Driving alone on a learners permit.

ANXIOUS · 22-06-2010 04:29PM #1

So I started this thread to find out, has anyone been stopped alone and what happened.

I'll go first I was stopped Friday, and told I might get a summons for driving alone. Don't think I will judging by the way it played out.

Naked Lepper · 22-06-2010 04:34PM

drove alone on a learners permit from may 2006 - may 2010

got stopped loads of times, often without tax and nct

never got in any trouble over it once

the most recent time i was stopped was in march, got fine for the tax but never said anything bout being a learner or nct

i guess its down to the garda on the day and how you act/ what their preceptions of you are - i wouldnt recommend it though, i heard they have given 1000s of fines to people.. maybe i was just lucky,

thankfully ive a full license, nct and tax now.. feels good being legit

ANXIOUS · 22-06-2010 04:40PM

Naked Lepper wrote: »

drove alone on a learners permit from may 2006 - may 2010

got stopped loads of times, often without tax and nct

never got in any trouble over it once

the most recent time i was stopped was in march, got fine for the tax but never said anything bout being a learner or nct

i guess its down to the garda on the day and how you act/ what their preceptions of you are - i wouldnt recommend it though, i heard they have given 1000s of fines to people.. maybe i was just lucky,

thankfully ive a full license, nct and tax now.. feels good being legit

Yeah I've "heard" that they have given big fines out, but I've yet to actually speak to anyone who has got fined. I'd say that they just add that charge on to boost up other charges if your being a pr*ck

Naked Lepper · 22-06-2010 05:54PM

yeah they could have just put that report out to scare people

ive yet to hear of a single person who got a fine and cant see them being that harsh

that said, its in the law and its a risk you take

tricky D · 22-06-2010 06:02PM

From 2 years ago: 1,400 fined by new learner driver law or 6,000 learner drivers fined for breaking law. Up to €1000 fine and maybe points.... only.

**Timbuk2** · 22-06-2010 06:08PM

I've never driven alone when I had my LP, except around my own house. There is a reason why LP holders can't drive on their own. You need to pass the test to show that you are competent enough to drive on your own.

ztoical · 22-06-2010 06:18PM

Mentioned on another thread on pretty much the same topic I'd never been asked to show my licence in 3 years of driving and two weeks ago was asked 3 times in as many days at police check points in different parts of the country [have a full licence by the way] In one case in Dublin my licence was in my bag in the back of the car and the guy just nodded and was going to let me drive on without getting the licence when the other guy with him told him to make me get it. They do seem to be checking more and more so odds of being not only caught but fined as well is rising.

ANXIOUS · 22-06-2010 06:43PM

tricky D wrote: »

From 2 years ago: 1,400 fined by new learner driver law or 6,000 learner drivers fined for breaking law. Up to €1000 fine and maybe points.... only.

Yeah but judging by those numbers someone on boards, should know a friend or someone who has got fined. I really think taht this is a smokescreen. Well i suppose ill just have to wait and see if i get a summons the gardai said i might get one

.

Yeah timbuk im aware that people shouldnt drive without a full licence driver, but the harsh reality is they do. So im just trying to get a feel for the punishments dished out.

carmel27 · 22-06-2010 06:52PM

Like other posters, I heard lots of talk about fines and penalty points, but have never come across anyone who was actually penalised. However, it is the law so I personally wouldnt like to be chancing it too often. If you were to run into a cop that does everything by the book (and theyre out there) you could land yourself in it. Probably best to get plenty of supervised driving practice, and a few lessons from a qualified instructer, and apply for your test ASAP

Piriz · 22-06-2010 06:58PM

hi,
i drove for almost 2 years without a full license and never had L plates up either..
its a risk and I could have faced a 2,000euro fine (1,000 for each offence), but it can be a double edge sword...i.e. if you have L's up and are on your own you are drawing attention to the fact you are unaccompanied..if you don't have L's up you risk an additional 1,000euro fine..
I was asked for my license once at a check point and let away with it..most other check points seemed to be just checking NCT, tax & insurance disks so make sure you have in date..
thankfully i have my full license now...
+1 to driving legit!!:)
my advice is to apply for the test asap

Max Power1 · 22-06-2010 08:11PM

Piriz wrote: »

hi,
i drove for almost 2 years without a full license and never had L plates up either..
its a risk and I could have faced a 2,000euro fine (1,000 for each offence), but it can be a double edge sword...i.e. if you have L's up and are on your own you are drawing attention to the fact you are unaccompanied..if you don't have L's up you risk an additional 1,000euro fine..
I was asked for my license once at a check point and let away with it..most other check points seemed to be just checking NCT, tax & insurance disks so make sure you have in date..
thankfully i have my full license now...
+1 to driving legit!!:)
my advice is to apply for the test asap

+1
I was stopped with no tax (had just bought the car - actually was driving to the tax office to tax the car and had the form filled out in the car with me) and they didnt fine me for the no tax or no l plates or driving unacompanied.

I find the "yes sir" approach normally works.

FewToLose · 22-06-2010 10:32PM

**Timbuk2** wrote: »

I've never driven alone when I had my LP, except around my own house. There is a reason why LP holders can't drive on their own. You need to pass the test to show that you are competent enough to drive on your own.

I tipped a kerb in my first driving test and it was another year before I got my full licence. Tipping a kerb happens to everyone; i was clearly competent to drive but i still had to wait-the majority of learner drivers who drive unaccompanied (and i said majority, not all) are competent to drive, they just have not gotten round to making it official

FewToLose · 22-06-2010 10:38PM

my friend's mother is in her 60's and only started to drive in 2001 when her husband became terminally ill. He died in 2002 and she needed to be able to drive her youngest daughter to school, etc; not long distances as she hates driving and thus tries to avoid it as much as possible but has to drive monday to friday on the school run and to buy food

She has no tax, NCT, l-plates and her LP expired in 2005

She's been stopped many times and let off because she needs to drive

So long as you actually have a purpose to drive, it is highly unlikely any remarks will be passed

Alanstrainor · 22-06-2010 10:50PM

FewToLose wrote: »

my friend's mother is in her 60's and only started to drive in 2001 when her husband became terminally ill. He died in 2002 and she needed to be able to drive her youngest daughter to school, etc; not long distances as she hates driving and thus tries to avoid it as much as possible but has to drive monday to friday on the school run and to buy food

She has no tax, NCT, l-plates and her LP expired in 2005

She's been stopped many times and let off because she needs to drive

So long as you actually have a purpose to drive, it is highly unlikely any remarks will be passed

I really do hope that's not true.:eek:

FewToLose · 22-06-2010 10:55PM

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I really do hope that's not true.:eek:

It is true; although i agree that she shouldn't be let away with the tax and NCT.

If I was a garda i would the LP part though, she is a widow who needed to drive her daughter to school in fairness; and to work now that she is finished school a few years but cannot drive

ANXIOUS · 22-06-2010 11:28PM

So between everyone on this forum we know of no one, who was caught and fined? That really is amazing and wierd wrapped into one.

erwinvr101 · 22-06-2010 11:34PM

i think the garda is more concerned with the tax, nct and insurance, or if you're drunk. i have driven for a year unaccompanied but never got into trouble at checkpoints.

Faith+1 · 23-06-2010 12:50AM

This is crazy! I've spent a small fortune with lessons/tests/nct/road tax etc.... and there's people here who at one stage didn't have these??? This Country is a bloody disgrace, do we have a Garda force or not.
Any other country you'd be out of the car and walking home with a court summons in your hand. Typical Irish mentality, 'Well if you're not hurting anyone then what's the problem'.:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

**Timbuk2** · 23-06-2010 12:55AM

In my opinion driving with an LP on your own is worse than driving without tax. Having no tax does not make you any more 'dangerous' to other road users - but driving alone on an LP does.

A lot of people on an LP think they are good enough to drive on their own - even when I had mine I thought the only thing that is stopping me from driving on my own is the law, and not my lack of experience and skill. But in reality, if you haven't passed your test, then you can't deem yourself skillful enough to drive on your own.

All that aside - it really isn't worth the risk. If a situation arose that you have never dealt with before, it's hard to react to it the best that you can without plenty of driving experience. Having no accompanied driver may cause you to do something which makes matters worse. If there is an accident, your insurance will not pay out if you are unaccompanied. Well, to be precise they will pay with respect to the third party but then subsequently sue you for the loss as you breached the terms of the contract. Adding to that the potential €1000 fine (and €1000 extra for no L plates).

Re-reading this post it comes across as a bit condescending, which was not my purpose. I only passed my test a month ago, and that was only after 9 months of experience, so I am by no means a great or experienced driver, but I do my best to be the best I can. Although I have a full licence, I don't always feel comfortable driving on my own as I worry about unexpected situations. And I've already passed my test, and got 3 green faults only, but I even think that showing you can make less than 8 serious mistakes in 20 minutes of driving through housing estates at 50km/h doesn't prepare you for the reality of driving. I'm ok with the familiar things but if it's something like city driving or motorways then I always take somebody with me. I'm considering taking a lesson in motorway driving but I've never heard of anybody doing it before.

The point is - anybody who is considering driving on their own obviously feels confident in their abilities and should therefore not drive on their own, but instead book their test, and even apply for a cancellation (1-2 weeks sometimes!), and get their full licence as quick as possible and then drive on their own, without worry of fines and penalty points and uninsured accidents!

Faith+1 · 23-06-2010 01:00AM

**Timbuk2** wrote: »

The point is - anybody who is considering driving on their own obviously feels confident in their abilities and should therefore not drive on their own, but instead book their test, and even apply for a cancellation (1-2 weeks sometimes!), and get their full licence as quick as possible and then drive on their own, without worry of fines and penalty points and uninsured accidents!

Well said!:)

FewToLose · 23-06-2010 01:07AM

**Timbuk2** wrote: »

In my opinion driving with an LP on your own is worse than driving without tax. Having no tax does not make you any more 'dangerous' to other road users - but driving alone on an LP does.

A lot of people on an LP think they are good enough to drive on their own - even when I had mine I thought the only thing that is stopping me from driving on my own is the law, and not my lack of experience and skill. But in reality, if you haven't passed your test, then you can't deem yourself skillful enough to drive on your own.

All that aside - it really isn't worth the risk. If a situation arose that you have never dealt with before, it's hard to react to it the best that you can without plenty of driving experience. Having no accompanied driver may cause you to do something which makes matters worse. If there is an accident, your insurance will not pay out if you are unaccompanied. Well, to be precise they will pay with respect to the third party but then subsequently sue you for the loss as you breached the terms of the contract. Adding to that the potential €1000 fine (and €1000 extra for no L plates).

Re-reading this post it comes across as a bit condescending, which was not my purpose. I only passed my test a month ago, and that was only after 9 months of experience, so I am by no means a great or experienced driver, but I do my best to be the best I can. Although I have a full licence, I don't always feel comfortable driving on my own as I worry about unexpected situations. And I've already passed my test, and got 3 green faults only, but I even think that showing you can make less than 8 serious mistakes in 20 minutes of driving through housing estates at 50km/h doesn't prepare you for the reality of driving. I'm ok with the familiar things but if it's something like city driving or motorways then I always take somebody with me. I'm considering taking a lesson in motorway driving but I've never heard of anybody doing it before.

The point is - anybody who is considering driving on their own obviously feels confident in their abilities and should therefore not drive on their own, but instead book their test, and even apply for a cancellation (1-2 weeks sometimes!), and get their full licence as quick as possible and then drive on their own, without worry of fines and penalty points and uninsured accidents!

Both my 94 year old grandmother (who can barely walk and can only recognise me when I am standing within a few metres of her) and my parents who have all been drivng for 40+ years never sat a driving test. Especially in the case of my grandmother, I am curious to know what you think of that?? Sorry if I am coming across as aggressive; I am only looking for opinions on this

**Timbuk2** · 23-06-2010 01:16AM

FewToLose wrote: »

Both my 94 year old grandmother (who can barely walk and can only recognise me when I am standing within a few metres of her) and my parents who have all been drivng for 40+ years never sat a driving test. Especially in the case of my grandmother, I am curious to know what you think of that?? Sorry if I am coming across as aggressive; I am only looking for opinions on this

It's a valid point, but I think it's different. When they were learning to drive, as far as I know there was no driving test system in place. Thus they didn't have to take it, so they were doing nothing wrong. If they have been driving for over 40 years, then they are very experienced in driving and there is no problem with them driving alone - they would be 10,000x more experienced and skillful than I would be.

The people I am referring to is LP holders. As they still have an LP, it is a reasonably fair statement to say that they haven't built up a huge amount of experience, nothing like 40 years of driving. They have done nothing to prove that they are competent to drive - the theory test does not count, as we all know theory and applying this theory to practice are two very different things.

I think there is one key difference though. 40 years ago there was a lot less traffic on the road, and there were no high-speed motorways etc. Thus the importance of having sat a driving test isn't as crucial as the need for it today.

I'm not defending the current driving test system however - it is extremely lacking. I have my full licence, and I took 12 lessons before I passed my (second) test. These lessons were based fully on the test. I do not feel like the driving test has prepared me as well as it could for real life driving. Although I have mastered the 'basics' (or what the test would define the basics), I still find myself having to learn very essential manoeuvres - bay parking, parallel parking, motorway driving, driving at night, driving on windy, country roads. Real life driving is not based solely in housing estates at 50km/h.

Additionally, I think the fact that you are forbidden from using motorways on an LP but then given free reign to drive on them on your own once you pass your test is an outrage. How are you supposed to learn?

challengemaster · 23-06-2010 01:54AM

**Timbuk2** wrote: »

without worry of fines and penalty points and uninsured accidents!

Well, by the sounds of it(from above), the Traffic corps are such a joke in this country that you can do just about anything and get away with it - so no reason to worry anyway.

Seriously, what's the point of having a traffic corps that does nothing?

Permabear · 23-06-2010 12:10PM

This post has been deleted.

CiaranC · 23-06-2010 12:16PM

Faith+1 wrote: »

This is crazy! I've spent a small fortune with lessons/tests/nct/road tax etc.... and there's people here who at one stage didn't have these??? This Country is a bloody disgrace, do we have a Garda force or not.
Any other country you'd be out of the car and walking home with a court summons in your hand. Typical Irish mentality, 'Well if you're not hurting anyone then what's the problem'.:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

I think people overestimate how strict the law is on these issues. I drove all over Oz and North America without a full licence and never had any bother. I know plenty of people here who drive without the full licence. What do you think is going to happen, death by firing squad for not having a bit of paper?

fergpie · 23-06-2010 12:26PM

I drove alone to the exam test centre which was technically against the law. I passed my test (first time) and then drove home alone which i was legally entitled to do having my certificate of competency.

someone tell me when in the space of 60 minutes i became competent and skilled enough to drive alone? (and it wasnt sitting in an office with the tester filling out a form saying i passed my test). clearly i was skilled enough to drive alone with my LP as i passed the test.

Not having passed the test does makes not u less skilled as a driver. prectice maks perfect. I agree that a person who sits behind the wheel for the first time should in no way be allowed out on the road, with or without a full licence holder with them.

but saying that because a person hasnt passed his test means they are not skilled enough to drive alone is just a general sweeping statement....

Faith+1 · 23-06-2010 12:29PM

CiaranC wrote: »

I think people overestimate how strict the law is on these issues. I drove all over Oz and North America without a full licence and never had any bother. I know plenty of people here who drive without the full licence. What do you think is going to happen, death by firing squad for not having a bit of paper?

Obviously you didn't rent the car yourself without having a full license :rolleyes:. Simple fact is, if you don't have a full licence then you've no right what so ever to drive on Irish Roads. Driving is a privilage not a right hense the hard work required to get that pink piece of paper.
The sooner the better Learner Drivers get with the programme or start walking!:mad:

Faith+1 · 23-06-2010 12:32PM

fergpie wrote: »

but saying that because a person hasnt passed his test means they are not skilled enough to drive alone is just a general sweeping statement....

That's true in one regard but still doesn't change the facts that in the eyes of the law LP holders are still learners. If as a LP you can drive at a safe standard then apply for the test and pass. Until then you're still obliged to obey the law and drive with a fully licensed driver!

fergpie · 23-06-2010 12:43PM

Faith+1 wrote: »

That's true in one regard but still doesn't change the facts that in the eyes of the law LP holders are still learners. If as a LP you can drive at a safe standard then apply for the test and pass. Until then you're still obliged to obey the law and drive with a fully licensed driver!

I agree with u on that point. The law is the law and it should be obeyed. It just annoys me when people say that LP holders arent skilled enough to drive alone, as if they all have just sat behind the wheel for the first time. obviously some are skilled enough to drive alone as they go on to pass their test and others arent because they fail or know they would do so.

Max Power1 · 23-06-2010 01:14PM

fergpie wrote: »

I drove alone to the exam test centre which was technically against the law. I passed my test (first time) and then drove home alone which i was legally entitled to do having my certificate of competency.

someone tell me when in the space of 60 minutes i became competent and skilled enough to drive alone? (and it wasnt sitting in an office with the tester filling out a form saying i passed my test). clearly i was skilled enough to drive alone with my LP as i passed the test.

Not having passed the test does makes not u less skilled as a driver. prectice maks perfect. I agree that a person who sits behind the wheel for the first time should in no way be allowed out on the road, with or without a full licence holder with them.

but saying that because a person hasnt passed his test means they are not skilled enough to drive alone is just a general sweeping statement....

no you werent! You are only entitled to drive alone legally when you have a licence in your hand. So technically you should be accompanied driving to and from a test

Faith+1 · 23-06-2010 01:43PM

fergpie wrote: »

I agree with u on that point. The law is the law and it should be obeyed. It just annoys me when people say that LP holders arent skilled enough to drive alone, as if they all have just sat behind the wheel for the first time. obviously some are skilled enough to drive alone as they go on to pass their test and others arent because they fail or know they would do so.

Exactly. And the same could be applied to fully licensed drivers. Just because they passed their test doesn't mean they have the right to be wreckless on the road.

Driving alone on a learners permit.

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