Thread previews when hovering mouse over titile....

Earthhorse · 07-12-2010 11:13PM

seamus wrote: »

In this case, Firefox allows you to alter the display time of tooltips and is therefore the most appropriate browser for users who make use of them.

Oh, so I see one of those people from the Mozilla Foundation got to you. :mad:

Carl.Gustav · 07-12-2010 11:38PM

seamus wrote: »

Jaysus, even worse. Custom-developed tooltip == more code in the page, less consistency across browser (not more), and more things that can go wrong.

One of the biggest follies that you see developers doing, in all languages and platforms, is writing their own code to perform a function which the platform or API already performs perfectly adequately and which has been tested far more rigorously than an individual can hope to test.
In this case, the browser is the platform and it does a perfectly good job without adding significant bulk and bugs to the code on the page.

Also "testing" for compatibility to have a fall-back function is in itself a funny game. What happens when your compatibility test fails because of a corrupt cache or disabled javascript?

On a bog-standard website, you'll get away with this. But when the site is on the scale of boards.ie, there are so many permutations of what can go wrong with what is a very minor and possibly massively unused piece of code that it's simply not worth it for the possible headaches and for ongoing maintenance.

Instead, it's much easier to advise users for whom this is an issue, to switch to a browser which better supports their surfing needs. In this case, Firefox allows you to alter the display time of tooltips and is therefore the most appropriate browser for users who make use of them.

Look this is just getting more and more bizarre , why not just say we do not have the inclination or/nor the talent to do this.

Because a mouseover event is not difficult to implement no matter how
strenuously you try to imply the opposite.

Do the boards team consider themselves 'developers'

your solution, as a developer, to a mouseover problem in a website is to suggest users download a different browser .

I guess the guys who designed the browser can call themselves developers as they are implementing solutions to problems they don't even know about, and in a very complex piece of software too.

It's a pity there is nobody of their calibre working on the boards team.

Anyway I'll leave it at that as this is obviously pointless, you guy's just bought someone elses work in this bbs package and have no idea how it works !

Instead of the constant back patting that goes on here why not take a few hours out and RTFM.

Thx for listening

Steve · 07-12-2010 11:50PM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

Look this is just getting more and more bizarre , why not just say we do not have the inclination or/nor the talent to do this.

Because a mouseover event is not difficult to implement no matter how
strenuously you try to imply the opposite.

Do the boards team consider themselves 'developers'

your solution, as a developer, to a mouseover problem in a website is to suggest users download a different browser .

I guess the guys who designed the browser can call themselves developers as they are implementing solutions to problems they don't even know about, and in a very complex piece of software too.

It's a pity there is nobody of their calibre working on the boards team.

Anyway I'll leave it at that as this is obviously pointless, you guy's just bought someone elses work in this bbs package and have no idea how it works !

Instead of the constant back patting that goes on here why not take a few hours out and RTFM.

Thx for listening

www.microsoft.com

I believe the original guy was named Bill or something - think he's in tech support.

Failing that - someone on mozilla.com might listen.

If you're really a wannabe developer then I despair. Did you learn about the mouseover event in class last week or did you just google it?

/interest in thread

Carl.Gustav · 08-12-2010 12:07AM

Steve wrote: »

If you're really a wannabe developer then I despair.

you despair because I do not consider a mouseover event a problem that could not be solved.

Speaks volumes about you.

I pity whoever you are employed by that such an inconsequential piece of fluff is a mountain to you.

God forbid they ever ask you to change the tp in the jacks.

K-9 · 08-12-2010 12:11AM

Shoddy workmanship Ted, shoddy.

Steve · 08-12-2010 12:16AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

you despair because I do not consider a mouseover event a problem that could not be solved.

I despair at your trolling lack of understanding of basic facts.

Speaks volumes about you.

I pity whoever you are employed by that such an inconsequential piece of fluff is a mountain to you.

God forbid they ever ask you to change the tp in the jacks.

08-12-2010 12:16AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

Look this is just getting more and more bizarre , why not just say we do not have the inclination or/nor the talent to do this.

Because a mouseover event is not difficult to implement no matter how
strenuously you try to imply the opposite.

Do the boards team consider themselves 'developers'

your solution, as a developer, to a mouseover problem in a website is to suggest users download a different browser .

I guess the guys who designed the browser can call themselves developers as they are implementing solutions to problems they don't even know about, and in a very complex piece of software too.

It's a pity there is nobody of their calibre working on the boards team.

Anyway I'll leave it at that as this is obviously pointless, you guy's just bought someone elses work in this bbs package and have no idea how it works !

Instead of the constant back patting that goes on here why not take a few hours out and RTFM.

Thx for listening

Boards.ie doesn't provide tooltips. It is not a "mouseover problem" as you suggest, since Boards.ie doesn't implement mouseovers. I guess, if they wanted, they could. As you said, it's not particularly difficult code, done in javascript in ten minutes. Lots of things to consider on a site of this size of course, processing time etc, but I'm sure it's a relatively benign performance hit. The question would be: why?

What Boards.ie does provide is 'title' attributes. It's a standard method of including extra information about an element. That's all Boards.ie provides. What the user-agent does with it is up to them. Given the vast, vast variety of user-agents that Boards.ie serves, the title attribute is by far the best way to provide that information. Most of the main browsers show it as a tooltip when you hover over it. They don't have to, they can do what they like with it. Screen-readers may or may not read it. Text browsers like Lynx won't display it at all.

So, since you're such an expert on how easy this is, here's the HTML for this thread in the Feedback forum:
[HTML]<td
class="alt1"
id="td_threadtitle_2056101129"
title="When you hover the mouse pointer over the title of a thread, a preview of the first post appears, but it doesn't stay long enough to read the whole thing. So I have to open the thread in a separate tab only to realize that the thread is actually a load of shyte.

Can you increase the time by a...">
[/HTML]

Implement a solution that includes the title attribute (as it's very important for, among other reasons, accessibility), but displays a custom tooltip. You can assume you have the necessary text available in a variable in Javascript (or do it server-side if you want). The end result must have the title tag included in the TD element, and work across all user-agents

Carl.Gustav · 08-12-2010 12:19AM

Steve wrote: »

I despair at your trolling lack of understanding of basic facts.

what basic facts are these then, you haven't stated any

Steve · 08-12-2010 12:27AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

what basic facts are these then, you haven't stated any

I don't understand? what are you asking?

Carl.Gustav · 08-12-2010 12:28AM

28064212 wrote: »

Boards.ie doesn't provide tooltips. It is not a "mouseover problem" as you suggest, since Boards.ie doesn't implement mouseovers. I guess, if they wanted, they could. As you said, it's not particularly difficult code, done in javascript in ten minutes. Lots of things to consider on a site of this size of course, processing time etc, but I'm sure it's a relatively benign performance hit. The question would be: why?

Wow someone agrees it's not rocket science.

the why would be because currently it's a pain in the arse, what is the point in having a mouseover preview if it doesn't stay open long enough to read, it's just a nuisance then.

This issue was raised YEARS ago and yes it is an issue which is effecting use of the site

so why not take a few minutes out and fix it, regardless of browser fix it,

blaming cross compatibility is a nonsense , why ? for starters no one has
looked at the issue ! it's a lazy copout and that is all.

You just need one member of the boards team to ho hum compatibility and then you get the legions of fawning fanbois who hop on the wagon and there you go we won't hear about it again for a couple more years.

Carl.Gustav · 08-12-2010 12:29AM

Steve wrote: »

I don't understand? what are you asking?

welcome to my ignore list

RolandIRL · 08-12-2010 12:32AM

It's a minor issue at best. The developers have other more pressing issues to deal with, and when it's something you can solve yourself, that just pushes it down their list of things to do even further.
that's not going to change

Steve · 08-12-2010 12:33AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

welcome to my ignore list

Eh?

Bet you a tenner you can't resist hitting 'view post' to see what I said

08-12-2010 12:34AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

the why would be because currently it's a pain in the arse, what is the point in having a mouseover preview if it doesn't stay open long enough to read, it's just a nuisance then.

It's a good thing Boards.ie does not provide a mouseover preview so.

Did you actually read my post? Go back and read it again. And again. And once more for luck. Now, any chance of you solving the problem I set for you? It's only on one single element, I'm sure such a trivial task should only take about 10 minutes. Don't worry about positioning or styling for the moment, you can assume it will come up directly under the mouse in a nicely presented box

Carl.Gustav · 08-12-2010 12:43AM

28064212 wrote: »

It's a good thing Boards.ie does not provide a mouseover preview so.

solution = provide one

08-12-2010 12:47AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

solution = provide one

How do you do that and not conflict with the title attribute? Answers on a postcard in Javascript/server-side code please

stupidusername · 08-12-2010 12:50AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

are you kidding ?
'the software doesn't let them'
anybody worth his salt could implement his own solution or hack it or whatever.

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

Sorry but are you telling me in 2010 soon to be 2011

it is impossible to program a tooltip to stay open forever

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

Do any of you people have the slightest bit of self respect ?

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

I would sort it out in 5 minutes

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

yea that was hard wasn't it

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

solution = provide one

seriously you just want to piss people off. just go away.

Carl.Gustav · 08-12-2010 01:06AM

28064212 wrote: »

How do you do that and not conflict with the title attribute? Answers on a postcard in Javascript/server-side code please

I would tell you but it's not my job.

Just quit with the excuses already, I don't know who you are but I hope you are not affiliated with boards and are asking a poster how to do your job.

Read a book FFS.
This stuff is not hard !
It's a tooltip we are talking about.
Definitely my last reply on this thread.
All of you just have a few pints and laugh about how epicly monumental the problem of a mouseover tooltip is.

Been browsing the web for at least 12 years now and this is the biggest pile of fail I have ever come across,

Although you may not be able to implement a tooltip at least feel good that your fanbois are still there for you.

Goodnight, hugs n kisses

don't let the tooltip bugs bite

08-12-2010 09:52AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

I would tell you but it's not my job.

Just quit with the excuses already, I don't know who you are but I hope you are not affiliated with boards and are asking a poster how to do your job.

Read a book FFS.
This stuff is not hard !
It's a tooltip we are talking about.
Definitely my last reply on this thread.
All of you just have a few pints and laugh about how epicly monumental the problem of a mouseover tooltip is.

Been browsing the web for at least 12 years now and this is the biggest pile of fail I have ever come across,

Although you may not be able to implement a tooltip at least feel good that your fanbois are still there for you.

Goodnight, hugs n kisses

don't let the tooltip bugs bite

So you're saying you actually have no idea how to go about it? Despite telling the development team of Ireland's most popular website that it would take "5 minutes" and "anybody worth his salt could implement his own solution or hack it or whatever"?

Tell you what, I'll stop ridiculing your absolute lack of knowledge on this subject if you can provide one example of a website anywhere on the internet that uses custom tooltips and the title attribute on the same element.

And no, I have no affiliation to boards, I just don't like seeing people spouting off on subjects on which they have no knowledge of, then refuse to back up their claims. "I would tell you but it's not my job" - what age are you? That's a playground response: "I do know, but I'm not telling you". You can bring this argument to an end very quickly by providing your mythical "5 minute" solution, but you haven't done so

And if you think all the boards.ie team are waiting for is someone to post 4 lines of Javascript to make their jobs easier, you're even more ignorant of the subject than you've made out so far

seamus · 08-12-2010 10:20AM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

Although you may not be able to implement a tooltip at least feel good that your fanbois are still there for you.

They can implement a tooltip. But they're not going to because the user's browser already does it adequately.

I'm going to assume that you're not a web developer, since you gather your knowledge from your 12 years of web browsing.

Javascript is easy, dead easy. It's actually far too easy because it allows you to implement pointless pieces of nice code to replace functions that the browser already performs natively.

Boards.ie doesn't implement tooltip functionality. It simply populates one of the standard attributes of the <A> tag. What the browser does with the content of that attribute is up to the browser. If you don't like how your browser deals with the information, switch to another one.

Yes, the solution for having a browser which doesn't do what you want it to do, is to use a different browser. If I wanted a browser to read all of the text on the screen to me through my speakers, and my current one doesn't do that, I would use a different browser. It wouldn't be the website's perogative to code in functionality that does that for me.

Carl.Gustav · 08-12-2010 10:45PM

seamus wrote: »

Yes, the solution for having a browser which doesn't do what you want it to do, is to use a different browser.

Thats looking at it from the websites point of view.

From a user point of view the solution to a website not doing what you want it to is to find a different website.

Steve · 08-12-2010 10:49PM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

From a user point of view the solution to a website not doing what you want it to is to find a different website.

That works for me.

Feel free to indulge in that theory and let us know the result.

stupidusername · 08-12-2010 10:52PM

Carl.Gustav wrote: »

From a user point of view the solution to a website not doing what you want it to is to find a different website.

Well there, you've given your feedback, let the people at boards decide whether they want to change it or want to let people find another site.

oscarBravo · 10-12-2010 12:18PM

I think the OP's question has been answered.

Thread previews when hovering mouse over titile....

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