A new Ireland

KeithAFC · 06-09-2010 03:14AM #1

If a new Ireland was to happen, should the flag be scrapped and a new flag created?

Revolution9 · 06-09-2010 03:24AM

A United Ireland should still use the tri-colour, as the tri-colour represents Nationalism (green) living in peace (white) with Unionism (orange).
After a dozen or so years of trying out this peace lark the hippies told us about, I've grown rather fond of it. I'd be offended if our flag was ever changed.

KeithAFC · 06-09-2010 03:29AM

Revolution9 wrote: »

A United Ireland should still use the tri-colour, as the tri-colour represents Nationalism (green) living in peace (white) with Unionism (orange).
After a dozen or so years of trying out this peace lark the hippies told us about, I've grown rather fond of it. I'd be offended if our flag was ever changed.

Unionisim would be pointless in a United Ireland. I think the flag should be changed if it did ever come about.

demonspawn · 06-09-2010 03:35AM

Yes please! And bring back the old Irish Naval Jack (that's what wiki calls it, I just call it the Irish flag). It's so much more attractive and defines our country much better in my opinion.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Naval_Jack_of_Ireland.svg

I'd prefer if this country just forgot we ever had Nationalists and Unionists, and the tricolor is just a constant reminder of the bloody conflict we've been witness to (or victims of).

Edit: The Four Provinces flag could be used as a secondary flag, it's pretty cool too.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/65/Four_Provinces_Flag.svg

Mahatma coat · 06-09-2010 03:47AM

Nevermind what sort of FLAG a new Ireland has, what sort of government do you envision??

demonspawn · 06-09-2010 03:52AM

Mahatma coat wrote: »

Nevermind what sort of FLAG a new Ireland has, what sort of government do you envision??

Former supermodels and action film stars. Ireland needs a Governator.

Darlughda · 06-09-2010 03:59AM

KeithAFC wrote: »

If a new Ireland was to happen, should the flag be scrapped and a new flag created?

Will you feck off with bs notions of national identity.
If a new Ireland were to happen all Dáil seater would be stripped of everything, including their seats.

Campaigning would be banned. No more parish pump politics, hereditary seats, scratch yer back and I'll show up at yer funeral type politics, irradicate the favour system

And there be your new Irealand

deise go deo · 06-09-2010 09:50AM

KeithAFC wrote: »

Unionisim would be pointless in a United Ireland. I think the flag should be changed if it did ever come about.

Well I dont think Unionism would be pointless, no one has said that if Unionists dont like being in a UI if it happens they cant try to get out of it.

The tri colour dosent represent nationalism and unionism, it represents the old gaelic tradition(green) and the protestant(orange) tradition and peace between the two(white), Overall I cant think of a better symbol for a United Ireland. Although I can understand Unionist reservations because it has been seen as the symbol of just one side in the past.

Liam Byrne · 06-09-2010 10:16AM

Revolution9 wrote: »

A United Ireland....

I thought the OP was just talking about a new, uncorrupt, fair and equal Ireland ?

mikemac · 06-09-2010 10:28AM

The tricolour is the perfect flag, green, white and orange.
No need for a new flag
Two parts of Ireland represented and white between them for peace.

Though I do hear football commentators and pundits on radio shows being proud of the "green, white and gold"
Where are they getting gold from?
Drives me mad!

Martin 2 · 06-09-2010 10:43AM

KeithAFC wrote: »

If a new Ireland was to happen, should the flag be scrapped and a new flag created?

It depends on what you mean by a new Ireland but if you mean a united Ireland then yes it would be a good idea to change the flag. Rightly or wrongly many Northern Irish people associate the tricolour with terrorism and with a state that claimed jurisdiction over NI until quite recently. It doesn't matter that the flag includes the orange tradition, the negative associations are too deep and if they were to give up their flag then a new government should be prepared to consider a new flag.

On a personal note, New Ireland or not, I'd like the flag to be changed, to me it doesn't stand out amongst other flags and I don't see why a flag can't be both meaningful and attractive. Anyway we can forget about any changes until the state coffers are back in a healthy state.

dvpower · 06-09-2010 11:14AM

Martin 2 wrote: »

It depends on what you mean by a new Ireland but if you mean a united Ireland then yes it would be a good idea to change the flag. Rightly or wrongly many Northern Irish people associate the tricolour with terrorism and with a state that claimed jurisdiction over NI until quite recently. It doesn't matter that the flag includes the orange tradition, the negative associations are too deep and if they were to give up their flag then a new government should be prepared to consider a new flag.

If the OP means a united Ireland, then we can assume that the negative associations would already have been overcome by the time we got to that point.

Lockstep · 06-09-2010 11:27AM

demonspawn wrote: »

Yes please! And bring back the old Irish Naval Jack (that's what wiki calls it, I just call it the Irish flag). It's so much more attractive and defines our country much better in my opinion.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Naval_Jack_of_Ireland.svg

I'd prefer if this country just forgot we ever had Nationalists and Unionists, and the tricolor is just a constant reminder of the bloody conflict we've been witness to (or victims of).

Edit: The Four Provinces flag could be used as a secondary flag, it's pretty cool too.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/65/Four_Provinces_Flag.svg

Hear hear.

Also, it's the flag of the United Irishmen (Protestant leaders like Wolfe Tone who organised with Catholic groups (Like the Defenders) to demand equality.

Nodin · 06-09-2010 11:40AM

KeithAFC wrote: »

If a new Ireland was to happen, should the flag be scrapped and a new flag created?

You like to walk around and poke things with sticks, don't you?

Rabble Rabble · 06-09-2010 01:15PM

Darlughda wrote: »

Will you feck off with bs notions of national identity.
If a new Ireland were to happen all Dáil seater would be stripped of everything, including their seats.

Campaigning would be banned. No more parish pump politics, hereditary seats, scratch yer back and I'll show up at yer funeral type politics, irradicate the favour system

And there be your new Irealand

seems like a benevolent dictatorship decided by you. Banning campaigning in a democracy. I say no.

KeithAFC · 06-09-2010 02:07PM

Nodin wrote: »

You like to walk around and poke things with sticks, don't you?

Just a discussion. Its always been an interesting topic if a new Ireland does happen.

Martin 2 · 06-09-2010 02:18PM

dvpower wrote: »

If the OP means a united Ireland, then we can assume that the negative associations would already have been overcome by the time we got to that point.

I think we can also assume that for a large section of those of unionist background the tricolour will always have negative associations even in a UI where most other issues have been resolved. A new flag should not have those associations and would represent a new beginning for all sides. An unwillingness to change the flag is an impediment, however small, to a UI, or at least to a UI which would be acceptable to all sides.

bmaxi · 06-09-2010 02:59PM

Martin 2 wrote: »

I think we can also assume that for a large section of those of unionist background the tricolour will always have negative associations even in a UI where most other issues have been resolved. A new flag should not have those associations and would represent a new beginning for all sides. An unwillingness to change the flag is an impediment, however small, to a UI, or at least to a UI which would be acceptable to all sides.

I agree. I would imagine there were plenty in the Republic, who were not too happy with how the flag was used either.

deise go deo · 06-09-2010 03:05PM

Martin 2 wrote: »

I think we can also assume that for a large section of those of unionist background the tricolour will always have negative associations even in a UI where most other issues have been resolved. A new flag should not have those associations and would represent a new beginning for all sides. An unwillingness to change the flag is an impediment, however small, to a UI, or at least to a UI which would be acceptable to all sides.

Well in the event of a UI compromises would have to be made on both sides. I dont really see that the flag would be a major Issue but if it was then something would have to be done, I dont really mind what it is as long as it dosent have a union jack in the corner.:D

junder · 06-09-2010 03:12PM

I would certainly not accept the tricolour as my national flag ever

Bottle_of_Smoke · 06-09-2010 03:21PM

Green flag with a red hand on it?

Bottle_of_Smoke · 06-09-2010 03:24PM

deise go deo wrote: »

The tri colour dosent represent nationalism and unionism, it represents the old gaelic tradition(green) and the protestant(orange) tradition and peace between the two(white), Overall I cant think of a better symbol for a United Ireland. Although I can understand Unionist reservations because it has been seen as the symbol of just one side in the past.

That's not official by the way. I've heard some people referring to the white representing the dissenter.

Liam Byrne · 06-09-2010 03:40PM

bmaxi wrote: »

I agree. I would imagine there were plenty in the Republic, who were not too happy with how the flag was used either.

I would imagine there were plenty in the Republic who were not too happy with how the flag was abused either.

lugha · 06-09-2010 03:59PM

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

That's not official by the way. I've heard some people referring to the white representing the dissenter.

Have never heard that but there are a number of alternative explanations of the flag, though the most popular understanding is the peace between the two traditions idea.
Of course the flag is now an icon of republicanism and as such is tainted, so there is no prospect of it being the flag of a united Ireland.

How about an image of a toilet bowl, with the orange and green joined together in unity and harmony, disappearing beneath the surface? :pac:

Ren2k7 · 06-09-2010 04:05PM

deise go deo wrote: »

Well in the event of a UI compromises would have to be made on both sides. I dont really see that the flag would be a major Issue but if it was then something would have to be done, I dont really mind what it is as long as it dosent have a union jack in the corner.:D

Ah crap. And there was me spending the whole of 5 minutes on Photoshop making a possible new flag in a United Ireland
Possible%20Flag%20of%20United%20Ireland.png

Possible%20Flag%20of%20United%20Ireland.png

The rationale behind this design is that in any future United Ireland the new state would be a member of the commonwealth so this design would be paying respect to both sides of the community.

Cú Giobach · 06-09-2010 04:17PM

Ren2k7 wrote: »

Ah crap. And there was me spending the whole of 5 minutes on Photoshop making a possible new flag in a United Ireland

The rationale behind this design is that in any future United Ireland the new state would be a member of the commonwealth so this design would be paying respect to both sides of the community.

Arrrgh!!!! EYE BLEACH...now!!!

Is that the "west Brit" flag. (Leinster & Union flag)

Ren2k7 · 06-09-2010 04:19PM

Cú Giobach wrote: »

Arrrgh!!!! EYE BLEACH...now!!!

LOL. It's only a suggestion. It's good enough for the Aussies and New Zealanders so it could work here. :pac:

Revolution9 · 06-09-2010 04:19PM

Just like that lad a few comments ago said he'd never accept the tri-colour, many would never accept the buther's apron, erm I mean the Union Jack, on our national flag.

Revolution9 · 06-09-2010 04:23PM

KeithAFC wrote: »

Unionisim would be pointless in a United Ireland. I think the flag should be changed if it did ever come about.

It really wouldn't. If Ireland was ever united, the Unionists wouldnt just go away. They would fight tooth and nail and this would probably usher in a new era of "trouble" for the island.

If we were a united nation, our first challenge would be getting the unionists to accept it. What better way to start than keeping the tri-colour, a flag which represents unionists living in peace with nationalists?

Ren2k7 · 06-09-2010 04:26PM

Cú Giobach wrote: »

Is that the "west Brit" flag. (Leinster & Union flag)

Could prove to be a popular flag around the west brit enclaves of Ballsbridge and Rathmines and at RDS events. :P

junder · 06-09-2010 04:55PM

Revolution9 wrote: »

Just like that lad a few comments ago said he'd never accept the tri-colour, many would never accept the buther's apron, erm I mean the Union Jack, on our national flag.

Nobody is asking you to

A new Ireland

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