The German people stopped a train--guarded by 17,000 police troops

digme · 11-11-2010 09:23PM #1

Protests against the storing of nuclear waste in Germany and extending the life of the nation's nuclear plants turned violent in spots on Sunday, according to protesters and police.
A train carrying nuclear waste left Lueneburg station Sunday on its way to Dannenberg, said Nicole Ramrath, Lueneburg police spokeswoman. After making the 50-kilometer (31-mile) trip by rail, the shipment will be unloaded onto trucks and driven to the storage site at Gorleben, in north-central Germany about 209 kilometers (130 miles) northwest of Berlin.

That's the sum total of the article. Sounds like a "nothing", right? Protesters got violent, the cops put it down, the train goes onward.
Well....... maybe not.

The German people stopped a train--guarded by 17,000 police troops!-- from delivering nuclear reactor radioactive waste that would have endangered people. This report of events in Germany emphasizes the non-violent aspect of the rebellion, but some of the protestors, contrary to the philosophy of nonviolence, applied force: “A water cannon truck [that would have been used by the police to remove protestors] was blocked by tractors.” Despite it being contrary to the philosophy of nonviolence, it seems like an excellent thing for the protestors to have done. -John

Wait a second. The people stopped the train - guarded by 17,000 cops?

But by Sunday night, those same police officers were begging the protestors for a respite.
Trapped in black, icy woods without supplies or reinforcements able to reach them because of blockades by a mobile fleet of farmer’s tractors, the exhausted and hungry police officers requested negotiations with the protestors.

Oh, those cops were all so tired and worn out...... and cut off? Uh, is this a protest or is this a civil war? And why isn't this being reported?
Gee, I thought the state always won? And that this was all under control?
This, over shipment of nuclear waste.
Now where are the protests related to the banks robbing the people blind?
And more importantly, who still thinks the people won't win if they decide they've had enough?

well done

InTheTrees · 11-11-2010 09:27PM

digme wrote: »

Gee, I thought the state always won?

The State always wins in the end. Thats the important part unfortunatly.

Anita Blow · 11-11-2010 09:28PM

nama, fianna fail, disgrace joe etc.

11-11-2010 09:29PM

The German people stopped a train--guarded by 17,000 police troops!-- from delivering nuclear reactor radioactive waste that would have endangered people.

Says who exactly?
It's nuclear waste, it hasn't endangered any of them yet

who what when · 11-11-2010 09:29PM

InTheTrees wrote: »

The State always wins in the end. Thats the important part unfortunatly.

But sometimes its important to give them something to think about!

Nodin · 11-11-2010 09:30PM

InTheTrees wrote: »

The State always wins in the end. Thats the important part unfortunatly.

Not nessecarily. Besides, the state is supposed to represent the people, to some extent. Allegedly.

Setun · 11-11-2010 09:31PM

Bloody germans. Even incredibly efficient in their protests.

dxhound2005 · 11-11-2010 09:33PM

who what when wrote: »

But sometimes its important to give them something to think about!

Give them something to think about by voting them out of office.

mobby · 11-11-2010 09:34PM

InTheTrees wrote: »

The State always wins in the end. Thats the important part unfortunatly.

An you see If them people win, then they will become the state.
and it starts all over again. That life boys and girls.

qwertz · 11-11-2010 10:09PM

The people have already won since this has been happening for years. Every protest makes it so much more expensive and from a certain point onwards unviable. Power to the people!

citizen_p · 11-11-2010 10:27PM

like that time the beer didnt get delivered to munich in 23'
apparently the customers kicked up a fuss.

beer hall putsch or somthing along them lines i think.

I dont think the germans like admiting their riots etc...
like 17000, police, is a very large standoff. even in the largest population in europe.

hatrickpatrick · 12-11-2010 03:39AM

bluewolf wrote: »

Says who exactly?
It's nuclear waste, it hasn't endangered any of them yet

The people didn't it want it there. In a democracy, that's all that should matter.

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Give them something to think about by voting them out of office.

If the people could do that at any point during an administration, and if they could pick and choose which departments they wanted in the hands of different politicians, I'd agree with you.

Unfortunately, our system has two gigantic failings which make it far to vague to ever be truly democratic:
1: The people do not have the power, by means of a referendum or anything of the sort, to demand an election. The politicians, once they get into office, can do whatever they like, no matter how it goes against their mandate, and not suffer consequences for 5 years.

2: You can't pick your policies. If I like FF's education policy but detest their health policy, WTF am I supposed to do? Decide, in my mind, which I am willing to let go of, healthcare or education?

This is why the general parliament system doesn't work.

What we SHOULD do is have a system where there is NO general Dail. A TD would run for a specific department, and if elected, would vote only on issues related to that specific department. In this system, you would never have a situation where "I hate their health policy but support their education policy", because they would only be able to actually run with ONE of those policies. They would have to declare which department they were running for before the election, and each constituency would have a number of TDs in each department rather than just in the Dail generally.

Far more direct rule by the people. FAR more democratic. FAR less easy for politicians to screw us over. FAR less easy for politicians to lie.

Einhard · 12-11-2010 04:04AM

Bah, they just don't make German soldiers like they used to.

Manic Moran · 12-11-2010 07:04AM

The people didn't it want it there. In a democracy, that's all that should matter.

Isn't that what the legislature is for?

It would have been amusing had the engineer put the locomotive into Notch 1, then stuck his head and hands out the window saying "you can sit on the tracks if you want to, but the train will take far less damage than you will"

NTM

galah · 12-11-2010 09:49AM

did anyone mention that this is GERMAN nuclear waste from GERMAN nuclear plants, generating electricity for GERMAN consumers, just returning to Germany where it rightfully belongs?

Idiots.

LittleBook · 12-11-2010 10:22AM

galah wrote: »

did anyone mention that this is GERMAN nuclear waste from GERMAN nuclear plants, generating electricity for GERMAN consumers, just returning to Germany where it rightfully belongs?

True, but in fairness the protest is about more than the actual waste, it's about shutting down the existing plants.

Anti-Nuclear Sentiment Swells in Germany

The protests are part of a resurgent anti-nuclear movement that has been enlivened by growing opposition to a plan to extend the life span of Germany's 17 nuclear power plants.

Tuesday marked the final leg of a contentious, five-day journey for German nuclear waste that was reprocessed in France and sent back for storage. For the past few days, protesters have tried everything to block the train and trucks — from human chains to herds of sheep and farm tractors.

The annual shipment is always a protest magnet. But this year, there was even wider support as the trainload — which protesters dubbed "Chernobyl on wheels" — drew huge crowds shouting "shut the plants down."

Organizers say 50,000 demonstrators turned out on Saturday and about 9,000 protesters participated in the blockade actions this week. Some 20,000 police officers were deployed in the operation. Both sides say the actions were largely nonviolent, but there were instances of protesters throwing stones and bottles and of police using pepper spray and tear gas, resulting in mostly minor injuries.

Police trade unions complained in unusually hard terms that they have been "scapegoated" by politicians, who "made a fatal mistake" when they extended nuclear plants life spans, and that citizens are right to protest.

Nuclear energy has been deeply unpopular in Germany since the 1986 Chernobyl accident in the Soviet Union. The anti-nuclear movement thought it had secured a victory in 2001 when the then-ruling Social Democrats and Greens agreed to phase out Germany's nuclear plants by 2021.

But this year, Chancellor Angela Merkel's conservative coalition reversed that decision and voted to extend the life of the plants by an average of 12 years.

FruitLover · 12-11-2010 10:22AM

Damn jackbooted Germans, always oppressing those poor innocent Germans :mad:

bonerm · 12-11-2010 10:25AM

Germany. Where the trains DON'T run on time.

Manic Moran · 12-11-2010 05:09PM

Nuclear energy has been deeply unpopular in Germany since the 1986 Chernobyl accident in the Soviet Union. The anti-nuclear movement thought it had secured a victory in 2001 when the then-ruling Social Democrats and Greens agreed to phase out Germany's nuclear plants by 2021.

But this year, Chancellor Angela Merkel's conservative coalition reversed that decision and voted to extend the life of the plants by an average of 12 years.

Good for Merkel.

It is pathetic that the anti-nuclear crowd's big bogeyman is an outdated design made by a country with a reputation for shoddy construction manned by less-than-stellarly trained Soviet Peoples' Technicians, whereas their neighbours in France have been producing 4/5ths of their energy incident and pollution free for decades, and Japan, a country which may perhaps know more than most about radioactive incidents, is continuing to expand its own disaster-free nuclear network.

NTM

orourkeda · 12-11-2010 05:14PM

At least they built nuclear power plants

SEPT 23 1989 · 12-11-2010 05:21PM

"Nuc-u-lar"! It's pronounced, "nuc-u-lar"

minidazzler · 12-11-2010 05:34PM

17000 police escorting nuclear waste, but for love parade, with over a million people in attendance there were only 3200 police on hand?

Duggy747 · 12-11-2010 05:35PM

All these years with power plants and nuclear waste and STILL we don't have a superhero. :mad:

I'll even settle on a guy who can shoot lasers out of his arse.

ejmaztec · 12-11-2010 05:42PM

****Godwin Alert****

They didn't bother stopping trains during WW2.

Seaneh · 12-11-2010 05:48PM

it's about time we built a few plants are started exporting electricity. Be much cheaaper than the coal and peat plants we are using at the minute and be much better for the environment.

Corsendonk · 12-11-2010 05:51PM

Manic Moran wrote: »

Good for Merkel.

It is pathetic that the anti-nuclear crowd's big bogeyman is an outdated design made by a country with a reputation for shoddy construction manned by less-than-stellarly trained Soviet Peoples' Technicians, whereas their neighbours in France have been producing 4/5ths of their energy incident and pollution free for decades, and Japan, a country which may perhaps know more than most about radioactive incidents, is continuing to expand its own disaster-free nuclear network.

NTM

Not always shoddy construction, they still have 1954 Russian constructed AK-47s working away in Afganistan.

Corsendonk · 12-11-2010 05:54PM

Seaneh wrote: »

it's about time we built a few plants are started exporting electricity. Be much cheaaper than the coal and peat plants we are using at the minute and be much better for the environment.

The current East-West interconnector with the European grid has had numerous protests from Nimbys. Factor in the costs of protests here from the Nimbys when you starting building reactors. Irish population arn't too strong on science.

galah · 12-11-2010 05:56PM

I realise that this is also about stopping nuclear waste/production in general, but seriously, what do the protesters want to achieve by stopping this train?

The waste is there, it's theirs as well (as in, collectively, whether they wanted it or not), and where should it go now? 'somewhere else' is not an option...by all means, protest against nuclear power (they could do that more cost-effectively at any power plant, though), but I'd like to hear what they'd suggest to do with the waste instead...

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 12-11-2010 05:58PM

InTheTrees wrote: »

The State always wins in the end. Thats the important part unfortunatly.

The GDR didn't win when the Berlin Wall came down.
The British Empire came second to Ghandi.
The State will probbaly not win the next general election (too late, I know, but still relevant)

Boskowski · 12-11-2010 05:59PM

galah wrote: »

did anyone mention that this is GERMAN nuclear waste from GERMAN nuclear plants, generating electricity for GERMAN consumers, just returning to Germany where it rightfully belongs?

Idiots.

You're obviously well clued in on what this is all about. Muppet.

Seaneh · 12-11-2010 06:13PM

nuclear is clearly the best, cheapest and cleanest way we have to produce electricity. In ireland we have the perfect conditions and with t plants and the continued use of our hydro plants we would be producing well over our grid capacity and could even be making a net profit by exporting.

The German people stopped a train--guarded by 17,000 police troops

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