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IM 2011 Rollcall

13567…10

Comments

  • #62
    hf4z6sqo7vjngi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,454 ✭✭✭hf4z6sqo7vjngi


    Does anyone have a good tried and tested IM training plan. I am going to start my training after DCM.

    Looks in tunneys direction for information:p


  • #63
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    Wren Easy Brick wrote: »
    Does anyone have a good tried and tested IM training plan. I am going to start my training after DCM.

    Looks in tunneys direction for information:p

    There are plenty of generic programmes that will get you around. You're going to need to do a good bit of work to adapt one to your strengths and weaknesses and your life. You'll need to do a good bit of reading. I've been tempted recently to do up a generic plan of what I would do but just haven't had time.

    I suppose the key thing I've learnt is that the actual IM training starts 8-12 weeks out from the race, everything else is just prep for the IM block.

    Before Christmas I would work on leg durability for running. (No marathon running won't build leg durability) Strength and form for swim, bike and run.


  • #64
    kingQuez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,210 ✭✭✭kingQuez


    tunney wrote: »
    Before Christmas I would work on leg durability for running. (No marathon running won't build leg durability) Strength and form for swim, bike and run.

    Out of curiosity what would you do to improve leg durability?


  • #65
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    Wren Easy Brick wrote: »
    Does anyone have a good tried and tested IM training plan. I am going to start my training after DCM.

    Looks in tunneys direction for information:p

    Hey there Jacky back. I've attached Fink's competitive 30 week plan. I transferred it manually to excel but as Tunney expressed I have manipulated it for my own training. I'm following the plan to a certain extent but needed to adjust lots of it. Starting training the week after DCM myself but its 36 weeks to my race date, therin lay the first alteration :) As Tunney said also there will be lots and lots of reading involved with creating your plan. There is so much to it. Mine is taking on a work of art/science and I'm sure I'll look back on it in 12 months and wonder why I did this and that... its all a learning process!


  • #66
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    shotgunmcos wrote: »
    Hey there Jacky back. I've attached Fink's competitive 30 week plan. I transferred it manually to excel but as Tunney expressed I have manipulated it for my own training. I'm following the plan to a certain extent but needed to adjust lots of it. Starting training the week after DCM myself but its 36 weeks to my race date, therin lay the first alteration :) As Tunney said also there will be lots and lots of reading involved with creating your plan. There is so much to it. Mine is taking on a work of art/science and I'm sure I'll look back on it in 12 months and wonder why I did this and that... its all a learning process!

    Is this your Roth plan?


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  • #67
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    tunney wrote: »
    Is this your Roth plan?

    No, one or too similarities but mostly customised


  • #68
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    shotgunmcos wrote: »
    No

    Good.


  • #69
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    tunney wrote: »
    Good.


    Think you ought to qualify here though TunnEy. I posted the plan up cause I bought the book and typed up the plan for reference rather than flicking through the book all the time. It will surely be of use to some poeple as I would say I found it a decent starting point at least. If you are shooting it down, throw out some reasons :)

    I didn't type up any of his swimming plans as I'm doing my own thing for that.

    I liked his weekly format and adopted some of that. Otherwise I've a 20 week base, 12 week IM build and 4 week taper

    Also worth noting that Metal Dog followed the plan up to 90% and did an 11:15 or so in Copenhagen so may be useful for a sub12 target. If you were going to use the plan it might be worth checking out his log http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055803768


  • #70
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    shotgunmcos wrote: »
    Think you ought to qualify here though TunnEy.

    really?


  • #71
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    shotgunmcos wrote: »
    Think you ought to qualify here though TunnEy. I posted the plan up cause I bought the book and typed up the plan for reference rather than flicking through the book all the time. It will surely be of use to some poeple as I would say I found it a decent starting point at least. If you are shooting it down, throw out some reasons :)

    I didn't type up any of his swimming plans as I'm doing my own thing for that.

    I liked his weekly format and adopted some of that. Otherwise I've a 20 week base, 12 week IM build and 4 week taper

    Also worth noting that Metal Dog followed the plan up to 90% and did an 11:15 or so in Copenhagen so may be useful for a sub12 target. If you were going to use the plan it might be worth checking out his log http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055803768

    If it was your plan for Roth I wouldn't be impressed at planning out the whole way to Roth because
    (a) because its longer than 30 weeks to Roth
    and
    (b) because you can't plan that far ahead. Things change, plans need to be at a much higher level at this stage. Phases and short and medium term goals rather than a 30 week plan thats done out at this stage.

    As for commenting on the 30 week plan itself. I wasn't commenting on it here.

    I also can't understand the shorthand so no idea what alot of it is in that programme.


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  • #72
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    tunney wrote: »
    If it was your plan for Roth I wouldn't be impressed at planning out the whole way to Roth because
    (a) because its longer than 30 weeks to Roth
    and
    (b) because you can't plan that far ahead. Things change, plans need to be at a much higher level at this stage. Phases and short and medium term goals rather than a 30 week plan thats done out at this stage.

    As for commenting on the 30 week plan itself. I wasn't commenting on it here.

    I also can't understand the shorthand so no idea what alot of it is in that programme.


    Aha I get you now kid ;) and I agree. A high level plan with benchmarks is the underlay. Yes I have 20 weeks of base written out to a tee (its took weeks to do) but as with the norm it will go Pete Tong at times and those are the times I'll prioritise key sessions and get rid of the filler if necessary. The IM build phase is speculative at best, a couple of tune up races (an OD and HIM) to be slotted in and I haven't even decided what those are yet.


  • #73
    hf4z6sqo7vjngi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,454 ✭✭✭hf4z6sqo7vjngi


    tunney wrote: »
    There are plenty of generic programmes that will get you around. You're going to need to do a good bit of work to adapt one to your strengths and weaknesses and your life. You'll need to do a good bit of reading. I've been tempted recently to do up a generic plan of what I would do but just haven't had time.

    I suppose the key thing I've learnt is that the actual IM training starts 8-12 weeks out from the race, everything else is just prep for the IM block.

    Before Christmas I would work on leg durability for running. (No marathon running won't build leg durability) Strength and form for swim, bike and run.

    Suprised by this i thought my marathon training run would stand me good although in IM training i would plan to do longer combined runs/bike sessions at the weekend to get the body used to longer physical strain on the body. I will be heavily focussing on my swim in whatever IM plan i go with as its very poor.
    Not sure what time i will do the swim in but would be hopeful of completing the run/bike section in under 10 hours.


  • #74
    Izoard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,437 ✭✭✭Izoard


    Wren Easy Brick wrote: »
    Suprised by this i thought my marathon training run would stand me good although in IM training i would plan to do longer combined runs/bike sessions at the weekend to get the body used to longer physical strain on the body.

    This depends on your level/expectation.
    For me, at the level of 12.07 finish & 4.06 run, I found the IM run reasonably straightforward.
    It was something I concentrated least on in training, as I've done 14 marathons over the past 9 years (pb 3.26) and generally speaking, I would be picking off people on the run in whatever distance (Oly-IM). - I can put that down to;
    a) not pushing hard enough on the swim/bike
    and/or
    b) a decent aerobic run capacity, based on the previous marathon activity


  • #75
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    Izoard wrote: »
    This depends on your level/expectation.
    For me, at the level of 12.07 finish & 4.06 run, I found the IM run reasonably straightforward.
    It was something I concentrated least on in training, as I've done 14 marathons over the past 9 years (pb 3.26) and generally speaking, I would be picking off people on the run in whatever distance (Oly-IM). - I can put that down to;
    a) not pushing hard enough on the swim/bike
    and/or
    b) a decent aerobic run capacity, based on the previous marathon activity

    I was thinking more the < 3:45 off the bike marathon.


  • #76
    Izoard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,437 ✭✭✭Izoard


    tunney wrote: »
    I was thinking more the 3:05 - 3:15 off the bike marathon.

    Sure, but let's be clear - you are refering to something that is an unlikely target for the majority of IMers...


  • #77
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    Izoard wrote: »
    Sure, but let's be clear - you are refering to something that is an unlikely target for the majority of IMers...

    But its relevant at all levels. (bar walking)


  • #78
    Izoard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,437 ✭✭✭Izoard


    tunney wrote: »
    But its relevant at all levels. (bar walking)

    Better leg durability is obviously a good thing for all levels (including walking), but this is more about the relevancy of marathon experience for IM at a certain level of athlete.

    Separately, I see from the link that IM CH could be considered the "easiest"..damn!:)


  • #79
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    How many of you IMers have strength Training (ie weights) factored into your winter plans? I have none as I want to prioritise by time for base training and anything extra for core strength. But then I see strength as one of my assets (power cleans were integral in rowing traniing years ago!). It will be the first winter ever I have not hit the gym. I certainly don't have time for a periodised progressive strength plan but may just pop in for an ad hoc session.

    What would be the top 5 exercises you could chuck into a 20 min session for most specificity to IM?


  • #80
    Izoard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,437 ✭✭✭Izoard


    shotgunmcos wrote: »
    How many of you IMers have strength Training (ie weights) factored into your winter plans? I have none as I want to prioritise by time for base training and anything extra for core strength. But then I see strength as one of my assets (power cleans were integral in rowing traniing years ago!). It will be the first winter ever I have not hit the gym. I certainly don't have time for a periodised progressive strength plan but may just pop in for an ad hoc session.

    What would be the top 5 exercises you could chuck into a 20 min session for most specificity to IM?

    Used to do quite a bit, but any trip to the gym over the winter will be mainly for core work....


  • #81
    pgibbo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,377 ✭✭✭pgibbo


    I ain't doing an IM but I reckon the following 5 if you are just looking for 5 exercises would stand to you:

    Power Clean;
    Squat (Back, front or over head);
    Deadlift;
    Seated rows;
    Pull ups.

    Just my 2c


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  • #82
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    pgibbo wrote: »
    I ain't doing an IM but I reckon the following 5 if you are just looking for 5 exercises would stand to you:

    Power Clean;
    Squat (Back, front or over head);
    Deadlift;
    Seated rows;
    Pull ups.

    Just my 2c

    LOL that looks like it was lifted from an old rowing journal!


  • #83
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    Is 5 weeks enough time to taper for an IM after a HIM?


  • #84
    pgibbo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,377 ✭✭✭pgibbo


    shotgunmcos wrote: »
    Is 5 weeks enough time to taper for an IM after a HIM?

    I guess that depends on the individual and their recovery potential. I know that Ruaidhrí Geraghty from GTC raced Kenmare HIM and the Loughrea Sprint the following day. 4 weeks later he raced Barcelona Challenge and clocked 9:41. So I guess it is possible. He has a very high level of fitness and raced the Rás earlier in the year as well as a few other races.


  • #85
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    shotgunmcos wrote: »
    Is 5 weeks enough time to taper for an IM after a HIM?

    Why oh why would you do a HIM 5 weeks out from an IM?
    Unless of course you don't care about your performance in the IM I suppose.


  • #86
    Izoard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,437 ✭✭✭Izoard


    tunney wrote: »
    Why oh why would you do a HIM 5 weeks out from an IM?
    Unless of course you don't care about your performance in the IM I suppose.

    If the point of the HIM was not to race, but to test nutrition, transition etc., how would it adversely affect IM performance?


  • #87
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    Izoard wrote: »
    If the point of the HIM was not to race, but to test nutrition, transition etc., how would it adversely affect IM performance?

    Why do a HIM then? Why not just do a much more relevant race simulation?

    Never saw the point in the Irish obsession with a HIM so close to IMs.


  • #88
    Izoard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,437 ✭✭✭Izoard


    tunney wrote: »
    Why do a HIM then? Why not just do a much more relevant race simulation?

    Never saw the point in the Irish obsession with a HIM so close to IMs.

    The question remains though - how exactly would it adversely affect performance, if approached as above?


  • #89
    shotgunmcos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    Originally the one I was thinking of was in May and as per Izoards post, to test out gear, nutrition, transitions etc..., it would have given me another 4 week block to iron things out before taper. The purpose of a race? To get the 'feel' of a race. Tune up. Whet the appetite for the big day. Especially if all you have been doing for 6 months is training!

    I asked the question because the event has moved to first week in June. There are other 70.3 options in May which I haven't ruled out but cost is a factor.

    So I'm asking what the effects of doing a HIM before a taper would be?


  • #90
    tunney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,585 ✭✭✭✭tunney


    Izoard wrote: »
    The question remains though - how exactly would it adversely affect performance, if approached as above?

    You'd miss a quality session in replace of a IM paced 90km ride and 21km run.
    Or you could race the HIM and impact your preformance due inadaquate time to recovery


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  • #91
    Gringo78
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,120 ✭✭✭Gringo78


    tunney wrote: »
    You'd miss a quality session in replace of a IM paced 90km ride and 21km run.
    Or you could race the HIM and impact your preformance due inadaquate time to recovery

    You'd probably miss more than one quality session when you factor in the travel time, registration previous day etc that occurs with a race. Probably better off spending the race entry fee/travel costs on getting a few rub downs instead after all the IM training?


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