An Post sacks post office worker after she was held at gunpoint

Pace2008 · 28-07-2010 07:44PM

caseyann wrote: »

I know you would imagine someone who has worked for them for 30 years :eek: is that right? wouldn't make a mistake.

On the other hand, you could posit that someone who's worked in the same job for that length of time, with relatively little incident, might be a little too in their comfort zone and may have become lax in certain areas of their duty.

All conjecture, obviously.

rubadub · 28-07-2010 07:45PM

caseyann wrote: »

From what i can hear she couldnt have done anything so what did she do wrong?

Well you didn't honestly expect her to spill her guts on how she actually f**ked up and didn't do her job did you?

caseyann wrote: »

30 years of loyalty

We have no idea how loyal she was, and for how long. This quote spoke volumes to me.

involved ongoing failure to implement basic security arrangements

If it was a young lad in his 20's I doubt he would get a fraction of the sympathy, esp. if it was a private security firm who said the same thing about "ongoing failure". To me it is a nice terminology to avoid any sort of defamation charge, sort of like rte news saying some scumbag shot in a pub was "known to gardai" -nudge nudge, wink wink, everybody knows what they really mean.

tallaghtoutlaws · 28-07-2010 07:45PM

caseyann wrote: »

I know you would imagine someone who has worked for them for 30 years :eek: is that right? wouldn't make a mistake.

Could they not have demoted her or gave her a slap on wrist for 30 years of loyalty.lol

Lets not forget security measures have changed so much in 30 years. Huge difference in Post Offices these days than there was even 10 years ago. Spoke to one of the girls in the Post Office in my area earlier and they said if they were robbed today there is no way the thief would get anywhere near 80k. Time locked safes and drops by securicor etc etc and proper security doesn't allow them to carry anymore than necessary.

caseyann · 28-07-2010 07:47PM

Pace2008 wrote: »

On the other hand, you could posit that someone who's worked in the same job for that length of time, with relatively little incident, might be a little too in their comfort zone and may have become lax in certain areas of their duty.

All conjecture, obviously.

It is possible.

rubadub wrote: »

Well you didn't honestly expect her to spill her guts on how she actually f**ked up and didn't do her job did you?

We have no idea how loyal she was, and for how long. This quote spoke volumes to me.

If it was a young lad in his 20's I doubt he would get a fraction of the sympathy, esp. if it was a private security firm who said the same thing about "ongoing failure". To me it is a nice terminology to avoid any sort of defamation charge, sort of like rte news saying some scumbag shot in a pub was "known to gardai" -nudge nudge, wink wink, everybody knows what they really mean.

He would from me as they havent said where she failed,I remain unsure.

blueser · 28-07-2010 07:48PM

OutlawPete wrote: »

We know all that.

I worked in a 24 hour shop that also had that procedure.

But rural post offices are slightly different.

Bookies work on the same principal as sometimes you have to access cash (a big win, someone wants to withdraw their savings etc).

The timer was on the safe as she explains and they came in just as the safe was open.

In such circumstances, wouldn't the punter/customer be paid by cheque, or be told to call in the next day if they wanted their money in cash?

caseyann · 28-07-2010 07:49PM

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Lets not forget security measures have changed so much in 30 years. Huge difference in Post Offices these days than there was even 10 years ago. Spoke to one of the girls in the Post Office in my area earlier and they said if they were robbed today there is no way the thief would get anywhere near 80k. Time locked safes and drops by securicor etc etc and proper security doesn't allow them to carry anymore than necessary.

Digging info were you

mikemac · 28-07-2010 07:50PM

rubadub wrote: »

If it was a young lad in his 20's I doubt he would get a fraction of the sympathy, esp. if it was a private security firm who said the same thing about "ongoing failure".

I realy think that if this was in the OP, people would be thinking "inside job"

This thread reminds me of the case in Galway where the GAA store had cash from advance tickets sales.
Employee fecked off for lunch and didn't secure the premises. You bet people thought it was an inside job! It was most people's first reaction. Hmmm, robbed between 1pm and 2pm the same day the store was not locked up......

Burglary at Galway GAA office
THE GARDA is appealing for witnesses in the wake of a robbery at the GAA office in Aras na Gael in Dominick St last Thursday. A substantial undisclosed The Garda is appealing to contact Galway Garda Station at (091) 538000, or sum of money -- the anyone who was in the the Galway crime unit at proceeds for last Sunday's area at the time of the raid to come forward, (091) 538023. -- anything unusual which T h e raid took place could be pertinent to the investigation. between 1pm and 2pm on Witnesses are asked to Thursday July 10.

http://archive.advertiser.ie/pages/view.php?ref=73346&search=!collection1734&order_by=field51&sort=ASC&offset=0&archive=0&k=

Which wasn't the case in the situation anyway, just to point that out

tallaghtoutlaws · 28-07-2010 07:51PM

caseyann wrote: »

Digging info were you

Never know when one needs to rob withdraw cash from the post office.

OutlawPete · 28-07-2010 07:53PM

rubadub wrote: »

To me it is a nice terminology to avoid any sort of defamation charge, sort of like rte news saying some scumbag shot in a pub was "known to gardai" -nudge nudge, wink wink, everybody knows what they really mean.

If that's the case, then she should have been sacked before, why wait till there was a robbery if there was "ongoing failure to implement security measures" and it was her fault?

If that is the case then they are more to blame than her.

I have won money in Paddy Powers where I have had to come back in 15 minutes as they have set the timer on the safe to open.

If there was an armed robbery at that point, would the guy get sacked?

Sounds to me like they watched that place and knew she was opening it when they hit, I doubt it was a coincidence.

Biggins · 28-07-2010 07:54PM

blueser wrote: »

In such circumstances, wouldn't the punter/customer be paid by cheque, or be told to call in the next day if they wanted their money in cash?

Yes, if the place had officially adopted and was following professional procedures.

I have previously worked in places that literally had millions in cash. All of which I had access to.
I could only absolutely get access to the larger amounts between certain times. Anyone else coming along later or before (and seeking large amounts) was made aware of the current security procedure times and that they would have to return at the appropriate time.

Grumpypants · 28-07-2010 07:56PM

I was thinking why didnt she quickly knock the shot gun away from her head grab the guy from behind use him as a human shield when the guy with the hand gun at the door started shooting. Then point his arm at the other two blasting them with the shotgun. Then break the neck of the guy she had a hold of if he wasnt already dead. Then jump the counter grab the hand gun, take out the other guy waiting outside. Get his gun run down to the cop shop dual wielding hand guns to take out the guys sitting outside the police station.

But then i thought what would happen if she wasnt able to jump the counter run over to the door and get the hand gun before one of the guys outside came in and shot her.

caseyann · 28-07-2010 07:56PM

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Never know when one needs to rob withdraw cash from the post office.

So did this friend talk alot

Biggins · 28-07-2010 07:57PM

Grumpypants wrote: »

I was thinking why didnt she quickly knock the shot gun away from her head grab the guy from behind use him as a human shield when the guy with the hand gun at the door started shooting. Then point his arm at the other two blasting them with the shotgun. Then break the neck of the guy she had a hold of if he wasnt already dead. Then jump the counter grab the hand gun, take out the other guy waiting outside. Get his gun run down to the cop shop dual wielding hand guns to take out the guys sitting outside the police station.

But then i thought what would happen if she wasnt able to jump the counter run over to the door and get the hand gun before one of the guys outside came in and shot her.

Aaaa here... Jack Bauer hasn't had a sex change just yet!

tallaghtoutlaws · 28-07-2010 08:03PM

caseyann wrote: »

So did this friend talk alot

Can you drive fast? I may need a get away driver.:D

gogo · 28-07-2010 08:31PM

I work in a bank and would fully expect to lose my job if raiders managed to get away with 80k. Security procedures are there for a reason, and clearly they were not being followed. There is a tendency to forget that the post office is out about 70k due to this woman not being able to follow instructions.
God bless any one who's raided, I feel sorry for them and god knows what I do in a raid but at least I know the max I'd be able to hand over is the max I'd be allowed have out in my drawer.

I once made a hugh mistake in work, and gave out about 15 times what the customer needed, (not directly to customer, long story), the money was recovered, I followed all procedures, just counted wrong in a hurry, i never got the money double counted properly as is procedure,again in too much of a hurry. When I was called before the manager and area manager, I fully expected my walking papers, and would do so if I was there 30 years or 1 year. The only reason I still work there is because I was able to recover the money within the hour. But the mistake is still probably in my file, and it was nowhere near 80k. Where I work, security is all about covering your own ass.

outlawpete wrote:

I have won money in Paddy Powers where I have had to come back in 15 minutes as they have set the timer on the safe to open.

How much money, honey;)

Gummy Panda · 28-07-2010 08:40PM

Is she actually employed by An Post?

I thought Post Master/Mistress tendered for a contract to run the post office and weren't directly employed by An Post.

Kinda like a franchise.

Our man in Havana · 28-07-2010 08:42PM

She would be a contractor.

Ghost Train · 28-07-2010 08:42PM

There are certain things that seem a bit weird about the story. Would be intereting to know if the post office has a set limit to the amount that should be kept in a post office or is it just general guidelines they give the staff

€80,000 seems like a lot for a small post office but relative to other financial institutions its probably not excessive

The big issue I would have is the Post Office thinking the women should have to repay them the €80,000

The only way she should have to pay them €80,000 is if she robbed the place herself

gogo · 28-07-2010 08:43PM

Yeah, her contract has been terminated. But no contract, no job, boils down to the same thing. No other postal service offering contracts for her.

Our man in Havana · 28-07-2010 08:46PM

She would be paying out dole, pensions and childrens allowance payments. There could easily be that much in the safe.

gogo · 28-07-2010 08:49PM

*Read today that over 100k was taken and they are asking her to repay 80k.
So presumably, the 20k is all they should have had access to, the remained should have been locked up.

*Independant.ie

veryangryman · 28-07-2010 08:51PM

You would wonder though - i worked in a bookies and the boss was obsessed with going to the bank if the cash was getting a little on the large side. Max in office any day (safe inclusive) about 4K.

Grand National weekend including bank holiday (so had to bank Tuesday) we had about 20K at end. Tuesday i walked the main streets with 10K in my pocket for Mr banker. Big red head on me

Wouldnt like to see what would happen if someone stopped me for a chat, even a friendly one. Id probably Jackie Chan/Chuck Norris Kick them and run like hell

Biggins · 28-07-2010 08:54PM

A post office worker has had her contract terminated because An Post said she did not follow the correct security procedures during an armed robbery last year.
Bernie Moore has run the post office in Carrigans in Co Donegal for 30 years.
Last February, three armed raiders held-up the post office and got away with cash from the safe.

Ms Moore was held at gunpoint and was forced to hand over the cash from the safe.
An Post contacted Ms Moore after the raid and demanded that she pay them €80,000 and they told her they were terminating her contract.
In a statement today, An Post said: 'While we do not wish to comment on an individual case we can confirm that the issue in Carrigans involved ongoing failure to implement basic security arrangements.
'For this reason we terminated the contract of our Postmistress in Carrigans.
'These security measures are in place for the protection of post office staff and customers.
'Failing to implement these measures puts all post office staff and customers at risk.'

An Post has advertised for a replacement postmaster for the Carrigans area starting on 1 September, the day Ms Moore's contract ends.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0728/anpost.html

rubadub · 28-07-2010 09:13PM

OutlawPete wrote: »

If that's the case, then she should have been sacked before, why wait till there was a robbery if there was "ongoing failure to implement security measures" and it was her fault?

Might be difficult to sack somebody in that position, like it is meant to be hard to sack teachers & civil servants. I expect she got lots of warnings by the sound of that one quote, maybe I am reading a lot into it, but when I hear a shot guy was "known to gardai" I do read between the lines.

Grumpypants wrote: »

I was thinking why didnt she quickly knock the shot gun away from her head grab the guy from behind use him as a human shield when the guy with the hand gun at the door started shooting

I was thinking what procedures was she not following, esp. when several posters who seem to know about postal security were saying it is next to impossible to rob that amount. I was thinking she must have been grossly negligent.

feelingstressed wrote: »

I realy think that if this was in the OP, people would be thinking "inside job"

I actually was wondering if this was what was being hinted at.

Ghost Train wrote: »

The big issue I would have is the Post Office thinking the women should have to repay them the €80,000

The only way she should have to pay them €80,000 is if she robbed the place herself

that was my reasoning for wondering it.

Gummy Panda · 28-07-2010 09:21PM

Ghost Train wrote: »

The big issue I would have is the Post Office thinking the women should have to repay them the €80,000

The only way she should have to pay them €80,000 is if she robbed the place herself

It might be part of the terms & conditions of the contract. I don't know about An Post but in franchises, the master franchiser could have a term in the contract stating that if certain aspects aren;t carried out, the franchisee will have to pay a fine.

Jaxxy · 28-07-2010 09:21PM

Having worked in post offices in various areas for years, and having been held up a number of times I can't understand the sympathy for this woman. Having that amount of cash on hand in the office, a rural post office at that, is ridiculous.

There are so many security measures in place to protect both the employee, the customers and An Post's interests, as has already been stated. If you find you are over your set amount of acceptable cash on hand there is a number you can call and a secure pick up will be arranged. Saying that logically there should be that amount of money in a post office on any given day because of social welfare payments is also ridiculous. Post offices get their weekly REMs of the estimated amount of cash needed per week (or in some offices, per day). If anything she should have beneath the requirement. With this story in the news any opportunist will get the impression that there is big, easy money available at any post office. There will be fall-out and I guarantee you attempted armed robberies will increase.

She's a lazy idiot IMO and I'm glad she got the sack. But she won't have to pay back that €80,000. It'll be settled on the steps of the court house, like most cases for the company, and she will agree to a weekly payment of €10 or something equally as insignificant as per the proof she will no doubt provide of her current state of earnings.

DazMarz · 28-07-2010 09:52PM

The only good thing about it all is, as a Postmistress, she will lose her An Post pension and redundancy/severance package as a result of this as An Post will claim that to compensate for her stupidity. And no harm either!

herbieflowers · 28-07-2010 09:57PM

Femails should never be given such posts in fairness.

DazMarz · 28-07-2010 10:02PM

Just listened to the interview... What a load... No way could a 'boo-iy' with a sledgehammer access the office so easily... She'd easily have had time to in some way slam the safe door, press a panic button, something....

That is pandering to the media and the public's sympathies if ever I saw it. What a joke...

And for the raiders to be that lucky to enter the office the moment she opened the safe...... ha... in the immortal words of Billy Connolly: "Give me a fúckin' break". The safe was probably swinging wide open the whole time anyway.

A Primal Nut · 28-07-2010 10:11PM

feelingstressed wrote: »

She didn't follow procedures so losing her job, it's the correct thing to do. To have €80,000 in a safe is a joke

The criminals throughout Ireland will look at this and the gardai are probably expecting a lot of extra attempts at post offices over the next month.
Through her carelessness it's not a stretch to say she could indirectly put other staff and gardai at risk.

I've never worked in a post office but did in a hotel reception and we had drop safes for a reason.
If we exceeded a certain amount of cash and/or every two hours, money went to the drop safe.
Hold a gun to my head and I could not open that drop safe, the general manager and the duty manager are the only people for that.

She sounds like the equivalent of a general manager or duty manager.

An Post sacks post office worker after she was held at gunpoint

Comments