Horrific treatment of prisoners.

Wolfe Tone · 18-01-2011 10:29PM

Dionysus wrote: »

How about if you want them, you get them yourself. Alternatively, whoever is making them, can support them.

I stuck some links in my post there.

phasers · 18-01-2011 10:30PM

Not only that OP, but they're also frequently subjected to a salad tossing

Einhard · 18-01-2011 10:31PM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Thats the thing, the media is not reporting on it, the details I have are from letters and comments from the prisoners themselves and their families/friends.

Much as I despise dissident Republicans, and indeed anyone who decides that that they have the right to murder and maim innocents in the name of personal ideology, mistreatment and abuse of any prisoner should not be condoned. However, the very people who are complaining of alleged abuse in prison, are those who would happily plant bombs and plan murders in direct contravention of the will of the people of this island, so you'll have to forgive me if I don't give their complaints much credence.

Wolfe Tone · 18-01-2011 10:36PM

Einhard wrote: »

Much as I despise dissident Republicans, and indeed anyone who decides that that they have the right to murder and maim innocents in the name of personal ideology, mistreatment and abuse of any prisoner should not be condoned. However, the very people who are complaining of alleged abuse in prison, are those who would happily plant bombs and plan murders in direct contravention of the will of the people of this island, so you'll have to forgive me if I don't give their complaints much credence.

There are murderers in the prison who arent republican and they are not treated as bad. You could apply your logic to any prisoner tbh to palm off mistreatment allegations.

Einhard · 18-01-2011 10:43PM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

There are murderers in the prison who arent republican and they are not treated as bad. You could apply your logic to any prisoner tbh to palm off mistreatment allegations.

But we don't actually know that they're treated badly. That's my point. All we have is word of would be murderers and bombers. Were we to automatically take every single, unsubstantiated claim of abuse by a prisoner at face value, the whole system would collapse. Also, as another poster has pointed out, none of the NGOs who would normally make some noise about such treatment has alleged anything of the sort. So the already dubious claims further lose credibility. The claims should be taken seriously, but until it is proven otherwise, they are allegations and nothing more. And given the character of those making the allegations, I prefer to err on the side of caution before jumping in with judgements. How is it that when claims are made about, say, Gerry Adams being a member of the IRA, Republicans shriek about there being no conclusive evidence, yet unproven allegations made by fellow Republicans are treated as the gospel? Seems a double standard to be honest.

dxhound2005 · 18-01-2011 10:47PM

How did this thread get unlocked?

Wolfe Tone · 18-01-2011 10:48PM

Einhard wrote: »

But we don't actually know that they're treated badly. That's my point. All we have is word of would be murderers and bombers. Were we to automatically take every single, unsubstantiated claim of abuse by a prisoner at face value, the whole system would collapse. Also, as another poster has pointed out, none of the NGOs who would normally make some noise about such treatment has allaged anything of the sort. So the already dubious claims further lose credibility. The claims should be taken seriously, but until it is proven otherwise, they are allegations and nothing more. And given the character of those making the allegations, I prefer to err on the side of caution before jumping in with judgements. How is it that when claims are made about the, say, Gerry Adams being a member of the IRA, Republicans shriek about there being no conclusive evidence, yet unproven allegations made by fellow Republicans are treated as the gospel? Seems a double standard to be honest.

Have you read the links I posted? There are details of a report in one which gives weight to the claims.

Why would they lie? There are dozens of first hand accounts of abuse.

martic · 18-01-2011 10:50PM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

How did this thread get unlocked?

Think it was re-opened under the terms of the Good Friday Agreement

Buceph · 18-01-2011 10:54PM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Have you read the links I posted? There are details of a report in one which gives weight to the claims.

Why would they lie? There are dozens of first hand accounts of abuse.

There was criticism of one aspect that could even be partially seen as any form of "torture." The site you linked to doesn't even link to the report. They cherry picked their words and statements very carefully. And most of all I would have thought if there's any truth to their claims, an NGO along the lines of Amnesty International would be all over a Western World superpower abusing prisoners. There's no credibility given to any claim of torture from an independent, respected authority.

And the idea that these scumbags should be taken at their word? You're having a laugh.

Wolfe Tone · 18-01-2011 10:58PM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

How did this thread get unlocked?

I fired off a PM and provided some links.

Mac daddy · 18-01-2011 11:01PM

Poor prisoners :rolleyes: couldn't care less what happens to them.

Wolfe Tone · 18-01-2011 11:25PM

Mac daddy wrote: »

Poor prisoners :rolleyes: couldn't care less what happens to them.

Why not? Prisoners should not be treated in such a way.

SEPT 23 1989 · 18-01-2011 11:47PM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Why not? Prisoners should not be treated in such a way.

Right or wrong they are big boys fighting a war yes

so when the enemy gets nasty,as they do in conflict situations

they cry foul??????

imme · 19-01-2011 12:07AM

Overheal wrote: »

Poltics, tbh. Not AH

History & Heritage I'd guess would be even more appropriate.

Coriolanus · 19-01-2011 12:09AM

He who lives by the bomb, gets the **** kicked out of him by a prisonguards baton.

Wolfe Tone · 19-01-2011 12:10AM

imme wrote: »

History & Heritage I'd guess would be even more appropriate.

How when it is currently happening?

previous user · 19-01-2011 12:11AM

INLA? who the fcuk are they?

stovelid · 19-01-2011 12:13AM

Despise terrorists of all hues (and I never agreed with them having any type of political status in prison) but obviously I vehemently oppose the torture or deliberate mistreatment of same: then and now.

RMD · 19-01-2011 12:15AM

When the Republicans grant the basic right of allowing people to live in safety then I might support the idea of giving them human rights. I would like to see this happen to both Republicans and Loyalists, break all the fúckers completely.

InTheTrees · 19-01-2011 12:16AM

I give money to Amnesty International.

Thats an organisation I respect and trust. Whats their take on the issue?

philstar · 19-01-2011 12:17AM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

How when it is currently happening?

where mountjoy?

as for the north all the terrorists have been freed ever since the good friday agreement

anyway who gives a flying fcuk if they get/got a hard time in prision, what compassion did they show when they were blowing the crap out of innocent civilians ..NONE

Wolfe Tone · 19-01-2011 12:19AM

philstar wrote: »

where mountjoy?

as for the north all the terrorists have been freed ever since the good friday agreement

anyway who gives a flying fcuk if they get/got a hard time in prision, what compassion did they show when they were blowing the crap out of innocent civilians ..NONE

Did you read the OP and its links? In the north. Dont know what the conditions are in portlaois, much better I think.

Terry · 19-01-2011 12:20AM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

How did this thread get unlocked?

I'd imagine a Mod unlocked it. It only takes two clicks.

As for mistreatment of murderers, **** them.
It's not nice from a moral standpoint, but you're talking about people who are willing to kill innocent civilians.

Wolfe Tone · 19-01-2011 12:22AM

previous user wrote: »

INLA? who the fcuk are they?

Irish National Liberation Army

Wolfe Tone · 19-01-2011 12:27AM

Terry wrote: »

I'd imagine a Mod unlocked it. It only takes two clicks.

As for mistreatment of murderers, **** them.
It's not nice from a moral standpoint, but you're talking about people who are willing to kill innocent civilians.

Ah but Terry the "normal" murderers are not being treated the same way.

previous user · 19-01-2011 12:27AM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Irish National Liberation Army

Well big woo to them.

Wolfe Tone · 19-01-2011 12:30AM

previous user wrote: »

Well big woo to them.

Eh, ok you asked.

philstar · 19-01-2011 12:35AM

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Ah but Terry the "normal" murderers are not being treated the same way.

oh so you class them as murderers, wow thats a first:cool:

listen mussolini why don't you start a thread about the plight of the relatives of the Omagh bomb victims instead, a much more worthy cause

Wolfe Tone · 19-01-2011 12:38AM

philstar wrote: »

oh so you class them as murderers, wow thats a first:cool:

listen mussolini why don't you start a thread about the plight of the relatives of the Omagh bomb victims instead, a much more worthy cause

Funny you should say that cause not all of them actually killed anyone, or even tried to.

You are welcome to go start a thread on it by all means, I will contribute.

philstar · 19-01-2011 12:43AM

well i taught it would make a change from your pro-IRA crap

Horrific treatment of prisoners.

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