French expulsion of Roma to begin Thursday

Blazer · 19-08-2010 02:23PM

I wonder how many people on here are saying..."good for the french..we should do the same" yet the same people want the illegal Irish over in the US to be granted citizenship rights etc..

My thoughts are..if you're staying illegally then any country has the right to throw you out..don't matter if you're irish, roma etc

raah! · 19-08-2010 02:23PM

The French seem to be taking a very strong stance bout which minority groups they don't want to allow in their society these days. But I guess if they are illegal then it's different.

All the same, France won't be seen in the same light after all these events. (I don't really know what light france are properly seen in mind you, but I always thought it was a fairly liberal country)

prinz · 19-08-2010 02:26PM

WindSock wrote: »

There are probably heaps of other nationalities that are there illegally too.

Yes, and these get deported on a case by case basis. It's usually harder to spot most nationalities as they tend not to set up illegal camps and gang together which makes it so easy to deport them en masse.

WindSock wrote: »

Are the Roma even there illegally? I thought they were from EU member
states.

Yes, even as an EU citizen you can be deported if you don't fulfill certain criteria and abide by the residence laws. Doesn't make a difference if it's a Roma or an Irish citizen.

Renn · 19-08-2010 02:27PM

Just give up already WindSock

Pookah · 19-08-2010 02:28PM

prinz wrote: »

Yes, even as an EU citizen you can be deported if you don't fulfill certain criteria and abide by the residence laws. Doesn't make a difference if it's a Roma or an Irish citizen.

Not under the Schengen agreement you can't, which Romania, I believe, are not yet fully signed up to.

Morlar · 19-08-2010 02:28PM

raah! wrote: »

All the same, France won't be seen in the same light after all these events. (I don't really know what light france are properly seen in mind you, but I always thought it was a fairly liberal country)

I can't see tourists protesting at the sudden lack of all that 'roma cultural enhancement' no their next trip to France. France will be seen in a better light after this.

ejmaztec · 19-08-2010 02:31PM

raah! wrote: »

The French seem to be taking a very strong stance bout which minority groups they don't want to allow in their society these days. But I guess if they are illegal then it's different.

All the same, France won't be seen in the same light after all these events. (I don't really know what light france are properly seen in mind you, but I always thought it was a fairly liberal country)

I see them in the same light, as I think France has always had a questionable attitude towards Foreigners, whether they've been involved in illegal activities or not.

prinz · 19-08-2010 02:32PM

Pookah wrote: »

Not under the Schengen agreement you can't, which Romania, I believe, are not yet fully signed up to.

Yes. You can.

Pookah · 19-08-2010 02:33PM

prinz wrote: »

Yes. You can.

Ok, then you can.

France do it all the time, esp to foreign prisoners, an 'interdiction' as they call it, but it's illegal and will be reversed by the Court of European Rights, if the person decides to follow that route.

ejmaztec · 19-08-2010 02:34PM

prinz wrote: »

Yes. You can.

As you quite rightly pointed out to me when I shot myself in the foot, the last time this came up:P.

WindSock · 19-08-2010 02:39PM

Renn wrote: »

Just give up already WindSock

Give up what exactly?

I posted here initially to point out that it is unfair label an entire group as criminals and gave an example of the attitude toward Irish in the UK during the Troubles. Was that not an example of racism?

deandean · 19-08-2010 02:40PM

The Roma contribute absolutely nothing in this country, and take all they can, and then some more. Seems it's in their genes to deceive and steal.
IMO the country would only benefit if the Roma were declared Persona Non Grata here, and deported.
And ship out most of the Equality Authority Quango with them.

southsiderosie · 19-08-2010 02:48PM

Pookah wrote: »

Ok, then you can.

France do it all the time, esp to foreign prisoners, an 'interdiction' as they call it, but it's illegal and will be reversed by the Court of European Rights, if the person decides to follow that route.

Has anyone seen any report that actually asked Roma people, rather than talking heads, how they feel about this? I'm curious, because when I was in Belfast, apparently a lot of the Roma wanted to go home but they couldn't afford the tickets (most have big families). I think a lot of them thought that Western Europe would be the land of milk and honey (or easier shakedowns) when they were allowed to move around the EU, and they were sorely disappointed - especially in Belfast where people have absolutely no time for beggars, and they get zero assistance from the state.

Anyway, I thought it was interesting that the official in the article noted that people were happy to be paid to leave...I'm just wondering what "the people" really think.

Pookah · 19-08-2010 02:51PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

Has anyone seen any report that actually asked Roma people, rather than talking heads, how they feel about this? I'm curious, because when I was in Belfast, apparently a lot of the Roma wanted to go home but they couldn't afford the tickets (most have big families). I think a lot of them thought that Western Europe would be the land of milk and honey (or easier shakedowns) when they were allowed to move around the EU, and they were sorely disappointed - especially in Belfast where people have absolutely no time for beggars, and they get zero assistance from the state.

Anyway, I thought it was interesting that the official in the article noted that people were happy to be paid to leave...I'm just wondering what "the people" really think.

Are you asking me?

I'm not Roma.

southsiderosie · 19-08-2010 02:56PM

Pookah wrote: »

Are you asking me?

I'm not Roma.

No it was a general query...hence the "has anyone seen any report..."

ejmaztec · 19-08-2010 02:58PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

"has anyone seen any report..."

Nope.

Pookah · 19-08-2010 02:58PM

southsiderosie wrote: »

No it was a general query...hence the "has anyone seen any report..."

Why quote me, then? It's just a little confusing.

The_Minister · 19-08-2010 03:14PM

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

I have only one thing to say about this..

NA NA, NA NA NA NA, WAAAA-AAAAVEE GOOOODBYEEEE

Right up to now I have been singing 'Way-hay, Goodbye".

southsiderosie · 19-08-2010 03:15PM

Pookah wrote: »

Why quote me, then? It's just a little confusing.

Ah, sorry about that - your point about the ECHR got me thinking "would any individual actually want to file a lawsuit? Maybe they are glad to go, or at least to get the money". I wasn't trying to put you on the spot.

Morlar · 19-08-2010 03:17PM

The_Minister wrote: »

Right up to now I have been singing 'Way-hay, Goodbye".

I must say that's a bit uncalled for.

prinz · 19-08-2010 03:22PM

Pookah wrote: »

Ok, then you can.
France do it all the time, esp to foreign prisoners, an 'interdiction' as they call it, but it's illegal and will be reversed by the Court of European Rights, if the person decides to follow that route.

No it isn't illegal to deport EU citizens under certain conditions..

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/site/en/oj/2004/l_158/l_15820040430en00770123.pdf

Persons exercising their right of residence should not, however, become an unreasonable burden on the social assistance system of the host Member State during an initial period of residence. Therefore, the right of residence for Union citizens and their family members for periods in excess of three months should be subject to conditions.....
For periods of residence of longer than three months, Member States should have the possibility to require Union citizens to register with the competent authorities in the place of residence, attested by a registration certificate issued to that effect....
As long as the beneficiaries of the right of residence do not become an unreasonable burden on the social assistance system of the host Member State they should not be expelled. Therefore, an expulsion measure should not be the automatic consequence of recourse to the social assistance system. The host Member State should examine whether it is a case of temporary difficulties and take into account the duration of residence, the personal circumstances and the amount of aid granted in order to consider whether the beneficiary has become an unreasonable burden on its social assistance system and to proceed to his expulsion. In no case should an expulsion measure be adopted against workers, self-employed persons or job-seekers as defined by the Court of Justice save on grounds of public policy or public security....

The Treaty allows restrictions to be placed on the right of free movement and residence on grounds of public policy, public security or public health.

Article 7
Right of residence for more than three months
1. All Union citizens shall have the right of residence on the territory of another Member State for a period of longer than three months if they:
(a) are workers or self-employed persons in the host Member State; or
(b) have sufficient resources for themselves and their family members not to become a burden on the social assistance system of the host Member State during their period of residence and have comprehensive sickness insurance cover in the host Member State; or
(c) – are enrolled at a private or public establishment, accredited or financed by the host
Member State on the basis of its legislation or administrative practice, for the principal
purpose of following a course of study, including vocational training; and
– have comprehensive sickness insurance cover in the host Member State and assure the
relevant national authority, by means of a declaration or by such equivalent means as
they may choose, that they have sufficient resources for themselves and their family
members not to become a burden on the social assistance system of the host Member
State during their period of residence; or
(d) are family members accompanying or joining a Union citizen who satisfies the conditions
referred to in points (a), (b) or (c).

Given that the Roma being expelled are illegally in France, the French have every right to deport them, under public policy and public order, or if they are unemployed and have insufficient resources to pay their own way. The Italians have already undertaken a similar move a few years ago, it wasn't reversed.

thebigbiffo · 19-08-2010 03:22PM

you're all xenophobic bigots in here. the lot of yis. and racist to boot.

roma are honourable people, with lots to offer the culture they decide to grace with their presence.

Nodin · 19-08-2010 03:25PM

The_Minister wrote: »

http://euobserver.com/9/30637

What do people think?
Should we follow suit, or is it a racist policy?

Morlar wrote:

We should definitely follow suit.

We already have expelled Roma....and we had this thread not too long ago....

deandean wrote:

The Roma contribute absolutely nothing in this country, and take all they can, and then some more. Seems it's in their genes to deceive and steal..

Ach...der Untermench....

ejmaztec · 19-08-2010 03:27PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

you're all xenophobic bigots in here. the lot of yis. and racist to boot.

roma are honourable people, with lots to offer the culture they decide to grace with their presence.

Reported for not being too far off the mark abuse.

Morlar · 19-08-2010 03:28PM

Nodin wrote: »

Ach...der Untermench....

Hehehe.

thebigbiffo · 19-08-2010 03:33PM

ejmaztec wrote: »

Reported for not being too far off the mark abuse.

s'hit. i forgot to hit the sarcasm highlighter button.

another 7 days without AH would probably do me good tbh

Cookie_Monster · 19-08-2010 03:38PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

you're all xenophobic bigots in here. the lot of yis. and racist to boot.

roma are honourable people, with lots to offer the culture they decide to grace with their presence.

name one bit of beneficial culture they bring

Morlar · 19-08-2010 03:40PM

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

name one bit of beneficial culture they bring

Hold on. Everybody get the popcorn. This could take a while.

gurramok · 19-08-2010 03:56PM

I said this on the other mega thread reagrding Roma. Nationals from Bulgaria and Romania need work permits before they are allowed to work in either France or Ireland or UK.

On failure to obtain that work permit, you are treated as a tourist where you have a maximum of 3 months stay in said country and then you must leave. If not, you become an illegal and can be rightfully deported.

Pedro K · 19-08-2010 03:58PM

Pookah wrote: »

Not under the Schengen agreement you can't, which Romania, I believe, are not yet fully signed up to.

Roma does not equal Romanian.

French expulsion of Roma to begin Thursday

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