Push, Pull, Squat

Pontificatus · 16-11-2010 02:02PM

Well done man. Saw you in the gym last night and you're looking visibly less fat (a lot leaner). Keep it up

Will Heffernan · 16-11-2010 04:03PM

Pontificatus wrote: »

I was checking you out in the gym last night and you're looking so damned sexy. Keep it up ...I know you're helping me too

See...this is the reason that we don't have a steam room in the gym...you guys would never get any training done.

It is also the reason that I'm not putting stiff legged deadlifts in the program next cycle.

Inspector Coptoor · 17-11-2010 12:09AM

IP Warm Up
2 rounds of:
side lunges x 10
scap pull ups x 10
high kicks x 10
Horizontal band pull aparts x 10
glute bridges x 10
windmill push ups x 10
knee lift (while lying on the ground) x 10

C 2

10' C block
prowler + 40kg
30 pushes 15m up and back for time.
11:58
This was tough

15' workblock
rounds of
10 prisoner squats
10 push ups
Max Rep band assisted Wide grip pull ups (after a while became pull ups to failure, min pull ups was 7 per round)
11 rounds

10' C block
KB Swings with 36kg KB
10 rounds of 20 seconds on, 40 seconds off
average of 10 swings per round

Foam Rolling and Stretching.

arrived into the gym later than usual so didnt get time to do the 2nd 15' block.
that's twice now Ive missed that work block.
Will put it in soon.

the Prowler block was rank. 2 mins behind Barry and Will'd times
Target to aim for i guess.

!5' workblock I did was grand.
Decided to do wide grip pull ups as I had done regular pull ups last night.

Moved up to the 36kg KB for the swings. very tough for the last two sets.

Will Heffernan · 17-11-2010 11:44AM

Liam Henners257 wrote: »

10' C block
prowler + 40kg
30 pushes 15m up and back for time.
11:58
This was tough

the Prowler block was rank. 2 mins behind Barry and Will'd times
Target to aim for i guess.

I won't be doing it again.

Barry.Oglesby · 17-11-2010 01:10PM

Yes I think the 30 pushes is about as much as anyone needs to do. 30 is a high tide mark and I reckon 31 would be just acting the bollox.

Inspector Coptoor · 18-11-2010 10:56PM

IP Warm up x 2

Strength 1

Deadlifts
60kg - 8
100kg - 2 x 5
145kg - 3
165kg - 3
180kg - 3 (belt on for this set)
195kg - 3 (belt on for this set) PR

Step ups
4 x 8 per leg with weighted X vest (~ + 20kg)

DB side bends
2 x 10 per side with 40kg DB
1 x 10 per side with 45kg DB

Bench press
20kg - 10
40kg - 10
60kg - 10
80kg - 5

Foam roller partial bench press
100 - 5
105kg - 5
110kg - 3 x 5 PR
the last rep on each set werent great. My line was off etc but I got them. and not just one set, which would have been a PB, got three sets

Round backed Back Extensions
1x 10 @ BW
4 x 10 @ BW + X vest (+~20kg)

Dip bar Inv Rows
1x 10 @ BW
4 x 8 @ BW + X vest (+~20kg)

DB curls
17.5kg DBs - 5 x 10

Comments:
Delighted with the 195kg x 3.
Gonna do whatever Will tell's me now for the next couple of weeks before the Crossfit Total.

Max Effort DB side bends were strange.
I remember doing them 4-5 weeks ago with 20kg DBs and having DOMS for days.
I guess my "core" is getting stronger

Benching has improved.

Added weight to the back extensions and the dip bar rows and added height to the step ups and went up on the DB curls.
weight today was 105kg on the nose.

the drifter · 18-11-2010 11:15PM

Can i ask a question. And this isnt being smart!

whats a foam roller partial bench, is it where your using a foam roller to force your arch? and whats with the partial ? what rom is it?

nice deadlifting man.

gymfreak · 18-11-2010 11:16PM

Liam Henners257 wrote: »

Gonna do whatever Will tell's me now for the next couple of weeks before the Crossfit Total

Should you not ..um...maybe...possibly..perhaps...do this all the time?? Would that not be an idea or maybe that idea is just too 'out there'..:P:P

Good work on the deadlifts...looks like my pyschological abuse didn't work...darn!:D

banshee_bones · 18-11-2010 11:19PM

gymfreak wrote: »

Should you not ..um...maybe...possibly..perhaps...do this all the time?? Would that not be an idea or maybe that idea is just too 'out there'..:P:P

Good work on the deadlifts...looks like my pyschological abuse didn't work...darn!:D

whoa whoa whoa! hold up! They allow you to do what you want??? Ummmm I thought the whole idea of the cult
IP was that you do what your told! something to do with results.. or somesuch :pac:

Inspector Coptoor · 18-11-2010 11:28PM

the drifter wrote: »

Can i ask a question. And this isnt being smart!

whats a foam roller partial bench, is it where your using a foam roller to force your arch? and whats with the partial ? what rom is it?

nice deadlifting man.

Foam roller partial bench is when you set up as normal.
the foam roller is then place on your chest.
Its like board pressing except with a foam roller.

Inspector Coptoor · 18-11-2010 11:34PM

gymfreak wrote: »

Should you not ..um...maybe...possibly..perhaps...do this all the time?? Would that not be an idea or maybe that idea is just too 'out there'..:P:P

What I meant by that was that I mightnt be doing the whole
Monday S2
Tuesday C1
Wed - Rest
Thurs S1
Fri C2
vibe for a couple of weeks before the comp.

As in, Will might have something else for me to work on.
A mini-programme before the comp while still being very close to the programme.

gymfreak wrote: »

Good work on the deadlifts

thank you

gymfreak wrote: »

looks like my pyschological abuse didn't work...darn!

pfft, how could it coming from someone who can do 2 pull ups?

you are becoming quite the cheeky madam.
Oh look at me, my mms are below 100 and i put on a 1.6kg of "muscle":P

banshee_bones wrote: »

whoa whoa whoa! hold up! They allow you to do what you want??? Ummmm I thought the whole idea of the cult
IP was that you do what your told! something to do with results.. or somesuch :pac:

You can do what you want in IP.
It can be a regular gym that way.
as in, you pay your money and you train how you like.

i did that for three months during the summer.
I lost 2kg in weight, gained NOTHING in strength and then decided that being my own coach was retarded.
Then i ate a big slice of humble pie, took my head out of my hole and realised that there a lot of people out there who know more than me, AND, when i am paying those people for coaching, and not actually availing of it, I am a complete and utter special.

in other words, I saw the light and have absolutely no regrets.
I will NEVER try to coach myself again.

Will Heffernan · 18-11-2010 11:36PM

Liam Henners257 wrote: »

195kg - 3 (belt on for this set) PR

This must be from the IP download you've been on since you finished 5/3/1?

Foam roller partial bench press
110kg - 3 x 5 PR
the last rep on each set werent great. My line was off etc but I got them. and not just one set, which would have been a PB, got three sets

These were fine...the foam roller throws you off you groove...that's normal.

Comments:
Delighted with the 195kg x 3.
Gonna do whatever Will tell's me now for the next couple of weeks before the Crossfit Total.

Best way to train for crossfit is to get me to coach you...even crossfit knows that

You forgot to mention the foam rolling?

Just so you know...it doesn't actually break down scar tissue...just keep that under your hat.

the drifter · 18-11-2010 11:41PM

Liam Henners257 wrote: »

Foam roller partial bench is when you set up as normal.
the foam roller is then place on your chest.
Its like board pressing except with a foam roller.

mmm interesting...

do you touch/pause the bar on the roller?

Will Heffernan · 18-11-2010 11:41PM

the drifter wrote: »

Can i ask a question. And this isnt being smart!

whats a foam roller partial bench, is it where your using a foam roller to force your arch? and whats with the partial ? what rom is it?

nice deadlifting man.

Are you the mod that told me not to get all sciencey and didn't give a crap about all that neural stuff?

If you are...I have no answer for you...but if you are not I'd tell you that we are actually attenuating the force in the stretch-shortening cycle and working on lockout strength with supramaximal loading.

Inspector Coptoor · 18-11-2010 11:44PM

the drifter wrote: »

mmm interesting...

do you touch/pause the bar on the roller?

yeah, you lower the bar into the foam roller.
the bar sinks into the foam roller and you bench press it back from there.

As Will said above, it takes you off your line and definitely makes you work harder on the way up.

It also gets you used to repping with heavy weights you couldnt use with a regular ROM

JJayoo · 19-11-2010 12:20AM

Will this not mess up your foam roller pretty quick?

Inspector Coptoor · 19-11-2010 12:23AM

JJayoo wrote: »

Will this not mess up your foam roller pretty quick?

Foam rollers in IP are outrageously solid.
They're the Elite Black ones.
very hard and solid like.

kevpants · 19-11-2010 01:00PM

Will Heffernan wrote: »

we are actually attenuating the force in the stretch-shortening cycle

Been doing heavy partial's myself recently. Can you clarify this bit for me Will?

My understanding is that by absorbinig some weight as it goes down you reduce the "spring" or "sling shot" effect you get by lowering the weight while keeping tight etc?

Would a spongey base be needed like a foam roller or the foam blocks Louie Simmons started using be needed here? Could you get a similar training effect from something like a dead bench where you push directly off the pins without the lowering of the bar happening first?

I know all about the supramximal lockout stuff that's the obvious bit of partials, it's the above I'm curious on.

Will Heffernan · 19-11-2010 01:06PM

kevpants wrote: »

Been doing heavy partial's myself recently. Can you clarify this bit for me Will?

Can I clarify you doing heavy partials? I'll try...YOU ARE DOING HEAVY PARTIALS.

My understanding is that by absorbinig some weight as it goes down you reduce the "spring" or "sling shot" effect you get by lowering the weight while keeping tight etc?

That sounds like you have a good understanding.

Would a spongey base be needed like a foam roller or the foam blocks Louie Simmons started using be needed here?

Yes and it isn't only people here in Ireland that copy what I do

Could you get a similar training effect from something like a dead bench where you push directly off the pins without the lowering of the bar happening first?

Nope. Very different effect actually.

I know all about the supramximal lockout stuff that's the obvious bit of partials, it's the above I'm curious on.

it's good to be curious.

kevpants · 19-11-2010 01:28PM

Right cool thanks.

Will Heffernan wrote: »

Nope. Very different effect actually.

Just on this, is there a relevent effect from the dead bench I described above? It almost feels like I'm engaging the wrong muscles to get it moving? But maybe that's what it feels like when the stretch cycle is removed?

Will Heffernan · 19-11-2010 02:40PM

kevpants wrote: »

Right cool thanks.

Just on this, is there a relevent effect from the dead bench I described above? It almost feels like I'm engaging the wrong muscles to get it moving? But maybe that's what it feels like when the stretch cycle is removed?

I'll keep this short and sweet and hopefully that will be enough. Pin pressing or rack pressing is very different due to the fact that if pushing straight from the pins there is no prior eccentric loading and if you are lowering onto pins depending on the 'pause' there is either a complete dissipation or dramatic lessening of the stretch shortening cycle. Experienced benchers don't tend to lose their line board pressing or doing partials the way we do...benching to pins...that's a completely different story. I don't like pin/rack pressing...that's not me saying that I don't 'like' it...I mean I don't think it's very good/effective. The foam roller partials don't remove the stretch shortening cycle...they attenuate it...that's very different.

Does that answer your question?

Hanley · 19-11-2010 02:52PM

Will Heffernan wrote: »

I'll keep this short and sweet and hopefully that will be enough. Pin pressing or rack pressing is very different due to the fact that if pushing straight from the pins there is no prior eccentric loading and if you are lowering onto pins depending on the 'pause' there is either a complete dissipation or dramatic lessening of the stretch shortening cycle. Experienced benchers don't tend to lose their line board pressing or doing partials the way we do...benching to pins...that's a completely different story. I don't like pin/rack pressing...that's not me saying that I don't 'like' it...I mean I don't think it's very good/effective. The foam roller partials don't remove the stretch shortening cycle...they attenuate it...that's very different.

Does that answer your question?

Ugh. I'm forced to agree with all of that!!

I don't like pin pressing for the same reasons. The main reason I dis-like it is because I don't think it works.

Will Heffernan · 19-11-2010 02:55PM

Hanley wrote: »

Ugh. I'm forced to agree with all of that!!

If you agree with me only half the time you're bound to be at least 50% correct.

I don't like pin pressing for the same reasons. The main reason I dis-like it is because I don't think it works.

Rack pulls being the exception...no eccentric loading prior to the commencement of the lift...(deadlifting that is) although as an aside I think deadlifting works best when you no how to generate some prior to lifting.

kevpants · 19-11-2010 03:02PM

Will Heffernan wrote: »

Does that answer your question?

Yes.

Sorry Liam for filling up your log but one more thing.

Band assisted bench? Similar attenuation of the eccentric loading or is it another species of lift again?

Will Heffernan · 19-11-2010 03:15PM

kevpants wrote: »

Yes.

Good...because apparently I don't normally provide any answers on boards...so that makes a nice change.

Sorry Liam for filling up your log but one more thing.

Liam's a student of strength and conditioning training...he won't mind. Talking about what people are actually doing makes a nice change from answering questions about imaginary training.

Band assisted bench? Similar attenuation of the eccentric loading or is it another species of lift again?

Very different.

cmyk · 19-11-2010 03:49PM

Will Heffernan wrote: »

If you are...I have no answer for you...but if you are not I'd tell you that we are actually attenuating the force in the stretch-shortening cycle and working on lockout strength with supramaximal loading.

Again, going slightly off topic, but is this a similar principal to box squatting off foam? I'm guessing not, as it would be difficult to do with supramaximal loading?

Will Heffernan · 19-11-2010 08:35PM

cmyk wrote: »

Again, going slightly off topic, but is this a similar principal to box squatting off foam?

Yes...but....

I'm guessing not, as it would be difficult to do with supramaximal loading?

It you could do it the same...but you'd be doing it 3-5 inches above parallel and that would be uber ghey. As in I wouldn't do it. I could see value in doing it at parallel though...obviously benching is different in that you CHEST gets in the way.

You follow?

*HMB - Info.

Also...just a note for the sport scientists out there...as Liam's log seems to be the place to hang out.

Just saw the HMB study that is noted in the main forum:
For your own info as strength athletes rather than cardio bunnies...HMB supplementation with regard to strength is pretty much useless in athletes/subject who are consuming adequate (as in lots) of protein. It provides some benefit to endurance athletes mainly because most endurance athletes in these studies are not consuming adequate amounts of protein in the first place. This is an illustration of poor boards.ie sport science...someone posts a study that say HMB is awesome..because that it what the meta analysis says...without understanding the limitations of the matter the meta analysis was based upon.

Barry.Oglesby · 19-11-2010 09:48PM

Nice log Liam:)

Will Heffernan · 19-11-2010 10:20PM

Barry.Oglesby wrote: »

Nice log Liam:)

I should stop posting here as well is that what you are saying?

I suppose I can just communicate in 'Thanks' or something? I thought Liam of all people would appreciate his log being a place of learning and intelligent discussion? I thought there should be at least one place on the forum where that happened.

Inspector Coptoor · 20-11-2010 12:48AM

I heartily endorse this product and or service and wish to avail of your newsletter should such a publication exist.

Seriously though, I don't mind in the least