Politician-At last a spark of humanity

fergiesfolly · 31-05-2010 11:24PM #1

Fine Gael TD, Michael Noonan was just on The Frontline speaking eloquently and sometimes emotionally about his wife, who suffers from alzheimers. Don't think any more or less of him than I do of most politicians, but it was a nice change to see one them being passionate about something, bar getting the better of their opposing parties. They should bring some of this emotion to their work. P.s I wish his wife all the best. Its a horrible, wicked disease.

Kelda09 · 31-05-2010 11:39PM

I agree, it's nice to see another side to them, though I don't think anybody would wish alzhiemers on his wife. I think he spoke eloquently on the matter and hopefully it might help people to see the reality of the disease. What struck me most was when he spoke about not wanting to lock the doors, but as a result his wife wandered off. A family member has alzhiemers and the same situation was faced. It's good to see that Alzhiemers is getting highlighted, and hopefully it might make people in power have a re-think about the facilities available.

On another note, I never thought that I would find Pat Kenny to be a good presenter, but the last two weeks on Frontline has made me re-evaluate my opinion of him. Perhaps Im getting old :eek:

starbelgrade · 31-05-2010 11:43PM

Would this be the same Michael Noonan Noonan who was Minister for Health when, after the death of Brigid McCole - who was one of the victims of the blood products contaminated with Hepatitis C - suggested rather callously in the Dail, that McCole's solicitors should have persuaded their client to go to the government-established compensation tribunal rather than to the courts?

The same Noonan who repeatedly tried to maintain that the state and its agency, the Blood Transfusion Service Board (which was directly responsible for the scandal), were "separate actors" in defending the legal actions prompted by the contamination of the Anti-D blood products?

The same Noonan who, for a crucial 18 months, effectively sat on an opinion from its top legal adviser, Attorney General Dermot Gleeson, that the BTSB had been negligent in relation to the manufacture of Anti-D both in 1976/77 and again in 1991-94?

And now he's on television crying over his own personal misfotunes when, as Minister of Health, it was clear that he didn't give a damn about the misfortunes of others?

It may been a spark of humanity that he has shown tonight, but the sad thing about this, is that he could not have afforded the same spark of humanity to others when he had the power & position to do something about it.

Biggins · 31-05-2010 11:55PM

Saw it tonight. Deeply moving stuff.
I wish some blinkered FF supporters who think the other side is just made up of evil, saw it too.
It would have given them an inkling as to the fuller picture that they are not conveniently seeing by their fanaticism.

Yes starbelgrade, it would be the same man and in the interview that is available on RTE website to view shortly, he admits having seen the "other side" - having been there, he acknowledge more so that changes clearly need to be made to the health system.
At least he admitted it. I wish a few more politicians would be so honest, either side of the Dail.

Ouijaboard · 01-06-2010 12:01AM

starbelgrade wrote: »

Would this be the same Michael Noonan Noonan who was Minister for Health when, after the death of Brigid McCole - who was one of the victims of the blood products contaminated with Hepatitis C - suggested rather callously in the Dail, that McCole's solicitors should have persuaded their client to go to the government-established compensation tribunal rather than to the courts?

The same Noonan who repeatedly tried to maintain that the state and its agency, the Blood Transfusion Service Board (which was directly responsible for the scandal), were "separate actors" in defending the legal actions prompted by the contamination of the Anti-D blood products?

The same Noonan who, for a crucial 18 months, effectively sat on an opinion from its top legal adviser, Attorney General Dermot Gleeson, that the BTSB had been negligent in relation to the manufacture of Anti-D both in 1976/77 and again in 1991-94?

And now he's on television crying over his own personal misfotunes when, as Minister of Health, it was clear that he didn't give a damn about the misfortunes of others?

It may been a spark of humanity that he has shown tonight, but the sad thing about this, is that he could not have afforded the same spark of humanity to others when he had the power & position to do something about it.

And he admitted tonight he made some serious mistakes when he was minister for health....which is more than can be said for some of the current idiots!

Bonito · 01-06-2010 12:05AM

cougar1 wrote: »

And he admitted tonight he made some serious mistakes when he was minister for health....which is more than can be said for some of the current idiots!

Ah here! Mary might eat enough to feed a few people but she's still only one person hippo!

fergiesfolly · 01-06-2010 12:12AM

cougar1 wrote: »

And he admitted tonight he made some serious mistakes when he was minister for health....which is more than can be said for some of the current idiots!

Its unfortunate, but most politicians sole purpose is to get re-elected. It would make for a much better system of government if the personal experiences of elected officials and ordinary citizens alike were used to make the decisions that affect us all. Michael Noonans experience could be of huge use to Mary Harney and the HSE if they could look past their own self interests.

Ouijaboard · 01-06-2010 12:14AM

Bonito wrote: »

Ah here! Mary might eat enough to feed a few people but she's still only one person hippo!

I meant Cowen et al could do with showing a bit of that sincerity and and lay the cards on the table and say they fcuked up in other depts.....Bertie and McCreevy could do with giving the nation a few apologies aswell!

OPENROAD · 01-06-2010 12:16AM

Kelda09 wrote: »

It's good to see that Alzhiemers is getting highlighted, and hopefully it might make people in power have a re-think about the facilities available.

Not just facilities but actual funding into a cure( this is a worldwide issue) which at current is an absolute disgrace.:mad:

Ouijaboard · 01-06-2010 12:20AM

fergiesfolly wrote: »

Its unfortunate, but most politicians sole purpose is to get re-elected. It would make for a much better system of government if the personal experiences of elected officials and ordinary citizens alike were used to make the decisions that affect us all. Michael Noonans experience could be of huge use to Mary Harney and the HSE if they could look past their own self interests.

Agree with this idea that he could be of huge help in this regard, it will never happen though. It was just nice for once to see a politician just be completely honest and without agenda come on tv and not try to spin us the usual yarns.
He did have it particularly though judging by the fact that his wife had the early onset variety and even before reaching pension age has lost all ability to function.

starbelgrade · 01-06-2010 12:24AM

Biggins wrote: »

Yes starbelgrade, it would be the same man and in the interview that is available on RTE website to view shortly, he admits having seen the "other side" - having been there, he acknowledge more so that changes clearly need to be made to the health system.
At least he admitted it. I wish a few more politicians would be so honest, either side of the Dail.

So Michael Noonan, after over 10 years of denying any resposibility in the blood scandal, finally admits some responsibility for his actions.

Finally, but only after his wife contracts alzheimers. Finally, but only after his life is affected, does he suddenly convert to honesty.

Finally, does he realise.

Well, Mr.Noonan, finally, is too f*cking late.

Kelda09 · 01-06-2010 12:25AM

OPENROAD wrote: »

Not just facilities but actual funding into a cure( this is a worldwide issue) which at current is an absolute disgrace.:mad:

Believe me, I totally agree with you, but unfortunately, for most people that are already diagnosed with alzhiemers at the moment the sad reality is that even if a viable, working cure is found, by the time it's passed the safety reviews, tests, and checks and then goes through the medical trials it will be too late to be of a real benefit for those who are currently suffering. I don't mean to sound callous by saying that, it's just that its extremely unlikely that any cure that is developed is going to undo the damage that has already been done, more than likely something will be found soon (I HOPE) that will stop the disease in it's tracks at the stage where it is diagnosed, preventing further deterioration. That is why I think the facilities need to be looked at and examined.

Also, I really don't think that disgrace is a strong enough word, But unfortunately, I don't think there is any word that is strong enough to convey the anger:mad:

aDeener · 01-06-2010 12:26AM

Biggins wrote: »

Saw it tonight. Deeply moving stuff.
I wish some blinkered FF supporters who think the other side is just made up of evil, saw it too.
It would have given them an inkling as to the fuller picture that they are not conveniently seeing by their fanaticism.

Yes starbelgrade, it would be the same man and in the interview that is available on RTE website to view shortly, he admits having seen the "other side" - having been there, he acknowledge more so that changes clearly need to be made to the health system.
At least he admitted it. I wish a few more politicians would be so honest, either side of the Dail.

its clearly you who is blinkered :rolleyes:

all is rosy in the garden just because he admitted it. god knows what you would have come out by now with had starbelgrades post been about an FF minister for health.... :rolleyes:

recylingbin · 01-06-2010 12:28AM

Of course he was passionate, it concerned him directly.
Just like Flynn was passionate about how his expenses shouldn't have been up for public ridicule.

I wouldn't wish alzheimers on anyone and it was good to hear an eloquent person given the time to discuss it. But her illness doesn't make him a better person.

K-9 · 01-06-2010 12:29AM

Biggins wrote: »

Saw it tonight. Deeply moving stuff.
I wish some blinkered FF supporters who think the other side is just made up of evil, saw it too.
It would have given them an inkling as to the fuller picture that they are not conveniently seeing by their fanaticism.

Yes starbelgrade, it would be the same man and in the interview that is available on RTE website to view shortly, he admits having seen the "other side" - having been there, he acknowledge more so that changes clearly need to be made to the health system.
At least he admitted it. I wish a few more politicians would be so honest, either side of the Dail.

My thoughts are with him. I can empathise. My Dad went through what his wife did.

Did he mention the McCole family? It would have made it more touching.

starbelgrade · 01-06-2010 12:32AM

aDeener wrote: »

its clearly you who is blinkered :rolleyes:

all is rosy in the garden just because he admitted it. god knows what you would have come out by now with had starbelgrades post been about an FF minister for health.... :rolleyes:

Very true... If it were today's news & Mary Harney was Minister of Health, presiding over the blood scandal, gulity of hiding key evidence & forcing victims to go through the court system to get compensation, some of whom were on their death beds, there would be zero sympathy for her, no matter what her personal circumstances were.

K-9 · 01-06-2010 12:34AM

starbelgrade wrote: »

Very true... If it were today's news & Mary Harney was Minister of Health, presiding over the blood scandal, gulity of hiding key evidence & forcing victims to go through the court system to get compensation, some of whom were on their death beds, there would be zero sympathy for her, no matter what her personal circumstances were.

Good point. I suppose seeing as it is 15 years ago, people forget.

OPENROAD · 01-06-2010 12:36AM

Kelda09 wrote: »

Believe me, I totally agree with you, but unfortunately, for most people that are already diagnosed with alzhiemers at the moment the sad reality is that even if a viable, working cure is found, by the time it's passed the safety reviews, tests, and checks and then goes through the medical trials it will be too late to be of a real benefit for those who are currently suffering. I don't mean to sound callous by saying that, it's just that its extremely unlikely that any cure that is developed is going to undo the damage that has already been done, more than likely something will be found soon (I HOPE) that will stop the disease in it's tracks at the stage where it is diagnosed, preventing further deterioration. That is why I think the facilities need to be looked at and examined.

Also, I really don't think that disgrace is a strong enough word, But unfortunately, I don't think there is any word that is strong enough to convey the anger:mad:

Oh I know, sadly as you say even when they do make a breakthrough it will be years before a drug is available, they really do need more funding, not wanting to take away from any other illness out there but the funding towards a cure is tiny.

You are right of course, more funding also needed to support carers to enable them to keep the person in their own house for as long as possible doing this really does help the person with the illness.

Kelda09 · 01-06-2010 12:37AM

recylingbin wrote: »

I wouldn't wish alzheimers on anyone and it was good to hear an eloquent person given the time to discuss it. But her illness doesn't make him a better person.

I don't think anybody ever said it made him a better person, but if it helps to get people thinking about alzhiemers and the reality of the disease then good and well. The unpleasant reality is that there is more likely to be newspaper coverage and talk on the radio about alzhiemers and the needs in relation to it through Michael Noonan going on front-line than there would be from other people going on. In saying that, please don't get me wrong, the people on front-line last week were brilliant, eloquent, moving and got their point across and they should be applauded for it, however, public figures are more likely to get paper column inches, and if Michael Noonan is willing to speak out more, then he could be in the position to be of help, whatever political party he was in.

Biggins · 01-06-2010 12:38AM

aDeener wrote: »

its clearly you who is blinkered :rolleyes:
all is rosy in the garden just because he admitted it. god knows what you would have come out by now with had starbelgrades post been about an FF minister for health.... :rolleyes:

All is not rosy - and he admitted it. He admitted his failings too.
While I don't lend him my support just because of one admission, I do extend to him some sympathy in regards to the condition of his wife.
Anyone with a shred of humanity would do so.
I suspect by your blindness to Fianna Fail, yours is lacking for you only see and grasp political opportunity to shoot any opposition down.

I have already previously given out about the state of health care in this country despite whos in the seat - for personal reasons alone, my daughter.

..And lets not forget that in the last 26 years of government - 23 of them were under the rule of Fianna Fail!
Talk about throwing stones in glasshouses! You really want to go there?

K-9 wrote: »

My thoughts are with him. I can empathise. My Dad went through what his wife did.
Did he mention the McCole family? It would have made it more touching.

No, he kept the interview personal for the sake of the alzheimers organisation that he is trying to help, one step at a time.

starbelgrade · 01-06-2010 12:40AM

Kelda09 wrote: »

The unpleasant reality is that there is more likely to be newspaper coverage and talk on the radio about alzhiemers and the needs in relation to it through Michael Noonan going on front-line than there would be from other people going on.

Of all the people to pick as a poster boy spokesman for people suffering from illnesses, Michael Noonan is the last person you'd go for if you were looking for some positive PR.

OPENROAD · 01-06-2010 12:43AM

starbelgrade wrote: »

Of all the people to pick as a poster boy spokesman for people suffering from illnesses, Michael Noonan is the last person you'd go for if you were looking for some positive PR.

Actually the more public figures whether they be TD's MP'S,writers actors etc.... the better imo. Its not just about PR, but rather to raise real awareness, have it out in the media constantly.

recylingbin · 01-06-2010 12:43AM

Kelda09 wrote: »

I don't think anybody ever said it made him a better person, but if it helps to get people thinking about alzhiemers and the reality of the disease then good and well. The unpleasant reality is that there is more likely to be newspaper coverage and talk on the radio about alzhiemers and the needs in relation to it through Michael Noonan going on front-line than there would be from other people going on. In saying that, please don't get me wrong, the people on front-line last week were brilliant, eloquent, moving and got their point across and they should be applauded for it, however, public figures are more likely to get paper column inches, and if Michael Noonan is willing to speak out more, then he could be in the position to be of help, whatever political party he was in.

I also didn't say he was a bad person. I agree with you. But it's easy for Michael Noonan to say these things now. It affects him now.

But regarding him directly, we should remember how gutless he was as minister for health. Not only was he worse than useless, but he actually caused alot of harm. When he had his big chance to make things better, he put his own interests first.

I do empathise with him with respect to his wife's condition though. As I said, I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Kelda09 · 01-06-2010 12:45AM

OPENROAD wrote: »

Oh I know, sadly as you say even when they do make a breakthrough it will be years before a drug is available, they really do need more funding, not wanting to take away from any other illness out there but the funding towards a cure is tiny.

You are right of course, more funding also needed to support carers to enable them to keep the person in their own house for as long as possible doing this really does help the person with the illness.

Funding?? What funding? The health system at the moment gives barely anything, and even though it is a very worthy organisation, the alzhiemers society is unable to help in a lot of cases. For example, my relative was only offered 1 hour per week help from the alzhiemers society, this is a man who could barely walk, was rapidly loosing his speech, would fall over very easily, and who needed two people to get him out of bed and was in incontinence pads! and he was offered 1 hour per week. With more help out there he, and many more like him could help him stay at home, which as you say really does help the person.

I just cant wait for the day that a cure is developed, I for one will be most definitely celebrating in thanks for all the lives that will be saved, not just the lives of the people who would otherwise develop the disease, but also for the family members who would be giving up their time, their love, their energy and ultimately huge chunks of their lives to help care for their loved one.

K-9 · 01-06-2010 12:46AM

Biggins wrote: »

No, he kept the interview personal for the sake of the alzheimers organisation that he is trying to help, one step at a time.

Did the McCole case not affect him personally?

Now that is sad. The one case that mars his ministerialship (is that a word?) and he couldn't acknowledge it?

Look, I sympathise. I know how alzheimers works, I can emapthise. Hepatitis C is very serious too.

Biggins · 01-06-2010 12:49AM

recylingbin wrote: »

I also didn't say he was a bad person. I agree with you. But it's easy for Michael Noonan to say these things now. It affects him now.

But regarding him directly, we should remember how gutless he was as minister for health. Not only was he worse than useless, but he actually caused a lot of harm. When he had his big chance to make things better, he put his own interests first.

Absolutely agree. It seems he has started to learn his lessons though and openly admitted it in something you rarely see in our politicians, some vestiges of honesty.

OPENROAD · 01-06-2010 12:50AM

Kelda09 wrote: »

Funding?? What funding? The health system at the moment gives barely anything, and even though it is a very worthy organisation, the alzhiemers society is unable to help in a lot of cases. For example, my relative was only offered 1 hour per week help from the alzhiemers society, this is a man who could barely walk, was rapidly loosing his speech, would fall over very easily, and who needed two people to get him out of bed and was in incontinence pads! and he was offered 1 hour per week. With more help out there he, and many more like him could help him stay at home, which as you say really does help the person.

I just cant wait for the day that a cure is developed, I for one will be most definitely celebrating in thanks for all the lives that will be saved, not just the lives of the people who would otherwise develop the disease, but also for the family members who would be giving up their time, their love, their energy and ultimately huge chunks of their lives to help care for their loved one.

Oh I know, thats the point, it really is the forgotten illness, people think its just about memory loss and you only get it in your late 70's 80's etc.. but its far more than that, the memory loss is just a small small part, people really don't know the half of it, I find it so hard to understand why it does not get more funding

Kelda09 · 01-06-2010 12:51AM

recylingbin wrote: »

I also didn't say he was a bad person. I agree with you. But it's easy for Michael Noonan to say these things now. It affects him now.

But regarding him directly, we should remember how gutless he was as minister for health. Not only was he worse than useless, but he actually caused alot of harm. When he had his big chance to make things better, he put his own interests first.

I do empathise with him with respect to his wife's condition though. As I said, I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

I'm sorry Recyclingbin, I just picked you up wrong. Genuinely, no offence meant.:o I can't really recall him as Minister, but I'll admit it's only fairly recently I really started considering politics. after reading another post about the blood transfusion scandal though it seems as though he definately didn't have much compassion. If only he had this insight back then (without his wife developing the disease, ideally) then he might have made a difference. if only life worked the way we wish it did

recylingbin · 01-06-2010 12:53AM

Kelda09 wrote: »

I'm sorry Recyclingbin, I just picked you up wrong.

No prob, I must have picked you up wrong too, I felt no malice in your post.

starbelgrade · 01-06-2010 12:54AM

Biggins wrote: »

Absolutely agree. It seems he has started to learn his lessons though and openly admitted it in something you rarely see in our politicians, some vestiges of honesty.

There are plenty of honest politicians in the country. The day people realise this & pay less lip service to those who admit their failings a decade later and only when a personal issue affects them, will be a much better day for the country.

K-9 · 01-06-2010 12:55AM

Kelda09 wrote: »

I'm sorry Recyclingbin, I just picked you up wrong. Genuinely, no offence meant.:o I can't really recall him as Minister, but I'll admit it's only fairly recently I really started considering politics. after reading another post about the blood transfusion scandal though it seems as though he definately didn't have much compassion. If only he had this insight back then (without his wife developing the disease, ideally) then he might have made a difference. if only life worked the way we wish it did

Ideally we'd have compassion while being a Minister, but unfortunately, it seems a big ask!

Politician-At last a spark of humanity

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