The Status Of Irish.

cyclopath2001 · 27-12-2010 7:39am

deise go deo wrote: »

The state supporting Irish, and it being compulsory are two very different things, The majority of people in this country want the Irish language to be supported by the state, some of them may not agree with it being a compulsory subject in school, but that dosent mean that they dont want the state to support it. The only justification for the state spending money on the Irish language, and the only justification needed for it, is that it is clearly the will of the majority that it be supported.
Some people here seam to have convinced themselves that the state spending money on the Irish language is some kind of con that is foisted on the state by a minority who are only in it for the money, that is simply a delusion.

It is fact that billions of euro have been spent, 80 years have passed and millions of English speaking children have been compelled to learn Irish.
It is fact that after all of this, most of those subjected to forcible Irish speaking lessons, don't speak Irish, and only a few thousand English speaking people use Irish in their daily lives. It is fact that native speaking of Irish is in decline.

To ignore these facts and to insist that a new kinder, more expensive form of Irish language imposition will succeed is the biggest delusion of all.

RandomName2 · 27-12-2010 2:27pm

deise go deo wrote: »

The state supporting Irish, and it being compulsory are two very different things, The majority of people in this country want the Irish language to be supported by the state, some of them may not agree with it being a compulsory subject in school, but that dosent mean that they dont want the state to support it. The only justification for the state spending money on the Irish language, and the only justification needed for it, is that it is clearly the will of the majority that it be supported.
Some people here seam to have convinced themselves that the state spending money on the Irish language is some kind of con that is foisted on the state by a minority who are only in it for the money, that is simply a delusion.

Well I think that the original OP question about comulsion has been categorically answered, at least for the Leaving Cert.

In terms of support of the language per se: has anyone ever been asked? As I previously said, it was institutionalised by CnG and FF at the birth of this state, but not much debate has occurred since (the simple matter of compulsion or non-compulsion for the LC is about as far as mainstream discussion has managed to wade into).

Whether people, in general, support the language?

I'd say they probably do (my guess): but how long is a piece of string?

I 'support' the language, insofar I believe that it should be preserved and made available to those who wish to learn it. I might even support state aid of a couple of Gaelteachts (within reason). Okay, segregation of housing based upon whether or not you can speak a certain language is pretty noxious, but if it's only in a couple of isolated areas it might be beneficial.

Anyway: no mention of the spending concerning the Irish language is part of the weakness of the government. The Irish language is also a pet project of FF, but that not the main issue here. Rather, it is an unmentionable within the Dail, and spending cuts are far more likely to affect lets-say infrastructure development or social welfare as these things can be rationally discussed. To question the Irish language budget can easily lead to being termed unpatriotic (as, I'm sure, our SF supporters would be quick to shout).

Not being able to discuss certain things within government does not lead to good decisions. Shall we regulate the banks, Bertie? - no! no! Don't rock that boat, it's the only thing keeping the property bubble going!

deise go deo · 27-12-2010 3:33pm

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

It is fact that billions of euro have been spent, 80 years have passed and millions of English speaking children have been compelled to learn Irish.
It is fact that after all of this, most of those subjected to forcible Irish speaking lessons, don't speak Irish, and only a few thousand English speaking people use Irish in their daily lives. It is fact that native speaking of Irish is in decline.

To ignore these facts and to insist that a new kinder, more expensive form of Irish language imposition will succeed is the biggest delusion of all.

You make the assumption that the factor preventing people learning Irish is that they simply refuse to, That they do not learn Irish because they simply do not want to learn it. In this situation it would follow that if they were willing to learn Irish they would learn it.

I contend that up to now, the way Irish has been thought has been wholly unsuited to people actually learning to speak Irish, That the curriculum is not capable of teaching people to speak Irish in a normal way and allow them to use Irish in their daily lives if they wanted to. And that this inability of the curriculum is due to how Irish is thought, not how willing people are to learn it.
Many people who are willing to learn Irish, Who actually want to learn it, fail to do so, This can not be explained save that the way they are thought is flawed.

So the explanation for people not using Irish in their daily lives is that they were never taught to do so properly in the first place, not that they chose not to learn the language.

That is my argument. On the basis of it I believe that should the curriculum be reformed, so that people are actually taught to speak Irish, rather than learn off answers to questions they dont even understand, then more people will speak Irish.
I dont think every single person wants to learn Irish, but as I have argued at length, I believe that the vast majority are open to learning it. And the vast majority are open to using it should they be able to leaving the education system.

And just to set the record straight, There is no reason at all for a 'new kinder, form of Irish language imposition' to be more expensive. That is a misrepresentation, something I have never suggested, nor dose reason suggest it would or need to be the case.

marienbad · 27-12-2010 3:37pm

There has never been an open discussion about attitudes to the Irish language and the vested interests have made sure to keep it that way. To even question the subject risks being labelled unpatriotic/west brit/ whatever, which tends to put put a damper on rational discussion and as for a politician it is believed to be a complete loser. I half suspect we are very wrong.

I would say you have 10% on either end of the spectrum violently pro or anti , and then the 80% in the middle who really dont give a toss , but say they do and probably believe it when they say it.

You ask any one of those if they still support it when they, or their sons or daughters are denied a house, a job, a sinecure because they dont have Irish and you will see their real views.

If politicians begin to stand up to these lobbies I think we will in the main be pleasantly surprised. It is simply not a mainstream issue and if that politician does good work people will support him or her regardless, and they may even listen to his arguments.

Particularly now when everything comes down to ''it's the economy stupid ''

marienbad · 27-12-2010 3:43pm

deise go deo wrote: »

You make the assumption that the factor preventing people learning Irish is that they simply refuse to, That they do not learn Irish because they simply do not want to learn it. In this situation it would follow that if they were willing to learn Irish they would learn it.

I contend that up to now, the way Irish has been thought has been wholly unsuited to people actually learning to speak Irish, That the curriculum is not capable of teaching people to speak Irish in a normal way and allow them to use Irish in their daily lives if they wanted to. And that this inability of the curriculum is due to how Irish is thought, not how willing people are to learn it.
Many people who are willing to learn Irish, Who actually want to learn it, fail to do so, This can not be explained save that the way they are thought is flawed.

So the explanation for people not using Irish in their daily lives is that they were never taught to do so properly in the first place, not that they chose not to learn the language.

That is my argument. On the basis of it I believe that should the curriculum be reformed, so that people are actually taught to speak Irish, rather than learn off answers to questions they dont even understand, then more people will speak Irish.
I dont think every single person wants to learn Irish, but as I have argued at length, I believe that the vast majority are open to learning it. And the vast majority are open to using it should they be able to leaving the education system.

And just to set the record straight, There is no reason at all for a 'new kinder, form of Irish language imposition' to be more expensive. That is a misrepresentation, something I have never suggested, nor dose reason suggest it would or need to be the case.

So my reading of this Deise is that you are banking all on the way it is taught, is that correct ?

So if we do not have significant improvement within say 5 years will you be open to the posssibility that people just are not open to learning it.

deise go deo · 27-12-2010 7:40pm

marienbad wrote: »

So my reading of this Deise is that you are banking all on the way it is taught, is that correct ?

So if we do not have significant improvement within say 5 years will you be open to the posssibility that people just are not open to learning it.

What do you mean? The curriculum is still in need of reform, In 5 years time we will have the same poor system producing the same poor results. If the system was reformed properly then I think you would see results, 5 years is a rather short time frame to see large social change, but I think the beginnings of change would be there to be seen, and continue at a steady pace.

There are many factors at play, such as the provision of state services, the use of Irish in the media and the use of Irish by the government in general(In the Dáil, by politicians in interviews etc) and of course the Education System as well as many other factors. All the factors need to be looked at to have effective change, However I think that most of the other factors are at a stage where improving them further(and the cost that would imply) would not be cost effective in the change in the use of the language they would lead to.

The Education system is one of the bigger factors
I think that the education system is an area where much better results can be achieved, i think that the root cause of the poor results is the Curriculum,

Now what exactly is the problem with the curriculum?
Firstly, I think the priority in the Education system as regards Irish should be to teach people to speak the language.
As it is now, the curriculum is failing badly to do this, but then it is not designed to do this either, people spend a very disproportionate amount of time rote learning stories, and poetry, often without understanding what they mean. Aspects of the language that most people find boring and difficult, and have very little meaning to peoples lives. I feel this overall is at best useless, and at worst counterproductive as it leads to resentment, people know that learning Peig is both useless and pointless, and as such dont want to learn it, Some people feel this way about the language its self, but not many, learning literature when people dont even understand the language will only make such resentment worse and act as a barrier to people who are open to learning the language.

Oral receives little time in the LC course, most time is spent learning poetry and learning how to answer questions on a comprehension piece, many students do not have a normal conversation in Irish until their Oral Exam, a ridiculous state of affairs. Even the Oral part of the Curriculum is in some need of reform, though not as much as other aspects of the Curriculum. Oral need to be given much more emphasis if real change is to happen, Students, need to be having conversations in the classroom with the teacher and each other, they need to experience Irish as a means of communication.

The other aspect of the Education system that is a factor on the Irish Language is Irish medium education, There are signs of hope here, Here we see what can be achieved when the language is taught properly, This sector has grown strongly over the past 30 years and demand is still well ahead of supply. The state should continue to support these schools and support the setting up of new Gaelscoileanna in areas where there is sufficient demand for them.
There are several factors which have thus far restricted the Gaelscoil movement, the dept of Educations refusal to recognize and support any new Gaelscoileanna until new regulations are put in place being the biggest, also the lack of teacher training through Irish for teachers that are to teach in these schools. These factors must also be tackled to allow the gaelscoil movement to grow naturally with demand.

Should Irish be reformed in our schools, and the Gaelscoil movement be properly sported, then I believe that the conditions for Irish to grow would be met, and as such the use of Irish in our society would grow steadily.

If this did not happen, if despite being taught how to use Irish and having the opportunity to use Irish, People 'chose' not to use it, then yes, The only reasonable conclusion is that people dont want to use it.

cyclopath2001 · 27-12-2010 10:43pm

It is reasonable to argue that the method of Irish teaching is important when it comes to willing English-speaking students.

But, let's look at what is happenening to Irish-speaking students of Irish-speaking parents. Their use of Irish is diminishing as the integrate into our English-speaking society.

Therefore, even if Irish were taught brilliantly to English-speakers who wish to learn Irish, it is even more likely than for native speakers that they will not use Irish in their daily lives.

We're spending an awful lot of money based on nothing more than the wishful thinking of CnaG and its fanatical followers.

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 12:45am

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

It is reasonable to argue that the method of Irish teaching is important when it comes to willing English-speaking students.

But, let's look at what is happenening to Irish-speaking students of Irish-speaking parents. Their use of Irish is diminishing as the integrate into our English-speaking society.

Therefore, even if Irish were taught brilliantly to English-speakers who wish to learn Irish, it is even more likely than for native speakers that they will not use Irish in their daily lives.

We're spending an awful lot of money based on nothing more than the wishful thinking of CnaG and its fanatical followers.

I dont think so, The reason Irish speakers dont use Irish in their daily lives when they 'Integrate' into English speaking Society is that they are in the massive minority in the Cities they are in, That is why a critical mass needs to be reached, This can be reached by properly teaching people how to speak Irish and through Immersion education.

30 years ago In Cardiff it was rare to hear welsh spoken in public, now however it is very common, in some parts of the City its even unusual not to hear it, Despite the fact that Cardiff is quite a distance away from traditional Welsh speaking Communities,
When Welsh speakers first moved to Cardiff, Welsh was rarely spoken, and when people spoke welsh there, they got accused of being arrogant and exclusive, However the result was not an Integration into English speaking communities and an abandonment of Welsh speaking, The result was an explosion of Welsh Medium Education, most of which came from Native English Speakers. To the extent that now one of the features of Local politics in Cardiff is the Closure of English medium Schools to make way for Welsh Medium Schools. There was no build up of resentment, No abandonment of Welsh after Leaving the Education System, but a successful revival of the Welsh Language.
So no, Not Wishful thinking, but rather a revival movement based on similar revival movements in other countries.

marienbad · 28-12-2010 12:57am

deise go deo wrote: »

I dont think so, The reason Irish speakers dont use Irish in their daily lives when they 'Integrate' into English speaking Society is that they are in the massive minority in the Cities they are in, That is why a critical mass needs to be reached, This can be reached by properly teaching people how to speak Irish and through Immersion education.

30 years ago In Cardiff it was rare to hear welsh spoken in public, now however it is very common, in some parts of the City its even unusual not to hear it, Despite the fact that Cardiff is quite a distance away from traditional Welsh speaking Communities,
When Welsh speakers first moved to Cardiff, Welsh was rarely spoken, and when people spoke welsh there, they got accused of being arrogant and exclusive, However the result was not an Integration into English speaking communities and an abandonment of Welsh speaking, The result was an explosion of Welsh Medium Education, most of which came from Native English Speakers. To the extent that now one of the features of Local politics in Cardiff is the Closure of English medium Schools to make way for Welsh Medium Schools. There was no build up of resentment, No abandonment of Welsh after Leaving the Education System, but a successful revival of the Welsh Language.
So no, Not Wishful thinking, but rather a revival movement based on similar revival movements in other countries.

And has compulsion been part of this success Deise ?

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 1:07am

marienbad wrote: »

And has compulsion been part of this success Deise ?

AFAIK, Welsh is compulsory to the GCSE's(Around 16)
Not that my argument was on compulsion, but rather against the idea that Irish speakers will integrate into English speaking Society regardless.

EDIT: From Wikipedia-

Naisc

Perhaps most important of all, at the end of the 20th century it became compulsory for all schoolchildren to learn Welsh up to age 16, and this both reinforced the language in Welsh-speaking areas and reintroduced at least an elementary knowledge of it in areas which had become more or less wholly Anglophone. The decline in the percentage of people in Wales who can speak Welsh has now been halted, and there are even signs of a modest recovery. However, although Welsh is the daily language in many parts of Wales, English is universally understood.

cyclopath2001 · 28-12-2010 9:15am

So, by your own admission, the revival of Irish depends on compelling people to learn it.

Ireland is not Wales.

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 12:17pm

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

So, by your own admission, the revival of Irish depends on compelling people to learn it.

I dont think it is absolutely necessary, but making Irish optional wont help, It will just be another roadblock in the way of the revival of the language, However Irish will still be compulsory to JC level so should the Curriculum be reformed and the teaching of Irish be managed in a Progressive and joined up way between Primary and Secondary level then the language can still be revived.

Ireland is not Wales.

Well done, But do you not think that in a society so similar and near by, that their attempts to revive their language are relevant to a discussion about a movement with the same aims here? I think that the success in Wales in Reviving the Welsh Language are quite relevant to this discussion.

cyclopath2001 · 28-12-2010 12:29pm

deise go deo wrote:

Well done, But do you not think that in a society so similar and near by, that their attempts to revive their language are relevant to a discussion about a movement with the same aims here? I think that the success in Wales in Reviving the Welsh Language are quite relevant to this discussion.

80 years of compulsion and huge amounts of money wasted would be one significant difference between here and Wales.

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 12:42pm

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

80 years of compulsion and huge amounts of money wasted would be one significant difference between here and Wales.

What makes that difference so significant?
Welsh Is being revived successfully, Irish can be too. Compulsion played a part in the revival of Welsh and It can here too.

SkepticOne · 28-12-2010 2:29pm

deise go deo wrote: »

What makes that difference so significant?
Welsh Is being revived successfully, Irish can be too. Compulsion played a part in the revival of Welsh and It can here too.

Not compulsory in Wales for the final two years of secondary school. Yet try that here and the knee-jerk compulsion brigade jump down your throat.

cyclopath2001 · 28-12-2010 3:10pm

deise go deo wrote: »

What makes that difference so significant?

It could indicate a number of things:

1: That people don't want to speak Irish.

2: That the people (CnaG/FF) responsible for imposing Irish on our English-speaking population have presided over a very expensive, 80 year-long flop and cannot be trusted.

deise go deo wrote: »

Welsh Is being revived successfully, Irish can be too. Compulsion played a part in the revival of Welsh and It can here too.

I'm sure we could 'revive' Klingon, if we made it compulsory.

But, like you say, it's about Irish (and not what's best for the people of Ireland).

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 3:41pm

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

It could indicate a number of things:

1: That people don't want to speak Irish.

2: That the people (CnaG/FF) responsible for imposing Irish on our English-speaking population have presided over a very expensive, 80 year-long flop and cannot be trusted.

Not really, the curriculum is poor, the results are poor, even among people who want to learn Irish, That suggests to me that the curriculum is and always was the cause of the problem, especially when Compulsion else where works well.

You seam to think that CnaG, A non govermental organisation that wants the system to be changed is somehow responsible for the system. Illogical at best. The Dept of Education is responsible, and certainly FF is responsible for not reforming the system,
Your attempts to lump CnaG and FF together are funny, they are two entirely separate organisations which are not affiliated to one another in any way.

I'm sure we could 'revive' Klingon, if we made it compulsory.

But, like you say, it's about Irish (and not what's best for the people of Ireland).

Revive Klingon? When was Klingon spoken here?:p

cyclopath2001 · 28-12-2010 4:28pm

deise go deo wrote: »

Not really, the curriculum is poor, the results are poor, even among people who want to learn Irish, That suggests to me that the curriculum is and always was the cause of the problem, especially when Compulsion else where works well.

Where there's a will (to learn Irish), there's a way. I'm sure you believe 'compulsion works', but that does not make it morally right.

deise go deo wrote: »

Your attempts to lump CnaG and FF together are funny, they are two entirely separate organisations which are not affiliated to one another in any way.

Your attempt to put distance between yourselves and your very unpopular political bedfellows is quite understandable. I'd say if we looked at CnaG's membership, we'd find quite a strong representation from the educational establishment.

If Irish has been mis-taught for 80 years, where was CnaG when this was happening?

deise go deo wrote: »

Revive Klingon? When was Klingon spoken here?:p

When was Irish last spoken as the common language of Dublin?

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 5:08pm

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

Where there's a will (to learn Irish), there's a way. I'm sure you believe 'compulsion works', but that does not make it morally right.

No it dosent, but then I see no reason to think of compulsion in the education system as Morally Wrong. Compulsion is very common in Education, Here and Elsewhere.

Your attempt to put distance between yourselves and your very unpopular political bedfellows is quite understandable. I'd say if we looked at CnaG's membership, we'd find quite a strong representation from the educational establishment.

Maybe I need to spell this out for you. I am Not a Member of CNAG

CnaG Had to deal with FF because they were in Government, When FG are in Government, CnaG will Deal with them. Makes sense dont you think, No Point lobbying the opposition to change Policy they dont have control of.

If Irish has been mis-taught for 80 years, where was CnaG when this was happening?

What is your point? I am not a member of CnaG nor do I know what their policy was 50 years ago, What I do know is CnaG today want the system to change.

When was Irish last spoken as the common language of Dublin?

What has that to do with it? Mid 1600's AFAIK, When and why did English become the common language of Carlow?

What is the relevance of this? The fact is that most people support the revival of the Irish language.

cyclopath2001 · 28-12-2010 8:54pm

deise go deo wrote: »

No it dosent, but then I see no reason to think of compulsion in the education system as Morally Wrong.

It is when it involves a language which is not one's native language.

deise go deo wrote: »

Maybe I need to spell this out for you. I am Not a Member of CNAG.........I am not a member of CnaG nor do I know what their policy was 50 years ago, What I do know is CnaG today want the system to change.

You want to restore a former common language, but the past is of no interest to you? You've been cutting and pasting pages and pages from CnaG's playbook and you quite obviously support all of its policies. Why on earth are you not a member of CnaG or it's affiliates? That way, you would be adding to the numbers who 'support Irish'.

deise go deo wrote: »

Mid 1600's AFAIK, When and why did English become the common language of Carlow?

So how long does a region have to be non-Irish speaking before you will relent with your demands that they switch 'back' to Irish?

deise go deo wrote: »

The fact is that most people support the revival of the Irish language.

The fact is that most people don't want to learn Irish, but they're happy if other people wish to speak it.

DJP · 28-12-2010 10:46pm

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

It is when it involves a language which is not one's native language.

It is a native language to Ireland and is more Irish than Hiberno English is.

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

The fact is that most people don't want to learn Irish, but they're happy if other people wish to speak it.

Most people would like to be able to speak Irish. I would like to be able to speak all the continental European languages but I am not prepared to learn them as I am hardly ever going to use them. The same goes with Irish. If everyone who went to Ard-Rang/Advanced Irish classes every year spoke Irish every day- were fluent- there would be a lot more Irish speakers in the country. The Anglo-American media is huge though and in most respects we are like a province of England. Hopefully the Strategy by creating Irish language cultural centres, like the one in Belfast and Derry, and promoting it more will increase the number of Irish speakers to 250,000 which is the aim.

Iwasfrozen · 28-12-2010 11:15pm

Darren J. Prior wrote: »

It is a native language to Ireland and is more Irish than Hiberno English is.

In that case it's a pity for you Ireland doesn't talk, eh?

Darren J. Prior wrote: »

Most people would like to be able to speak Irish. I would like to be able to speak all the continental European languages but I am not prepared to learn them as I am hardly ever going to use them. The same goes with Irish. If everyone who went to Ard-Rang/Advanced Irish classes every year spoke Irish every day- were fluent- there would be a lot more Irish speakers in the country. The Anglo-American media is huge though and in most respects we are like a province of England. Hopefully the Strategy by creating Irish language cultural centres, like the one in Belfast and Derry, and promoting it more will increase the number of Irish speakers to 250,000 which is the aim.

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here but I would be very surprised if you got 250,000 speakers ever, let alone by a deadline. By the way when is the deadline?

And even if you did get 250,000 speakers it would still only be one thirteenth of the population of Ireland. Hardly worth the money being put into it.

DJP · 28-12-2010 11:23pm

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

And even if you did get 250,000 speakers it would still only be one thirteenth of the population of Ireland. Hardly worth the money being put into it.

And you are going to 1) complain on a website about that or 2) lobby some politicians 3) start a campaign against the money spent promoting Irish?

Iwasfrozen · 28-12-2010 11:25pm

Darren J. Prior wrote: »

And you are going to 1) complain on a website about that or 2) lobby some politicians 3) start a campaign against the money spent promoting Irish?

No, I'm going to do number four. Raise the issue with any politican who comes looking for my vote.

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 11:53pm

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

It is when it involves a language which is not one's native language.

So Compulsory English is immoral in the Gaelthachts then?:rolleyes:
No, Compulsory learning is not immoral, its a normal part of many education systems.

You want to restore a former common language, but the past is of no interest to you? You've been cutting and pasting pages and pages from CnaG's playbook and you quite obviously support all of its policies. Why on earth are you not a member of CnaG or it's affiliates? That way, you would be adding to the numbers who 'support Irish'.

No particular reason, just havent gotten around to it, I am doing my own thing as far as promoting the Language in UL, We work with CnaG now and again, but I am not a member of the organisation.

So how long does a region have to be non-Irish speaking before you will relent with your demands that they switch 'back' to Irish?

My relentless demands? It is the people of Ireland who support the Irish language, Should that stop, then any relentless demands on my part would be meaningless, But I dont think that will happen any time soon.

deise go deo · 28-12-2010 11:55pm

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

No, I'm going to do number four. Raise the issue with any politican who comes looking for my vote.

would that not be option 2?

Iwasfrozen · 29-12-2010 12:04am

deise go deo wrote: »

would that not be option 2?

Nope because I'm not actually lobbying them. Only asking them their opinion then basing my decision on whether of not to vote for them on their answer.

cyclopath2001 · 29-12-2010 9:54am

deise go deo wrote: »

So Compulsory English is immoral in the Gaelthachts then?:rolleyes:

I agree with you, English should be optional for Irish-speakers. Indeed, compulsory English lessons have contributed to the decline of native Irish speaking, something which you are fighting to preserve.

deise go deo wrote: »

No particular reason, just havent gotten around to it, I am doing my own thing as far as promoting the Language in UL, We work with CnaG now and again, but I am not a member of the organisation.

Ah that's so Irish. I suppose I should give you credit for not joining an organisation you don't know much about.

deise go deo wrote: »

My relentless demands? It is the people of Ireland who support the Irish language,

They support the right of those who wish to speak Irish. That's all.

cyclopath2001 · 29-12-2010 11:33am

Darren J. Prior wrote: »

It is a native language to Ireland and is more Irish than Hiberno English is.

That may have been the case 700 years ago, but not today.

Darren J. Prior wrote: »

The Anglo-American media is huge though and in most respects we are like a province of England.

This is true. There are no actual plans to change this.

Darren J. Prior wrote: »

Hopefully the Strategy by creating Irish language cultural centres, like the one in Belfast and Derry, and promoting it more will increase the number of Irish speakers to 250,000 which is the aim.

It's just a strategy, there are no actual plans to increase the number to 250,000.

nice_guy80 · 29-12-2010 1:56pm

I think it would be just cheaper to give a grant to families who speak Irish in the home - anywhere in the country.

than wasting all this money on language promotion etc

But there has to be at least 20 families within a 5 mile radius for them to elegible. this financial incentive would mean more parents (who can) making an effort to speak Irish with kids in the home. If you cannot - then funding be provided to run proper, modern Irish language classes for adults

This would men the formation of local Irish speaking networks and communities to enable people apply for the grants. And they would use Irish between families and so would the kids.

The Status Of Irish.

Comments