Victor wrote: »
Doesn't the M8 already extend to the Dunkettle Interchange? SO the motorway order is so they can alter the motorway.
Ring road ‘will be M50 bottleneck’ if offices go ahead
CORK’S Southern Ring Road could become a bottleneck like Dublin’s M50 if major development continues along its corridor, the National Roads Authority (NRA) has warned.
In a detailed objection to a €200 million office plan in Mahon, Cork, which has the potential to create almost 1,500 jobs, the NRA said its experience of traffic congestion on the M50 was a key reason in its decision to appeal this project.
The NRA has already objected to residential plans by O’Flynn Construction at Dunkettle, and by McCarthy Developments at Mahon.
There are now fears that the authority is preparing to block future developments along the road pending the completion of the Dunkettle interchange upgrade.
John Cleary Developments (JCD) secured planning permission from Cork City Council last month after city councillors voted unanimously to rezone the site between the Project Management building and the internal Mahon Point Shopping Centre road.
Councillors agreed to address traffic concerns by ring-fencing some of the estimated €3m in development contributions which will be paid by JCD to build an extra lane for traffic going into the site.
But full details of the NRA’s objection to it became available yesterday that show it is objecting on eight key grounds, including:
* The protection of public investment in the N25’s intended transport function.
* An over-reliance on a strategic national road to gain access to the proposed development.
* The limited public transport services to the Mahon area.
* And "overstated" and "inadequate" mitigation measures proposed by the developer.
The authority acknowledged the Mahon area has been designated for development but it said the focus is excessively dependent on the use of private cars, and dependent on the national road network for access.
The NRA said it considers JCD’s proposed development will set an "undesirable precedent for similar types of development adjacent to the national road network".
It said before the M50 upgrade, that road was the most heavily congested national road in the country – caused by its increased usage as a distributor road and significant development pressures on its interchanges.
"The NRA would highlight that the experience of development pressure on the M50 and its associated interchanges was a key reason in the decision to lodge this appeal so as to avoid similar development practices emerging along the N25," its objection states.
It said the N25 is an expensive strategic national road which should not, because of inappropriate development along its corridor, become a distributor road.
It is the NRA’s view that the benefits of publicly funded investment in the road are not eroded by inappropriate development.
The NRA also said Mr Cleary’s project has the potential to adversely affect the capacity, efficiency and safety of the N25, the Jack Lynch Tunnel and the Dunkettle interchange.
The NRA said it was not notified by Cork City Council about JCD’s planning application either during the planning process, or during the public consultation phase which led up to the rezoning vote.
"This action has deprived the authority of its entitlement to participate in the planning process as intended by the legislation," the NRA said.
And it also pointed out the limited provision of public transport to the Mahon area.
Just three buses – the no 10, no 2 and no 19 South Orbital route – service the area, leading to an over-reliance on the private car.
It said a private shuttle bus the developer has been asked to provide will have minimal impact.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that the NRA is seeking tenders from contractors to provide design and environmental services associated with the N8/N25 Dunkettle Interchange Improvement Scheme.
Part of the work will involve the successful candidate providing the NRA with full planning advice on development and proposals in the study area, and any application that may impact on the performance and capacity of the N25 South Ring Road.
The contractor will be required to prepare reports on the application if a planning appeal is required.
The NRA said tenderers should allow for up to 18 applications in the Cork area over the course of the 24-month appointment.
Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/kfkfideykfey/rss2/#ixzz0zXbhbWpr
tharlear wrote: »
Question on a friday afternoon how long does it take to get through the tunnel and onto the M8?
tharlear wrote: »
Is there any work being done on the Dunkettle junction?
It looks to me as if there are at least 3 roundabouts that need to be eliminated.
Also the numbering of the road is a bit of a mess,looking at google map it appears to be N22,n28,n27,n25,
Some renumbering might be an idea. Similar to n20,n18,n17 but over a much shorter distance.
It is Cork's M50 and so you have a lot of national routes converging on it.
tharlear wrote: »
I understand that but,
on OSm.org it the n22 becomes the n25 at bandon roundabout.
On google map
N22 becomes n28 at bandon roundabout,
which becomes the n27 and n28 at pouladuff road,
this then becomes the N25,n27,n28 at the kindsale roundabout
then the n25 and n28 after the roundabout and final the n25 after the n28 branches off.
While I understand that one peice of physical infastructure may have more than one route number applied to it over a given stretch, in this case it rather confusing for some one not familiar with the area. If it's going to be corks M50 they might think of giving it it's own seperate designation.
When I drove from kinsale to cashel, none of the intersection I encountered in cork city were easy to nagavitate. I became the guy consentantly changing lanes as I tried to figure out where I was going.
Furet wrote: »
Hang on: I've just spotted the N28 here. Apologies. That strikes me as bizarre and unnecessary alright. Anyone know why it's there?
invinciblePRSTV wrote: »
Surely an error by whoever put it up seeing as it's a slip from the N27 to the SRR & Togher Flyover. There's certainly no N28 signage on it anyway.
Another reason why you should never to fully trust new fangled sat nav and DIY online maps :cool:.
As for upgrading the SRR, that means we won't be able to build some a motorway to the middle of nowhere out in the schticks. Couldn't have that now could we?.
charlemont wrote: »
before the tunnel was built the south ring road went to the bloomfield interchange , there was no road past the present N28 trumpet interchange to mahon and beyond. also the ring road stopped at the bandon road so originally before the tunnel was open all of the south ring road was N28 so some maps still probably show it as that..it only all became N25 when the tunnel was opened.
think you were just bamboozled by all the N twenty-something route numbers. My father also finds the South Ring very hard to follow, but he's old school and doesn't use route numbers at all. What improvements to signage would you suggest, given that several people have expressed confusion with the directions signed on the route? I've no problem with them myself.
invinciblePRSTV wrote: »
All well and good but the slip road which was marked N28 on the link above only came into existence with the construction of the KRR a few years ago did it not? it hardly was allocated a N28 designation in 2006 when the SRR itself was given the N25 designation in the late 1990s.
Buildings do not create jobs. Especially when there is vacant office space.
tharlear wrote: »
Its is possible to have more than one road number on a piece of road wher ethe share the same carrageway
Are you sure about that? I've never seen that done in Ireland. Indeed the Statutory Instruments defining the routes of the national and regional roads have many instances of routes being interrupted as they join another route, then resuming as they diverge from it again. So I've always taken the view that multiplexing of this sort is never done in Ireland.
NRA ‘stifling growth’ in city
By Sean O’Riordan
Friday, September 17, 2010THE Construction Industry Federation (CIF) is seeking a meeting with senior National Roads Authority officials amid claims it is stifling growth in Cork.
The claim was made last week by developer Michael O’Flynn after Bord Pleanála turned down permission for his €400 million, 1,200-house development at Dunkettle.
The NRA objected to his development on the grounds it would generate enough traffic to seriously affect already gridlocked local roads and the major interchanges at the Jack Lynch Tunnel and Dunkettle roundabout.
It was the second time Bord Pleanála had refused planning permission for the Dunkettle development and the second time the NRA had objected to the project.
CIF director for the southern region, Joe O’Brien, said he was very disappointed. He said he was concerned that job creation in the construction sector was being stymied because major projects were being held up because roads in the area need upgrading.
The NRA also successfully objected to plans by Iarnród Éireann to build a park and ride railway station at North Esk, near Dunkettle.
The NRA were also asked to comment on a Port of Cork plan to build a container terminal in Ringaskiddy. Board Pleanála also refused permission for that project. The NRA said the extra traffic resulting from the move would create further pressure on the tunnel.
This story appeared in the printed version of the Irish Examiner Friday, September 17, 2010
Read more: http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/nra-stifling-growth-in-city-131063.html#ixzz10Yq46hpc
The submission by the NRA, which is accompanied by a report by Faber Maunsell,
can be summarised as follows:
5.5.1 Impact on National Road Infrastructure and Strategic National Traffic
• The N28, N25 and in particular the N8/N25 interchange are part of the Atlantic corridor which has been identified for development under Transport 21 and will carry much of the long distance traffic between Waterford, Cork, Limerick and onto the northern gateways.
• Development generated traffic must be controlled so as not to unduly interfere with the strategic movement of goods and people to/from the Cork region along these national roads.
• The impact of local development traffic is significant.
• Currently the AADT using the interchange is 100,000 vehicles. National and local traffic converge on this junction resulting in severe congestion at peak times. The interchange is currently over capacity at peak times.
• Increased traffic trip generation is set to continue. Land use and employment strategies have encouraged orbital car based movements along the N25 Cork southern ring road. Car based volumes will continue as the CASP objective of strengthening Carrigtohill and Middleton comes to fruition.
• The intensification of traffic weaving at the interchange as a result of traffic volumes from the IBIS slip is undesirable and will lead to significant safety concerns.
5.5.2 Prematurity Pending Provision of Required Improvements
• The NRA has undertaken preliminary work in relation to required improvements but substantial work remains to be done to devise a preferred
solution. Thus, the development continues to be premature pending the determination of a future transportation infrastructure and road layout including proposals for Dunkettle interchange.
• The road improvements included in the Council’s decision could potentially form part of the upgrade determined for the national roads in the area and in particular the Dunkettle interchange.
• The permission measures do not constitute a comprehensive response to ensure that the function of the interchange in catering primarily for strategic interurban and interregional traffic is maintained.
Victor wrote: »
In fairness, the developers are trying to build a "donut city", which isn't acceptable. Plenty of unused land in the city centre, while Cork County Council are building away.
Victor wrote: »
The county council object to the city council trying to expand the city boundary ont he argument that there is still development land in the city. If there is development land, why are they allowing development all over the place in the county?
Local Authority: Cork County Council
Start County: Cork
End County: Cork
Description: This scheme involves the upgrading of the Dunkettle Interchange between the N8 and N25 national routes on the outskirts of Cork City. The current interchange arrangement has free flow for the traffic going in an east - west direction but forces north - south traffic and turning traffic to use a traffic signal controlled roundabout. It is proposed to upgrade the interchange to fully free flow in all directions and to include measures to remove locally generated traffic from the interchange.
Mainline Length (km): 1km
Current Project Phase: Route Selection
Aidan1 wrote: »
Well, even for a start, building them does, along with a lot of traffic movements. More pertinently, it would be highly unlikely that anyone would actually build office space at the moment, but would wait until things picked up, PP in hand. Clearly, developers would dearly love to build along the N25/SRR, and the NRA want to protect their (our) investment.
This is critical an issue for the City/County Councils. They have to decide if they want to build City West style developments along the SRR, and choke that up, or to zone and plan properly, ideally putting office developments in cities themselves.