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Why people don't clear the snow off their properties?

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24

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    #32
    wildefalcon
    Registered Users Posts: 928 ✭✭✭wildefalcon


    Where there isn;t much traffic the leaving hte snow to provide traction works.

    WHere there is a lot of foot traffic a path should be cleared and gritted/salted. If you just clear the snow the remaining ice thaws for a bit and re-freezes and leaves a sheet of ice.


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    #33
    JDxtra
    Registered Users Posts: 5,876 ✭✭✭JDxtra


    We don’t do it because we’re not used to getting regular weather like this. If we had 20 winters like this, then a generation would evolve to be as considerate and unified as the Germans.


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    #34
    thetonynator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭thetonynator


    af_thefragile wrote: »
    If I clear the snow off the front of my house, the ground will just end up freezing over and would be worse. Atleast the snow gives traction and stops you from sliding on it. Ice would be much more dangerous to walk on. Also there's the question of what do you do with the snow? Where would you put it??


    Snow doesn't give traction, after it is walked on a few times it turns into compacted ice which is worse than anything else for walking on. Also pile the snow against the wall or if you have a garden at the front dump it in there.

    d'Oracle wrote: »
    Not yet.
    There is in Germany.

    I hope Ollie isn't reading.

    Ollies from finland!!!


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    #35
    nacho66
    Registered Users Posts: 175 ✭✭nacho66


    HellFireClub wrote: »
    What's the point when it's probably going to snow again on what you've shovelled up??? Complete waste of time... What p*sses me off most about this country in the last few years is this thing were people feel that we have to legislate for absolutely every eventuality nowadays. All people in this country seem to want to do these days is spend their time looking over their neighbours wall and finger wagging and complaining.

    We don't get snow that often, let's try to enjoy the change of scenery without feeling the need to dream up a completely new set of stupid politically correct norms and ridiculous whims and then creating angst by trying to hold our neighbour to a new little mini code of conduct for a snow event.

    What's the point of taking a shower then? You will get dirty again!

    However, now that you put this that way, I can see why you wouldn't clear the snow
    Not outside my house.
    There like 4 inches of fluffy snow over 2-3 inches of compacted snow. Much better to walk on than on frozen, icy ground.
    You won't slide on snow...

    That's only if you think clearing the snow is the only thing you can do. Well, clearing the snow is enough when you do it right after the snowfall. If you do it later, you obviously have to break the ice as well. Clearing the path is not just clearing the snow... it's making the path walkable !!


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    #36
    thetonynator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭thetonynator


    JDxtra wrote: »
    We don’t do it because we’re not used to getting regular weather like this. If we had 20 winters like this, then a generation would evolve to be as considerate and unified as the Germans.


    Cold spells like this used to be a much more regular occurance apparently, we hardly all forgot how in the space of 20 years???


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    #37
    John mac
    Registered Users Posts: 5,112 ✭✭✭John mac


    Put up a sign saying slippery surface. :D:D


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    #38
    nacho libre
    Registered Users Posts: 16,677 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    it really sickens me that there are humans who only see opportunities to sue other people for their kindness/ civic mindedness(?)

    anyway. perhaps adequate winter footwear might also be a solution to slippy footpaths

    http://www.tracktion.ca/main.html


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    #39
    nacho66
    Registered Users Posts: 175 ✭✭nacho66


    nacho libre wrote: »
    it really sickens me that there are humans who only see opportunities to sue other people for their kindness/ civic mindedness(?)

    anyway. perhaps adequate winter footwear might also be a solution to slippy footpaths

    http://www.tracktion.ca/main.html

    I don't get your mentality... Reason I post such subject and concern is exactly opposite to wanting to sue someone. I don't want to break a leg I don't want to sue anyone about it. Clear paths would help such situations not to happen

    Besides... it's not about me and my legs... Such approach as presented by many here doesn't help the country avoid a stand still in which schools and offices are closed as people are literally afraid of walking and driving


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    #40
    Not
    Closed Accounts Posts: 626 ✭✭✭Not


    I tryed to clear snow off the footpath outside the front gate. It was back breaking as there was a two inch deep layer of solid ice under it. Not having a pickaxe, and being worried about breaking the pavement if had, I gave up after I'd spent half an hour hacking away an area of about 1 ft X 3ft. Then as I'd created a lethal hole with kerb height lips around the edges I ended up filling the lot back in with snow again. You see, if you clear the snow, you have to remove the ice under it as well, otherwise you are just leaving it more slippy, its easier to walk on trampled snow than it is to walk on exposed ice. Having said that with yesterdays snowfall leaving 1 foot depth on the ground, it would be no harm to skim off the top 9 - 10 inches so that people can walk without sinking half way up to their knees in it.


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    #41
    nacho libre
    Registered Users Posts: 16,677 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    nacho66 wrote: »
    I don't get your mentality... Reason I post such subject and concern is exactly opposite to wanting to sue someone. I don't want to break a leg I don't want to sue anyone about it. Clear paths would help such situations not to happen

    Besides... it's not about me and my legs... Such approach as presented by many here doesn't help the country avoid a stand still in which schools and offices are closed as people are literally afraid of walking and driving

    what is there to get? i wasn't attacking you, i was just making a general comment about people who would be of a mind to sue people who are civic minded.


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    #42
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    nacho66 wrote: »
    BTW: is there no law in place that requires property owners to be responsible for the pavements in front of them?
    Thankfully there's not. I didn't pay for the public land in front of my house, I wouldn't appreciate being legally compelled to do anything with it unless it also gave me the right to cordon it off and use it for barbecues. It's public land, I pay taxes for the state to look after it. You want me to look after it, then it should legally belong to me.
    feelingstressed wrote: »
    Blame the media who spread the stories on liability, the government only tried to clear it up
    ...and they failed miserably. Something along the lines of "It's not a problem so long as the person has made a reasonable attempt at making it safe". Well therein lies the problem. You could legally show that if the path is unsafe, then the person who cleared did not make a reasonable attempt at making it safe and can be sued.

    Of course they could find out who did it, because we know the council didn't.
    nacho66 wrote: »
    1) you clear a 1 meter wide path on the pavement
    2) you put the snow aside the path
    3) you put some sand or gravel on it so it's not slippery

    Is this that difficult?
    Where does someone living in the city get their hands on sand or gravel within walking/carrying distance? I'm not in the city centre, the nearest place I could conceivably get sand is 2 miles away and my car is snowed in. I'm not carrying 5kg of sand 2 miles home, just to clear some snow. Like Mike says, I'll leave the snow there until it becomes ice at which point I'll take a hammer and a shovel and clear it out.


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    #43
    funkyjebus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,547 ✭✭✭funkyjebus


    zagmund wrote: »
    I've cleared the snow and ice off the path in front of my house regularly.

    People who go on with this rubbish about "but then they can sue you if you don't do it properly" are just looking for an excuse not to clear.

    Look at it this way - if they don't clear and someone falls outside their house will they just stand there smugly and say "well, I didn't do anything ;) so nobody can blame me" while the rest of the world will say "well, they didn't do anything :mad: to help reduce accidents so it's partly their fault."

    z

    I'm afraid that not how laibiltiy works.


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    #44
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    thetonynator wrote: »


    Ollies from finland!!!

    Yeah, but I don't know the names of anyone else associated with our new German Overlords.


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    #45
    ayumi
    Registered Users Posts: 676 ✭✭✭ayumi


    i have cleared my driveway with hot water and a shovel but it hadnt made a sheet of ice it actually helped to take the snow/ice off the driveway.I also did this for the pathway in front of my garden and there is no snow on it


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    #46
    Sierra Oscar
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,466 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    reverenddave wrote: »
    and do what with the snow ????????????

    put it on the road to refreeze over night
    creating a massive iceberg for the lovely motorists to write off their cars into

    :confused:

    Put it into a pile by the side of the footpath/road, like everyone else has to do.


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    #47
    zagmund
    Registered Users Posts: 2,501 ✭✭✭zagmund


    funkyjebus wrote: »
    I'm afraid that not how laibiltiy works.

    I'm not talking liability, I'm talking public service and community focus.

    z


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    #48
    JONJO THE MISER
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 12,333 ✭✭✭✭JONJO THE MISER


    mymo wrote: »
    I have cleared infront of my house(in a small estate) 4 times so far, my idiot neighbour threw a bucket of hot water on the path between our houses "'cos there was some bits of snow left" now theres a sheet of ice by my gate that I can't clear.

    Slips outside mymo's house * aww my back* /rings my solicitor.


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    #49
    Stinicker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,102 ✭✭✭Stinicker


    I ran the boiler at full whack until the tank was bubbling then connected my garden hose and melted snow and ice off all my footpaths and driveway with it. Then I took my coarse brush and brushed the water and icy debris out of the way, leaving a dryish surface. I then salted the heck out of it with Lidl's finest cheap table salt, about half an hours work and it was no big deal costing under €5 in salt and kerosene to heat the water. I don't see the big deal and haven't had a bit of trouble the last few days with it as I had no new snowfall.

    redt0m wrote: »
    And to think that in countries like Germany, people are obliged to clear snow outside their homes/businesses...

    In Germany they take snow in their stride and I was there in March and got some real heavy showers of late snow. The german salters were out at 6am and salted the whole place and cleared the snow. The hotel staff where I was staying were clearing the driveway and salting and I helped them for a few minutes clear behind my rental car and they made easy work of it. They got several inches yet the Autobahn was open and I took to it with my rental car complete with Winter tyres and was soon cruising at 200km/h in conditions that cause Armageddon in this country.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGYiiuVRays


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    #50
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    zagmund wrote: »
    I'm not talking liability, I'm talking public service and community focus.

    z

    I just spent an hour breaking ice up on the footpath outside mine and my elderly next door neighbors gaffs.

    Go me.


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    #51
    Captain Commie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 688 ✭✭✭Captain Commie


    In every news broadcast this week it has been mentioned that the government have asked for home/buisness owners to clear paths outside their property - why poeple dont is beyond me.

    With regards to liability, this was cleared up last year, if anyone tries to make a claim then no solicitor would take the case else they face disciplinary issues with the law society.

    I live in an apartment block and spent about 20 mins last night clearing a path to the door, one of my neighbours has also been doing the same. Was annoying as the management company obviously didnt see fit to do anything.

    It really doesnt take much effort to clear some snow/ice and make pavements a little safer for people to walk on, especially on streets and roads that are walked along often.


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    #52
    JJJJNR
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭JJJJNR


    if you clear the path and put some nitrogen on after, it will not freeze over, nitrogen is also dirt cheap, 5 euro for a huge bag like the one I've been using for the past three years...


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    #53
    greenpeter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 600 ✭✭✭greenpeter


    JJJJNR wrote: »
    if you clear the path and put some nitrogen on after, it will not freeze over, nitrogen is also dirt cheap, 5 euro for a huge bag like the one I've been using for the past three years...

    You must be some height using nitrogen:D


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    #54
    JJJJNR
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭JJJJNR


    Freezing up here...


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    #55
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    JJJJNR wrote: »
    if you clear the path and put some nitrogen on after, it will not freeze over, nitrogen is also dirt cheap, 5 euro for a huge bag like the one I've been using for the past three years...
    How could you get nitrogen in a bag? And of course it wouldn't freeze over considering it boils at -196C!


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    #56
    RandomAccess
    Registered Users Posts: 1,830 ✭✭✭RandomAccess


    redt0m wrote: »
    And to think that in countries like Germany, people are obliged to clear snow outside their homes/businesses...

    Just to add a little balance, I was in Berlin last winter and from a pedestrian point of view it was absolutely lethal to be honest. Some of the main thoroughfares had been somewhat cleared but there were still patches of solid snow ice around. Many secondary foothpaths were single file and had stony grit spread on a narrow path so that was ok unless you had to pass someone which meant stepping onto the ice which was quite thick. Bear in mind that I'm not complaining about that, I'm simply pointing out that the utopia commonly ascribed to Germany does not in my experience exist!

    When we left those main areas we found that the remaining footpaths had not been cleared at all and any of them which had had moderate foot traffic had turned into the compressed snow type of ice we are mainly discussing here. The only option for most of the time was to walk on areas of snow which had not been trodden upon.

    Surprisingly many of the main tourist areas such as the Brandenburg gate were also lethal and I witnessed a few falls while I was there.

    Anyway, just wanted to add my 2cents.


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    #57
    peasant
    Registered Users Posts: 17,819 ✭✭✭✭peasant


    The trick is not to wait until the stuff has compacted/frozen, but to clear snow directly after it has fallen. You wouldn't even need a shovel then, in most cases a strong broom would do.
    profi-elaston-strassenbesen-besen-kehrbesen-mit-stiel-und-quickhalter.jpg
    This of course means that you have to be vigilant and might have to do it several times a day ...getting up early and all that ...and we surely couldn't expect people to do that, could we? :D


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    #58
    FarmerGreen
    Registered Users Posts: 1,134 ✭✭✭FarmerGreen


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    How could you get nitrogen in a bag? And of course it wouldn't freeze over considering it boils at -196C!

    I think he means Krista K fertiliser aka potassium nitrate.


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    #59
    Harps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,548 ✭✭✭Harps


    The problem at the moment, around here at least, is the freezing rain. I cleared a path from my house and now its actually easier to walk on the snow than the path which has a layer of ice on it.

    Obviously it doesnt work with the footpaths as all the snow is heavily compacted but around the house I'm finding myself avoiding the areas I've cleared today


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    #60
    irish1967
    Registered Users Posts: 3,516 ✭✭✭irish1967


    Just ventured to the shop on foot ( 0.5 miles away) and i was grand until I got to a row of terraced house where some had cleared and some hadn't... those that were cleared were deadly. :mad:


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    #61
    H2UMrsRobinson
    Registered Users Posts: 763 ✭✭✭H2UMrsRobinson


    It's a case of damned if you do, and damned if you don't...

    It's all very well clearing a path, but after you've cleared put a layer of grit/salt/sand/ashes down to give some traction and prevent ice forming. I think the key issue here is appropriate footwear. Socks over the shoes definitely works if you don't have a pair of grippy boots or shoes. Golf shoes or running spikes would work too if you have a pair.


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