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pensioners to loose out

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  • 27-10-2010 10:30pm
    #1
    Voltex
    Registered Users Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭


    Just looking at the evening hearld and the main shock and awe story was the "unbelieveable" story that pensioners are going to be hit in the budget. When i read a bit more it would seem that the propsal is for a 2.5% reduction...equal to on average €5 p/w.

    Now..call me mean spirited or what...but sod em!!
    They in general dont have mortgages...kids to bring up...pensions to pay for!!
    Im all for a social welfare society....but lets face facts here. For Ireland to recover we need to get middle Ireland spending again and to expect the likes of the old age pensioner to get away scot free is bolli x quite frankly!!


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    #2
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    I think we should make Logan's Run a reality, but increase the age by 50 years or so.


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    #3
    flutered
    Registered Users Posts: 6,677 ✭✭✭flutered


    quite a lot of pensioners are from the ps, their pensions have never been taxed.


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    #4
    El Guapo!
    Registered Users Posts: 12,431 ✭✭✭✭El Guapo!


    *Lose















    ..........just saying........


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    #5
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    They'll be dead soon enough as well, **** 'em.


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    #6
    Millicent
    Registered Users Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    Voltex wrote: »
    Just looking at the evening hearld and the main shock and awe story was the "unbelieveable" story that pensioners are going to be hit in the budget. When i read a bit more it would seem that the propsal is for a 2.5% reduction...equal to on average €5 p/w.

    Now..call me mean spirited or what...but sod em!!
    They in general dont have mortgages...kids to bring up...pensions to pay for!!
    Im all for a social welfare society....but lets face facts here. For Ireland to recover we need to get middle Ireland spending again and to expect the likes of the old age pensioner to get away scot free is bolli x quite frankly!!

    So let's punish them for the frugality of their youth and buying and paying off properties they could afford? Have I got the gist of that right?


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    #7
    Voltex
    Registered Users Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Voltex


    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    They'll be dead soon enough as well, **** 'em.
    not if we keep giving them the equivalent to my total tax deduction each week. If i was getting that much just for being old, Id try hanging round for a while longer...just for a laugh!!
    anyway...what do they contribute?
    Iknow a couple of them and all they do is drink their pension...every day.


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    #8
    admiralofthefleet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15,515 ✭✭✭✭admiralofthefleet


    bloody coffin dodging, oxygen thieving bastards them pensioners, smell like glue too


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    #9
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    Voltex wrote: »
    not if we keep giving them the equivalent to my total tax deduction each week. If i was getting that much just for being old, Id try hanging round for a while longer...just for a laugh!!
    anyway...what do they contribute?
    Iknow a couple of them and all they do is drink their pension...every day.
    What do they contribute?

    Hmmm, I dunno... Maybe 40 years of taxes?

    I don't think anyone should be spared in the cuts but let's not talk silly talk.


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    #10
    galwayrush
    Registered Users Posts: 12,815 ✭✭✭✭galwayrush


    admiralofthefleet wrote: »
    bloody coffin dodging, oxygen thieving bastards them pensioners, smell like glue too

    Are you quoting one of Mary Hearney's well paid advisors....:rolleyes:


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    #11
    Voltex
    Registered Users Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Voltex


    Millicent wrote: »
    So let's punish them for the frugality of their youth and buying and paying off properties they could afford? Have I got the gist of that right?
    right lets get a few points staright...its the state pension we're on about here.
    One example i know of is a woman who is 68. never worked a day in her entire life...has her council house well paid for. i think she forked out €18 per week for it. Has her daughter living with her who takes care of all the bills. She basically hands over her entire pension to the local pub owner each week.


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    #12
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    If these old boys are so great why was the country bollixed till the mid 90's?

    take everything off them i say


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    #13
    Voltex
    Registered Users Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Voltex


    MagicMarker wrote: »
    What do they contribute?

    Hmmm, I dunno... Maybe 40 years of taxes?

    I don't think anyone should be spared in the cuts but let's not talk silly talk.
    and what did they get in return??
    40 years of social democracy!!
    when they dialled 999..they got emergeny response
    when they put their bins out they got collected
    when they went walking on the streets they had street lights
    when they turned on their taps they got water....

    ...all the stuff we are looking at having to pay extra for.


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    #14
    Asphyxia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,740 ✭✭✭Asphyxia


    My dad still has a mortgage and kids in the household under 18 so not "all" old aged pensioners have nothing to pay for, he was already cut a few times and has been struggling with so anymore cuts would be really hard for him. Anybody claiming unnecessary benefits should be cut, I know a girl who rakes in over 500 quid a week and her husband could get anything from a grand up a week and she still claims Children's Allowance among other things. It just isn't right.


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    #15
    Millicent
    Registered Users Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    Voltex wrote: »
    right lets get a few points staright...its the state pension we're on about here.
    One example i know of is a woman who is 68. never worked a day in her entire life...has her council house well paid for. i think she forked out €18 per week for it. Has her daughter living with her who takes care of all the bills. She basically hands over her entire pension to the local pub owner each week.

    Anecdotal evidence is not the way to win an argument. That one woman is not indicative of every pensioner in the country.

    You know how many pensioners I've met who have been the opposite? Tons. I saw it from retail -- the ones who would collect old receipts just to get the few points from them to the ones who wandered the shopping centre looking for spare change, but without wanting anyone to see what they were doing.

    I'm not exactly comfortable vilifying a whole class of people, that didn't have the arse in their trousers in their youth and worked hard to make something of their lives, to save a few quid now. I can't understand how anyone else would be comfortable with it either.


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    #16
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    MagicMarker wrote: »
    What do they contribute?

    Hmmm, I dunno... Maybe 40 years of taxes?

    I don't think anyone should be spared in the cuts but let's not talk silly talk.

    And their taxes paid for the pensioners that were alive at the time they were working. This idea that pensioners are entitled to retain their benefits because they worked all their lives is wrong. A small cut in their entitlements, which amounts to €5 or a cheap bottle of wine a week is not going to leave them destitute. Everyone has to contribute to the effort to pull ourselves out of the hole we are in, including pensioners.


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    #17
    brummytom
    Registered Users Posts: 10,572 ✭✭✭✭brummytom


    Loose pensioners




    Ugh


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    #18
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    Millicent wrote: »
    Anecdotal evidence is not the way to win an argument. That one woman is not indicative of every pensioner in the country.

    You know how many pensioners I've met who have been the opposite? Tons. I saw it from retail -- the ones who would collect old receipts just to get the few points from them to the ones who wandered the shopping centre looking for spare change, but without wanting anyone to see what they were doing.

    I'm not exactly comfortably vilifying a whole class of people, that didn't have the arse in their trousers in their youth and worked hard to make something of their lives, to save a few quid now. I can't understand how anyone else would be comfortable with it either.

    There is no need for any pensioner in this country in the last 10 years to be at that craic. They are well looked after, and through the recession have seen an increase in their standard of living because of deflation.

    Gone long are the days of the auld fella in the thatched cottage with only a candle to keep him warm. Pensioners are not poor, do people not realise that?


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    #19
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    oppenheimer1 wrote: »
    And their taxes paid for the pensioners that were alive at the time they were working. This idea that pensioners are entitled to retain their benefits because they worked all their lives is wrong. A small cut in their entitlements, which amounts to €5 or a cheap bottle of wine a week is not going to leave them destitute. Everyone has to contribute to the effort to pull ourselves out of the hole we are in, including pensioners.
    I've already said that no one should be spared in the cuts.


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    #20
    Millicent
    Registered Users Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    oppenheimer1 wrote: »
    There is no need for any pensioner in this country in the last 10 years to be at that craic. They are well looked after, and through the recession have seen an increase in their standard of living because of deflation.

    Gone long are the days of the auld fella in the thatched cottage with only a candle to keep him warm. Pensioners are not poor, do people not realise that?

    And yet, some of them are. Doesn't matter if they should all be well taken care of -- evidently, some of them aren't. Do you want to take money off those people?

    Did you read the final portion of my comment? Why are you comfortable taking money off people who worked their whole lives? And realistically, how much of the social welfare bill do you think pensioners actually account for?


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    #21
    TimeToShine
    Registered Users Posts: 4,881 ✭✭✭TimeToShine


    Loose...GRRR


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    #22
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Millicent wrote: »
    So let's punish them for the frugality of their youth and buying and paying off properties they could afford? Have I got the gist of that right?

    Maybe their pension should be paid at the rate it was when they bought their house so? Are are we rewardign them for not dieing?


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    #23
    phasers
    Registered Users Posts: 18,159 ✭✭✭✭phasers


    Screw em, put them all on an island and let God sort it out

    We could film it and sell the broadcasting rights internationally to help with the deficit


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    #24
    Asphyxia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,740 ✭✭✭Asphyxia


    oppenheimer1 wrote: »
    There is no need for any pensioner in this country in the last 10 years to be at that craic. They are well looked after, and through the recession have seen an increase in their standard of living because of deflation.

    Gone long are the days of the auld fella in the thatched cottage with only a candle to keep him warm. Pensioners are not poor, do people not realise that?

    Not all pensioners are wealthy though, my father is getting f**k all. After working 40 years of his life he gets screwed by the job he was in. I'm not saying that they're all poor either I am just stating that not every pensioner are stinking rich.


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    #25
    Millicent
    Registered Users Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    Stekelly wrote: »
    Maybe their pension should be paid at the rate it was when they bought their house so? Are are we rewardign them for not dieing?

    Not familiar with inflation then?


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    #26
    smk89
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,163 ✭✭✭smk89


    If they didn't spend €30,000 on the terrible advert that won't even be shown anyway I might have some sympathy. http://youtu.be/OnebFH5CVlI


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    #27
    phasers
    Registered Users Posts: 18,159 ✭✭✭✭phasers


    smk89 wrote: »
    If they didn't spend €30,000 on the terrible advert that won't even be shown anyway I might have some sympathy. http://youtu.be/OnebFH5CVlI
    "I couldn't keep my dog"
    -pfft, Dog food is 30c a pop in aldi

    "I had to give up my car"
    -Good.

    "IT'S COLD AND THERE ARE WOLVES AFTER ME"

    Damn old people


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    #28
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    The non contributory pension is about €230 afaik. They will get a council house if their own is unfit for habitation. They get free telephone, medical, transport, tv licence and electricity as well as a winter fuel allowance. They don't have loans and by and large their children are self supporting at that stage. Are you really suggesting that €225 isn't enough to feed and clothe a person?

    The Pension makes up €4bn (possibly more) of the €13bn total social welfare bill afaik.


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    #29
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Thought the total social welfare bill was about 22bn?

    Anyway yes, if a person with the above criteria as oppenheimer1 described cannot live on it, there is seriously something wrong somewhere. And many pensioners have pensions from when they worked to add to their weekly state pension income.


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    #30
    token101
    Registered Users Posts: 3,050 ✭✭✭token101


    Sure they'll probably be sponging off us more now after that advert because they're in hospital dying of pneumonia after being out in the rain.


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    #31
    Goldenegg
    Closed Accounts Posts: 352 ✭✭Goldenegg


    I think it is completely unjust to tax oaps. These people worked their arses off for 40+ years, paid their taxes and now should be their time to relax a little bit. 220 euro (or whatever the amount is) is not an awful lot to live on when you consider utility bills, grocery shopping etc.

    Cowen and Lenihan should have a little look over the water to England and take a leave out of their book. State cars should be abolished with the exception of maybe 1 or 2 for state affairs. These polititions should walk / drive / cycle to work like everyone else and should be on an average wage.


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