i believe with a party like sinn fein in governemnt we can witness real change. the sort of change that was guaranteed by the proclamation of 1916. sinn fein has a solid leadership, probably the least corrupt of them all. im hoping to see sinn fein in governemnt this time round. they're a revolutionary party that will bring real change, the kind of change ireland needs today

LordSutch · 20-01-2011 07:53PM

IRcolm wrote: »

And I don't want the first post after this to be "They're murdering Scum" and get a million thanks. (Which someone will definitely do now that I've written that).

Okay, so we have Adams who vehemently denies leading the IRA when it's plain he had more than any old casual involvement.

Well there you go . . . . .

The wounds are still raw in many peoples minds & hearts, there may not be the 'whiff of sulphur' anymore, but there are still the memories which are hard to forget, plus the fact the SF's image down here is one of a Northern based IRA leadership - NO Thanks.

Labour & Fine Gael won't touch them anyway, for fear of freightening away their own voters.

OhNoYouDidn't · 20-01-2011 07:53PM

mcwhirter wrote: »

If sinn fein get in then forget about ireland doing business with UK

This is exactly the half baked nonsense the OP is talking about.

zig · 20-01-2011 07:53PM

mcwhirter wrote: »

If sinn fein get in then forget about ireland doing business with UK

more scare mongering, elaborate please.

OhNoYouDidn't · 20-01-2011 07:56PM

To answer the question, Irish people give out about the quality of politician and lethargy and arrogance of the political elite yet are suspicious of anything or anyone that might give it an auld shake

Cake. Eat. It. Too.

lugha · 20-01-2011 07:56PM

Sinn Fein have broadly occupy the same place on the political spectrum as the likes of Joe Higgins or Richard Boyd-Barrett. And while a lot of people would consider these guys economics to be loopy, I believe they are widely respected, Higgins in particular, as being genuinely intent on shaping the world for the better.
SF don’t get the same respect because of their past. And it isn’t sensible to compare them with what are now fully constitutional parties. That part of the past of FF and FG in ancient. SF still have their “war veterans” at the forefront of the leadership. Until they go, SF will never be widely accepted.

And even then, I don’t think they would make any greater inroads than any other socialist party. Ireland doesn’t do left. Any politicians who started off over there and who went on to be successful (Gilmore, Rabbitte etc.) had to scurry towards the centre. But then, them was the old rules.

The whole political order might get a shake up in March.

paky · 20-01-2011 07:58PM

LordSutch wrote: »

Well there you go . . . . .

The wounds are still raw in many peoples minds & hearts, there may not be the 'whiff of sulphur' anymore, but there are still the memories which are hard to forget, plus the fact the SF's image down here is one of a Northern based IRA leadership - NO Thanks.

Labour & Fine Gael won't touch them anyway :-)

well im sure if us irish can get over the countless atrocities the british carried out on us then im sure a few unionists can too. irish people have shown that they are able to forgive by hosting england at croke park. surely the unionists can return the gesture

LordSutch · 20-01-2011 08:01PM

paky wrote: »

well im sure if us irish can get over the countless atrocities the british carried out on us then im sure a few unionists can too. irish people have shown that they are able to forgive by hosting england at croke park. surely the unionists can return the gesture

Here we go . . . .

The disregard of SF is because of their past & their policies, no amount of blaming 'The British' &/or 'Unionists' will get Sinn Fein into government down here. Not too many Unionists down here you know, so its Nationalists in the South that don't vote for Sinn Fein in any great numbers, and I expect that trend to continue.

flazio · 20-01-2011 08:01PM

I can only say that at the last General election, that Sinn Fein were pushing for the early release of the Garda Detective Jerry McCabe murderers as political prisoners. I felt at the time I could not vote for a party that supported people who kill defenders of our peace for whatever reason.
These days I will read whatever the local candidate has to promise for my area and if I think they can achieve it, while they would never get my No. 1 i may bump them up the list.

KeithAFC · 20-01-2011 08:01PM

I would never vote for them in this election if i wanted to because of Bloody Friday and Enniskillen. I could not shame their names by doing so.

OhNoYouDidn't · 20-01-2011 08:02PM

LordSutch wrote: »

Well there you go . . . . .

The wounds are still raw in many peoples minds & hearts, there may not be the 'whiff of sulphur' anymore, but there are still the memories which are hard to forget, plus the fact the SF's image down here is one of a Northern based IRA leadership - NO Thanks.

Will be interesting to see if the smell of cordite matters to the voters who might be willing to hold their noses to destroy the economic terrorists.

LordSutch wrote: »

Labour & Fine Gael won't touch them anyway, for fear of freightening away their own voters.

FG won't touch them because they are chalk and cheese - to be fair SF wouldn't touch the other way.

Labour is a more interesting proposition. I think it comes down to the stickie factor. 25 years ago they were shooting at each other. Remember Harris was a hickory dick too, and while his politics are for sale, he has kept that visceral hatred of the Provo's, which is shared by a lot of his former comrades.

OhNoYouDidn't · 20-01-2011 08:04PM

LordSutch wrote: »

Here we go . . . .

The disregard of SF is because of their past, no amount of blaming 'The British' and/or 'Unionists' will get Sinn Fein into government down here.

Horse. Cart.

I think you are underestimating them and the potential for rural FF barstool republican's to give them a tick as well as their core urban base.

I think there is 8-10 seats there for them if they play it right.

paky · 20-01-2011 08:04PM

KeithAFC wrote: »

I would never vote for them in this election if i wanted to because of Bloody Friday and Enniskillen. I could not shame their names by doing so.

worken late tonight keith?

zig · 20-01-2011 08:04PM

I find it comical that people refer to Sinn Feins "lunatic" economic policies (hasnt been said in this thread yet but im sure it will be), yet are willing to go along with the herd and vote for the likes of FG or Labour who are pretty much exactly the same as Fianna Fail. Sinn Fein imo offer something different, they offer a potential change in the way politics work here. Granted they are a bit socialist economically but if they were given power they would be forced to be a bit more central making them the ideal 'left' party.

Hannibal · 20-01-2011 08:05PM

mcwhirter wrote: »

If sinn fein get in then forget about ireland doing business with UK

I think their negotiating with the British since the early 90's disproves this. Participation in the Stormont assembly etc.. People are ignorant of SF and cant be bothered finding out the facts. FG's policies are just as or even more loopy, FG will do terminal damage to this country beyond repair.

zig · 20-01-2011 08:06PM

flazio wrote: »

I can only say that at the last General election, that Sinn Fein were pushing for the early release of the Garda Detective Jerry McCabe murderers as political prisoners. I felt at the time I could not vote for a party that supported people who kill defenders of our peace for whatever reason.
These days I will read whatever the local candidate has to promise for my area and if I think they can achieve it, while they would never get my No. 1 i may bump them up the list.

Can I ask you a favour, will you please vote for whatever party you think is best for both your area, but more importantly the country. Leave the local stuff to councillors.
Not trying to be smart , just trying to remind people whenever I get the chance.

danbohan · 20-01-2011 08:07PM

KeithAFC wrote: »

I would never vote for them in this election if i wanted to because of Bloody Friday and Enniskillen. I could not shame their names by doing so.

you know i think their tally men had factored in that you might not be voting for them anyway keith , but its good you are taking a keen interest in the election down here , who knows by the time next one comes around you might be voting in it .

Monty Burnz · 20-01-2011 08:07PM

I like the notion that they would default on the banks debts, but the rest of their economic policies would make Chairman Mao weep. On top of that they've proved in NI that they are no different to any other party with regard to living it up on the public purse.

(and there's the IRA stuff too)

Hannibal · 20-01-2011 08:09PM

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I like the notion that they would default on the banks debts, but the rest of their economic policies would make Chairman Mao weep. On top of that they've proved in NI that they are no different to any other party with regard to living it up on the public purse.

In the north they dont have control over their budget, another nonsense post

whywonder · 20-01-2011 08:14PM

My biggest issue with SF is, currently, their economic policies. I haven't been a wholehearted fan of any FF/FG policies either, but the SF economic agenda really takes the biscuit, IMO. They don't really seem to have the barest grasp on how the Irish economy works- socialist leanings or no, in order to succeed in government they would at least need to be competent to perform within a capitalist economy and I have seen no indication of that from them in the last decade.

And then to the TDs that are currently representing SF in the Dail- I wouldn't trust a single one of them to balance a chequebook, never mind run the country. If SF do manage to swing a position in government, I'll be on the picketline protesting that move- and I'll make no apologies for it, either.

KeithAFC · 20-01-2011 08:15PM

danbohan wrote: »

you know i think their tally men had factored in that you might not be voting for them anyway keith , but its good you are taking a keen interest in the election down here , who knows by the time next one comes around you might be voting in it .

If i was a republican, why would i want to vote for the biggest bullsh*tter this Island has seen in terms of politics? Gerry Adams is a complete liar and what most people should be looking for in politics with a leader is some one who is honest and has credibility. All Gerry Adams does best is spit on the faces of the people who fell in the republican side during the conflict and spits in the face of people who were proud to be in the IRA.

Forget his policies, start with the man and the man is a liar and a bullsh*tter.

20-01-2011 08:16PM

Its bad enough we have dodgy dealings with banks and developers now some people want us to take yet another step backward and have dodgy dealings with political wings of terrorist organisations

What an electorate

Monty Burnz · 20-01-2011 08:17PM

Dotsey wrote: »

In the north they dont have control over their budget, another nonsense post

So anyone who disagrees with Shinner propaganda is talking nonsense? I suppose I'd better keep my mouth shut or a volunteer will be around to see to my knees...

melekalikimaka · 20-01-2011 08:17PM

gerry adams is about a likeable as saddam

Why the disregard of Sinn Féin?

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