Driving alone on a learners permit.

ANXIOUS

Okay okay, we all get that it's illegal to drive without a full licence driver. I don't see why people on here are getting worked up about it when the gardai obviously don't care ( judging by the fact that not one person on this forum knows anyone who got summonsed over it).

So I'll ask again does anyone know anyone who has had to go to court over driving alone?

Jamie-b

I don't know anyone. Hands up I drive alone all the time now as I have been told by everyone (including an ADI) it's the only way to progress properly as you need to learn to make your own driving decisions. I have not been stopped although in my town the guards have seen me plenty of times going around.
I do know one girl who showed her LP twice when driving alone - once a checkpoint and once when someone ran into the back of her. In the accident they said nothing at all. When at the checkpoint the guard said "you know you're not supposed to be driving alone?" She said "yeah sorry" and he was like "off you go so".

keithclancy

Jesus H Lads,

Just sit your test and get your license.

The licensing system is the only way we can tell that the person is competant to drive a car.

If they've been driving for 30 years without an issue then they proabably are.

Jamie-b

Jesus H Lads,

Just sit your test and get your license.

The licensing system is the only way we can tell that the person is competant to drive a car.

If they've been driving for 30 years without an issue then they proabably are.

I don't disagree there but I just mean that it is very hard to get the experience if you have to have a person with you at all times. Plus you don't have to make your own decisions since they are there. Even if they're quiet it's not the same.

A girl I know lived with her brother and mother neither of whom drove at all, and her extended family live far away and apart from lessons had no one to go with her

FewToLose

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I am not criticizing those who did not sit a test, but rather the government for simply issuing her with another without getting her to take a test or even learn some of the rules of the road. Surely it is unfair that we have to go through so much and learn so much about the rules of the road before obtain our full licences yet my grandmother can drive around with no knowledge of them and minimal eyesight and awareness of where in the world she is.

You took me up completely wrong on that

FewToLose

Max Power1 wrote: »

no you werent! You are only entitled to drive alone legally when you have a licence in your hand. So technically you should be accompanied driving to and from a test

3 days after I passed my test I went through 2 checkpoints in one day. In both cases they simply said 'congratulations on passing your test' and let me continue on.

PCPhoto

Jamie-b wrote: »

I don't disagree there but I just mean that it is very hard to get the experience if you have to have a person with you at all times. Plus you don't have to make your own decisions since they are there. Even if they're quiet it's not the same.

A girl I know lived with her brother and mother neither of whom drove at all, and her extended family live far away and apart from lessons had no one to go with her

The point is that you get LESSONS to improve your driving - you pay an instructor to accompany you and assess your driving - on each occasion you are gaining more and more experience.

I do agree that people find it difficult to drive on a scheduled date/time (lesson) - and people dont want to pay money for something which THEY think they can do anyway....but its the best way to do it - MOST people who drive on their own dont realise the amount of bad habits that they pick up from parents or driving on their own....which results in bad drivers on the roads !!!

Personally I think there should be a proper clampdown on drivers with learners permits driving on their own.... and NO EXCEPTIONS...but the problem is the gardai can use their discretion and allow people off.... theres no consistancy.

The Garda Traffic Corps do a decent job but like all other services in this country they are under resourced and not able to deal with the amount of people who break the law - ALL drivers in this country (Full or Learner) break driving rules at some point, the rules need to be changed !!

I would like the driving test to require a minimum of car maintenance, first aid and night/bad weather driving.......I would love to learn basics of car maintenance and first aid in the event of coming across a crash or being involved in a crash....and to be able to properly understand how my car works.

Jamie-b

The point is that you get LESSONS to improve your driving - you pay an instructor to accompany you and assess your driving - on each occasion you are gaining more and more experience.

I have spent 700 euro on lessons. You still have to practice what they teach you.

erwinvr101

i also drove alone before i got my full license. thing is, it was my driving instructor who told me to drive alone in between lessons. he said that it's different if someone is watching you and telling you what to do and that you would be able to gauge how much you have absorbed the lessons you took. he also said that it gives you confidence in driving. i guess it's different for everyone else on what method is best for them to learn.

**Timbuk2**

Jamie-b wrote: »

I have spent 700 euro on lessons. You still have to practice what they teach you.

Yes but you have to practice it with somebody in the car. When I still had my LP, I found it a huge inconvenience to find somebody to go with me, but I still never went out on my own. If these LP holders are 'skillful' enough to drive on their own, then they should have already gotten their full licence at that stage. Seriously, a cancellation test only takes a few weeks at most!

If they still hold LPs, they have done nothing save the theory test to prove they are competent drivers. Who is to decide that they have the skill and experience necessary to drive on their own, other than themselves, and obviously that's a very biased and often inaccurate view. It is a danger on the roads, and frankly it is unfair to full licence holders.

I empathise how difficult it can be to practice when you are reliant on other people's schedules. I am only 18, and practised for the test (obviously you never really stop learning how to drive) over 6 months, driving only on weekends as that is the only time I could get out in my mother's car with somebody. The lack of practice slowed down my progress a bit, but it has to be done - there is a very valid reason why I wasn't allowed out on the road alone. It simply wouldn't be fair to full licence drivers to share the roads with LP holders, who are breaking the law and breaching the terms of their insurance.

Now that I have passed my test, I don't consider myself a 'qualified' driver per se - but rather that I have been given the opportunity to further my competence, skill and experience behind the wheel without the necessity of an accompanied driver. 80% of the learning is still to come!

af_thefragile

Millionth time this question has been asked here.

I'll say the same thing. I won't advise you to do it because it is pretty risky. The gards are much more strict now days and 1000eur is just not worth it.

That saying I won't say I never drove alone while a learner because I did drive a good bit by myself. Infact also had to end up driving to the test center by myself for my pretest and my test. But I kept my alone driving to the bare minimum. Just to the shop and back and occasionally a couple of rounds around my neighborhood. It did help me become more confident driving by myself and so I didn't get any of those "eek I passed my test, now I'm too nervous to drive alone..." thing.

Though I did drive around 1000miles with my mate who's got a full license. Every other weekend I'ld pick him up and go for a drive around the city, the countryside, into the mountains and all. That's what made me more confident on the roads than anything else.

So if you wanna get confident on the road, find a friend who's got a full license and take him for a drive.

sentient_6

Late last summer i was stopped at checkpoint. Was still on learners permit at the time & had L badges up. Was by myself. The car is fairly big so the gard had to go around the far side to check the tax & insurance so she couldnt have missed the L's. Came back around & breathalised me. No problems there & i just got waved on with a good night. I thought i as done for pulling up. I guess its the gards discretion.

Davabo

The way I see it is like this,

I'm going for my theory test tomorrow, Hopefully I will pass and I already have 10 lessons booked for myself with ISM, After those 10 lessons ill be experienced, Then ill probably get 10 more. But the fact I can't sit my test for 6 months is crazy! I could be 100% at driving but because I have to wait 6 months I'm incompetent and MIGHT receive fines? They need to get rid of the 6 months rule.

Alanstrainor

Davabo wrote: »

After those 10 lessons ill be experienced,

I'm sorry but this is where the problem lies, and is the reasoning behind the 6 month rule imo. The idea is that you are expected to get 6 months accompanied driving experience in before doing your test, i know the reality is different but still.
After 10 lessons/<10 hours driving you are in no way shape or form "experienced", maybe after 1000 hours you could start to argue otherwise, but even then i'd say you never stop learning, and getting it into your head that you are "experienced" only serves to hinder the learning process.
You are learning a skill that you will use for the rest of your life, 6 months is a small amount of time to set aside to practice.

DrivingMad

Davabo wrote: »

The way I see it is like this,

I'm going for my theory test tomorrow, Hopefully I will pass and I already have 10 lessons booked for myself with ISM, After those 10 lessons ill be experienced, Then ill probably get 10 more. But the fact I can't sit my test for 6 months is crazy! I could be 100% at driving but because I have to wait 6 months I'm incompetent and MIGHT receive fines? They need to get rid of the 6 months rule.

If you have 10 lessons, and then 10 more, at one lesson a week that will bring you up to the 20 weeks marker, or approx 5 months. you could at this stage apply for your driving test to sit it at some point after only another 4 weeks or so...... doesnt seem too tough or too harsh.......

Davabo

DrivingMad wrote: »

If you have 10 lessons, and then 10 more, at one lesson a week that will bring you up to the 20 weeks marker, or approx 5 months. you could at this stage apply for your driving test to sit it at some point after only another 4 weeks or so...... doesnt seem too tough or too harsh.......

Id be getting a lesson everyday :P Not one a week.

And 400 for 10 lessons = 800 euro. Expensive

Davabo

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I'm sorry but this is where the problem lies, and is the reasoning behind the 6 month rule imo. The idea is that you are expected to get 6 months accompanied driving experience in before doing your test, i know the reality is different but still.
After 10 lessons/<10 hours driving you are in no way shape or form "experienced", maybe after 1000 hours you could start to argue otherwise, but even then i'd say you never stop learning, and getting it into your head that you are "experienced" only serves to hinder the learning process.
You are learning a skill that you will use for the rest of your life, 6 months is a small amount of time to set aside to practice.

I said experienced, Nothing more.
But after 10 lessons you should ATLEAST be allowed to do your test, if you pass fair play, if you fail go do another 10 lessons.
The chance of passing is small, But we should atleast be allowed an attempt. Isn't that fair?

pops

What happens if you're on an LP and you have an accident - will the insurance company still be obliged to pay up?

DrivingMad

Davabo wrote: »

Id be getting a lesson everyday :P Not one a week.

And 400 for 10 lessons = 800 euro. Expensive

you are very lucky to be able to have a lesson daily. I dont think that generally this is the norm?
Would you not consider spacing the lessons a bit more? You could then practice in between lessons? You seem in an awful rush.

And I didnt comment on the expense involved!

Lillylilly

Davabo wrote: »

I said experienced, Nothing more.
But after 10 lessons you should ATLEAST be allowed to do your test, if you pass fair play, if you fail go do another 10 lessons.
The chance of passing is small, But we should atleast be allowed an attempt. Isn't that fair?

I think it would be a waste of money to do it this soon- if you plan on doing a lesson a day, you reckon you'd be ready to do your full test a week and a half after first sitting in the drivers seat?

I'm a learner, and failed my first test. I asked (stupidly) for a cancellation and got the test date for a week after I first applied. I had only been driving about three months, and they were really short (5- 10 min) journeys!

I got stopped on the way home from a night shift at a check point in Drumcondra a few weeks ago. Your man just asked was I on a LP, I said "yeah" and he said "consider yourself warned". That was all

WillyWonkaBar

Davabo wrote: »

Id be getting a lesson everyday :P Not one a week.

And 400 for 10 lessons = 800 euro. Expensive

Your an eejit!.. you want a lesson a day but you only want 10 lessons?
So what are you going to do for the rest of the 6 months?
if you drive on your own, you'll more than likely pick up bad habits and possibly drive like a mong?

ERR!

well heres my story!!

I got my car in May, have had my LP for 3 years now. Only started driving in May though. I drive to and from work every day work is about a 15min drive each way. I know the roads like the back of my hand, I dont see myself as not capable to drive, everyone has to learn somehow and I have applied for my test.

I was stopped on my way back from work at a check point 2 weeks ago because I had no insurance disk in my car as it had not been sent out in the post but I was covered.

The garda pulled me over, I had no L plates up and I was on my own. She asked about my insurance disk I showed her a letter from my insurance company saying I was covered, she asked for my details said I needed to bring my insurance certificate when it came to local garda station in the next 10 days,

She then asked if I had my LICENCE with me, I answered no not with me because I didnt have it with me. I never stated it was a LP because she never asked :P

She told me to bring that down with the certificate as well. I went down a few days later to the station showed them my certificate and my LP thinking I was going to get in **** and they entered my info into the system and not a word was said that it was only a LP and not a full licence and they said that was all that was needed.

Advice I can give is, be nice and smile and if your a girl wink an old eye :P

Max Power1

pops wrote: »

What happens if you're on an LP and you have an accident - will the insurance company still be obliged to pay up?

yes they will. Its been asked a few times in the main motors forum, and I think there was a thread here a while back aswell. I queried it with the IIF (Irish Insurance Federation) and you are insured as long as you are not breaking any terms of your insurance policy. (some policies state that LP holders are not covered unless accompanied)

Alanstrainor

Max Power1 wrote: »

yes they will. Its been asked a few times in the main motors forum, and I think there was a thread here a while back aswell. I queried it with the IIF (Irish Insurance Federation) and you are insured as you are not breaking any terms of your insurance policy. (some policies state that LP holders are not covered unless accompanied)

The important part of the above, is that some policies do require you to be accompanied at all times, and breaking that would cause massive trouble should you be involved in an accident.

Davabo

WillyWonkaBar wrote: »

Your an eejit!.. you want a lesson a day but you only want 10 lessons?
So what are you going to do for the rest of the 6 months?
if you drive on your own, you'll more than likely pick up bad habits and possibly drive like a mong?

The whole point was after all those lessons we shouldn't have to wait 6 months to do our test! Give us the chance to pass it atleast!

bambera

ERR! wrote: »

The garda pulled me over, I had no L plates up and I was on my own. She asked about my insurance disk I showed her a letter from my insurance company saying I was covered, she asked for my details said I needed to bring my insurance certificate when it came to local garda station in the next 10 days,

She then asked if I had my LICENCE with me, I answered no not with me because I didnt have it with me. I never stated it was a LP because she never asked :P

She told me to bring that down with the certificate as well. I went down a few days later to the station showed them my certificate and my LP thinking I was going to get in **** and they entered my info into the system and not a word was said that it was only a LP and not a full licence and they said that was all that was needed.

Advice I can give is, be nice and smile and if your a girl wink an old eye :P

There was nothing in their systems (assuming that's how they know if you've reported to the garda station) to say that you were in the car alone. For all they know, you could have had a fully licensed passenger.

LilMsss

The six month rule is an extremely important one. I have have my LP for approximately 15 months but only learned to drive five months ago. I have been driving consistently and practicing since then, and am fairly competent and confident in my abilities.

I sat my driving test (first time) in May and failed, mainly due to reaction to hazards, and that is something that cannot be taught ... you have to build it up through experience on the road. I am due to take my test again in a months time, which will be six months driving in total and feel it's only now that I am at a standard that I can deal with almost any traffic situation.

With regards to driving unaccompanied, I have to admit I do it regularly. I keep my L Plates up and have gone through numerous checkpoints all without any problems. While I realise this is illegal, I prefer to take my chances. If I'm being honest, I wouldn't have gotten to the standard of driving I have now if I wasn't driving on my own.

danthefan

I drove plenty on my own as an L driver. I was stopped at checkpoints twice, though both times there were passengers in the car. The first time they checked my tax/insurance and gave my a breath test. The second time they checked the tax/insurance and sent me on my way. I've passed by or been seen by plenty of Gards though driving on my own. From my own experience they don't give a toss about L drivers driving alone.

Peppapig

Got my car and LP so that I could get a job in Gorey! How am I supposed to have a full licenced driver?

The only way to REALLY learn is to think independently, make mistakes and learn from them, and drive alone! Once my dad thought me how to move and reverse and crap, I basically have drove alone ever since that a year ago!

I'm on my second learner permit( which is the exact same as the first, you still need a FL driver) and the local guard says to me, " Oh jaysus sure you're on you sencond now, ya don't need nare a FL driver" The arsehole:rolleyes:

Raskolnikov

I live near a secondary school and I'm forever seeing students driving on their own with L plates up. I have yet to meet anyone who has been brought to court for driving alone on a learner permit.