Held prisioner in country by economy

Enter Username · 09-10-2010 06:42PM #1

Some advise here please.

A friend worked in construction for the past 10 years. Now has a house that is about 40% in negative equity and has no job. Is living on state benefits while picking up the odd nixer here and there.

He is looking to move to Oz but does not think he will be gone forever. All his family are here so would only be going until the country gets back on its feet.

The problem he has is the house, he cant sell the house as he in neg equity, if he just leaves he will be blacklisted and never get another loan/mortgage if he returns.

He is essentiall being forced to stay here and be a drain on the country while he could be productive in another country. Any suggestions as to whis options are?

Mr. Loverman · 09-10-2010 06:58PM

Rent out the house while he's gone?

Why can't he continue paying the mortgage from Oz?

baaaa · 09-10-2010 07:01PM

Rent out the gaff via a letting agency,use rent to pay off mortgage(I know it's not enough but it'll have to do) and go look for work in Oz.

deman · 09-10-2010 07:03PM

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

Rent out the house while he's gone?

Why can't he continue paying the mortgage from Oz?

Is there anything stopping him from renting it out?

Enter Username · 09-10-2010 07:08PM

he lives in the north east

1. there is a severe over supply of houses, he may not be able to rent it
2. even if he does the mortgage is 1050 € per month - rents are only about 550 around here

Mr. Loverman · 09-10-2010 07:11PM

Enter Username wrote: »

he lives in the north east

1. there is a severe over supply of houses, he may not be able to rent it
2. even if he does the mortgage is 1050 € per month - rents are only about 550 around here

Why won't he pay the mortgage from Oz?

Enter Username · 09-10-2010 07:14PM

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

Why won't he pay the mortgage from Oz?

There is no reason I suppose, its just a massive cost to have to send back for a house he would not be living in as well as paying accommodation over these also

super_furry · 09-10-2010 07:17PM

Rent it out and pay the remainder of the mortgage with the money he earns in Australia. Simple.

Mr. Loverman · 09-10-2010 07:19PM

Enter Username wrote: »

There is no reason I suppose, its just a massive cost to have to send back for a house he would not be living in as well as paying accommodation over these also

If he chooses to stop paying the mortgage even though he is capable of paying it, he deserves everything he gets.

Enter Username · 09-10-2010 07:36PM

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

If he chooses to stop paying the mortgage even though he is capable of paying it, he deserves everything he gets.

Whoa.. slow down with the aggression. I only asked what his options are. "he deserves everything he gets":rolleyes::rolleyes:

goat2 · 09-10-2010 07:40PM

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

If he chooses to stop paying the mortgage even though he is capable of paying it, he deserves everything he gets.

how many rooms in said house, bedrooms, is the area a populated or popular area, does he have garage onto house,

Enter Username · 09-10-2010 07:53PM

goat2 wrote: »

how many rooms in said house, bedrooms, is the area a populated or popular area, does he have garage onto house,

3 bed - one of the main commuter towns to Dublin - no garage. There is currently 6 houses for rent in the same estate. Some have been up for months.

oppenheimer1 · 09-10-2010 07:54PM

Enter Username wrote: »

Whoa.. slow down with the aggression. I only asked what his options are. "he deserves everything he gets":rolleyes::rolleyes:

Its true though. He can't just walk away from his obligations just because he overpaid for a house and not expect for there to be consequences. I don't know much about banking in Oz, but would he not need a letter of introduction from an Irish bank if he ever wanted credit over there?

It appears to me that the best option for your mate would be a renegotiation of the terms of the mortgage with the bank and to rent it out at the market rate. If this isn't enough to meet the mortgage he should top it up with cash earned abroad.

Enter Username · 09-10-2010 07:59PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Its true though. He can't just walk away from his obligations just because he overpaid for a house and not expect for there to be consequences. I don't know much about banking in Oz, but would he not need a letter of introduction from an Irish bank if he ever wanted credit over there?

It appears to me that the best option for your mate would be a renegotiation of the terms of the mortgage with the bank and to rent it out at the market rate. If this isn't enough to meet the mortgage he should top it up with cash earned abroad.

I agree that is probably the best/only option. He also would not need to have a credit report over there as he would only be there for 5 years max so no mortgage or anything.

Enter Username · 09-10-2010 08:00PM

Thanks for all the replies (except for Mr Loverman ye big child)

Nehaxak · 09-10-2010 08:06PM

I wouldn't worry about credit ratings and all that lark, there's plenty of ways around it if he did want to come back and had a bad rating or whatever.
Tell the bank he can no longer afford to pay the mortgage, hand the keys back and go off to Oz and live life while he's still young and can do it - he'll probably end up staying there anyway once he's settled in with a job.

Mr. Loverman · 09-10-2010 08:07PM

Enter Username wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies (except for Mr Loverman ye big child)

Eh, what?

johnnyskeleton · 09-10-2010 09:18PM

He could retrain to do something else and start up a business perhaps.

jimmycrackcorm · 09-10-2010 10:09PM

I don't know how this thread is titled add being held a prisoner of the economy. If anything the guy is a prisoner of his own belief that construction workers such as labourers once believed they deserved to earn €1000 per week.

Nehaxak · 10-10-2010 12:31AM

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I don't know how this thread is titled add being held a prisoner of the economy. If anything the guy is a prisoner of his own belief that construction workers such as labourers once believed they deserved to earn €1000 per week.

Yes, because it's only those who "worked hard" by spending most of their teenage years and younger adult life bumming around in college, sponging off the state coffers + having Daddy pay the rest of the college fee's - who are entitled to a decent wage after they eventually get a degree of one sort or another - Prof., of Anthropological research studies into the effect of consuming Heinz rather than Batchelors Baked Beans in middle class society - perhaps, top profession that, well worth all the years of study...

Nevermind the guy carrying 2 x 8 stone bags of cement on his shoulders up a ladder all day.

Every trade requires skill and even a lowly labourer deserved his cut of the profits being made in the boom times - besides that fact, it's also worth noting that you wouldn't find many a plasterer for example who would take some pissy weak student in to mix his plaster, or a builder content to put up with same mixing his mortar.
Most labourers go on to specialise in one or other of the construction trades, whether that be brick/block laying, plasterer, plumber, tiler, chippy or whatever. They were paid well because they done a good job and supported the tradesmen to do their job well not because they grew up thinking they deserved it "just because". If they were crap, they were dumped and replaced and only the most experienced and skilled labourers got the highest pay, they didn't all come up with €200+ a day. It was an ok wage for a hard days work.

rainyrun · 10-10-2010 12:42AM

he should rearrange his mortgage to interest only.. this will reduce the actual monthly payment and any potential rent could cover it.. then arrange to have i rented and pay any difference from austraila.
This means he will not damage his financial rep here in Ireland and has somewhere to come back too. Its not impossible to do that and much better then handing the keys back to the bank..

the_dark_side · 10-10-2010 01:56AM

Nehaxak wrote: »

I wouldn't worry about credit ratings and all that lark, there's plenty of ways around it if he did want to come back and had a bad rating or whatever.
Tell the bank he can no longer afford to pay the mortgage, hand the keys back and go off to Oz and live life while he's still young and can do it - he'll probably end up staying there anyway once he's settled in with a job.

+1

credit rating will soon mean buck all in this failed state.... Ireland Inc.'s credit rating has suffered severly since 2008, so I wouldn't worry too much about personal credit rating from Ireland, I think alot of people will have 'economic refugee' status as they move abroad to places such as Australia in search of a new life...

Ste.phen · 10-10-2010 09:30AM

Er, I thought Australia closed off the visas for construction trades? Why is everyone assuming the OPs friend can just go there and live there legally?

kelle · 10-10-2010 10:14AM

I agree with your friend trying to change to interest only repayments for a while, and try and rent out his house at a slightly lower price than the other houses to let in the area so he is guaranteed tenants.

Mr.Loverman, it's easy to be so smug because you were not caught out by the property boom - believe me, anybody could have been and you wouldn't be making such remarks if you were.

Mr. Loverman · 10-10-2010 10:34AM

kelle wrote: »

Mr.Loverman, it's easy to be so smug because you were not caught out by the property boom - believe me, anybody could have been and you wouldn't be making such remarks if you were.

I'm not being smug, I think you've misunderstood the OPs post. He is choosing to not pay back his mortgage when he is working in Australia.

Who do you think will have to clean up his mess when he's gone? The tax payer.

He's not a victim, we are.

kelle · 10-10-2010 10:59AM

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

I'm not being smug, I think you've misunderstood the OPs post. He is choosing to not pay back his mortgage when he is working in Australia.

Who do you think will have to clean up his mess when he's gone? The tax payer.

He's not a victim, we are.

I totally understand.

But his action is that of a desperate man taking desperate measures. He never guessed he would be in a situation where his income would drop to zero.

I can't help but feel pity for him, and it sounds like he wants to do what's right at the end of the day.

viclemronny · 10-10-2010 11:17AM

First of all, his income is not zero. He is getting state benefits.
Second of all, if he thought he would have a job for 25 years guaranteed out of a housing boom, then he is, to put it politely, short-sighted and while he does not deserve to be punished for stupidity, should not be allowed to lump the cost onto others.

However, it does not seem like he is trying to do that as he is looking for options on moving to oz, not options on escaping debt.

His best bet imho is to rent the house out and try and pay the mortgage from oz. Defaulting completely on the remainder is not an option. For numerous reasons, not least of which, he does not have to if he gets a job in Australia.

OP - tell him to make sure he has work before heading over, or at least that there is a reasonable amounts of work in his field. He doesn't want to get over there and find he has to come back with nothing but a 2 grand bill after a few months. Get this information form an embassy, one of the places doing visas, an australian government website, etc. DO NOT get this information from friends/neighbours/etc as they have a habit of being in-accurate as does all anecdotal evidence.

mikemac · 10-10-2010 11:19AM

OP, does your friend have a trade?

Or was he a labourer in construction?

Tigger · 10-10-2010 11:26AM

Two points
1: cement bags weigh about four stone they havent weighed eight since about 92

2: many educated people worked on construction sites to pay for thier education education or college dosnt make you a mammys boy

Nehaxak wrote: »

Yes, because it's only those who "worked hard" by spending most of their teenage years and younger adult life bumming around in college, sponging off the state coffers + having Daddy pay the rest of the college fee's - who are entitled to a decent wage after they eventually get a degree of one sort or another - Prof., of Anthropological research studies into the effect of consuming Heinz rather than Batchelors Baked Beans in middle class society - perhaps, top profession that, well worth all the years of study...

Nevermind the guy carrying 2 x 8 stone bags of cement on his shoulders up a ladder all day.

Every trade requires skill and even a lowly labourer deserved his cut of the profits being made in the boom times - besides that fact, it's also worth noting that you wouldn't find many a plasterer for example who would take some pissy weak student in to mix his plaster, or a builder content to put up with same mixing his mortar.
Most labourers go on to specialise in one or other of the construction trades, whether that be brick/block laying, plasterer, plumber, tiler, chippy or whatever. They were paid well because they done a good job and supported the tradesmen to do their job well not because they grew up thinking they deserved it "just because". If they were crap, they were dumped and replaced and only the most experienced and skilled labourers got the highest pay, they didn't all come up with €200+ a day. It was an ok wage for a hard days work.

maninasia · 10-10-2010 11:26AM

A few things came out of my reading of this

1. The obsession with credit ratings, very American... who cares about credit, it's about how much money you can earn and saving these days.
Do you think the guy is going to get a loan anyway? How?

2. Saying he doesn't have options. He certainly does have an option of defaulting and running off..he can do it from the UK more easily. That doesn't mean it's the right thing to do of course.

3. Thinking he'll be away a short-time, why would he come back after getting set up there, come back to what and when exactly?

4. Personal responsibility still lacking, he can pay off the mortgage easily enough once working in Australia, anybody can work that out, just wants the easy way out.

mikemac · 10-10-2010 11:35AM

A bag of cement you buy weighs 25kg

Who uses stones anymore

Held prisioner in country by economy

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